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Problem Solving => Daughter in Laws and/or Son in Laws => Topic started by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 02:21:46 pm

Title: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 02:21:46 pm
On the MIL hate sites they speak of the MIL giving CBF or doing CBF...what is that?

I cannot understand how one lone woman can be so upset when a MIL is excited about seeing her grandchild when the
DIL is going to have a baby.  Could someone explain?

I can't help this.....whole sites created to pour out hatred for a Mother in law. Do they know how hard that is for us? 
It's beneath contempt to live your life, loving your kids, having a great life and have to look at this hatred.  Before I get
lectured on not going there, please understand THEY ARE EVERYWHERE.  You can't escape them. 

Everything we do is wrong. Everything.  ...."and if DH doesn't like what you're wishes are, tell him to have the baby himself."
This is what they say.  "His Mother gives the CBF when she is told she's not to be there"  "I'm having the baby, not her"

I told you about my friend who was so excited about having her first grandchild that the poor thing ran into the house, after
being told she was not welcome at the hospital and said, "OH!! my baby~!!!  Look at him!!"

She has never been allowed to see that child again.  10 years have passed. That was it.  No contact.  Not allowed.

Do they think we never had a child?  Why all these ridiculous rules?  What is it for?  All it does is destroy people. 
Here I go again......

Update:  CBF means "Cat Butt Face."  Unbearable and unbelievable.   
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 03:42:38 pm
Chickie I think the problem is not the excitement, it's the entitlement some people display.

As you know, giving birth is hard work.  You leave your dignity at the hospital doorstep on the way in and pick it up on the way out. 

I understand why some of these daughters in law don't want their mother's in law around.  I was dressed in an oversized t shirt, no underwear, in pain and vulnerable.   By the end of it I was hating my husband for knocking me up and told him as much, in great detail complete with profanity!  He's a great guy and even when I squeezed his hand so hard I bent his wedding ring, he was there for me.  He was all I needed.

That is not something my mother in law had to see.

As for excitement over grandchildren visiting etc.  I understand it I really do. 

But you need to remember there are Mothers in law out there who cross the line, they are not normal.  I've looked after nieces and nephews, my friends children and even did a spell working in a day care.  I've never let a child other than my own call me Mommy, when they do I just stop and look at them. Yet there are mother's in law out there that choose names close to Mommy or Mama, encourage their grandchildren to call them Mommy and refer to themselves as Mommy over and over. 

These daughters in law are dealing with Mothers in law who have grandma showers, who prepare nurseries in their homes or feel entitled to decorate their grandchilds room in their son and daughter in laws home.

It's all beyond the normal excitement.

Sometimes I read and think that some of these poor women I just trying to be normal grandmothers, but often times there is a long history behind the post you are reading.  The saddest I think are the ones where the Mother in law has little or no interest in the couple until they announce their first pregnancy, then she's all over them like a rash.  While I understand a grandchild excites her, she's put no spadework into the relationship before hand, it has no foundation and the daughter in law feels like she is nothing more than a baby factory.

As for CBF, when I was a child we used to call people who made that face lemon lips, as though they had sucked on something surprisingly sour and puckered up. 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 03:56:34 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 03:42:38 pm
Chickie I think the problem is not the excitement, it's the entitlement some people display.

As you know, giving birth is hard work.  You leave your dignity at the hospital doorstep on the way in and pick it up on the way out. 

I understand why some of these daughters in law don't want their mother's in law around.  I was dressed in an oversized t shirt, no underwear, in pain and vulnerable.   By the end of it I was hating my husband for knocking me up and told him as much, in great detail complete with profanity!  He's a great guy and even when I squeezed his hand so hard I bent his wedding ring, he was there for me.  He was all I needed.

That is not something my mother in law had to see.

As for excitement over grandchildren visiting etc.  I understand it I really do. 

But you need to remember there are Mothers in law out there who cross the line, they are not normal.  I've looked after nieces and nephews, my friends children and even did a spell working in a day care.  I've never let a child other than my own call me Mommy, when they do I just stop and look at them. Yet there are mother's in law out there that choose names close to Mommy or Mama, encourage their grandchildren to call them Mommy and refer to themselves as Mommy over and over. 

These daughters in law are dealing with Mothers in law who have grandma showers, who prepare nurseries in their homes or feel entitled to decorate their grandchilds room in their son and daughter in laws home.

It's all beyond the normal excitement.

Sometimes I read and think that some of these poor women I just trying to be normal grandmothers, but often times there is a long history behind the post you are reading.  The saddest I think are the ones where the Mother in law has little or no interest in the couple until they announce their first pregnancy, then she's all over them like a rash.  While I understand a grandchild excites her, she's put no spadework into the relationship before hand, it has no foundation and the daughter in law feels like she is nothing more than a baby factory.

As for CBF, when I was a child we used to call people who made that face lemon lips, as though they had sucked on something surprisingly sour and puckered up.


I was reading what you wrote and realized that maybe some of the DILs are dealing, like you said, with over the top
people.  One of the things that struck me was that my DIL was excited and wanted me to put a nursery in one of our roooms.  I did. 
This wasn't an issue with her.  I am also called one of the "not Mommy" but close to "Mama" names that is common in
the South.

The other thing is that all of my friends have Grandma showers that we give for them.  I am so shocked that this is
an issue.  The DILs are there at the shower!! This way, the Grandma has nursery things when the baby stays there. 
It has never been an issue with the DILs.

Something in the background must have happened for all these things to be such a sore spot.  Some of us though,
do not know which end is up with all this. 

I remember being at the hospital and the Mother's Mother was told to go in first.  I know that's the way things are done. I went in second. 

I never dreamed of being in the delivery room, never thought of it. No one was there with me....my husband was smoking
a cigar in the waiting room!! HA!

I remember wishing my MIL had wanted to play more
of a role in my kid's lives.  She worked, though and never had time for it.  She made up for that in other ways, like making
great dinners on Sundays for us. 

Things have so radically changed these days.  We are going in this blind, thinking it's the way it once was. 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 04:13:57 pm
Everyone is different Chickie.  Half the problem is that expectations are not necessarily spelled out or understood I think.  My stepmother purchased a secondhand crib to keep in her spare room and a high chair, because I come from a large family there were lots of babies of a similar age and we always had somewhere to put the baby down.  If it was a large gathering, there'd be a couple of babies sharing that crib.  I didn't have an issue with it either.  But then I wasn't the sole focus of her attention either.

I know when my stepsister had her baby, my stepmother spent a lot of time in the first few weeks "helping".  When I had my son a year later, she knew me well enough to know I would prefer to find my feet alone.  She told me that if I wanted her, to just ring and she'd be over in a flash.  In a nutshell I think that is often the problem with Mothers/daughters in law.  My stepmother knew me, my mother in law not so much.  Where my stepmother would offer help, my mother in law would literally push me aside and take over.  I hated that!  So maybe I wasn't the worlds fastest diaper changer at first, no need to hip check me out the way and tell me my son would catch pneumonia if I didn't hurry up was there?  When I raised any small objection my mother in law would pout and cry that she was just trying to help.  It's not helping when you do that, in my opinion anyway.

Grandma showers are a hot topic at the moment.  I understand the reasoning and if the daughter in law is comfortable with it, so be it.  To me a second or third baby shower is crass, a money dance at a wedding is crass, but other people find it acceptable and if that is comfortable for all involved, go for it.

Things have changed, the way society is set up, they have to.  I've worked all my children's lives.  I do things differently to my mother, my mother in law and my grandmother.  I've had stand up arguments with my father over things he thinks I should allow my children to do, like riding a motor bike at 12!  He thought I was being over protective and he would have let me do it, I told him it was my right and duty to protect my kids, he said I was being silly!  I told him that he'd feel really bad if he had to tell me my kid was dead from a motorbike accident!  He didn't agree but he accepted my decision and he didn't let them on the motorbike.  By comparison mother in law would ask if the kids could have candy, I'd say it was too close to dinner so not now maybe after, she wouldn't debate the issue, she'd sneak them the candy before dinner!


Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 05:03:19 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 04:13:57 pm
Everyone is different Chickie.  Half the problem is that expectations are not necessarily spelled out or understood I think.  My stepmother purchased a secondhand crib to keep in her spare room and a high chair, because I come from a large family there were lots of babies of a similar age and we always had somewhere to put the baby down.  If it was a large gathering, there'd be a couple of babies sharing that crib.  I didn't have an issue with it either.  But then I wasn't the sole focus of her attention either.

I know when my stepsister had her baby, my stepmother spent a lot of time in the first few weeks "helping".  When I had my son a year later, she knew me well enough to know I would prefer to find my feet alone.  She told me that if I wanted her, to just ring and she'd be over in a flash.  In a nutshell I think that is often the problem with Mothers/daughters in law.  My stepmother knew me, my mother in law not so much.  Where my stepmother would offer help, my mother in law would literally push me aside and take over.  I hated that!  So maybe I wasn't the worlds fastest diaper changer at first, no need to hip check me out the way and tell me my son would catch pneumonia if I didn't hurry up was there?  When I raised any small objection my mother in law would pout and cry that she was just trying to help.  It's not helping when you do that, in my opinion anyway.

Grandma showers are a hot topic at the moment.  I understand the reasoning and if the daughter in law is comfortable with it, so be it.  To me a second or third baby shower is crass, a money dance at a wedding is crass, but other people find it acceptable and if that is comfortable for all involved, go for it.

Things have changed, the way society is set up, they have to.  I've worked all my children's lives.  I do things differently to my mother, my mother in law and my grandmother.  I've had stand up arguments with my father over things he thinks I should allow my children to do, like riding a motor bike at 12!  He thought I was being over protective and he would have let me do it, I told him it was my right and duty to protect my kids, he said I was being silly!  I told him that he'd feel really bad if he had to tell me my kid was dead from a motorbike accident!  He didn't agree but he accepted my decision and he didn't let them on the motorbike.  By comparison mother in law would ask if the kids could have candy, I'd say it was too close to dinner so not now maybe after, she wouldn't debate the issue, she'd sneak them the candy before dinner!


I am honestly trying so hard to learn....it is hard.  We are acting in the era of our lives and the DILs are in their own eras.  Life is different and like you say, it had to be, I guess because life has changed.  People have become very hard in their actions, very rigid and not bending. We don't know why. 

One wrong move and you're out.  It's hard for us to learn.  We don't know the new ways.

Now, the motorcycle?  My brother came within a hairs breath of dying from an accident and I am terrified of them.  Even if I wasn't, I'd never suggest anything like that. 

The Grandmother showers have been so good and really have made the DILs and Grandma's feel special.  The DILs seem thrilled to be apart of it.  I am baffled.

The money dances, I don't know...we don't do those. 

Candy?  Never been an issue.  I've never heard either DIL say anything about that.  One of my DILs is very different, hard in her approach....when I have kept her kids, she walks in the door, doesn't say hello, nothing...."what did they eat?"  That's it, think about it being said in a shouting, brutal way...."WHAT DID THEY EAT?"

One of my friends who I love said to tell her, "they ate sandwiches, if that's not what you wanted, get something out and fix it yourself!" (she said for me to have a mean look on my face)  She has daughters.  (that's why she can say that).  I could not do that with Daughters in law. 

