March 29, 2020, 02:36:58 pm


"Welcome to -- When adult children marry and leave home, life can sometimes get more complex instead of simpler.  Being a mother-in-law or daughter-in-law can be tough.  How do we extend love and support to our mothers-in-law, adult children, daughters-in-law, sons-in-law, and grandchildren without interfering?  What do we do when there are communication problems?  How can we ask for help when we need it without being a burden?  And how do our family members feel about these issues?  We invite you to join our free forum, read some posts... and when you're ready...share your challenges and wisdom."

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Topics - Keys Girl

Grab Bag / Lessons Learned
April 27, 2013, 08:34:56 am
I happened upon this page and I'm looking forward to reading Roz Savage's book.  Here's a link to some of Roz Savages' lessons learned while rowing the oceans alone.
Grab Bag / Tough Day......Looking For Some Support
April 10, 2013, 05:37:41 pm
Ladies, it's been a rough day.

The pain in my feet is actually due to plantar fasciatis and shin splints (wasn't expecting the second one) according to a specialist I saw a couple of days ago. 

Unfortunately I was also advised today that the results of some blood test done for something else show levels of creatinine more than 20% higher than the normal range.  I need to get myself to my family doctor and hopefully a kidney specialist.

What's also worrisome about this issue is that I went for blood tests 3 weeks ago with my family doctor, for diabetes and kidney stuff.  So response from her office.  For the last 30 years I've always been told not to call the office, that they will call me if anything is wrong.........I'm not sure if this is the "new" medicine of if my new GP is well, asleep at the switch.  Luckily the other medical professional I saw did some blood tests last week, picked up on this, and contacted me today.

The new GP didn't sign the prescription for the foot specialist but they held the meeting with me anyway.  The GP who forgets to sign her prescriptions? I also found out that she lied to me during our first meeting about the number of specialists for a specific issue in our town, she told me 5 but the internet lists 27........if anyone knows of a decent witch doctor, please send them my way because if I have some serious kidney issues, I'm going to need someone who can remember to sign her own prescriptions and since she's already lied to me once about a specific set of circumstances that are critical to my health, this is worrysome. 

When I was much younger I was told that the reason doctors had offices because 50% of the time you spent in them was to give you a place to cry.  I can't see myself ever feeling comfortable enough with her to need a kleenex or two, despite perhaps even life threatening circumstances.

I'm worried and it's been a rough day.  I don't know what I'm dealing with, don't know anything about kidney disease and don't have any confidence in my primary health care physician.  I've been reading up on the net today on CKD, but if anyone has anything to contribute, that would be helpful.

Tomorrow, I'm going to a nearby swimming pool tomorrow to take some aqua fit lessons to get my feet on the path to healing up and I'm also going to schedule a massage for myself to try to bring my stress levels down.  If I get a minute I'll see if there are any tribesmen left in what's left of the Amazon forest who wouldn't mind having a gringa girl in the canoe down the river to the closest Shaman.  I'll go to the grocery store and buy all the "rabbit" food that a kidney disease diet entails. 

My sense of humor is starting to surface tonight but the last time I shed this many tears in one day was a few years ago when I went online and found Luise and her WW when I realized my son was never going to telephone me ever, despite his many promises to do so.

Margaret Thatcher who died today apparently complained of the same things that affect many people on this board.

She started a war to protect the Falkland Islands but even the "Iron Lady" would have liked more time with the GCs

I had to chuckle when I saw this article......wonder if this will ever happen in North America.

Grab Bag / Wise Words - Author Unknown
December 16, 2012, 11:34:46 am
The Four Agreements

1. Be impeccable with your word
   a. Speak with integrity   
   b. Say only what you mean
   c. Avoid using the Word to speak against yourself or to gossip about others
   d. Use the power of your word in the direction of truth and love

2. Don't Take Anything Personally
   a. Nothing others do is because of you
   b. What others say and do is a projection of their own reality, their own dream.
   c. When you are immune to the opinions and actions of others, you won't be    the victim of needless suffering

3. Don't Make Assumptions
   a. Find the courage to ask questions and to express what you really want
   b. Communicate with others as clearly as you can to avoid misunderstandings, sadness and drama.
   c. With just this one agreement, you can completely transform your life.

