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"Welcome to WiseWomenUnite.com -- When adult children marry and leave home, life can sometimes get more complex instead of simpler.  Being a mother-in-law or daughter-in-law can be tough.  How do we extend love and support to our mothers-in-law, adult children, daughters-in-law, sons-in-law, and grandchildren without interfering?  What do we do when there are communication problems?  How can we ask for help when we need it without being a burden?  And how do our family members feel about these issues?  We invite you to join our free forum, read some posts... and when you're ready...share your challenges and wisdom."


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Topics - firelight

1
Well, it finally happened.  a little over 2 yrs ago my DD went through rehab for her heroin addiction.  as did my SIL.  it failed only I didn't know it till recently.  they just went through their umpteenth eviction with my 2 little GC in tow.  Let my DD move in very recently (SIL went to his aunts as my DH will not allow him in here to live).  My DD also went to the hospital and they found a blood clot near her armpit.  To make a long sad story short, I discovered she's using again.  If I'd have known this, I wouldn't have let her back in.....however, I've got my little GC (1 just turned 3 and 1 is 9 mos) to consider.  So,  DD is heading to rehab and is on a waiting list for 2-3 wks to get in and she doesn't know I'm going to file for temporary custody.  I mentioned it to her so I could seek medical care should it be needed for the grands but, of course, she was not interested in that.  SIL has warrant out and is also using heroin and does finally have a job......I am sick to my stomach.  I am 49 and do not want to raise babies at this age.  I only hope this is temporary and love them very very much.  I will do whatever it takes to make sure they are in a stable home and safe while these 2 go through their issues once again.  I do hope it is temporary because it's not fair to my husband and I.  But, if it means longer than temporary, this grandma is willing.  I'm so sad and deeply heartbroken and very angry and resentful all at the same time.  I hope it doesn't come to having to bury my DD.  I can hardly describe my emotions.   I asked my SIL what does he plan on doing when DD goes into rehab and all he can respond with is:  "I don't know."  I don't feel he really wants the help.....if my DD doesn't want it in her heart then it will fail again....it will certainly be doomed to failure if she comes out and has no plans on leaving him.  I am beside myself.  I feel so sorry for my GC.  I will do whatever I have to do......  I love them dearly.....I only hope my DD's rehab sticks this time.  The drug isn't called "the devil's medicine" for nothing.
2
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / been a while
October 19, 2013, 03:34:32 pm
Been a while since I've been on.  Since then, my mother died at home unexpectedly in July 2013 and my daughter had 1 more daughter in May 2013 who is cute as a button(total of 2 for her, 4 total for SIL).  SIL managed to lose yet another job.  I and my DH are convinced this is his plan and he has no desire to hold a job.  DD is working at a low paying job (but at least she is working)  and they are all struggling as usual while he sits back....that just doesn't stop grinding me.  I know this is her choice.  Her license plates are stolen (no one's birthday we know on the stamp) I believe since they cannot afford insurance or plates for the vehicle.  I just do what I do and spend time with the grands when I can and have gotten slightly better with pulling back some.  Still don't understand how she can be attracted to this loser but it is what it is.  I keep hoping she'll "outgrow" it but she doesn't.  Wishing a better life for my daughter and grands.  Maybe some day.   
anyway, good to see you.  I referred a friend today to this site who is having issues with her AC.  I hope she will try it as I know she would like it. 
3
Grab Bag / Tortilla ideas! Yum
July 16, 2012, 02:26:36 pm
I wanted to share this tortilla idea to make some edible taco salad bowls.  I haven't tried it yet, but I am going to! 
(might have to copy and paste this into your browser...hope it works!)

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=299794680116843&set=a.142233909206255.28180.140547806041532&type=1&theater

"If you ever wanted taco bowls, turn your muffin pan upside down, spray with cooking oil and bake tortillas for 10 minutes at 375F or 180C. Perfect. -- "
4
Well, sadly, looks like my DD and SIL are drugging again.  It is with disgust and a heavy heart for my GD I write. 

I had my DD and GD spend the night a few nights ago.  Caught her in another lie and it blindsided me.  Her pupils were as big as Texas when she finally got in my car.  I quietly confronted her in her quick and well constructed lie that anyone would have believed by her sincerity.  My gut wanted to drive away and leave her there in the rat hole she calls a residence and I'm surprised she actually stayed in the car when I called her out on the lie. 