It's so hard for us...we don't understand things.  If we try to help, we're interfering, if we don't help, we don't care...on and on it goes.  Sometimes I think it's truly hopeless.   
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 05:04:25 pm
Anna if a little sense was employed with the candy thing, I probably wouldn't have got so mad at the time, it was just one thing among many and very small.  I would internally steam though, why ask me then go against my request of waiting till after the meal?  What difference would it make to give them candy after they'd eaten dinner? 

For years my children have gone to stay with my parents for a couple of weeks during the summer holiday, I don't accompany them and they are completely under my parents control while there.  My parents live a long way away.  My in laws live locally but have not had my kids to stay since my son said no thanks when he was 4, he's a teenager now.  If they wanted to take him or my daughter to a movie or any other outing, I wouldn't think it strange or object at all, but they don't.  In fact they don't even visit.  It seems that the only way my children ever see them is when we or dh takes them over and while there,  my inlaws sit with the television blaring and occasionally grill my children on their progress at school, big fun!

I went to stay with my grandparents, I went on outings with them.  To me it's perfectly normal.  When my children were small, more so my son, my parents both worked still.  When my daughter was about a year old they shifted away to retire.  My father does the kind of things my grandfathers and my husbands grandfather did, the kids hang out with him in his large garage (we call it the man cave) he makes them cotton reel tractors, lets them shoot the bb gun at targets (they live on a lifestyle farmlet) and help with the cows.  They bake with my stepmother and go into town once a week to shop and get treats, they swim in the river, fish and have fun.  I think that is as it should be. 

As I said, my inlaws have never offered to have them, when ds went as a preschooler, they just lived their lives with him around, I don't think that is wrong either.  Just once he didn't want to go over and they never asked again.

I've edited to add the following

Chickie it's to each his/her own.  Cultural differences, generational differences, familial differences.  I think it's a minefield!  I don't think it's understanding the "new ways", I think it is a matter of understanding the individual you are dealing with.  If we could find a foolproof way to ensure that there is a meeting of the minds between mothers and daughters in law, I'd spread it far and wide.

I can honestly say I don't think my mother in law ever tried to understand me or modify her approach with me, to account for the fact that I am for all intents and purposes, moulded by outside influences.  She says she treated us all just like her own children.  The problem is, we (the married in dils) were not her children, we were all brought up by different people with different ideas and ways.  I resented being scolded like a child in my 20's for example, heck my husband resented it too but at least he was used to it.

Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 05:11:47 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 05:04:25 pm
Anna if a little sense was employed with the candy thing, I probably wouldn't have got so mad at the time, it was just one thing among many and very small.  I would internally steam though, why ask me then go against my request of waiting till after the meal?  What difference would it make to give them candy after they'd eaten dinner? 

For years my children have gone to stay with my parents for a couple of weeks during the summer holiday, I don't accompany them and they are completely under my parents control while there.  My parents live a long way away.  My in laws live locally but have not had my kids to stay since my son said no thanks when he was 4, he's a teenager now.  If they wanted to take him or my daughter to a movie or any other outing, I wouldn't think it strange or object at all, but they don't.  In fact they don't even visit.  It seems that the only way my children ever see them is when we or dh takes them over and while there,  my inlaws sit with the television blaring and occasionally grill my children on their progress at school, big fun!

I went to stay with my grandparents, I went on outings with them.  To me it's perfectly normal.  When my children were small, more so my son, my parents both worked still.  When my daughter was about a year old they shifted away to retire.  My father does the kind of things my grandfathers and my husbands grandfather did, the kids hang out with him in his large garage (we call it the man cave) he makes them cotton reel tractors, lets them shoot the bb gun at targets (they live on a lifestyle farmlet) and help with the cows.  They bake with my stepmother and go into town once a week to shop and get treats, they swim in the river, fish and have fun.  I think that is as it should be. 

As I said, my inlaws have never offered to have them, when ds went as a preschooler, they just lived their lives with him around, I don't think that is wrong either.  Just once he didn't want to go over and they never asked again.


Oh, I see...they must have gotten their feelings hurt?  Is that it?  Maybe they don't feel like they would do the right thing with the kids.  I don't know, just shooting in the dark.  I wonder if maybe they have gotten the wrong impression somewhere.  Like they're not wanted?  I don't know. Sometimes I think when we're not feeling like we're wanted, we hide out.  I do.  Do you think that might be it? 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 05:22:32 pm
If that were the case Chickie how thin skinned do you have to be for a 4 yr old saying no thanks to an invitation to permanently scar you for life?  I'm sure you are right though, despite my efforts as a young bride, she always said she felt unwelcome at our home, to other people.  I always treated her as best I could, made her coffee, snacks etc.  I don't know what else I could have done.
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: dirtyglassgrl on April 11, 2010, 05:27:54 pm
This is my first post I hope I am not starting out on the wrong foot,  there were a few things I wanted to respond to as a DIL.  I have let my parents and my ILs spend time alone with my kids anytime they asked because my kids seemed to like it even with the IL's that we are now estranged from got a chance to do things with my kids until it blew up in my face, but everyone is different some people have different ideas of grandparenting I guess.  I don't mind candy for my kids either really, they are in fine health and it won't hurt them.  The only things I have discouraged as it came up was with my parents, "no secrets".  I know it is harmless and people feel its fine to have a bit of a secret with kids behind mom's back "this treat will be our secret"  but I feel it does overstep on the parents and it is not apropriate for any adult to set the stage that kids are confidants of adults or that keeping a secret because an adult says so is right.  That's my two cents on the grandparenting.
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 05:33:58 pm
Hi Dirtyglassgirl :)

Am I right in thinking the reason for your no secrets from Mom is the danger of pedophiles etc?  Todays parents have a lot more to worry about.  When I was a child, all the kids from my neighborhood would go to the local park and play together.  I wouldn't let my son do that when he was a child and even less so my daughter.  Times have changed so much in the past 50 years.
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 05:39:45 pm
my entire post disappeared!  I can't believe this!!
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 05:47:47 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 05:22:32 pm
If that were the case Chickie how thin skinned do you have to be for a 4 yr old saying no thanks to an invitation to permanently scar you for life?  I'm sure you are right though, despite my efforts as a young bride, she always said she felt unwelcome at our home, to other people.  I always treated her as best I could, made her coffee, snacks etc.  I don't know what else I could have done.


In a nutshell what I was trying to say is when we think we're not wanted as GP's, we run and hide.  We think when a child
says, "no thanks", it is coming from you.  We think he is saying what he's heard at home, that we are bad. 

When we don't feel welcome, we don't go.  We hide.  It's scary to go somewhere where we are not wanted.  I know it
is for me. 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 06:01:56 pm
That's true Anna, secrets can be fun and it's good if children feel they can trust someone.  For example my son is more comfortable confiding in me than he is my husband.  He was also aware that my husband and I share everything especially pertaining to the children (you know there should be an adjective for nearly adult and adult children that isn't children!).  When he got to his teens I made a deal with him, that every day type stuff, like girls he liked and asked advice about, I would keep to myself, however if he told me something I felt his father should know about, I'd tell him this is something I need to tell your Dad and why.  It was part of him growing up and being able to have the expectation of a certain level of privacy.  My husband is aware of the deal.

Sometimes it's easier to tell someone else who you trust other than a parent.  I understand that.

Please understand, I have no fear that my Mother in law could ever replace me in my children's hearts, it's never been about that.  All I have ever wanted from her is to be respected as a good mother to my children and a good wife to my husband.  Instead I was treated like an interloper, a user and she made it abundantly clear she didn't want me around.

Chickie all I can ask is why? Isn't that kind of paranoid?  I understand not going where you aren't wanted, but I really tried so hard to make her feel wanted.  Do you think that treating her as an honored guest in our home could have made her feel unwanted? Perhaps when offering her coffee I should have said the kettles on the bench help yourself and I'll have one while you're making? I don't know? 

I still think the whole dynamic is a minefield.
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 06:06:56 pm
Honestly, I don't know, Postscript..if you made her feel welcome then that's all you could have done.  I could be wrong about that.  I don't know.  It is a minefield and it doesn't need to be that way. When you have normal people in a family, it seems like
we would be able to work things out.  We just can't seem to. 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 06:10:53 pm
I'm getting beyond exhausted trying to find some way to fit into a family.  Every little way I could, I have done it.  It  just doesn't work.  My health has really taken a hit with all this.  It's a shame too. 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 06:14:16 pm
Neither do I Chickie, I do know my husband may find his mother irritating at times and avoids her, but I know in his heart that he loves her and that he would like her to love me and accept me because I am the woman he chose to spend his life with and he loves me too.  He says nobody would be good enough for any of her children in her eyes.  That is certainly proven by her treatment of my sisters in law. 

Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 06:19:59 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 06:14:16 pm
Neither do I Chickie, I do know my husband may find his mother irritating at times and avoids her, but I know in his heart that he loves her and that he would like her to love me and accept me because I am the woman he chose to spend his life with and he loves me too.  He says nobody would be good enough for any of her children in her eyes.  That is certainly proven by her treatment of my sisters in law.


This is so important to me....do you think he does love her?  I don't understand why she can't accept you if she loves him. 
I want my kids to be happy.  I would have loved anyone they chose.  But she doesn't like us.  I know she talks about us to
him and believe me, that kills you as a Mother.  You find your son disappearing before you eyes...I'm not talking about
growing up.  Just removing himself from you as a Mother...seeing all your faults, that you know you have but are
magnified to him by her.  You would think we could overlook that but we can't.  It hurts too bad. 
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 06:39:32 pm
Chickie I think it's the same thing that kept you trying to get your Dad to say hello to you.  You wanted his love and his approval, you wanted him to show it.  I know my husband loves his mother, he always hugs her hello and he often speaks of her fondly.  I really try not to burden him with slights etc because I wouldn't like to hear someone speak ill of my parents.  For his part he refrains from speaking of my mother for much the same reasons.

Imagine you were trying to get your father to say hello to you AND your husband.  You'd not only be hurt for you, but for your husband as well.  Then add your sons to that, trying to get your father to greet you, your husband and your sons.  You'd feel hurt for them all as well as yourself. 

Someone else on a different site asked why inlaw relationships have to be different from other relationships.  If you put it in terms of a friendship, it's very rare for people to meet and become instant friends.  But that is what we expect from inlaw relationships, even worse the minute the ring goes on we expect instant familial relationships.  I think time and learning about each other and how we operate as people is the missing ingredient and I think it's missing on both sides of the equation.  For example my Mother in law never gave me any idea what to call her, the minute we married she signed Mom on her cards etc, she has never asked me and I have never called her Mom.  I think my reasons are valid that I don't.  For one, I have a mother who I call Mom and frankly the connotations I get from the name aren't that good. 2. I have a stepmother who I love very much who was in every way possible a real mother to me, I don't call her Mom.  Perhaps if my mother in law had taken a step back and looked at my relationships (of which she was aware)  she'd have talked to me before just expecting me to suddenly call her Mom?  Perhaps I should have taken the time to explain it made me uncomfortable? I think both sides need to give and take, just like any relationship.  How to get to that point right now has me stumped?
Title: Re: CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 06:48:35 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 06:39:32 pm
Chickie I think it's the same thing that kept you trying to get your Dad to say hello to you.  You wanted his love and his approval, you wanted him to show it.  I know my husband loves his mother, he always hugs her hello and he often speaks of her fondly.  I really try not to burden him with slights etc because I wouldn't like to hear someone speak ill of my parents.  For his part he refrains from speaking of my mother for much the same reasons.

