"Leave & Cleave" vs. Honor thy Mother(-in-law)

[miss_priss]

If you don't believe in God, the Bible, or that the Word of God should guide your life....read this post at your own risk.  If it offends you, you were warned not to read it.  If it kicks you in the heart...I pray God will guide you in your struggle.   

Confronting a difficult MIL is a lot easier said than done.  Ok, scratch that.  Confronting her in a way *that won't leave your husband resenting you* is easier said than done.  But here's an idea for DILs...it's not your place to do so.  It's your husband's.   

Some women have such a firm grasp on their sons that it's near impossible for them to ever stand on their own, I've seen this in other relationships besides my own.  Moms who simply can't let go are oddly enough the ones who complain of DIL issues.  Did someone just say irony? 

My husband and I tried all kinds of therapy, after 2 years of his mother sabotaging our relationship with lies, incomplete truths, and passive aggressive and narcississtic behavior.  We tried couples counseling, support groups for loved ones of people with personality disorders, and finally counseling with our pastor. 

Accepting that a son should "leave his mother and cleave unto his wife" (Genesis 2:24), was THE single hardest thing my husband ever did.  When our pastor got down into the nitty-gritty of what that passage means, my husband's eyes were opened.  HE realized that letting his mother lead our relationship down a path of destruction was wrong, that her gross mistreatment of his wife was wrong, that her emotional blackmail tactics were wrong.  His mother on the other hand, admittedly won't accept that she's supposed to let her son go, that its the natural order of things that she should let him make his own decisions, let him make his own mistakes, let him grow up, let him create his own family and future...and she certainly doesn't agree that her not doing so has caused problems in her relationship with her son.  Sadly, my MIL told me once that her cruelty and admonishment towards me were a "right to passage" of sorts.  Her MIL was brutal towards her, even hit her once, so she felt it her duty to pass on the tradition and "break me in right."  The relationship between my DH and his mother, and also between "us" and her, got especially rocky when DH told her he was "respectfully leaving" her in order to cleave unto his wife.  You should have seen the rage....I think Satan himself was controlling her words and actions after that.  And because his mother couldn't, at the very least, keep her thoughts to herself, my husband and I made the decision to "leave" her behind.  We now have no contact with her whatsoever, we don't visit, we don't invite her to visit, we don't accept her poisonous letters to our daughter.  MILs - take a lesson, I hope none of you ever have to know what that feels like.  I myself hope that I learned enough from her mistakes to be a better MIL someday.     

I like this website.  Our pastor directed us to it, we found it very helpful because it broke "biblical" language down into food for the soul and our relationship that we could easily digest.  http://www.gotquestions.org/leave-cleave-honor.html

In the end...MILs, its OKAY that you don't like your DIL.  Its ok that you don't agree with the path your son is headed down with that "girl" you don't like.  But always remember, that your son chose her.  You didn't, nor did you have the right to.  Adult sons (and daughters) will "cleave" unto their partners.  And while the parent-child relationship *SHOULD* always be close, respectful, and sacred; the marriage ("become one flesh") is, should, and will be the absolute most important and intimate relationship...even above the parent-child relationship. 

More help on MIL/DIL relationships:  http://www.gotquestions.org/mother-in-law-dealing.html                

[barelythere]

Dear Miss_Priss, this is my first post. I am shocked that your MIL is the kind of person she is. Be it known here, I for one am not that kind of MIL.  Let me repeat the words of the smartest man in the world, my Husband:  "If you are going to have kids, have at least one Daughter so you won't have to deal with a DIL who might cut you to pieces."
You sound like a Godly woman and I understand your actions and would not like to have that kind of "toxic" person in my life either.  Being Godly is the best thing you can be, it fills your heart with love and forgiveness for even your enemies, even a MIL.  God bless you.