4. Always do your Best
   a. Your best is going to change from moment to moment it will be different when you are healthy as opposed to sick
   b. Under any circumstances, simply do your best, and you will avoid self-judgment, self-abuse, and regret

Grab Bag / You Say Bad News, I say Good News
August 26, 2012, 06:55:41 am
I happened to meet some tourists yesterday, while sitting on a park bench.  Eventually we started to chat, 3 women around the same age.  We soon found out that the 3 of us each had at least 1 adult son who had "divorced" his mother or his entire family.

We talked about the difficulties of talking to people about this who didn't understand or or some who had those "perfect, perfect" lives and who cast disdain our way.  We talked about how Christmas is such a difficult time for us and  eventually we came to the conclusion that it's best to say "No, I don't haven any children" or "I have (one fewer) children".  It's not a good topic of conversation unless you happen to meet two other woman who have walked the path we are on, as I fortunately did yesterday.

One of the women said that her son married a controlling, woman who wouldn't let her see the grandchildren, and shut the door on her.  Five years later, he phoned her to say "Mom, I've got some bad news, I'm getting a divorce".......and I knew before the words came out of her mouth that she would say "Oh, that's not bad news, it's GREAT news".  And we both roared with laughter.  She agreed to meet him for coffee and they are slowly repairing their relationship.

We are going to keep in touch, that's what email is for!

Grab Bag / Baby Clothes, etc.
July 19, 2012, 04:28:34 pm
I have been storing baby and toddler clothes that my son wore and even though I've moved a few times, I've always kept them, with the idea that he might like to have his children wear them.  I'm in a small apartment now, and I'm clearing through some clutter and I'm thinking of sending most of them on to a charity, and keeping one or two items.

I'm not even sure that I'll ever see any grandchildren and after 25+ years of holding on to these items, I could use the space and my enthusiasm for holding on to them has of course gone down the tubes.

Any ideas?


The first thing that crossed my mind when I watched the viral video of that 68 year old grandmother who was bullied on the bus by 4 young kids, with some cruel and malicious remarks as well as being physically harassed was how will those boys treat their mothers or MILs in a couple of decades if they are doing this at such a young age?

I'm gratified that so many people are contributing to the fund for her and that she will probably get a lovely vacation out of this.

If those brats hadn't videotaped their satisfaction at her humiliation and then put it on a Facebook page and it hit Youtube, it would have been just another day where the bad dogs have some fun.

Grab Bag / Rodney King's Legacy
June 18, 2012, 09:02:46 pm
During the riots that followed the trial where 4 white police officers were acquited in LA, Rodney King was asked to speak while blocks of the city went up in flames.  He deviated from the prepared remarks that someone had given him and said "Can't we all just get along?". 

Great advice for everyone, and maybe some day some of us on this board will be able to get along with our estranged families.

If you ever need a lift check out the story of Dawn Loggins, the teenager abandoned by her parents, who worked as a janitor in her high school, at times was homeless, but somehow managed to keep her grades up high enough by doing homework until 2AM and is now admitted to Harvard on a full scholarship!! 

The child of drug addicts (it appears) she has no hostility or bitterness towards them despite the fact that the once moved away while she was out of town and made sure she was unable to contact them and had to fend for herself.

She has set up a new foundation for the homeless and is now giving out advice.

One piece is:  Don't let your circumstances define you"

I think she's 18 years old, but that is one wise woman indeed!


Grab Bag / Another Milestone In Sight
May 21, 2012, 08:38:40 pm
I received a call from one of my sisters that my mother is very ill and expected to die soon.  She doesn't live close by, has been suffering from dementia for quite some time and with my blood pressure issues, I decided and told my sister that I would not be able to speak to her on the phone.  My mother was a miserably unhappy woman for most of her life and served up a measure of malice and cruelty to her children over the decades once they became adults.  I sent flowers and a note thanking her for everything that she had done for me.  She did a lot of great things for me in her younger days, but as she got older she got jealous and mean and envious of everyone on the planet.  I decided some time ago to add the "Lead by bad example" of her hostility to the good example that she gave me during my younger years.  I have to accept that she did the best she could although there were many times that her passive-aggressive malice was like a knife in my heart.  I stopped seeing her some years ago after a particularly nasty episode after my father's funeral.

I realized that I haven't told my son about his grandmother's expected death.   I've decided not to call him.  He and one of my sisters were on good terms so she may have told him, but if my mother dies shortly, it will be a difficult period of time for me and I don't need to add any kind of interaction with him and his bride to add to the mix.   I have no idea if any of my family was invited to his wedding last year, the family has been separated by distance and the responses to a lot of the family hassles which may or may not be coming to an end.  But I've decided that if he doesn't want to keep in touch with me, I'm not going to contact him for exceptions that I think he might want to know about.  Those are his consequences to deal with and I'm not going to jump through hoops and stress myself out to try to let him know.