Imagine you were trying to get your father to say hello to you AND your husband.  You'd not only be hurt for you, but for your husband as well.  Then add your sons to that, trying to get your father to greet you, your husband and your sons.  You'd feel hurt for them all as well as yourself. 

Someone else on a different site asked why inlaw relationships have to be different from other relationships.  If you put it in terms of a friendship, it's very rare for people to meet and become instant friends.  But that is what we expect from inlaw relationships, even worse the minute the ring goes on we expect instant familial relationships.  I think time and learning about each other and how we operate as people is the missing ingredient and I think it's missing on both sides of the equation.  For example my Mother in law never gave me any idea what to call her, the minute we married she signed Mom on her cards etc, she has never asked me and I have never called her Mom.  I think my reasons are valid that I don't.  For one, I have a mother who I call Mom and frankly the connotations I get from the name aren't that good. 2. I have a stepmother who I love very much who was in every way possible a real mother to me, I don't call her Mom.  Perhaps if my mother in law had taken a step back and looked at my relationships (of which she was aware)  she'd have talked to me before just expecting me to suddenly call her Mom?  Perhaps I should have taken the time to explain it made me uncomfortable? I think both sides need to give and take, just like any relationship.  How to get to that point right now has me stumped?


Yes, I can see that.  DIL used to call us Mom and Dad when they were dating...it made me feel bad for her Mom who she
said she didn't like.  I told her not to be that way and to love her mother. Now, her Mother is the Queen Bee. DIL was darling
to us when they were dating.  The second they married, she turned on us.

I wish it wasn't this way....maybe time will heal it.  The hate site has a whole post with many postings about the glorious
CBF now. I guess they're having a fun time reading about our heartbreak.

Time, something I'm running out of...(no, girls, this is not a poor pitiful, manipulative plea for "one last visit, please") 
maybe will heal some of this.  Let's  hope so. Too many hurts to count.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 07:04:23 pm
We can only work on ourselves Chickie  ;D
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 07:08:05 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 11, 2010, 07:04:23 pm
We can only work on ourselves Chickie  ;D
[/quote

Yes, isn't it glorious
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: dirtyglassgrl on April 11, 2010, 07:16:21 pm
I am not afraid of my children loving all their grandparents,  I have kept in touch with my ex inlaws and they see my kids regularly.  I am in touch with my parents and they see my kids and one of my dh's sets of parents interact regularly with my kids as well.  I understand that children are not possessions to be hoarded or shared, they are people and they have a right to family and a childhood of memories of postive role models.  Some of the things that bothered me about set of inlaws that we are estranged from did involve secrets with my kids.  One of the secrets was for my kids not to tell me that inlaws were driving them around with out car seats and that one child was permitted to sit on the lap of the driver.  That is unsafe and illegal where I live, and one of the other secrets was cornering my kids and asking them who their "real father" is and why am I not married to him anymore.  Secrets can make kids very uncomfortable and upset and to anwer the other previous poster some of my concerns about adults encouraging kids to keep secrets can set them up for uncomfortable situations with other adults who do not have their best interests at heart.  That is where I was coming from regarding my previous post, that's all.  I accept and understand that my kids love me even when they love other as does dh, their love for others does not take love away from me or anyone else.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 11, 2010, 07:39:03 pm
I had one of those MILs who was overly excited about the idea of grandchildren.  Specifically, she started telling me about my future children and what she was going to do with them at my wedding shower.  I wasn't pregnant.  DH and I didn't even know if we were going to definitely have kids.  But she was planning when she'd be a grandmother.  And we were going to have a boy and a girl in her mind, and she was going to take the boy fishing and play Barbies with the girl, and I was going to go back to work immediately and use her as my daycare, and she was going to do x and she was going to do y. 

Notice how none of this was ever run by me, the imaginary child's future mother.  And in my mind, if we had kids, I was going to use all of my maternity leave (as I'm doing now), and I'm going to use the day care at my work so I can still breastfeed once I'm back at work, and if my girl wants to fish or my imaginary boy wants to play Barbie, I'm fine with that and won't force them to conform to stereotypes, and so on and so forth. 

For a grandmother to be excited about having a grandchild is normal.  For a grandmother to insist they be the FIRST to hold the child, or that they be in the delivery room, or go to the OB appointments, or something else that really falls under the parents/patient's jurisdiction is going overboard.  In many cases, the problem is that the grandparents have a number of expectations that butt against the parent's expectations, and if the grandparent expects to be able to feed candy to the kids, and the parents expect to raise their kids on a strict organic diet, guess who wins?  The problems come up when the grandparents are unwilling to adjust.  If you want to give candy to show your love and have a special relationship, and the candy is a no no, then give apples.  Or pretty marbles, or those little fuzzy headed trolls, or whatever floats your boat and sticks within the parents guidelines.  I know some parents are more permissive and others have a rulebook a mile long, but at the end of the day, they do get to decide what happens with their kids.  We've seen it on here time and time again.  Cut offs, distancing, etc.  The parents can ultimately make sure that grandma never slips the kid another piece of candy again if they want to.   And for many parents, it's not about the candy, or taking the child to a movie, or whatever.  It's about saying no and having the other person respect our authority enough to say, "OK, you're the mom, what you say goes." without trying to go around us or bully us into giving in.   

So I have some sympathy for anyone dealing with an overzealous grandmother.  If I can guess the post you're referring to, the poster in question has a MIL who ripped the poster's stockings off their wall because the MIL was the only person allowed to do stockings, tried to dictate who was going to hold the poster's child after he's born, and upon hearing that the poster was pregnant exclaimed that she (the MIL) is going to have a baby.   This is not a "normal" grandma. 

As far as secrets go, my parenting books have said that for little kids, you should never teach them to keep a secret from their parents.  For a gift or surprise, you say that we'll tell daddy on April 15th or whenever you're going to give them the surprise.  That way they can be taught that you never keep a secret from mom and dad (only possibly delay the telling), which means they'll hopefully tell us if Mr. McHooney is trying to touch them in a bad place or if Johnny hits them on the playground.  I don't think my daughter will always tell me everything, and I know I can't protect her from everything, but if I can protect her in some small way from pedophiles or bullies and I don't, then I've failed as a parent. 

As far as the CBF's go, I think it's the same as when MILs say that their son "finally stood up to her".  It seems like a small victory for the DIL.  And I think that no matter what side we're on (why do there have to be sides, ugh?), whenever there's a victory, the person will be happy.  I think the title is kind of gross, but the idea isn't that foreign.  People like to win.

As far as getting offended by what kids say, kids say the darndest things and misinterpret things so much that I don't think it's wise to get offended by what a child says.  I thought this back when Anna was relating the cat story.  Her grandson said that she should leave so they could get a cat.  And it was concluded that the DIL was turning the grandson against his grandmother.  It's also possible the DIL said, "No, Tommy, we can't have a cat because it will make grandma sick." A true statement, not intended to turn Tommy against grandma but to explain the situation, and still might make Tommy say "go away, we can't have a cat because of you".  You never know what causes kids to say and think certain things.   When I was little I didn't want to go over to my aunt's house.  She was really hurt by it and finally asked why I would never go to her house and said I hated it.  It was because I got stung by a bee there.  It has nothing to do with my aunt, my mom's opinion of her (which was positive), or her house, but until she knew the reason she was hurt. 

As far as grandma showers, I'm not a huge fan.  I'm also not a huge fan of baby showers or bridal showers in general.  The wedding shower I had was at the insistance of my MOH and my MIL.  I opted to have my friends get together for a girls day instead of a baby shower.  I just don't like anything that puts an obligation on someone to buy a gift.  I'm weird like that.   I guess it's just something about how registries and gift cards seem to be replacing thought and a genuine desire to give. 

Wow, what I thought would be a quick response has turned into an essay.  These are my opinions off the cuff (and written quickly while my daughter grabs a few zzzs).  Can't say they're worth the internet space they occupy, but there they are. 

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 11, 2010, 08:07:29 pm
Quote from: clover on April 11, 2010, 07:39:03 pm
I had one of those MILs who was overly excited about the idea of grandchildren.  Specifically, she started telling me about my future children and what she was going to do with them at my wedding shower.  I wasn't pregnant.  DH and I didn't even know if we were going to definitely have kids.  But she was planning when she'd be a grandmother.  And we were going to have a boy and a girl in her mind, and she was going to take the boy fishing and play Barbies with the girl, and I was going to go back to work immediately and use her as my daycare, and she was going to do x and she was going to do y. 

Notice how none of this was ever run by me, the imaginary child's future mother.  And in my mind, if we had kids, I was going to use all of my maternity leave (as I'm doing now), and I'm going to use the day care at my work so I can still breastfeed once I'm back at work, and if my girl wants to fish or my imaginary boy wants to play Barbie, I'm fine with that and won't force them to conform to stereotypes, and so on and so forth. 

For a grandmother to be excited about having a grandchild is normal.  For a grandmother to insist they be the FIRST to hold the child, or that they be in the delivery room, or go to the OB appointments, or something else that really falls under the parents/patient's jurisdiction is going overboard.  In many cases, the problem is that the grandparents have a number of expectations that butt against the parent's expectations, and if the grandparent expects to be able to feed candy to the kids, and the parents expect to raise their kids on a strict organic diet, guess who wins?  The problems come up when the grandparents are unwilling to adjust.  If you want to give candy to show your love and have a special relationship, and the candy is a no no, then give apples.  Or pretty marbles, or those little fuzzy headed trolls, or whatever floats your boat and sticks within the parents guidelines.  I know some parents are more permissive and others have a rulebook a mile long, but at the end of the day, they do get to decide what happens with their kids.  We've seen it on here time and time again.  Cut offs, distancing, etc.  The parents can ultimately make sure that grandma never slips the kid another piece of candy again if they want to.   And for many parents, it's not about the candy, or taking the child to a movie, or whatever.  It's about saying no and having the other person respect our authority enough to say, "OK, you're the mom, what you say goes." without trying to go around us or bully us into giving in.   

So I have some sympathy for anyone dealing with an overzealous grandmother.  If I can guess the post you're referring to, the poster in question has a MIL who ripped the poster's stockings off their wall because the MIL was the only person allowed to do stockings, tried to dictate who was going to hold the poster's child after he's born, and upon hearing that the poster was pregnant exclaimed that she (the MIL) is going to have a baby.   This is not a "normal" grandma. 

As far as secrets go, my parenting books have said that for little kids, you should never teach them to keep a secret from their parents.  For a gift or surprise, you say that we'll tell daddy on April 15th or whenever you're going to give them the surprise.  That way they can be taught that you never keep a secret from mom and dad (only possibly delay the telling), which means they'll hopefully tell us if Mr. McHooney is trying to touch them in a bad place or if Johnny hits them on the playground.  I don't think my daughter will always tell me everything, and I know I can't protect her from everything, but if I can protect her in some small way from pedophiles or bullies and I don't, then I've failed as a parent. 