My gut is in knots.  Apparently the air conditioner I bought for them to use (new last year) has been sold after she went on about how wonderful it is to have it.  To make a long story short, the partner of their landlord was asked by my SIL to write me a false receipt as I paid the extra money ($60 for 2 mos of air conditioner use that is extra on top of the reg rent they are charged....I do not pay their rent) out of concern for my GD living in the hole with them in 100 degree days on some days.  Looks like they could care less how hot it gets for GD.   My DD and DIL went inside for a bit just before I was to leave with DD and GD.   The landlord's business partner took that opportunity to inform me that they do not have an air conditioner and he felt I needed to know because he could not write a receipt for what they do not use.  He told me he felt what my SIL and DD was trying to do is wrong.  The money is gone.  the air conditioner is gone that was not theirs to sell.  The rehab I assisted with getting them to is in the toilet. 

I do not think this is heroin use again just yet but most probably the oxycontin they admittedly used to take or yet some other drug that is leading back up to it.  Unsure as to what it actually is. 

GD seems happy and healthy for now and I was initially asked for a ride to the store to get the baby some milk which I of course agreed to do.  She agreed to accpet the invite to spend the night with my sis and I (hubby out of town so we thought it would be a fun girls night).  but once again, my DD found a way to ruin the evening unknowingly as her chronic lying and getting back into drug use was the focus. 

I quietly confronted her in the car and that's when she about jumped back out just before we left and I was actually hoping she would.  I left it up to her as to if she wanted to come over and she actually stayed in the car. 

I did not dwell on the issue for the evening once we got to my home but did talk to her about it the next day.  I initially had plans for us to have s'mores and hang out on the deck and just have a fun girls night but it was overshadowed by the darkness of her drug addiction and chronic lying that I see is not going to change.  On a brighter note, it wasn't a bad night since I left the hot topic off the table and my GD had her very first s'more which she loved.  but my gut was in knots during the visit.  DD did take good care of my GD while they were here in my home. 

I feel that if they are up to their old tricks selling everything under the sun for their drugs, then it must be time for me to call a lawyer and see what to do .  I am so worried about my GD as the last time they drugged and started acting like this heroin was the outcome and a bad scene.  I can't believe with all I saw them go through with their withdrawals they are back into the drug scene. That didn't take long.   My DD was in rehab a lot longer than SIL and he really didn't make much effort.  I dislike him like no other.  I wish he would disappear.  He seems to thrive on pulling her down in the hole with him and she allows it.  I will have to get a free consult or 2 with lawyers and see if I need to petition the court.  I do not want to raise another child but am very worried about my GD.  DD did great with her while her in my home and GD sure loves her momma.  However, with the rif-raf that slinks around those "rooms for rent" and the constant coming and going of  "bottom of the barrel" creepy tenents , I'm afraid something could happen to GD sooner or later since all DD and SIL (who is the champion chronic liar) seem to care about is their drugs and sleeping.  SIL constantly looks like he's been sleeping no matter what time of day I have shown up there.  My gut is so tied up my appetite is gone.  Losing sleep.   I had taken the GD's crib over so she'd have a bed and not sleep in the bed her parents have or on the floor.  Well, the other day I showed up unexpectedly and one of the "lovely" tenants let me in through the coded door and I witnessed the crib full of other items and filled to the brim.  GD had a "bed" of blankets on the floor in their small bedroom they live in .  The thing is, when I took her bed over my DD made up this big wonderful story about how the SIL turned it into a daybed (that it is a feature of this crib) and described how GD loved it into the minutest details of how she did when they put it up!  Only for me to see it was never done and is just a big storage crib.  I am very disturbed and do not know who my DD is or what planet she is from.  I'm sick.  Just sick.   Not to mention my own DM has had money coming up missing again a few days ago....and who was around?  My DD.  I left a message with a person whom my DD will be seeing this a.m. for her to call me.  Interested to see how she will react to what I have to say since we've seen this same scene before with her stealing from my DM.  My DM has had her clean for her as she can no longer do it very well......that's what she is doing there in the first place.  I want to throw up. 