[catchingup]

Miss-priss. You have posted here what I was not willing to post.
No matter what our beliefs if we are Christian we obey the word of God, if we are muslim we obey the word given to them
Many people squirm when referred to "What the bible says"because the bible is understood to be a set of laws that people mostly dont like keeping. It is too difficult to obey but actually it is very easy.
It brings freedom. I always say God's laws were not given for his benefit to make our lives a boring religious misery but for our benefit.
Strange how most Mother-In-Law problems come from the husbands mother. Wise God who spoke to the husband when he instructed him to "Leave your Father and Mother and cleave to your wife"
And "Wives submit to your husband"
Therefore if a husband does not leave his Father....and cleave well wives dont have to submit to anything that is not biblical so if he submits to his Mother she cannot submit to him and so the whole biblical priciple is thrown off balance.

Men actually have the hardest part although it brings freedom "Husbands love your wives as Christ loved the church" Virtually die to yourself completely and love your wife
Unfortunately some truly christian men "As head of the home" and as head have the responsibility to cover and protect their wives but they instead use the womens part "submit to your husband" as a tool to control.

As head the husband should protect his wife from any interferance from his mother.

I had this  in my own marriage and it was only saved because eventually he put the biblical principle into practise.
Unfortunately the damage MIL caused was too late to rescue. We forgive but we dont forget.MIL does not change so I always had to keep her at bay--did not abandon her or keep her son away from her but would not allow her to get too close.If I gave her my little finger she would take my whole hand.

I have 3 sons and if having an interferring mother-in-law was to benefit my role as a MIL then so be it.
I understand fully the feeling of the future daughter -in-laws and if my sons had to ask me for advise and I felt it was a decision that the pair of them should make I would refer him back to his wife.

My son offered to settle our credit card which I can manage to pay. He just felt he could make more interest than he gets at the bank and we could pay a lower interest.
He is engaged to be married and they are saving for the wedding etc.
The first thing I said was "Have you spoken to fiance" He had not.So this is where a wise mother-in-law's role fits in.She has a role to play in making sure that her son "leaves his Mother and Father and clings to his wife" although it is the responsibilty of the son to obey the word of God

What most people fail to understand is that God is not a policeman waiting round every corner to nail us for a wrong move.
It reminds me of the verses --I think in Isaiah--"How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that brings good news"
"Announcing peace".
Peace comes with obeying the Word of God.

We are told to "Honour our mother and Father" but God also said"Parents do not provoke your children to anger"
The bible principles have to be balanced where all parties are concerned and those who dont carry them out are the ones that suffer.

There are 2 verses in proverbs that go something like this and they seem to contradict themselves
but they are used depending on the situation that arises.

"Treat not a fool according to his folly or you will become like him" Very next verse says
"Treat a fool according to his folly least he become wise in his own eyes"

This little story would probably interest all the Americans on here.

I woke up on 9/11 and a scripture came to mind. "Enter his gates with thanksgiving in your hearts" This is not something that happens everyday. I knew it was for a reason
When I arrived home my son was watching the 9/11 news on TV and said to me that planes had flown into the world trade center. He was booked to visit the U.S. in December.
I knew immeadiately that God was speaking to me. Strangely enough I did not look up this scripture for about a week.
A friend and I were discussing the 9/11 incident and she asked me if I was worried about him going to America and I said no "He does not belong to those people who did this awful thing"

It was only then that I went home and referred to the original passage "Enter his gates with thanksgiving in your heart" and in these verses is a quote "You belong to me"
Absolute confirmation that there was no need for me to worry about his visit to the U.S.
God knew I would worry.
The times I could mention that my mind has been put at rest by The Lords communication is endless.

My sister has been a widow since she was in her 30's and had to bring up 4 children on her own.
She needed a door installed at her home and someone from the church offered to do it for her .
She had entered a competitin for a car and when this guy was there she thought of buying him a bottle of champagne--yes a christian can drink in moderation--Nevertheless her phone rang and the guy on the line said "Sorry you did not win the car but you won third prize,a bottle of champagne.
Gods coincidance.
I could write a book.
I just know from experiance God is real.

[Alicev]

Thanks for sharing your story. I am sorry that you have had to go through difficult times like this. Your post was very emotion filled for me. I could read behind the lines that the hurt must have been so big. I am not a religious person myself but more of a spiritual one. I basically agree with the particular passage from the Bible. It looks like your husband is very protective of you and loves you very much to have participated in all the couples therapy and trying out to all the help available. It sure it has been an ordeal for him and you, including his mother. As extreme as your MIL-s reaction was in the end, it came out of insecurity and fear of abandonment. Those are really difficult feelings to deal with for anybody. Change is sometimes most difficult to accept.