As far as the CBF's go, I think it's the same as when MILs say that their son "finally stood up to her".  It seems like a small victory for the DIL.  And I think that no matter what side we're on (why do there have to be sides, ugh?), whenever there's a victory, the person will be happy.  I think the title is kind of gross, but the idea isn't that foreign.  People like to win.

As far as getting offended by what kids say, kids say the darndest things and misinterpret things so much that I don't think it's wise to get offended by what a child says.  I thought this back when Anna was relating the cat story.  Her grandson said that she should leave so they could get a cat.  And it was concluded that the DIL was turning the grandson against his grandmother.  It's also possible the DIL said, "No, Tommy, we can't have a cat because it will make grandma sick." A true statement, not intended to turn Tommy against grandma but to explain the situation, and still might make Tommy say "go away, we can't have a cat because of you".  You never know what causes kids to say and think certain things.   When I was little I didn't want to go over to my aunt's house.  She was really hurt by it and finally asked why I would never go to her house and said I hated it.  It was because I got stung by a bee there.  It has nothing to do with my aunt, my mom's opinion of her (which was positive), or her house, but until she knew the reason she was hurt. 

As far as grandma showers, I'm not a huge fan.  I'm also not a huge fan of baby showers or bridal showers in general.  The wedding shower I had was at the insistance of my MOH and my MIL.  I opted to have my friends get together for a girls day instead of a baby shower.  I just don't like anything that puts an obligation on someone to buy a gift.  I'm weird like that.   I guess it's just something about how registries and gift cards seem to be replacing thought and a genuine desire to give. 

Wow, what I thought would be a quick response has turned into an essay.  These are my opinions off the cuff (and written quickly while my daughter grabs a few zzzs).  Can't say they're worth the internet space they occupy, but there they are.


Clover, I was trying to name all the non-existent kids too, which DIL found funny. One of the names, though, she did
name on of her sons.  Thank goodness she liked it.  I was so excited and was looking at names, we both were.

I didn't get to hold the baby first. I never thought of doing that.  I don't know what else to say except when we made
mistakes, we were not aware they were mistakes. We are all learning from each other and I think that is the first
positive step we've made as a group. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 11, 2010, 08:19:30 pm
I think if your DIL is also talking about kids, that's one thing.  To be at her wedding shower and start talking about kids that she's not even planning to have it another. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: dirtyglassgrl on April 12, 2010, 11:05:18 am
I have never heard of a grandma shower either maybe it is the location where I live that does not do that?  I am not sure what it is.  If gma is going to babysit the new baby that often that she is going to need a crib and playpen perhaps parents should buy her one to thank her for the childcare?  And if she is not going to have baby that often or long maybe just have mom and dad bring a swing over when they visit?  I always took a swing with me for my kids when I went to former inlaws.  They never asked to make a room for my kids there and I never thought of it.  They kept one bottle and one formula at their house and a pack of diapers and wipes.  I always brought a diaper bag with extra clothes etc.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Carmexx on April 12, 2010, 12:02:14 pm
This topic stirs up old wounds for me!

I've talked about this before, but when I was pregnant with my son, my MIL was not nice to me at all.  She would tell me to "control" myself when I had nausea, would tell my BIL and her friends that she thought I was faking my symptoms, and she didn't even wish me happy b-day (even though we lived together) the first birthday after I was married.

Then my son was born after a long labor, and she tried to take my son from me. She would lock herself in her room with him at night and not come out until almost noon the next day. I was livid, livid, livid, but I was so scared that I didn't know how to stop this. This happened like 3 weeks, but it seemed like an eternity. Now (3 and a half years later) I would have never allowed this to have happened, but at the time I didn't know what to do. That stopped (her locking herself with him), but it still seemed like a fight over who would hold the baby or care for him. She would always get mad when I would get him, and my DH didn't help at all because he would always ask her whether the baby should eat or what should he wear, etc.

Things came to a head one day, and she left for almost a year. Once she came back, everything got better. Although we still have our issues, things have gotten remarkably better.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Carmexx on April 12, 2010, 12:44:12 pm
I forgot to add, even though what happened was hard and really did feel like a minefield, I don't know that it was entirely inevitable. I think it is a necessary rough first patch you have to cross before it gets easier. Perhaps it could have been a little smoother, but not entirely.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 12, 2010, 01:02:03 pm
I've actually been to three grandma showers for people in a club I'm in.  Two of them were nice happy affairs.  We ate cake, drank punch, chatted with our friend who was becoming a grandma, and gave her little gifts (books, little toys, baby spoons, etc) to celebrate the coming arrival.  The pregnant mom (daughter for one, DIL for the other) came and all was nice and happy. 

For the third, it was just a really awkward thing.  The woman, who is fairly controlling in our club, was just the same way about her coming grandchild.  She had a registry (the other two women did not) where she listed a crib, changing table, and the things needed if you're bringing a baby home, not babysitting.  She, in the course of the party, managed to comment on how she was going to keep her daughter from breastfeeding so she could feed the baby, too.  On how her granddaughter was going to be baptized Catholic regardless of the fact that her D and SIL were now Methodist, and then related the story about how she ambushed her D and SIL at their OB appointment because they said she couldn't be there but this is her baby, too, so she should get to see the ultrasound.  We all just sort of sat there and stared at our plates not knowing what to say.  It doesn't surprise me she's like this because she's like this about everything, but I can see how some of these DILs would be complaining if they had her as a MIL.  She only has daugthers, but I don't think that makes her any more "safe" since she's said her daughter has told her off and taken a break from her, too. 

I think in many ways, grandma showers can be great things or terrible things depending on who it's for.  And MILs or DILs can be great people or terrible people depending on who they are, not the title assigned.  It stinks that we got the short end of the stick in our respective departments. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 12, 2010, 01:14:47 pm
I've never heard of the Grandma Shower before. I wonder if there's a "Your Kids Have Grown and Moved Out, Now You need New Towels, Silverware, Dishes, & Sheets" Shower???  I could use a nice omelette pan, some lovely new hand towels, and some new everyday dishes. LOL!
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 12, 2010, 01:47:32 pm
Pent, you just summed up why I don't really like showers in general.  I just feel like I'm saying gimme gimme.  I enjoy going to most of the ones I'm invited to (unless I'm invited to one where I've never heard of the bride and groom and realize I am a coworker of their second cousin once removed.), but I am happy to give them a gift and would have felt moved to anyway.  I do think that they take some of the thought and spontaneity out of giving.  But if they're here to stay, then bring on the "My kids moved out shower".  I think I'll also have a reverse "Clean my House" shower where the guests get to come and take things home so I can get rid of things without having to drive to Good Will.  What other parties can we think of?  I think I have an extra cast iron skillet if you're looking to get one. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 12, 2010, 02:13:15 pm
Clover, thanks, but I don't need cast iron. I'm sure you'll find a nice home for it :) My DS & DIL totally scored between two showers and the wedding - when I got married I received a few little things, but DS & DIL ended up with appliances (small and large), full sets of cookware, tableware, money, etc. etc. She got spa days, lingerie, all kinds of high-end foo-foo stuff. Now they have those price guns you can take around when you register; I think people get a bit trigger-happy, but that's good for the economy, right?

It was then very hurtful when DIL announced that she hated our friends (and us) after receiving such a bounty (all of it registered for, so her exchanging some of it made no sense.) I'm realizing she was raised to be a spoiled princess and shall probably remain one for years to come. It would be hilarious if it didn't also mean we were being distanced from DS & probably FGC. I really don't understand selfish people.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 12, 2010, 03:05:29 pm
Quote from: penstamen on April 12, 2010, 02:13:15 pm
Clover, thanks, but I don't need cast iron. I'm sure you'll find a nice home for it :) My DS & DIL totally scored between two showers and the wedding - when I got married I received a few little things, but DS & DIL ended up with appliances (small and large), full sets of cookware, tableware, money, etc. etc. She got spa days, lingerie, all kinds of high-end foo-foo stuff. Now they have those price guns you can take around when you register; I think people get a bit trigger-happy, but that's good for the economy, right?

It was then very hurtful when DIL announced that she hated our friends (and us) after receiving such a bounty (all of it registered for, so her exchanging some of it made no sense.) I'm realizing she was raised to be a spoiled princess and shall probably remain one for years to come. It would be hilarious if it didn't also mean we were being distanced from DS & probably FGC. I really don't understand selfish people.


I wanted to reply to all of you but I am having such a hard time getting over another bout of COPD.  It has taken me down,
down. 

I was reading about the bounty your DIL and son got....oh boy, you wouldn't believe all the stuff both mine got.  Pen,
it hurts my heart that she said she didn't like your friends or you.  Isn't this the strangest world we live in?  It makes
life not worth it sometimes.

The DILs, some of them, take our sons with them when they go.  It would be fine if they didn't.  We would never have
known either one of them.  I know it's been hard for both sons to be distant toward us.  My husband says it will not
destroy his life...I can't be like that.  It makes me sad, so sad.  I see them but it is so different.  All eyes are on the little
ladies who constantly watch for any attention paid to us.  It's easy to tell they aren't supposed to do that.

Why? Why is this happening?  I hear of it but never dreamed of it happening to us.  First DIL is a good woman.  She just
is terribly threatened by me.  Second DIL is a good woman but she is the most self-centered person known to humanity. 
She is a spoiled brat.  Easier for me to get along with but terribly spoiled. 

In the end, the threatened DIL takes her husband and the steps of the plan to unhook him from his family are set in
place...firmly.  I am telling you, those steps I first wrote are the real deal.  Some of them will work till it's completed just
because they are threatened.  Were any of you threatened by your MILs?  I was not threatened.  Did she talk about
things that were so dull that my head split open?  Yes, she did.  She discussed the food she cooked like it was a soap
opera coming on 5 nights a week. 

I came from a dysfunctional feeling family. She didn't.  Anything feeling was scary to her.  I asked the poor thing where she
and FIL met?  Oh my Lord!!! TMI.  Too personal.  "that's kind of personal, don't you think?"

That did scare me, come to think of it.  I used to sit at the table and listen to how the butter beans were made and think
"oh my Lord!! this is so interesting!" ;D   

They were good people, though.  The thought of them as being pushed out never entered my mind.  Why would I do that?
They were his family members.  I'm sure he wanted to shove some of mine over a cliff but he didn't.   It's just a different
world, I guess.  I think people have changed and not in a good way.  All special or sacred things are pretty much gone.
Totally a "me" time.  My brother calls these kinds of people the 3 tenors...."me", "me" and "me". 

I wanted to talk about The Real Housewives of New York City and New Jersey...those are the ones I watch but I am
not feeling well today.  I love to watch those totally self-absobed ladies be totally self-absorbed. They don't have DILs.
Most of them have Daughters.  They will be fine forever!!  I love the way Teresa of New Jersey turned the entire table
over at the restaurant....she seemed so sweet till Danielle made her mad.   Bethenny of New York is my fav...she is so
funny.  Jill is great but I'm mad at her right now because she's not nice to Bethenny. Hello?  I've lost my mind?  :P
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 12, 2010, 04:34:07 pm
Chickie, it's so funny to find out about people's "vices." I'll have to check out the Real Housewives sometime. Right now I'm loving Glee and old Gilmore Girl reruns when I can catch them. Sorry :(

Yup, it's sad to hear awful things said about you when you've done everything you could to be accepting and loving. If I had done or said something I could apologize for, I'd do it ASAP. However, she doesn't like who we are. How do I change that? DS still loves us - we all just ignore DIL's rudeness and keep on going these days!