I hope this post is understandable as I feel as if I'm just numb and rambling on at this point. 
5
Just wanted to share some info from a site on the 5 stages of grief that might be helpful for someone.  I posted under a new topic in the Grab Bag for anyone who is interested. 

6
Grab Bag / 5 Stages of Grief
June 05, 2012, 08:42:52 am
This is the Elizabeth Kubler-Ross model.  Just wanted to share it so maybe someone could identify with it.  Experiencing loss (not just death, or it could be the death of something besides the physical body) does have it's stages of traveling through....even if not in order.  We're all going through the normal process when suffering from a loss....I know that I can identify with it and realize, I'm cruising right along as I should be.  In my case it has to do with the relationship w my DD and who she used to be....I hope it helps someone else to read it. 

Stages

The stages, popularly known by the acronym DABDA, include:[2]
1.Denial -- "I feel fine."; "This can't be happening, not to me."
Denial is usually only a temporary defense for the individual. This feeling is generally replaced with heightened awareness of possessions and individuals that will be left behind after death. Denial can be conscious or unconscious refusal to accept facts, information, or the reality of the situation. Denial is a defense mechanism and some people can become locked in this stage.
2.Anger -- "Why me? It's not fair!"; "How can this happen to me?"; '"Who is to blame?"
Once in the second stage, the individual recognizes that denial cannot continue. Because of anger, the person is very difficult to care for due to misplaced feelings of rage and envy. Anger can manifest itself in different ways. People can be angry with themselves, or with others, and especially those who are close to them. It is important to remain detached and nonjudgmental when dealing with a person experiencing anger from grief.
3.Bargaining -- "I'll do anything for a few more years."; "I will give my life savings if..."
The third stage involves the hope that the individual can somehow postpone or delay death. Usually, the negotiation for an extended life is made with a higher power in exchange for a reformed lifestyle. Psychologically, the individual is saying, "I understand I will die, but if I could just do something to buy more time..." People facing less serious trauma can bargain or seek to negotiate a compromise. For example "Can we still be friends?.." when facing a break-up. Bargaining rarely provides a sustainable solution, especially if it's a matter of life or death.
4.Depression -- "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"; "I'm going to die soon so what's the point?"; "I miss my loved one, why go on?"
During the fourth stage, the dying person begins to understand the certainty of death. Because of this, the individual may become silent, refuse visitors and spend much of the time crying and grieving. This process allows the dying person to disconnect from things of love and affection. It is not recommended to attempt to cheer up an individual who is in this stage. It is an important time for grieving that must be processed. Depression could be referred to as the dress rehearsal for the 'aftermath'. It is a kind of acceptance with emotional attachment. It's natural to feel sadness, regret, fear, and uncertainty when going through this stage. Feeling those emotions shows that the person has begun to accept the situation.
5.Acceptance -- "It's going to be okay."; "I can't fight it, I may as well prepare for it."
In this last stage, individuals begin to come to terms with their mortality, or that of a loved one, or other tragic event. This stage varies according to the person's situation. People dying can enter this stage a long time before the people they leave behind, who must pass through their own individual stages of dealing with the grief.

Kübler-Ross originally applied these stages to people suffering from terminal illness. She later expanded this theoretical model to apply to any form of catastrophic personal loss (job, income, freedom). Such losses may also include significant life events such as the death of a loved one, major rejection, end of a relationship or divorce, drug addiction, incarceration, change in office environment, the onset of a disease or chronic illness, an infertility diagnosis, as well many tragedies and disasters.

As stated before, the Kubler-Ross Model can be used for multiple situations where people are experiencing a significant loss. We explain how the model is applied differently in a few specific situations below. These are just some of the many examples that Kubler-Ross wanted her model to be used for.

[edit] Children grieving in divorce

Denial - Children feel the need to believe that their parents will get back together or they will change their mind about the divorce. Example: "Mom or Dad will change their mind"

Anger - Children feel the need to blame someone for their sadness and loss. Example: "I hate dad for leaving us"

Bargaining - In this stage, children feel as if they have some say in the situation if they bring a bargain to the table. This helps them keep focused on the positive that the situation might change and less focused on the negative, the sadness they'll experience after the divorce. Example: "If I do all of my chores maybe Mom won't leave Dad"

Depression - This involves the child experiencing sadness when they know there is nothing else to be done and they realize they cannot stop the divorce. The parents need to let the child experience this process of grieving because if they do not it will only show their inability to cope with the situation. Example: "I'm sorry that I cannot fix this situation for you."