[catchingup]

Gods word is deep,very spiritual and easy to understand if we are commited to him.
It is revealed not by man but by the Holy spirit.

"The  bible" or "The word of god' is powerful.

We can read "In the beginning "God said let there be light and there was light"
He spoke and it came into being.It is difficult for our minds to understand that just saying something can create something. Well I take that literally"God said and it was done"
His word is so powerful that when he said to Peter"Come" peter walked on water.
He created a barrier on the water with one word "Come"Sound crazy it is true.
Peter did not walk on water he walked on the Word of God.
There may come a time for Miss Priss when God will give her a difficult task to perform"Time for you to humble yourself and bring your MIL lovingling back into your lives" End her suffering of missimg out on your lives  and when it does happen believe me it will be the right thing to do.

It happened to me. I picked up the phone one day and said"I think it is time the amnosity between us is ironed out"
It was never perfect but it eased relationships although as I said before I always made sure she was kept in check if she tried to interfere

[barelythere]

Thanks for sharing your story. I am sorry that you have had to go through difficult times like this. Your post was very emotion filled for me. I could read behind the lines that the hurt must have been so big. I am not a religious person myself but more of a spiritual one. I basically agree with the particular passage from the Bible. It looks like your husband is very protective of you and loves you very much to have participated in all the couples therapy and trying out to all the help available. It sure it has been an ordeal for him and you, including his mother. As extreme as your MIL-s reaction was in the end, it came out of insecurity and fear of abandonment. Those are really difficult feelings to deal with for anybody. Change is sometimes most difficult to accept.

Dear Faith,
Your words hit me like a ton of bricks.  It is a fear of abandonment with me.  Holding on with my fingernails to a situation where I'm criticized at every turn, not openly but you can just feel it.  Not good for me and hard for my son.  But at the heart of the story is a fear of abandonment.

[catchingup]

God never abandons us.
In all I have said here I still take things in my own hands but then I am reminded to pray for my children. Pray that I will be a good mother-in-law.
Believing does not mean to say we will always do everything perfectly but guidence is sure helpful and the one who knows us best is God.

One gets MIL's who are church goers. Sometimes they can be the worst. Laying down Gods law never mind their own.Preaching fire,brimstone and hell. That is wrong too.
It is the same as trying to control a son's marriage,taking over Gods role in their lives.

On the funny side may we step aside and give God some of the responsibility we have had to bring up our children.
Think about it where DIL is concerned someone else has to clean,cook,wash his clothes.
Take a break we are free to go.

[donewithdrama]

This is a serious post, but just to interject a little humor I want to share something related to it. When DH and I picked out our vows and the readings the pastor would do, the reading regarding a man leaving his family and cleaving to his wife was one of my favorites. Yes, I was trying to get a message across to MIL by choosing it. Well, when we got our wedding video back, we saw that as the pastor was doing the vows she sat there looking all sweet, UNTIL he read that passage. She whipped her head around and hissed something at FIL and then had a frown on her face the rest of the ceremony. So, I take it she got the message, lol.

[Pen]

Oh boy. First we need to see if the statements written as fact are indeed true, for example: "Moms who simply can't let go are oddly enough the ones who complain of DIL issues.  Did someone just say irony?" In some cases perhaps, but in many cases it's not. I know in my case this isn't the issue; it's actually DIL's FOO that can't let go and they've created a situation that allows DIL to disrespect us. 

[catchingup]

Oh boy. First we need to see if the statements written as fact are indeed true, for example: "Moms who simply can't let go are oddly enough the ones who complain of DIL issues.  Did someone just say irony?" In some cases perhaps, but in many cases it's not. I know in my case this isn't the issue; it's actually DIL's FOO that can't let go and they've created a situation that allows DIL to disrespect us.

Pen you are so right. This can be the case
The reason I am here is because my FDIL's mother is the problem and having had a very interferring MIL I vowed to never be one but was dragged into a family argument.
I read her, believe me. I think my FDIL's mother is a very jealous women and together FDIL and mother are 2 dangerous women.
I am prepared. Remember God can handle them better than I can.