Chickie, when you had the epiphany regarding how your DSs still loved you, it was emotional and hopeful to me, too. I hope you still know it's true. Still hurts though.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 12, 2010, 04:41:22 pm
Quote from: penstamen on April 12, 2010, 04:34:07 pm
Chickie, it's so funny to find out about people's "vices." I'll have to check out the Real Housewives sometime. Right now I'm loving Glee and old Gilmore Girl reruns when I can catch them. Sorry :(

Yup, it's sad to hear awful things said about you when you've done everything you could to be accepting and loving. If I had done or said something I could apologize for, I'd do it ASAP. However, she doesn't like who we are. How do I change that? DS still loves us - we all just ignore DIL's rudeness and keep on going these days!

Chickie, when you had the epiphany regarding how your DSs still loved you, it was emotional and hopeful to me, too. I hope you still know it's true. Still hurts though.


I would apologize too, Pen. It galls me so much, though that I just can't stand the thought of it.  I know they still love
me....but I think my expectations were so high. I thought families stayed together and were there for each other. I
have given everything to them in babysitting, all those things. 

It's hard when you know you've done nothing but the thing is they know that.  It's very hard.  I keep going over and over
every detail and I have to stop before it takes my life.  The DILs most likely would love that.  I hope to keep living to
drive them nuts. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 05:52:00 am
Quote from: Anna on April 13, 2010, 05:40:52 am
I still don't get "grandma showers", I think they would be totally ridiculous.  Only if grandma suddenly had to have her grandkids 24/7 might she need this, & even then I don't think so !!  Baby showers, IMO, are for Mommy's & Daddy's.  Not for grandparents.  I don't get it.
My dil registered for their wedding & was truly trigger happy, but  did not expect to get everything she pointed that little gun at.  (I think).  We went to the store with them & we had a great time watching them dream about what they wanted after they were married.  We had a truly great relationship with our dil until our first gc was born.  We did a lot of fun things together.  I fondly remember those days !!!
Carmexx, I don't understand why your mil would tell you to control yourself when you had nausea, that's impossible.   Maybe she didn't have morning sickness & doesn't understand what you went thro.  I was one of the lucjy ones & never got sick, but I watched my sister throw up, a lot, & I cried for her.  She was extremely sick. 
Pen, I want a my kids are grown up & moved out shower, I would like to travel so cash only please !!!  LOL  Can you imagine ??   Gimme, gimme seems to be what a lot of the young people are all about, some of them, not all of them.  I had a bridal shower & one baby shower.  I got things I actually needed cause I needed everything.  I lived with my parents until I married at the age of nineteen.  No foo foo stuff, I got a care basket of cleaning supplies for a wedding shower gift & I was happy.  It would have cost a bundle for me to buy all the things I needed to clean the apartment & we didn't have much money to spare back then. 
Chickie, I sure hope you are feeling better.   I was talking to my nephews new wife the other day & she was telling me that her hubby is not as close to his family (my sister, brother, & nephew-in-law), as he once was.  Plan in motion?


Dear Anna,
I had no idea the Grandma showers were an issue at all.  Here, it is done with all the love in the world....the DILs are
excited that the new 1st time Grandma is participating in it!   It's a lot of fun and we usually do it with a small group of 1st timers.

It usually consists of little things like diapers, a blanket or two, books, lots of books and nothing at all that would be considered over the top.

Seems like all my friends are excited about being a Grandmother for the 1st time and it's only a chance to get together celebrate.  Nothing more.  I think I'm going to talk to the next group who wants to do this. They are not aware it's a problem either.

We always enjoy each other and have lots of fun.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: cremebrulee on April 13, 2010, 06:03:52 am
I have never heard of a grandma shower until now...not that I remember?  And I could be wrong, perhaps I have and forgot, however, and I'm not saying I'm right...whatever works, but I myself, couldn't have one....I'd feel terrible asking people for gifts...especially at my age...and I can understand how some could get into it and enjoy it...I just couldn't, and I'm not saying I'm right and anyone else who believes int hem is wrong...
it's simply the way I feel about it...


Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 06:16:13 am
Quote from: cremebrulee on April 13, 2010, 06:03:52 am
I have never heard of a grandma shower until now...not that I remember?  And I could be wrong, perhaps I have and forgot, however, and I'm not saying I'm right...whatever works, but I myself, couldn't have one....I'd feel terrible asking people for gifts...especially at my age...and I can understand how some could get into it and enjoy it...I just couldn't, and I'm not saying I'm right and anyone else who believes int hem is wrong...
it's simply the way I feel about it...


Creme, honestly, these are simply to get together and have fun with the soon to be Grandma for the first time.  She just
gets inexpensive things that she might use when she babysits.  We eat cake that has, "New Grandma ******" on it.
I can't believe this is an issue.  I have given all my friends one.  Come to think of it, though, I don't think I had one!  Drats!!

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: doormat on April 13, 2010, 06:19:03 am
Regarding the original topic- "the glorious CBF".... 

1)  You haven't the slightest clue what the history is behind that DIL's relationship with her MIL.  Unless you'd like to have all your comments about your "mutant freakoid" DIL taken out of context and repeated on another website without your permission, I'd like to encourage you to exercise a little compassion and restraint toward others that may very well have it just as bad, if not possibly worse, than you.

2)  The members on that site you mentioned are forbidden to bring posts from other websites - like THIS one - over there because the operators and most members feel it cheapens the site and the purpose for it being there as a source of support.  How do you think it reflects on you when you do that here? 

Unless I'm mistaken- and by all means let me know if I am- this site exists to lend support and acceptance to people in a difficult and frustrating situation.  If the purpose has changed and this site is now a place to dissect and degrade all DILs no matter how ridiculous their circumstances, then count me out.   Posts like this one do nothing but affirm the bad reputation that many MILs have.

If you need to vent and cry about the bad treatment you're receiving from your DILs- or anyone else for that matter- then by all means have at it.  The ladies here, I'm sure, wouldn't hesitate to lend an understanding hug to help you overcome your low points.   Otherwise, maybe you should save this for your group therapy sessions, or better yet, just understand that it isn't just MILs that have to deal with deceptive, cruel and oblivious ILs.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 13, 2010, 08:14:17 am
Doormat, it seems "the other site" encourages rude and hateful speech towards MILs...one category is called Frequent Fry-her, for example. Even the site name is inflammatory. I remember being shocked that the site was run by a psychology professional! It was so hateful. As a DIL and a MIL I couldn't understand the attitude of most of the DILs who posted. I never felt that way about my MIL or ex-MIL. The ex-MIL was really mean to me, but I never disrespected her or called her names. I tried to find common ground and kept on as if she weren't rude and hurtful.

We don't have anything like that here. We don't have rude names like Cat Butt Face for DILs expressions. We may discuss DILs rudeness and poor behavior, but we don't condone hate speech. I've not been there since I joined here, so maybe it's different now, but the feeling I got over there at the time was that DILs would just as soon MILs disappear whereas here most MILs would just like some access to their DSs and GC.

I may be a little blind to what's being said here since I do prefer this site, but what I know for sure is that Luise and Kirk were very careful to set this site up as a safe, positive place for communication, support and wisdom. Occasionally we might see frustration take an angry turn, but for the most part I think we've avoided the denigrating, harsh, uncompassionate tone the other site seems to have.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 08:27:59 am
Quote from: penstamen on April 13, 2010, 08:14:17 am
Doormat, it seems "the other site" encourages rude and hateful speech towards MILs...one category is called Frequent Fry-her, for example. Even the site name is inflammatory. I remember being shocked that the site was run by a psychology professional! It was so hateful. As a DIL and a MIL I couldn't understand the attitude of most of the DILs who posted. I never felt that way about my MIL or ex-MIL. The ex-MIL was really mean to me, but I never disrespected her or called her names. I tried to find common ground and kept on as if she weren't rude and hurtful.

We don't have anything like that here. We don't have rude names like Cat Butt Face for DILs expressions. We may discuss DILs rudeness and poor behavior, but we don't condone hate speech. I've not been there since I joined here, so maybe it's different now, but the feeling I got over there at the time was that DILs would just as soon MILs disappear whereas here most MILs would just like some access to their DSs and GC.

I may be a little blind to what's being said here since I do prefer this site, but what I know for sure is that Luise and Kirk were very careful to set this site up as a safe, positive place for communication, support and wisdom. Occasionally we might see frustration take an angry turn, but for the most part I think we've avoided the denigrating, harsh, uncompassionate tone the other site seems to have.


Penstamen, it is so beyond belief that they state and are allowed to state there.... that they wish the old bag was dead and will flick
on her grave...things that make you sick.  I was shocked too that they promote a book written by a Dr. (?) who is supposed
to have all the answers.  They want you to buy that book....no thank you. 

If you try to go on it, they ban you...!  What amazes me is that anytime you get a group together and they state in a crual
way how they feel, it's easy to get others to chime in and say, "yes, you go girl, you're right...she has no rights to your
life!!! She wants your womb...!!!  She tries to come over, it ain't gonna happen.  DH can either get on board or DUH can
get out!! It's best to let DH see what's going on for himself.  (tee hee)"  It's the craziest thing I've ever seen.  Then, they all agree with each other. 

I am so amazed that we have a group of people here who don't say things like that, even if they're seething inside. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Laila9 on April 13, 2010, 08:37:59 am
I've just been to look at the "other site" and I see where Doormat is coming from!

Yes they do say some hateful and nasty things about their MILs (some of it may be deserving - I know if my MIL had purposefully poisoned me so I had a miscarriage and then bragged about it to my OH then I'd say some pretty evil things too! and she would darn well deserve them!)

But they don't under any circumstances talk about the posters here! Their comments are not personal attacks on us! 

I agree with Doormat that it would be respectful for us to do the same and not repeat their stories or comments here - or it makes us seem like the bad ones!

I was also very shocked at the post by a MIL over there who just baited the DILs and then stuck her fingers in her metaphorical ears to all their explanations - then insulted them to top it off! I really do hope that wasn't one of our posters as it was a very horrible way to behave!!

Lets please keep this as the lovely supportive community that enticed me to join!
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 08:45:34 am
Quote from: Laila9 on April 13, 2010, 08:37:59 am
I've just been to look at the "other site" and I see where Doormat is coming from!

Yes they do say some hateful and nasty things about their MILs (some of it may be deserving - I know if my MIL had purposefully poisoned me so I had a miscarriage and then bragged about it to my OH then I'd say some pretty evil things too! and she would darn well deserve them!)

But they don't under any circumstances talk about the posters here! Their comments are not personal attacks on us! 

I agree with Doormat that it would be respectful for us to do the same and not repeat their stories or comments here - or it makes us seem like the bad ones!

I was also very shocked at the post by a MIL over there who just baited the DILs and then stuck her fingers in her metaphorical ears to all their explanations - then insulted them to top it off! I really do hope that wasn't one of our posters as it was a very horrible way to behave!!

Lets please keep this as the lovely supportive community that enticed me to join!