Acceptance - This does not necessarily mean that the child is completely happy again. The acceptance is just moving past the depression and starting to accept the divorce. The sooner the parents start to move on from the situation the sooner the kids can begin to accept the reality of it. [3]

[edit] Grieving a break-up

Denial - The person getting broken up with is unable to admit that the relationship is really over. They may try to continue to call the person when they want to be left alone.

Anger - When the reality sets in that the relationship is over, it is common to demand to know why they are being broken up with. This phase can make them feel like they are being treated unfairly and it may cause them to become angry at people close to them who want to help aid the situation.

Bargaining - After the anger stage, one will try to plead with their former partner by promising that whatever caused the break up will never happen again. Example: "I can change, please give me a chance".

Depression - Next the person might feel discouraged that their bargaining plea did not convince their former partner to change their mind. This will send the person into the depression stage and can cause a lack of sleep, eating and even disrupt daily life tasks.

Acceptance - Moving on from the situation and person is the last stage. The person accepts that the relationship is over and begins to move forward with their life. The person might not be completely over the situation but they are done going back and forth to the point where they can accept the reality of the situation. [4]

[edit] Grieving in substance abuse

Denial - People feel that they do not have a problem concerning alcohol or substances. Even if they do feel as if they might have a small problem they believe that they have complete control over the situation and can stop drinking or doing drugs whenever they want. Example: "I don't have to drink all of the time. I can stop whenever I want"

Bargaining - This is the stage that drug and alcohol abusers go through when they are trying to convince themselves or someone else that they are going to stop abusing in order to get something out of it or get themselves out of trouble. Example: "God, I promise I'll never use again if you just get me out of trouble."

Anger - The anger stage of abusers relates to how they get upset because they have this disease of addiction or are angry that they can no longer use drugs. Some of these examples include "I don't want to have this addiction anymore." "This isn't fair I'm too young to have this problem."

Depression - Sadness and hopelessness are important parts of the depression stage when dealing with a drug abuser. Most abusers experience this when they are going through the withdrawal stage quitting their addiction. It is important to communicate these feelings as a process of the healing.

Acceptance - With substance abusers admitting you have a problem is different than accepting you have a problem. When you admit you have a problem this is more likely to occur in the bargaining stage. Accepting that you have a problem is when you own that you have a problem and start the process to resolve the issue. [5]

As stated above, according to her theory, Kübler-Ross claimed these stages do not necessarily come in order, nor are all stages experienced by all patients. She stated, however, that a person will always experience at least two of the stages. Often, people will experience several stages in a "roller coaster" effect--switching between two or more stages, returning to one or more several times before working through it.[2] Women are more likely than men to experience all five stages.[2]

However, the Kübler-Ross theory holds that there are individuals who struggle with death until the end. Some psychologists believe that the harder a person fights death, the more likely they will be to stay in the denial stage. If this is the case, it is possible the ill person will have more difficulty dying in a dignified way. Other psychologists state that not confronting death until the end is adaptive for some people.[2]

[edit] Cultural relevance

A dying individual's approach to death has been linked to the amount of meaning and purpose a person has found throughout his lifetime. A study of 160 people with less than three months to live showed that those who felt they understood their purpose in life or found special meaning, faced less fear and despair in the final weeks of their lives than those who had not. In this and similar studies, spirituality helped dying individuals deal with the depression stage more aggressively than those who were not spiritual.

All info taken from :  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C3%BCbler-Ross_model
7
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / I've missed you.
March 25, 2012, 09:14:17 pm
Why is it that some days I can feel so strong and tough (and I'll have a good stretch of them!), but another part of me still surfaces on other days and I feel so sad and broken-hearted re: my DD and her situation.  Some days I feel like I'm grieving a death of my DD who once was compared to who she is now.  Does this feeling ever go away??  They say time heals all wounds, but I think sometimes it doesn't completely.  Just having a sad few days I guess.   Maybe I just need some sun.  Maybe I need to visit you ladies more....been working too much.  I have really missed you all.
8
Grab Bag / HAPPY HAPPY BIRTHDAY!
March 10, 2012, 07:10:25 am
I hope you had an extraordinary birthday, luise!!   :-*

There I was, all ready to wish you one on the day and then I unexpectedly had my 1 yr old GD which made me forget everything else!