[miss_priss]

Pen - you are definitely right.  Not all situations are the same, and sometimes sons/daughters do pick truly "bad apples."  Sometimes the MIL is NOT the issue.  Sometimes the DIL is the issue.  Sometimes the DIL is not the issue, but her parents are.  Sometimes it just simply the environment in which the relationships are bred.  Sometimes.....we could go on and on. 

But I think Faith really hit the nail on the head, "fear of abondonment."  MILs are not the only ones who feel that way, certainly.  It affects all parties, and unfortunately leaves usually one person in the middle.  Pen - I 've read your post, and I think your DIL is facing that very thing...fear of abandonment (or something very close), and this could be why she has responded to you in the ways she has.  Maybe she is jealous of the relationship you have with your son, and she wants to destroy that.  Maybe she feels cornered because you make her look bad by being the better person.  Maybe she feels like her husband hasn't fully "left" the nest.  Who knows why people do the things they do, but it's sad that some people simply don't know how to channel that fear and overcome it so that it doesn't ruin the lives of others.  They're the ones who need help dear, not you.  But what can you do, besides pray that God have his will.  None of us know his reasons for the situations we go through, but we are required to have faith in God that he knows what he's doing and why, and trust that he will not leave us, even at our darkest hour, so hang in there. 

But you know, I think I said it before...I could have totally been your DIL.  I knew that DH and his mother were close even when we were dating, but I had NO CLUE that he was hiding just how close they were.  He was giving her money, paying for her cell phone plan every month, paying her car insurance, and sending her very lavish gifts (a 52-inch flatscreen TV for one!), and funding her beach vacations several times a year.  All of this he kept from me, and now he admits that he hid it from me because deep down he knew what a "mama's boy" he would look like if he told me the truth about their relationship.  But he says he also knew that if he tried to stop the "money-funnel" to her, she would FLIP OUT.  So he just kept doing it and kept it from me.  It caused a lot of resentment, especially when it came time to start planning our wedding.  I knew how much his job paid him.  I knew what bills he had, how much it took to pay them.  We had discussed all this when we discussed our "couple" financials and how we would combine our incomes and bills once we were married.  But when we started needing to pay for things for our wedding, he was broke.  Flat broke.  There were times I even had to pay his mortgage for him, even before we lived there together, because he was dry.  When I put two-and-two together that his mother was retired and on a fixed income, yet she was taking several lengthy beach vacations every year, then she suddenly got this new television...but she always complained of being broke, I figured out what was going on.  I confronted him about it, and intially he lied to me.  He was ashamed that he had let himself go broke supporting her lavish lifestyle.  I was FURIOUS.  It really began to get ugly when we got married, and he suddenly couldn't just send her $1000 without talking to me first, because it was my earnings, my income, my savings now too.  And I contributed just as much as he did, actually more.  Her "secondary income" suddenly just stopped....and then, SHE was furious!  Suddenly, I was "ruining her relationship" with her son, when in fact, I was just ruining the lifestyle she was used to.  Her narcissistic and passive aggressive personality really started to show its ugly head, and we ALL saw her true colors.  It was very hard for him not to just give in to her tantrums, just to calm her down, but later on in therapy we resolved that his "pacifying" her was exactly what created that monster, and that it's a temporary solution to a very long-term problem. 

Now to my point:  I, the DIL, felt abandoned.  I felt like his mother was getting the life he'd promised to me.  I felt like his loyalty was to HER, even though his vows were spoken to me and to God.  So I hastily started acting towards her similarly to how your DIL acts towards you.  I made it as uncomfortable as possible for her when she and his father would move into our home for weeks on end.  I was downright nasty to them both.  I was harboring hatred in my heart towards her, so much that it really began to consume me.  It was wrong.  I knew it was wrong, but I felt so "provoked" by her and that's how I justified it.  How can a Christian, like I thought I was, be so overcome with hatred?  I felt possessed, consumed, and CRAZY!!!  And that's when we sought counseling with our pastor.  It was there that we peeled back the layers of animosity, and got down to the real "bones" of our problems.  It was ALL our faults:  MIL's for not allowing her son to emotionally leave the nest, DH's for not "cleaving," and mine too, for reacting to her (and him) out of hatred.  We had couples counseling, but I went to pastoral counseling alone as well, just to work through the resentment I had towards them both.  In the long run, that's what saved our marriage.