You're right, Laila...they were stopped from posting there about this site.  We're unique in that we do try to
understand where everyone is coming from.  I'm glad about that.  I guess all comments should stop about it.  Just be
glad we have what we have. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: dirtyglassgrl on April 13, 2010, 09:34:00 am
Ya'll are not going to like this but I do think it is wrong to bring stuff from other sites on to this one.  Especially stuff that is just not helpful and is in fact inflammatory.  If they are doing that to us, then they are wrong too, but I am not going to participate in that.  If I wanted to read things from their site I would go there.  I also think it was wrong of whomever went on another site and baited them all.  Be glad of what you have and leave others alone.  If you don't like it do not go there.  Sorry but I am just trying to be honest with ya'll, it serves no purpose.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 13, 2010, 09:56:04 am
You're right, we're better than that. It hurts feelings and creates anger. I don't go there for that very reason.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: MLW07 on April 13, 2010, 10:15:52 am
"CBF" is not cat butt face it is "can't be f*cked."  I agree no one should discuss what is going on each others sites.  You can't imagine the pain that me
and other DIL's have been handed from our MIL; just like I can never fully imagine the pain you all have been handed.  I my self have had to deal with a
very evil woman.  My husband is so hurt by his mom and his whole family...that he questions whether they ever loved him at all.  I am not inocent and have
contributed to the mess we are in, but in my DH's eyes and mine I/we have only tried to fix things and make things right.  I wish we could have a great relationship with my DH's family instead of a 2 year cutoff, but we can't.  I wanted nothing more than to have a MIL that was my friend and family, but she couldn't accept me having a relatinship with my family.  I was expected to dump mine all together.  My DH gave up after his mom told him its either her or us.  He said the choice was easy, although not easy to handle.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 11:25:27 am
The difference between that site and this site is that "here" Everyone (both mil, dil) is welcome. You can talk about anything and receive compassion.
If something is brought here from there it is usually a concept (something said there)  that person may see a need to discuss here. I have never posted there,ever. I know my views are very different. My comfort zone is here to post and discuss. We are only looking for answers.

I don't think we need to discuss a certain posters story from that site here...

And...that rule about them posting about our stories is very recent.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: doormat on April 13, 2010, 11:39:27 am
Quote from: penstamen on April 13, 2010, 08:14:17 am
Doormat, it seems "the other site" encourages rude and hateful speech towards MILs...one category is called Frequent Fry-her, for example. Even the site name is inflammatory. I remember being shocked that the site was run by a psychology professional! It was so hateful. As a DIL and a MIL I couldn't understand the attitude of most of the DILs who posted. I never felt that way about my MIL or ex-MIL. The ex-MIL was really mean to me, but I never disrespected her or called her names. I tried to find common ground and kept on as if she weren't rude and hurtful.

We don't have anything like that here. We don't have rude names like Cat Butt Face for DILs expressions. We may discuss DILs rudeness and poor behavior, but we don't condone hate speech. I've not been there since I joined here, so maybe it's different now, but the feeling I got over there at the time was that DILs would just as soon MILs disappear whereas here most MILs would just like some access to their DSs and GC.

I may be a little blind to what's being said here since I do prefer this site, but what I know for sure is that Luise and Kirk were very careful to set this site up as a safe, positive place for communication, support and wisdom. Occasionally we might see frustration take an angry turn, but for the most part I think we've avoided the denigrating, harsh, uncompassionate tone the other site seems to have.



Once again-  It.  Is.  Not.  About.  You. 

Jerks come in all ages and sizes.   The oh-so-offensive frequent fry her section?  You should feel nothing but pity for those posters.  Those are the unfortunate souls who have MILs who have repeatedly and deliberately degraded, insulted, excluded and overruled so many times it's a wonder they haven't changed their names and relocated just to escape.

I don't know if this was her intent but your buddy's repeated rehashing of that site over here has made her a subject all her own. 

If you wanted attention, you got it. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 11:52:38 am
Quote from: doormat on April 13, 2010, 11:39:27 am
Quote from: penstamen on April 13, 2010, 08:14:17 am
Doormat, it seems "the other site" encourages rude and hateful speech towards MILs...one category is called Frequent Fry-her, for example. Even the site name is inflammatory. I remember being shocked that the site was run by a psychology professional! It was so hateful. As a DIL and a MIL I couldn't understand the attitude of most of the DILs who posted. I never felt that way about my MIL or ex-MIL. The ex-MIL was really mean to me, but I never disrespected her or called her names. I tried to find common ground and kept on as if she weren't rude and hurtful.

We don't have anything like that here. We don't have rude names like Cat Butt Face for DILs expressions. We may discuss DILs rudeness and poor behavior, but we don't condone hate speech. I've not been there since I joined here, so maybe it's different now, but the feeling I got over there at the time was that DILs would just as soon MILs disappear whereas here most MILs would just like some access to their DSs and GC.

I may be a little blind to what's being said here since I do prefer this site, but what I know for sure is that Luise and Kirk were very careful to set this site up as a safe, positive place for communication, support and wisdom. Occasionally we might see frustration take an angry turn, but for the most part I think we've avoided the denigrating, harsh, uncompassionate tone the other site seems to have.



Once again-  It.  Is.  Not.  About.  You. 

Jerks come in all ages and sizes.   The oh-so-offensive frequent fry her section?  You should feel nothing but pity for those posters.  Those are the unfortunate souls who have MILs who have repeatedly and deliberately degraded, insulted, excluded and overruled so many times it's a wonder they haven't changed their names and relocated just to escape.

I don't know if this was her intent but your buddy's repeated rehashing of that site over here has made her a subject all her own. 

If you wanted attention, you got it.


I think we're dealing with different classes of people.  I can't imagine a grown woman/Mother doing the things you said
were done to these women.  But, then I do undertstand because some of those things have been done to us...just not some
of the extremes like you've seen. Mostly we've been ignored and forgotten. (sometimes I think that's worse)

Classless people come in all age groups.  I don't think I realized that, living in a bubble of nice people and knowing only
people who genuinely wanted to love a new DIL.....I guess that accounts for the hatred coming from those places.  Maybe
their MILs don't have class?  That has to be it. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: doormat on April 13, 2010, 12:09:26 pm
sigh....you know you're the buddy to which i was referring to.....i could be wrong, but i'm betting everyone be happier if the 2 sites were kept separate and no one dragged their issues to hostile territory.  just a random thought. 

i'm outta here.  i'm totally drama'd out for the day.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 13, 2010, 12:32:20 pm
Doormat, I can *sigh* too, but I choose not to because that would be rude and possibly hurtful. I can also use rude punctuation, but I choose not to for the same reason.

I wasn't comparing MILs and DILs, or saying one was better than the other. The tone of the two different sites was being compared, that's all. I think you've proven the point a lot of us are trying to make about communication differences. No drama coming from me!
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Enough on April 13, 2010, 03:51:56 pm
Whomever stated that "jerks come in all sizes" hit the nail on the head.  It is unfortunate that some poster (yes I know who you are) chose to post on another site, insult everyone on it and then drag the carcass back here to dissect.

This seemed to be a site I could come to, and get good, well rounded advice.  But it seems that is not the case.  You (the poster who did it) have tarnished all the good, that many others on here have tried to accomplish. 

Shame on you.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 04:23:06 pm
You know the other site doesn't encourage anything other than self expression.  People say things when they are angry or upset that they normally wouldn't.  A little compassion would go a long way when reading such posts.

Someone went there with an agenda and a closed mind, that now reflects upon us all, and badly.  The writing style and turn of phrase is all too familiar I'm afraid.  What that person did cheapens us all. Discussing a concept is one thing, going to another site with diametrically opposite views and spouting off is a completely different thing.  The poster that went there wasn't interested in learning anything, had she been, judging by many of the responses, she would have learned about some of the pain the other side suffer.

I won't be back to these boards, I will leave my account so friends can reach me via PM if they wish.  My advice to all is take a good look at your friends here, one of them has a big wooden spoon and uses it a lot.

No doubt the Personal messages will be flying now, perhaps I have lived up to the scuttlebutt that flew via personal message that I am from a hate site just here to stir up trouble.  I never was, but one of you is.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 04:43:49 pm
Postscript, I wish you would stay here and I am sorry that I've disappointed you of all people.

To all of you, of course, it was me....I used the name, "anonymousdonor" on there. 
I asked them consider that we were Mothers and to look at themselves in what they were saying. Then, when the rage began
I told them to look at themselves that they were like a bunch of rabid dogs. 

I want you to know that the webmaster banned me pretty early on.   So that won't be a problem anymore.  The problem is that one of the
posters put our sites name on there so they could click and see it.  They don't know I'm banned.  I emailed the webmaster
and told her that she might want to tell them that I was banned because surely all this publicity for this site would
not be good for business there but she has not done that.  They have royally told me off as you can see. 





Quote from: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 04:23:06 pm
You know the other site doesn't encourage anything other than self expression.  People say things when they are angry or upset that they normally wouldn't.  A little compassion would go a long way when reading such posts.

Someone went there with an agenda and a closed mind, that now reflects upon us all, and badly.  The writing style and turn of phrase is all too familiar I'm afraid.  What that person did cheapens us all. Discussing a concept is one thing, going to another site with diametrically opposite views and spouting off is a completely different thing.  The poster that went there wasn't interested in learning anything, had she been, judging by many of the responses, she would have learned about some of the pain the other side suffer.

I won't be back to these boards, I will leave my account so friends can reach me via PM if they wish.  My advice to all is take a good look at your friends here, one of them has a big wooden spoon and uses it a lot.

No doubt the Personal messages will be flying now, perhaps I have lived up to the scuttlebutt that flew via personal message that I am from a hate site just here to stir up trouble.  I never was, but one of you is.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 05:16:45 pm
Chicky, any of us could have gone there and gotten the same results as you did. Did you ever get a civil answer?  All I saw was hate.  Putting you down for not knowing every one of there stories before you posted.(all 70 or so of them). I didn't read all of it.  I didn't see a lot of compassion...one reason I would never post there.  It's OK Chicky.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 13, 2010, 05:18:56 pm
This has gotten way out of control. Let's be reasonable for a minute. Accusations are flying; but there are some things we know for sure.

When a site's name is inflammatory (no pun intended) it's not innocently encouraging free expression. Observe the graphics of that site and look at the name of this site compared to the name of that other site. Look at the category names on the other site compared to this one. The one time I stumbled upon that site (I was looking for help before I found WWU) it almost made me physically ill to read the hateful, violent things that were said about MILs who may or may not have been deserving. These are all observable.

We know Luise and Kirk, and Chickie too, set up this site to be an antidote to the negativity of other sites. They knew MILs had no place to go; we're a caricature or a joke on other sites; here we're valued as real people with hopes, dreams, and valid feelings. This is also observable by reading the mission statement and the category titles.

Chickie, I'm only sad that you put yourself in harm's way. You were just exercising your right to "freely express yourself" as the site claims to encourage, but that's not a safe place. I hope now you know where to stay for the kind, compassionate support this site gives everyone who comes in peace seeking support and wisdom.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 05:23:29 pm
Thank you so much, Rose. I would  never want to disappoint you.  I got one civil answer out of the 70.  You can see,
and I hope you all do see, what they said.  No compassion. 

Now, they are really thrilled thinking you are all telling me off.  Someone finally told them I am banned and can't respond.
I wasn't going to respond anyway.  I did want them to see what they were doing, as one of the posters there pointed
out. 






Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 05:16:45 pm
Chicky, any of us could have gone there and gotten the same results as you did. Did you ever get a civil answer?  All I saw was hate.  Putting you down for not knowing every one of there stories before you posted.(all 70 or so of them). I didn't read all of it.  I didn't see a lot of compassion...one reason I would never post there.  It's OK Chicky.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 05:25:49 pm
Thank you, Pen.  I would never want to disppoint you either.  It is unbelievable what my post brought forth.

Anonymousdonor brought forth wrath like you  have never seen before.




Quote from: penstamen on April 13, 2010, 05:18:56 pm
This has gotten way out of control. Let's be reasonable for a minute. Accusations are flying; but there are some things we know for sure.

When a site's name is inflammatory (no pun intended) it's not innocently encouraging free expression. Observe the graphics of that site and look at the name of this site compared to the name of that other site. Look at the category names on the other site compared to this one. The one time I stumbled upon that site (I was looking for help before I found WWU) it almost made me physically ill to read the hateful, violent things that were said about MILs who may or may not have been deserving. These are all observable.

We know Luise and Kirk, and Chickie too, set up this site to be an antidote to the negativity of other sites. They knew MILs had no place to go; we're a caricature or a joke on other sites; here we're valued as real people with hopes, dreams, and valid feelings. This is also observable by reading the mission statement and the category titles.

Chickie, I'm only sad that you put yourself in harm's way. You were just exercising your right to "freely express yourself" as the site claims to encourage, but that's not a safe place. I hope now you know where to stay for the kind, compassionate support this site gives everyone who comes in peace seeking support and wisdom.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 05:29:32 pm
And if the members here cannot see the difference in the 2 sites and want to leave this site for that one....then do they really want to be here? I don't know.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 1Glitterati on April 13, 2010, 05:32:44 pm
Quote from: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 05:23:29 pm
Thank you so much, Rose. I would  never want to disappoint you.  I got one civil answer out of the 70.  You can see,
and I hope you all do see, what they said.  No compassion. 

Now, they are really thrilled thinking you are all telling me off.  Someone finally told them I am banned and can't respond.
I wasn't going to respond anyway.  I did want them to see what they were doing, as one of the posters there pointed
out. 






Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 05:16:45 pm
Chicky, any of us could have gone there and gotten the same results as you did. Did you ever get a civil answer?  All I saw was hate.  Putting you down for not knowing every one of there stories before you posted.(all 70 or so of them). I didn't read all of it.  I didn't see a lot of compassion...one reason I would never post there.  It's OK Chicky.



You didn't get a civil answer because you didn't make a civil post. 

I've lurked on this board and that one...and on many of the others you and Creme have been on over the years.  After all these years you are still saying the same things over and over and over again.  Both Creme and her dil finally seem to have made some progress...and that happened because Creme was finally willing to see how her actions were perceived and why they were perceived as such.

You should be ashamed of the poor light you have cast this site in.  You should be ashamed for creating a situation that Luise will have to mop up after--especially with all the REAL problems and issues and pain she has going on in her life right now.

I hope the regulars here will not blindly accept your woe is me, I didn't know what I was doing, I have no idea why they were mean to me whine.  You knew what was going to happen when you did it.  YOu kicked sand in another kids face and they fed you your lunch for doing it.

Get off the cross, we need the wood for something else.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Marilyn on April 13, 2010, 05:45:21 pm
Chickie,what has happened to Renny and Coco?

Doe's any body know what run them off?
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 05:46:45 pm
I have not heard about Renny for so long!!  And Coco, of course too.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 05:47:47 pm
1Glitterati...and you just became a member to write a civil post I suppose.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 1Glitterati on April 13, 2010, 05:54:58 pm
Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 05:47:47 pm
1Glitterati...and you just became a member to write a civil post I suppose.


I never pretended my post was anything other than what it was.

Several of the ladies on this site have real problems that they did NOT for the most part cause.  Several ladies on here are in the situation they are in because of their OWN behavior.  Very few people on this site are willing to call another poster out when they do something inappropriate.  Enabling, many times, is the name of the game.

What Chickie did was wrong.  She knew what was going to happen when she did it.  And she knew that most, not all, of the crew here would kiss away her tears and tell her she is the victim--when in reality, in this situation, she's the bully.

How many times have people encouraged her NOT to read the dil site?  Repeatedly.  Even Luise, in her very kind and very logical way.  What she's done with this is created a major dirt storm for Luise.  She supposedly cares so much about Luise and think so highly of her and is so grateful to her.  She just threw Luise and her site under the bus.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:16:20 pm
Not for me Glitter. I can post here and get all the compassion  I'm looking for. This site heals and listens.
This is the internet...Chicky can go where ever she wants, so can I, so can you....we all all looking for answers.
All we have so do is listen to each other, have compassion and respect for each other...treat that poster the way you want to be treated.
I didn't  like what I saw coming from that site today...if it wasn't Chicky...could have been me...you ganged up on her like vultures...all because you did not like what she asked.
Please know this is my opinion and you have yours. I respect that. Thank-you
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Marilyn on April 13, 2010, 06:19:49 pm
Chickie you cared so deeply for Coco,and i now you have her e-mail address have you e-mailed her and tryed to find out what happened to her?Coco was always soooooooo concerned about you and every other member,she always worried about the way she worded her post,taking care not to hurt any one.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 06:22:11 pm
Yes, we all have emailed her. I know Creme has and I have.   


Quote from: Mominwaiting on April 13, 2010, 06:19:49 pm
Chickie you cared so deeply for Coco,and i now you have her e-mail address have you e-mailed her and tryed to find out what happened to her?Coco was always soooooooo concerned about you and every other member,she always worried about the way she worded her post,taking care not to hurt any one.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 13, 2010, 06:24:09 pm
First, to bring everyone up to speed, these are the posts we're talking about.  I've gotten some PMs asking what in the world "the other site is" and what was said. 

Post 1 by anonymous donor

"We are Mothers. I am reading what you're writing and feel like I'm dying. What do you want us to do? Be very careful about throwing out his Mother. Someday, you will become a Mother and no matter what you do, your DIL won't like you. It will break your heart. Stop and think before you do what you are doing."

Post 2 by anonymous donor

"Your webmaster invited me to post because I inquired how these kinds of statements could be said about us. She said that some of you were MILs. She also stated that you were helpful and could be kind if spoken to with respect.

Is what she said not true? I don't want to debate you or argue with you. I do want to tell you that in spite of what you might do in your life the loss of your child, even though grown, will kill you.

You feel like you have valid reasons for talking about your husband's mother in the most terrible ways.

These things we've supposedly done to you, without even knowing what we've done in our minds and hearts, might come back around to you someday; you will be on the receiving end of it. You think it can't happen but it can.

You're too young to understand how this kind of hurt can effect you but it is unbearable and makes you want to die. Life is very short but this kind of hatred is reserved for war criminals, we're Mothers who raised your husbands with the only knowledge we had at the time.

I have no idea what a troll even is. I can assure you I am not one. I will go away but just one last thing, if this comes your way someday and your heart dies, remember that I told you."

Post 3 by anonymous donor

"I can't help but say this. It amazes me to watch you and I know you'll get vile now but most of you are like a pack of wild dogs.

Would you listen to yourselves? This is a society we live in, surely you'd like to be a participant and not a rabid dog. What is wrong with you all?

Someone must have been horrible to you and I'm sorry for that but it's obvious to me that someone was very cruel because no one could be this vicious over a mother in law. Something in your lives is not right. Something far more than your husband's mother. What is it?

I've watched most of you respond and one of you was really kind, I appreciate that but most you have been vicious. I am baffled. You can dissect my statements, it doesn't bother me at all but explore yourselves and see what is really going on with you. It's frightening to see."

The first post was in response to a woman posting about detaching from her MIL.  Her MIL has done many things, the biggest I'd say was trying to abduct her children twice now, I believe.  I'll say what I said before....some DsIL stink, and it's equally true that some MsIL stink.  This website is for people whose MsIL stink.  Going on there and saying that these women are throwing out his mother, that they will one day be cast aside, and calling them rabid dogs isn't really a great way to be accepted and get a warm greeting. 

And I don't think it's fair to say that we're willing to have anyone post their opinion here.  When I first posted, people jumped all over me.  Luise locked the thread.  I didn't post again until Coco was kind enough to invite me back.  And I didn't call anyone on here a dog.  I just told my story. 

I do think this has hurt this site a bit if for no other reason than now we're exposed to the possiblity that their large list of members might try to come here and stir up the same trouble that we made there.  I hope that doesn't happen.  I am going to beg and plead with you chickie.  Don't go there.  It doesn't help you.  The responses you got don't prove all DsIL are evil any more than someone posting something insulting to MsIL here and getting a negative response would prove all MsIL are evil.  And it's just not healthy for you.  I feel like some of what you said there is what you'd like to say to your DIL.  To not throw you away and to not go on the attack.  Then say it to her.  I know you're scared to do so, but saying it to a messageboard of other DsIL won't solve your problems.  I care about you, and I don't want to to do things that are only going to hurt you. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:24:54 pm
Mominwaiting,

I would like to know why she hasn't posted lately.  I thought maybe she was busy with work or on a vacation. I do not have her email but I did start a post asking about her. If you have her email please tell her we miss her very much.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 1Glitterati on April 13, 2010, 06:33:21 pm
Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:16:20 pm
Not for me Glitter. I can post here and get all the compassion  I'm looking for. This site heals and listens.
This is the internet...Chicky can go where ever she wants, so can I, so can you....we all all looking for answers.
All we have so do is listen to each other, have compassion and respect for each other...treat that poster the way you want to be treated.
I didn't  like what I saw coming from that site today...if it wasn't Chicky...could have been me...you ganged up on her like vultures...all because you did not like what she asked.
Please know this is my opinion and you have yours. I respect that. Thank-you


And Chickie did NOT do that when she went to the dil site.  She went for the sole purpose of attacking.  If she actually wanted to know what people thought or why they thought it...she wouldn't have posted an attack.

She got a way tamer response than deserved...and some of the women actually gave her some good advice.  It's doubtful she'll hear it because it's incongruent with her perception and is going to cause major cognitive dissonance if she listens to it.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 06:39:02 pm
I would LOVE to hear her voice too.  I loved her so much, still do.




Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:24:54 pm
Mominwaiting,

I would like to know why she hasn't posted lately.  I thought maybe she was busy with work or on a vacation. I do not have her email but I did start a post asking about her. If you have her email please tell her we miss her very much.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Sassy on April 13, 2010, 06:47:36 pm
Luise has plainly asked us many, many times not to drag other websites' trash over here to the site she built with love.

There's not much point coming here, if it's all the same garbage as found everywhere else.

While she's known to be busy tending to some very serious personal issues, someone has apparently gone out of their way to stink up her beautiful place behind her back.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 1Glitterati on April 13, 2010, 06:48:38 pm
Quote from: MLW07 on April 13, 2010, 10:15:52 am
"CBF" is not cat butt face it is "can't be f*cked."


Actually...on the dil site it is cat butt face...there's a link somewhere on there for frequently used terms...it's defined right in there.