HAPPY HAPPY BIRTHDAY.....1 day late.

9
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / It finally happened
January 19, 2012, 01:13:38 pm
I haven't visited in several days because I have been going through hell on earth. 

I now have my GD.  I picked up my DD a few days back and took her to a fast food place because that is the only way I could get her away from her husband.  Some that have remembered my old posts know that my DD and SIL lived in a "boarding house" that looked more like a drug house to me. They also had my 1 yr old GD in there with them.  I had tearfully called Child Protective Services once in the recent past and still don't know what came of that.....anyway, I was full of regret about that but no more because my gut feeling was right. 

In the car I calmly and gently offered to take my GD till DD and SIL can "get it together" and I also offered to let DD come back home if she wanted to.  I didn't know how she would react to the actual offer but she began to cry.  She told me "I've been wanting to come home....but, Mom, I'm sick."  "I need to get clean but I don't know how."

I brought my DD and GD home with me that night and then to Hospital ER to get my DD help for withdrawal symptoms.  She had just did drugs that morning.  I found out my DD is seriously addicted to Oxycontin (obtained on the street).  On the way to ER she told me she wanted me to go in with her and since I was, she wanted me to know "there's more and it's worse" than what she just told me.  She proceded tearfully to tell me she's been shooting heroin with my SIL.  I can tell you next to a funeral (which I'm grateful I am not having to attend right now), this is the worse news a mother can get. 

If anyone has ever held their child in their arms while they go through physical (and psychological) withdrawals from these hard core drugs knows it would not be wished on any other soul.  The tears she and I have both cried in front of each other and silently in seclusion are beyond measure. The ER gave her some meds for the night to "get through" which is really antianxiety meds that barely touch the symptoms but better than nothing....then we went to an express care the next day to get her though the 10 days it took to get into rehab ...they gave her antianxiety and meds for nausea and vomiting.  There are cold/hot sweats and uncontrollable shaking, uncontrollable diarrhea, also severe bone and muscle pain, but mostly bone.  These withdrawals go on for many days.  I never want to witness this again.  The reason it's been so hard to stop the drugs is because of these hellish withdrawals that I never understood till I saw it with  my own eyes.

The next night, I had to work and had to leave on my rare time I get a lunch and had to take my SIL to the ER for the same withdrawals.  He did not get the pleasure of support however since I had to return to work.  This is a horrible nightmare.

My daughter has admitted herself to rehab and that took time also....one has to wait for an opening that sometimes takes several days.  My SIL has an appt on the 30th to go also.  They must go separately because they do not allow husbands and wives to be treated at the same time (wierd).  One must complete while the other waits. 

I am praying AIDS or hepatitis has not been contracted and I believe this addiction will be a lifelong battle for both of them. 

My gut feeling was right and I do not regret calling the child protective services now even though I don't know whatever became of that call.  I know my DD did tell me while confessing and crying that "I don't want to lose my daughter."   

My DD and my SIL are bags of bones as they did not eat much during the years (yes, I said "years" I found out) of using.  I only noticed the changes as they both got worse in their addictions.  Thank God my GD is healthy and well and nothing happened to her during this horror even though I know it is affecting her since she is now with me and my SIL's aunt back and forth...probably wondering where's mommy and daddy. 

I can say even though my DD has a mind of her own, I still feel like a failure somehow.....My sensible side says she made her own choices but another side says what did I do or what didn't I do.....

I have a headache.
10
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / HAPPY NEW YEAR!
December 31, 2011, 08:32:55 pm
HAPPY NEW YEAR to all you wonderful, witty, wise women!!
Out with the old and in with the new!   :)
11
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / a glimmer of hope
December 15, 2011, 01:45:01 pm
Happy to have my daughter willingly accompany me tomorrow on a small Christmas shopping trip for the GK's.  Surprised she accepted my invitation and she will help with picking out the simple gifts I will be giving them and maybe do a lunch. 