Unfortunately, it didn't save the realtionship between DH and his mother, nor did it improve my own relationship with her.  We gave it a try, we invited her to phone counseling with us (she lives several hours away), when she was down visiting other relatives, we made contact with her to try to talk it out, but she couldn't do so without a screaming/cursing fit and tantrum, or her throwing wild accusations towards me.  DH eventually just had to cut her off in order to protect his family.

Ok, I'm wrapping up here, I promise!   

The real root of our problem we determined was the way WE dealt with the lack of his parents' support of our marriage.  It was easy to realize that his mother was throwing us off balance, the hard part was to realize how to deal with it.  We desperately wanted his parents' approval and support, but when we didn't get it we reacted badly out of eagerness to gain the approval.  In the long run, we couldn't force them to approve and there was nothing we could do to change that except pray for God's will in her life and in ours.     

[cremebrulee]

If you don't believe in God, the Bible, or that the Word of God should guide your life....read this post at your own risk.  If it offends you, you were warned not to read it.  If it kicks you in the heart...I pray God will guide you in your struggle.

I think we're a group of ladies here with diverse beliefs here,...that being said, you bring a lot of good points to the table, however, anyone, can take the Bible and God's word and bend it to they're very own issues....plus, your God may not be my God...can you see the broarder view of that?  We all have to believe in something more powerful then ourselves....it's human nature and our way of wanting to to explain or rationize so many questions we have, like birth and death....but it is also about allowance, and being at peace with ourselves. 

Confronting a difficult MIL is a lot easier said than done.  Ok, scratch that.  Confronting her in a way *that won't leave your husband resenting you* is easier said than done.  But here's an idea for DILs...it's not your place to do so.  It's your husband's. 

This one I believe  is the best for discussion...confronting mil...and if your trying to confront her in a way, that won't get your husband upset, and that is your only concern, then you are not really concerned with resolving a problem with her...only concerned for your own well being in your relationship...which is ok, however, it's not the way one should look at this type of problem...and I disagree that it's your husband's problem...its a problem that involves three people, including you...this is 2010, and realistically, it should be discussed with all 3 present...not a confrontation, but a sincere discussion as to how each one should take ownership and change the relationship to a positive one... 

Some women have such a firm grasp on their sons that it's near impossible for them to ever stand on their own, I've seen this in other relationships besides my own.  Moms who simply can't let go are oddly enough the ones who complain of DIL issues.  Did someone just say irony?

While I do agree with you on this, your wrong in stating this in general and here's why...not every single MIL/DIL relationship is the same, and the problems do not always exist b/c a mother in law can't let go of her son...there are in fact, some very difficult dil's who are very immature, owns a huge lack of confidence, some are narcissistic and fear the love they're husbands have for they're mothers.  I've witnessed many mature DIL/MIL relationships where everyone gets along...and it takes maturity along with confidence and understanding....but yes, there are MIL's that cannot let go...but we're not all like that...I promise...LOL

My husband and I tried all kinds of therapy, after 2 years of his mother sabotaging our relationship with lies, incomplete truths, and passive aggressive and narcississtic behavior.  We tried couples counseling, support groups for loved ones of people with personality disorders, and finally counseling with our pastor. 

I'm glad you both kept trying...however, your MIL really really needed to be there, did you invite her to come?  Did she refuse?  If she refused, then I must agree with all you think and feel about her...

Accepting that a son should "leave his mother and cleave unto his wife" (Genesis 2:24), was THE single hardest thing my husband ever did. 