But...you are correct about what it usually means...it just doesn't mean that on the dil site.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:50:24 pm
1Glitterati,

I don't know what you  want me to say here...it happened
None of us can do today over...it is what it is
I hope it never happens again
I respect your opinion...
We are only human and can't always be perfect.
I would like to go back to reading the concerns of the wise women here and the advise we offer out of concern and compassion for each other.




Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Marilyn on April 13, 2010, 06:55:25 pm
Chickie i have to agree with clovers post,and with Glitterati.


May i suggest you make a copy of the post you wrote on that other site, and take it to your therapist.

I dont want to hurt your feelings,but you might just be addicted to Drama.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 06:56:21 pm
Rose, I wanted to ask you about your son?  How is he doing? I hope he's doing well.  :)



Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:50:24 pm
1Glitterati,

I don't know what you  want me to say here...it happened
None of us can do today over...it is what it is
I hope it never happens again
I respect your opinion...
We are only human and can't always be perfect.
I would like to go back to reading the concerns of the wise women here and the advise we offer out of concern and compassion for each other.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 1Glitterati on April 13, 2010, 06:57:48 pm
Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 06:50:24 pm
1Glitterati,

I don't know what you  want me to say here...it happened
None of us can do today over...it is what it is
I hope it never happens again
I respect your opinion...
We are only human and can't always be perfect.
I would like to go back to reading the concerns of the wise women here and the advise we offer out of concern and compassion for each other.


Rose...you are certainly right that this site offers concern and compassion many times.  Sometimes what it offers isn't concern and compassion---it's enabling. 

When someone does something bad or wrong or misguided or even stupid, we can hold them accountable and still love them.   When we don't hold those around us accountable to their actions and the consequences of those actions it isn't compassion.  It's actually very damaging because it only encourages more bad behavior.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 07:16:00 pm
Thank-you for asking Chicky
He is doing ok...waiting for his divorce to be final
He wants to move on with his life so bad.
I  have helped him take care of his son a few times on the days he has him
My grandson is such a joy.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 07:16:17 pm
When someone does something bad or wrong or misguided or even stupid, we can hold them accountable and still love them.   When we don't hold those around us accountable to their actions and the consequences of those actions it isn't compassion.  It's actually very damaging because it only encourages more bad behavior.

Glitterati1 is right.  This site has been brought into disrepute and it's safety has been compromised as a result. Poor Luise

What and how people choose to express there, should not be brought back here nor should it be question how they can be allowed to say such things, freedom of speech is guaranteed by the constitution.  Why was it? What was the intent in going there?  Especially after being asked multiple times not to? 

No we can't undo what is done, but we can and should understand it, so that history does not repeat.




Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 07:18:22 pm
Divorce is so hard on everyone. I hate that it had to come to that. I know how precious those Grandbabies are. They
are my heart.




Quote from: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 07:16:00 pm
Thank-you for asking Chicky
He is doing ok...waiting for his divorce to be final
He wants to move on with his life so bad.
I  have helped him take care of his son a few times on the days he has him
My grandson is such a joy.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Pen on April 13, 2010, 07:27:36 pm
People grow and gain insight in their own time. It's not for us to be brutal towards someone who is not growing as fast as we think they should. We offer support and gentle insight that is either ignored or acted positively on; it's not our place to denigrate.

Learning happens when stress is absent; you can't be sarcastic, mean, and brutal and expect growth to happen. Enabling means you make it possible for someone to stay stuck. I don't think anyone here has ever said, "Don't look inside yourself; don't ever change; stay stuck in your pain and misery."

BTW, what little I've seen on the other site is often inflammatory and snarky, not to mention joking about physical violence towards MILs. I think we all need to look at ourselves and be very honest about how we communicate. What kind of people do we want to be?
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 07:34:32 pm
Pen I get what you are saying, but I agree with Glitterati1 about accountablity.  When we bring up our children to take ownership of their wrongs and their mistakes.  I don't mind a mistake but I do mind when the person who made it tries to sweep it under the carpet.  Saying it could have happened to any one of us and back patting is not encouraging ownership.

I respect that Chickie stood up and said she did it.  She then however went on to excuse herself.  Ownership would be saying, I was wrong, my post was ill conceived. 

When I first posted here, I had a similar experience to Clover.  It was Coco who invited me back.

I really try to see both sides her, I think I have proved that over and over. 
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 07:38:40 pm
Quote from: penstamen on April 13, 2010, 07:27:36 pm
People grow and gain insight in their own time. It's not for us to be brutal towards someone who is not growing as fast as we think they should. We offer support and gentle insight that is either ignored or acted positively on; it's not our place to denigrate.

Learning happens when stress is absent; you can't be sarcastic, mean, and brutal and expect growth to happen. Enabling means you make it possible for someone to stay stuck. I don't think anyone here has ever said, "Don't look inside yourself; don't ever change; stay stuck in your pain and misery."

BTW, what little I've seen on the other site is often inflammatory and snarky, not to mention joking about physical violence towards MILs. I think we all need to look at ourselves and be very honest about how we communicate. What kind of people do we want to be?


Thank-you so much Pen....I agree
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 1Glitterati on April 13, 2010, 07:40:38 pm
Quote from: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 07:34:32 pm
Pen I get what you are saying, but I agree with Glitterati1 about accountablity.  When we bring up our children to take ownership of their wrongs and their mistakes.  I don't mind a mistake but I do mind when the person who made it tries to sweep it under the carpet.  Saying it could have happened to any one of us and back patting is not encouraging ownership.

I respect that Chickie stood up and said she did it.  She then however went on to excuse herself.  Ownership would be saying, I was wrong, my post was ill conceived. 

When I first posted here, I had a similar experience to Clover.  It was Coco who invited me back.



I really try to see both sides her, I think I have proved that over and over.


Exactly.  That's textbook enabling.  Maybe someone will listen if it comes from you.

ETA...the thread is now gone in totality, as if it never existed.  Maybe that will help things die down.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 07:45:14 pm
Quote from: Mominwaiting on April 13, 2010, 06:55:25 pm
Chickie i have to agree with clovers post,and with Glitterati.


May i suggest you make a copy of the post you wrote on that other site, and take it to your therapist.

I dont want to hurt your feelings,but you might just be addicted to Drama.


Mominwaiting,

Maybe all of the 70-100 people that responed to Chicky need to take it to their therapists also..there was a lot of drama...you are right
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 07:50:45 pm
RR I know you think you are helping chickie by circling the wagons, but honestly, you aren't.  Chickie came a long way the other day realizing her sons love her.   I'd like to see her go all the way to happiness.  She deserves it.

Chickie was wrong to go there and post what she did.  That's it in a nutshell.  She stood up and faced it, and you turned her away from what she was seeing, then sucked her back into the vacuum of victimhood.  She can be a victim but she'll be much happier being a survivor.  Sometimes learning is hard.

Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Marilyn on April 13, 2010, 07:54:39 pm
Redrose,i didn't say that to hurt her feelings.............i just thought since she is going to a therapist,it would help her to understand why she feels the need to go to the other sites,when she doesn't get the support she needs there.All it ever does is cause them to come here and cause us problems.I didn't mean that any other way
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Marilyn on April 13, 2010, 07:58:56 pm
And i agree with postscript,it does not benefit Chickie,she knows Luise doesn't like her going to the other sites,because she cares for Chickie very much.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: RedRose on April 13, 2010, 08:00:51 pm
Postscript,

I don't agree with you and I don't believe she did anything wrong. What was wrong was how she was treated at that site.
Yes, I agree, Chickie knows her sons love her and she deserves all the happiness in the world.
I don't believe you are helping her at all.
The reactions of the dils here are surprising to me. Chicky has shown that  she cares about all of you so much.
You all need to think about this.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 08:05:00 pm
I have thought Red Rose.  Nobody here is trying to do anything other than protect the integrity of this site and to help Chickie.  When I came here I was kicked out at one point and treated with open hostility so what makes people their reaction any worse than what I got when I came here?

You are free to disagree, not everyone subscribes to the facing the facts of life method of becoming aware.

I would ask you to ask yourself this:

Why did she go there? Why?

I for one would like to know the answer.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 13, 2010, 08:10:18 pm
I'm gobsmacked.  RR....she went to a site for DsIL who have horrible MsIL and basically said that the anger they feel couldn't possibly be due to their MsIL and must be because of some problem with them.  It would be like someone coming here and telling Chickie that since her sons and DsIL don't like her the problem must be her.  Both are mean and hurtful and shouldn't be done.  And then the posters responded by telling her to be respectful, read their stories, and basically get off their site and come back to this one.  Were some more blunt than I might be, yes.  Did I totally disagree with their sentiments, no.  I really want to understand how you feel that it wasn't wrong to go there and post.   And likewise, do you feel that if they all come here and post that the MsIL here are being mean that you'll embrace their opinions and feel that they're not doing anything wrong either?
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Postscript on April 13, 2010, 08:18:03 pm
Lets change that original post around a little

We are Mothers too. I am reading what you're writing and feel like I'm dying. What do you want us to do? Be very careful about throwing out his wife. Someday you might end up an estranged Mother in law and no matter what you do, your DIL won't like you because you threw her away. It will break your heart. Stop and think before you do what you are doing."

How would you honestly feel if that were posted under your post about how awful your daughter in law has been to you and what steps you were taking to address it?


Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: 2chickiebaby on April 13, 2010, 08:20:15 pm
No, I didn't say that, Clover.
I'd like for this to end.  I think enough has been said to me about it.  I am not a patient that anyone needs to diagnose or
call some kind of name.  That's enough.



Quote from: clover on April 13, 2010, 08:10:18 pm
I'm gobsmacked.  RR....she went to a site for DsIL who have horrible MsIL and basically said that the anger they feel couldn't possibly be due to their MsIL and must be because of some problem with them.  It would be like someone coming here and telling Chickie that since her sons and DsIL don't like her the problem must be her.  Both are mean and hurtful and shouldn't be done.  And then the posters responded by telling her to be respectful, read their stories, and basically get off their site and come back to this one.  Were some more blunt than I might be, yes.  Did I totally disagree with their sentiments, no.  I really want to understand how you feel that it wasn't wrong to go there and post.   And likewise, do you feel that if they all come here and post that the MsIL here are being mean that you'll embrace their opinions and feel that they're not doing anything wrong either?
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: Marilyn on April 13, 2010, 08:22:31 pm
Redrose,Clover and postscript have a very good point.

please help me understand your point of view,please.

how do you see this being alright?
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: willingtohelp on April 13, 2010, 08:34:06 pm
I apologize if I've misinterpreted your statements.  Please explain this one:

"Someone must have been horrible to you and I'm sorry for that but it's obvious to me that someone was very cruel because no one could be this vicious over a mother in law. Something in your lives is not right. Something far more than your husband's mother. What is it?"

I took that to mean that you feel their anger is due to something other than their MIL.
Title: Re: The Glorious CBF
Post by: luise.volta on April 13, 2010, 08:43:07 pm
Stop. Right now. Stop. Get back to what we came here for. I don't have the time or the energy to police our site until Val gets settled in at the nursing home and I recover from the paralysis of care giving too long and too hard. You know that. Please back me up until I get back on my feet.

Before I lock this topic down...I am asking the adults to stay and get back to what we're here for and will the rest of you please leave and not come back. You know who you are...stop the drama...all of you.