I have promised to keep the conversation out of seriousness and to keep it light-hearted.  Going to focus on some much needed and overdue gentle fun for us.  Seems like everytime I have talked to her lately is deadly serious topics of conversation and motherly reprimands.... no one likes that on a constant basis.  Frankly, I need a break from that too.  Trying to keep her near and just enjoy her company for the day.  I have hope that this situation she has chosen to be in will get better in time and improve as she ages.  There is always hope.   

I'm going to take today for what it is....a gift.
12
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / A Quick Thank You
December 13, 2011, 07:49:23 am
As I read through many of these topics I keep finding the simliar thing I found.....re: finding this site when you're feeling at your absolute worst and at a time when having great feelings of despair and emotional pain.  I am the same....I thought my heartbreak would kill me and I'm not even sure what I typed in to find this site, but I think it's no coincidence. 

Thank you, Luise, and to all of your support staff who make this site possible and for all your hard work.  I'm sure we have no idea what kind of work is actually involved to keep this site's quality high like it is.

  It has been an answer to prayer to find I am not alone in this and how helpful it is to just be able to talk about it.  The DH can only hear so much....  It's not often people you know personally share these sorts of things probably because we don't want to be judged or for "people to talk".

I can't tell you, Luise, and all the others what it has meant to be able to be a part of a site like this.  What a treasure it is.  I know of no other quite like it.  It's like a family in a way.   I do know of another friend who has problems with her AC and I gave her the site address....not sure if she is considering using it (she hasn't said) but I hope she does as I know it would be a great help to her. 

Thank you for being here.   8)
13
My SIL has been very disrespectful and beligerent with me lately and also blatantly lied about an issue.  There are substance abuse issues on his part which are not helping at all.  I have always purchased Christmas gifts for him in the past when his behavior was better but this year I  really don't want to.  My husband says NO.  I did skip his recent birthday this year (usually just gave a card with a small amount of $ in it) because of his behavior and remarks toward me.   I just told my daughter I was skipping the birthday because he is not treating me very well and I did.  I am wondering if I should give something for Christmas for my daughter's sake or just do for her and grands and to heck with him.  My husband actually won't allow him in our home anymore so I doubt I'll see him, unless he comes to a larger family function that is coming up....Part of me wants to just not do anything for him for the holiday and another part of me feels obligated for my daughter's sake.....It seems like a no brainer doesn't it.
14
I am considering calling child protective services on my own child and I think I  might throw up.  My heart is shattered into a million pieces.  I don't know what to do.  I am worried about my granddaughters well-being at this point.  I got a call yesterday from my daughter's dad's side of the family and got an earful of how Thanksgiving went at their home.  Apparently, drugs may be involved with my daughter and son in law along with the very poor life choices.......  I'm dyin' over here.  I do not want to do this....I feel I have to.  I'm hating on it.
15
Hi, I just viewed the start here first and then the other form of the preferred conduct.  Do I need to change my user name somehow?  I'm sorry I didn't go to those places first, I just stumbled on the site and then didn't read those things first.....I also have a strong faith in God so by the looks of the conduct issues it asks we refrain from our spiritual beliefs....I would still like to stay on because it's a really helpful site for me and I am happy to tone it down....however, not sure how to change my user name.  Should I re-register under a different one if this one is not acceptable?
16
Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / A Lot of Heart Ache
November 22, 2011, 09:03:15 pm
I have just stumbled on this website and it couldn't have been at a better time.  I'm really thankful to have found it.  Reading all the posts about problems everyone is having lets me know I am far from alone in my heartbreak with my adult daughter.  This time of year is killing me and I am tearful much of the time, wishing things were the way they used to be, or at least different than they are now.  Funny how I am feeling so very homesick for the good old days.  Wishing my daughter wanted to be around me.  I have a beautiful granddaughter 10 mos old that I am allowed to see but daughter doesn't seem to want much to do with me.  She has had her own issues lately and has made some poor life choices.  I am praying for her continuously and missing her so very much.  Thank you for sharing all your thoughts and I'm really glad I'm not alone because it feels that way most of the time.  The holiday times are so hard to get through with all the pressure and memories of a better day.  I'm hoping to find the joy and trust God that He is in control.