Yes, it is difficult for some son's...why, b/c they feel like they are put in a position in which they have to choose, and when you do that to any human beings, well, it's just so wrong!  No one should ever do that to another human being....sad...and while I agree that a son should leave his family and cling to his wife....that doesn't mean that his wife possesses him now, nor does it mean, that they should always go to where his wife wants to go, when it comes to holidays and family outings....a wife also has a responsiblity to her husband's family, to his peace and happiness, and should allow...and again, as every situation is different....a wife should decide what is fair, instead of knowing that her husband is going to go where she wants to go, even if it means, not interacting with his own family.  Jealousy and the inability to allow others, to compromise and understand the needs of others as well as our own is a very important part of life's teachings...

and please understand, that I'm discussing this issue with you from my perspectives...I know how you feel now, however, when you reach your 50's, 60's and have son's of your own, your going to hope and pray, your son marry's someone who is mature, and realizes he needs a relationship with his family as well as hers...she will encourage him to spend quality time with him...she will encourage him to take his mom out to dinner once in a while....by himself...there are times yes, when his wife will go along, however, a son still needs quality time once in a while with his mother...and I say this, also, having friends and family members who realize, and are mature enough to encourage they're husbands to do this....

His mother on the other hand, admittedly won't accept that she's supposed to let her son go, that its the natural order of things that she should let him make his own decisions, let him make his own mistakes, let him grow up, let him create his own family and future...and she certainly doesn't agree that her not doing so has caused problems in her relationship with her son. 

Again, I totally agree with this...we as MIL's owe it to our son's to let them go, allow them to make they're own mistakes...that is the only way our son's will learn, that is the only way we learned...however...again...I believe the natural order here would be compromise and understanding...

I also want to say, that I've been dealing with this for almost 13 years, and it has become a huge part of my life....I was in pain for 13 years...I lost my sense of humor, my personal identity...the pain was there inside of me all the time...so, now that things have changed, I can't change back so quickly, meaning, I have still not been able to gain that light back, that innocence and trust...and hope that it changes however, I don't know that it ever will...these are life changing events that effect people for a long time...and I strongly believe, when you harm the karma of someone else, you change they're life path....which stagnates they're own personal journey....and they take turns along the way they were not supposed to take....which will also come back to huant those that did the hurting....and I don't wish that on any human being...

Sadly, my MIL told me once that her cruelty and admonishment towards me were a "right to passage" of sorts.  Her MIL was brutal towards her, even hit her once, so she felt it her duty to pass on the tradition and "break me in right."  The relationship between my DH and his mother, and also between "us" and her, got especially rocky when DH told her he was "respectfully leaving" her in order to cleave unto his wife.  You should have seen the rage....I think Satan himself was controlling her words and actions after that.  And because his mother couldn't, at the very least, keep her thoughts to herself, my husband and I made the decision to "leave" her behind.  We now have no contact with her whatsoever, we don't visit, we don't invite her to visit, we don't accept her poisonous letters to our daughter.  MILs - take a lesson, I hope none of you ever have to know what that feels like.  I myself hope that I learned enough from her mistakes to be a better MIL someday. 

I am so so sorry your life experience with your MIL will be one of such negativity...it's sad when a mother in law or daughter in law, is like what you have described above.  It's not just about her, it's about all of you and your children loosing out on so much.  So very much.

In the end...MILs, its OKAY that you don't like your DIL.  Its ok that you don't agree with the path your son is headed down with that "girl" you don't like.  But always remember, that your son chose her.  You didn't, nor did you have the right to.  Adult sons (and daughters) will "cleave" unto their partners.  And while the parent-child relationship *SHOULD* always be close, respectful, and sacred; the marriage ("become one flesh") is, should, and will be the absolute most important and intimate relationship...even above the parent-child relationship. 

In this statement...I can feel your pain and anger and the damage your mil has caused, but please remember, not all MIL's are like this...I honestly have a girlfriend, no 2 girlfriends who have and had a DIL and DIL's that are so close to her....the DIL's sometimes actually have this thing going between them, where each of them say, they are her favorite...it's kind of interesting to me, but they love her as much as they're mothers.  Also, my other girlfriends DIL was like this....so, there are many good stories out there, however, the ones who have good relationships with they're inlaws are not on the internet looking for support....but there are wonderful stories out there and many more then not...