I've become more and more protective of myself in the last year or so, and while my son may be angry with me in the future, I think it's more important to protect myself from any kind of blood pressure related problem that might be brought on by getting involved in the mix, funerals and these kinds of events are always difficult.

I'm starting to adopt a policy of "I'm not the only person on the planet, someone else can always do it".  Usually there is at least one busy body in earshot who will fill those shoes and by avoiding all these family crises I hope to keep my blood pressure in a reasonable range and keep the grief down to a low volume intensity.  I mourned my mother for a decade or so while she was alive while she was nursing her meticulously held grudges against everyone she felt had wronged her during the course of her long life (including me).

It's a sad but painful lesson and I will work towards making sure that when my day comes to leave the planet that I'm more than a vessel filled with grudges and jealousies and bitterness.


This Is How: Proven Aid in Overcoming Shyness, Molestation, Fatness, Spinsterhood, Grief, Disease, Lushery, Decrepitude & More. For Young and Old Alike.
Augusten Burroughs (Author)

This is a great book, the author was interviewed on CNN.  It's a brilliant, insightful book, if I had to keep only one book on my shelves, this would be the one.

Yes, I know I'm jumping the gun because it's a couple of weeks away but I was in a store today and they were full of the "Mother's Day" type gifts, etc. etc. etc.

I decided that this year, I'm not going to observe Mother's Day, it will just be another Sunday or if I choose to at the last minute, I'll do something special or go some place that I'm interested in.

Gonna sit around and mope? NOPE, NOPE, NOPE!

Keep your expectations at 0 and you won't be disappointed because that's the difference between and adventure and an ordeal.


I hope that this Christmas brings as much joy as possible to everyone on this board, and a special nod to Luise, without whom this wonderful cyber family wouldn't exist.

All the best for 2012,

Grab Bag / Pop Up When I Log In
November 25, 2011, 06:13:57 pm
I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer when it comes to technology, but every time I log in, I get a pop up saying there is a private message for me.  Since private messages were discontinued (as far as I know) how can I prevent this reminder from coming up every time I come to the site?

Many thanks,
I recently heard a friend of mine talk about her entitlement issues going forward.  Since most of the talk, in my experience is about the next generation younger than mine having "entitlement issues", I thought it was refreshing for her to put a new spin on it.  She talked about what she felt she was entitled to at this point in her life and it got me to thinking about my own entitlement issues.

So, just in case anyone was wondering, here they are - I am entitled to:

A. Peace and quiet in my own home, no matter how modest it may be.
B. The ability to refuse to consider to answer any and all questions that I may consider to be intrusive or tiresome be it "What kind of sandwich did you have for lunch?" or "Who is in your will?"
C. Foster the the attitude in thought and deed that I am now "put out to pasture", my days of mothering a small child, working like a slave to pay all the bills, dealing with a hostile and combative ex-husband so his son can have a relationship with him and trying to complete a "to do" list of laundry, grocery shopping, cooking and commuting in addition to everything else that would choke a horse are over.  Its my little pasture, and I'm gonna do what I please, whether it's standing around all day chewing the grass day or kicking up my heels.
D. A good night's sleep where I don't worry about how anyone else decides to live their life or try to have their life impact mine on a negative basis.

If you have any "entitlement issues", feel free to add them below.
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / Stress Busters
September 25, 2011, 05:05:37 pm
I've started this thread from a conversation with CityGirl on another thread -

CityGirl, the stress levels that you are under are extreme.  What can you do, if you might lose the house, which not lose it early and then the family members who are supposed to be "helping" you but are hostile if you ask them to do the laundry can find somewhere else to stay.

Can you find a place to live that will accommodate your MS should it get worse? I don't anything about the disease but I believe it is progressive. 

What kind of help can you get from an MS Association? Will someone come in and assist you (without the grumpy, snarky routine)?

You've had some huge losses in the very recent past and your children are being less than supportive.......however, I do know of someone who was adopted as an adult by some wonderful, loving people and both the parents and their 25 year old son have found and created a new family for themselves.  Is that an option for you?