I did not get along with my DIL for many years....and I realized the issues at hand...but instead of understanding, fought it....and caused problems...my son and I used to be very close....and all I ever wanted was a DIL, couldn't wait...however, I also did not perceive at that time, there had to be boundaries...and believe me, I am not an interferring MIL, nor one who needs to have my son be around me all the time, as a matter of fact, I want a call from him or anyone who is coming over to visit...I'm not into that, just stopping by stuff, for many reasons, I could have company, I could be sleeping, or simply put, I need my own down quiet "me" time, since I work full time.   What I am is a loving giving mother who could not wait to have him marry and have a daughter.  It is only thru my experiences and reading online, that some DIL's take offense to that...however, to me, it has always been the highest of honors to have my MIL accept me and love me as much as her son...and she did...thank God, even though we had our problems....however, I grew up and being a mother of a son myself, now realize what she was doing and why...and it was all good and out of love and concern.  But there were times she drove me nuts...and there were also times I felt it was important that my husband and her spend quality time together without me, just like I spent quality time with her on my own without my husband there.  It all works out.

So, the problems that existed between us were really horrible, sad and very bad.  It literally changed my life...there was though a lot for me to learn in the experience...life is not always fair, and isn't nearly the way we plan it or see it to be.  From a mother's point of view, I couldn't see my DIL's side, but from a DIL's point of view I could....and I'm thankful to have been both b/c in the end it worked out.  They came to visit for a few days and I couldn't have asked for more...and it made me happy to see them beaming from ear to ear in happiness...that is all a mother wants for her son...believe me...which is normal...and also part of the nature of life...

My son is working over seas, home on leave...and since my DIL and I have resolved our differences, they came to visit me for the first time in almost 4 years....and it was that long that I didn't see my grand child as well...it was more painful then you can imagine.  A life changing event....and it's so sad, that people cannot understand, it's not about just them, but effects so many people.  Our thoughts, our words, and actions effect so many many others. 

God doesn't make decissions for us....He gives us the gift of life, a set of rules to guide our lives by,  allows us to make our own decissions and choices...what is written in the Bible isn't written in stone, in other words, it's not cut and dry, black and white...there is much room in those words to translate compromise...understanding and allowance....so, while your dealing with a very stubborn and immature MIL, please remember, there are mothers here in this website whose DIL's have cause the same type of problems for them as you have been having....it's not only isolated to bad MIL's....there are really bad DIL's out there, thank God one of them isn't mine....I know now, she was hurting just as much as me, if not more....as I do believe you are to....

So, while I feel you've made the right decission....I also feel the pain in your words...the frustration and doubts, not to mention the pain of rejection...we as human beings all want to be liked...that's all...so, I know your dealing with this in the best possible way you can....and I hope the future brings for you, a great turn around in your MIL....however, if she doesn't change, then please know, that if you have son's and they grow up to marry, you to, are going to have to let them go...but as a mother, you should also have a right to share things with your son...share some holidays...family gatherings...it's so importnat to have balance...

Hugs and love
Creme

[catchingup]

 Well religion is a very controversial subject and I hope Luise does not mind that it was discussed here.
May we from our own human experiance always be able to comfort and help others without sounding like bible punches.
When Maggie8 posted here for the first time and opened her post with"Hello my name is Annie"
I just felt this incredible love for her. I think for some reason or other she is very special and I often think of her and pray for her and her son.

[Alicev]

Fear of abandonment can be so overwhelming and can run our lives to the point that we start to feel like we are going crazy. I am sure many of us have had situations in the past where we thought we would not make it, we could not take it any longer (whatever that "it" was). Today we look back and see that we did survive.

I think people often underestimate their own powers and their own strength.  I see fear of abandonment as closely related to the trust in our ability to take care of ourselves in tough times. We can take good care of ourselves.

Starting to trust ourselves and Higher Power (God, as we understand him to be) coupled with letting go of self doubt are the first steps toward dealing with fear of abandonment.

[cremebrulee]

Dear Faith,
Your words hit me like a ton of bricks.  It is a fear of abandonment with me.  Holding on with my fingernails to a situation where I'm criticized at every turn, not openly but you can just feel it.  Not good for me and hard for my son.  But at the heart of the story is a fear of abandonment.

Hi Faith
Do you mean a fear of abandonment from your husband, or fear of rejection?  I guess rejection and abandonment could describe rejection from a family member you so wish to get along with?