Finally, I would suggest finding some kind of role that would allow you to totally forget about all the dilemmas and lose yourself in the act of helping others.  You can use a computer, you could create an on-line group for children whose parents are serving in the military.  Those kids are probably scared to death every single day, worried sick and probably not wanting to burden the parent who is back home with their fears or maybe some kids whose parents or relatives have been diagnosed with the illness.  It's always easier to ask a stranger the questions you are most afraid of.

I would like to suggest that you start with a small group of children (with their parent's approval) and as someone who has dried many tears with your children, calmed their fears, you should have a  lot of on the job training already under your belt.

Things are not as worse as they could be.  You're doing some serious suffering, there is no doubt about that between the loss of your mother, the cavalier actions of your adult children, your concerns about your MS and worrying about the house and being unemployed.

A long time ago I was in a similar situation and the future seemed bleaker than black.  A friend of mine took out a piece of paper and drew a small drawing that looked like a pot.  He had drawn "-" (minus) signs in the pot and there were about a dozen of them.  He showed it to me and said "See this? this is your life.  You take the minus signs ONE AT A TIME and change them into "+" (plus) signs and eventually your bucket is full of plusses.  One at a time" he said.  It was great advice and eventually I did get my bucket full of "+" plus signs..........every now and then a "-" (make that major minus) for the troubles with my son, but I remember my friend's bucket analogy and trudge onward towards finding a way to get the plusses back in the bucket.

It's extraordinarily difficult to do it while you are in the midst of grief and pain and sadness.  Your bucket probably feels totally full of "-"'s but that's impossible.  Sit down and make a list of every achievement that you've made since the age of 3 and that includes riding a two wheeled bike to giving birth.  The list will be longer than your realize, keep it handy and read it once in a while to remind yourself of everything that you've done on every road you've been on and keep those photos in a drawer until those allergies disappear.

I recently had lunch with some wonderful friends and we got to talking about my blood pressure issues and stress.  I told them what I had planned for that week and they both said, "Nope, cancel that, it's stressful, keep your blood pressure down".........and next week I'm doing this "Nope, cancel that too, it's stressful, keep your blood pressure down".........I've learned that I can reduce a lot of the stressors by just saying "I have to cancel".  What can you cancel to remove stress?

I wouldn't do anything in terms of large changes for 6 months, it's not good to make big decisions in an emotional time, but I would brain storm, chat, surf the net, and consider every and any option to make your living space better and move towards a happier spot and if your adult children aren't treating you well, you don't have to choose to tolerate them.

I've been spending some time doing some research and came across the old saying "Those with whom we assemble we will soon resemble".  I've taken some steps in the last year to stay away from my son future DIL as well as some other toxic people.  The end result is that I feel better about the people that I do spend time with and the toxic people are trying (in one way shape or form) to get some attention from me have been left to find some time with anyone else on the planet.

My blood pressure reached a new low (!) this week, lower than it's been in the last 2 years when the hostilities with my son and the future bride started.  I think I'm on to something.  I'm taking more more steps to remove anything and anyone toxic out of my life.....these people will do nothing more than subtract from my happiness and well being, and would have added to it some time ago if they ever were going to.

The people who are currently in my life are the ones who have added joy and laughter and fun.  The toxic people are in my "I'm busy" file.  Scoop, that was a great post about JADE (justify, argue, defend and explain). 

While there is an enduring theme in our lives that mothers need to sacrifice everything and anything for family, I think that theme doesn't apply any more.  Toxic is toxic.  Parents deserve to have a happy life, even if their adult children don't necessarily agree with how that comes to pass, if their needs aren't put first.

Adult children need to have happy lives as well, so if they think one or both of their parents are/were toxic, then I encourage them as well to shut the door, however, that means shutting the door to borrowed money, free baby sitting, no rent money and all the other benefits that mothers/grandmothers often provide.  "Toxic with benefits" isn't a status that I encourage anyone to adopt.

Carolyn Bourne sent this email to her future daughter-in-law, Heidi Withers about her "rude behaviour"..........For those of us who would have liked to send something like this to our future or current DILs, it serves as a lesson that anything you put on the internet can go viral.  Her future DIL uploaded it.  I understand that the "sympathy vote" isn't all going to Heidi.

So next time you are tempted to sent an email that is anything less than kind, draft it up and save it.  In the meantime, read this one, I have to say my personal part of this quote is "No-one gets married in a castle unless they own it. It is brash, celebrity style behaviour."  I wish I had thought of it myself.