Dear WW,
This morning I was motivated to check out the safety of full-body x-ray scanners that are currently in use at airports. As a result of this research, I recommend that you politely refuse the scanner and ask for a pat-down check instead.
The TSA personnel will tell you that the scanners are safe. They may even give you some statistics. I can tell you that the x-ray scanners are NOT safe, and that the statistics they are using are not correct, because they are comparing different types of x-rays in their stats.
These are my reasons for recommending that you avoid the scanners:
1. The x-ray scanners use an x-ray energy that will dump all the x-rays in your skin and in a small depth beneath your skin. The skin-dump is exactly the reason they give the pictures. This is extremely dangerous for (a) people who are already at higher risk for skin cancer (melanoma), (b) children, (c) pregnant women, and (d) men's gonads.
2. A group of scientists at the University of California, San Francisco (UCSF) raised concerns about the "potential serious health risks" from the scanners in a letter sent to the White House Office of Science and Technology in April. This is what the scientists said:
__________________________
Biochemist John Sedat and his colleagues said in the letter that most of the energy from the scanners is delivered to the skin and underlying tissue.
"While the dose would be safe if it were distributed throughout the volume of the entire body, the dose to the skin may be dangerously high," they wrote.
The scientists say the X-rays could pose a risk to everyone from travelers over the age of 65 to pregnant women and their unborn babies, to HIV-positive travelers, cancer patients and men.
"Men's sexual organs are exposed to the X-rays. The skin is very thin there," Love explained
___________________________
The White House poo-pooed their concerns, giving statistics that were not relevant, because they were comparing apples to oranges, i.e. comparing x-rays that pass through the body to these "skin-dump" x-rays. The scientists are now at work on a rebuttal.
3. Cancer scientists are warning that these body scanners will statistically lead to some people getting skin cancer.
4. Pilots unions are telling their members to avoid the scanners, for the reasons given above.
5. The International Agency on Radiation Safety, composed of 14 agencies throughout the world, including the IAEA, says that these scanners should not be used on pregnant women and children. (They also should have included men!).
All the information above applies to the x-ray type of body scanner, which comprises about 2/3 of the scanners now in use at airports. Another type of scanner uses microwave radiation. The safety of this radiation is not known.
Please tell your sons and daughters. Protect their "junk"!
I am very concerned about this also. Here is a link to the
Opt out day Nov 24th.
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/say-i-opt-out-of-airport-scanners-on-national-opt-out-day-november-24-108112344.html
Here's the thing, though: I fly maybe once or twice a year, if that. I'm willing to risk the potential side effects (especially since I am exposed to tons of different kinds of radiation and chemicals daily as part of normal life, as are all of us) than have someone run their hand around my private parts. It's not a regular pat down - they actually reach between your buttocks and where your thighs meet your torso. I have a very definite negative reaction to being touched, particularly there, and would rather not endure that. I might feel differently about it if I flew weekly (although I suspect not).
Seasage,
There is an organization, FlyersRights.org, that is dealing with this and other issues, started by Kate Hanni. She was on CNN yesterday talking about this and the fact that a high government ex-official involved with homeland security is one of the principals now in one of the scanner companies making so much money off the systems.
I found this organization after a nightmare, cattle-car trip to San Diego, that I almost wondered if I would survive. My husband and I vowed if we got back home alive, that was it for flying for us. And it was. Flying is a choice; even going 1,500 miles this summer to a conference, we opted to drive. If we can't drive, we don't go.
We won't put ourselves through health hazards or embarrassing searches; Kate Hanni pointed out this is treating every flyer as a potential criminal. It's not a whole lot different than what you go through if you get arrested for a crime. I'm glad we have the choice not to fly.
Our answer may be too extreme for most, but it's what we're comfortable with at this stage. Beyond the body scans are the long waits, the
lack of food and water, filthy restrooms, exposure to all kinds of illnesses, and being jammed in without enough space in the cabin. Nothing fun about it. I arrived home from San Diego exhausted and sick for two weeks. And by far it wasn't the first time; just the last straw.
Thank you for posting this; it's good information.
Kathleen
Elsieshaye,
If I were you, I would probably make the same decision you are making. However, in my family, we have a long history of melanoma. Many family members have died in their fifties due to that cancer, including my brother, who died in august.
Kathleen,
I too drive in preference to flying whenever possible. However, our family needed that info for DS, DD, 1 remaining brother and 2 sisters, most of whom will be traveling next week. Due to past research, I was the one who was familiar with the scientific arguments and able to sort between competing claims.
I am going to check out flyersrights.org. Thank you for that information.
S---FlyersRights has updates they will send you via email. I read every one and find them very informative. Kath.
I am posting a link to a picture of the millimeter-wave full-body scanner. I have no reason to believe that this scanner is unsafe. So if you are standing in line, and a TSA agent taps you on the shoulder and invites you into one of these, I say go ahead.
http://www.sds.l-3com.com/products/i/PROV_PS_Jan2010.jpg (http://www.sds.l-3com.com/products/i/PROV_PS_Jan2010.jpg)
Here is the letter UCSF scientists sent to the White House:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3685/cancer-ray-opt-out.pdf (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3685/cancer-ray-opt-out.pdf)
And here is a great story about a man who printed out that letter and used it at the airport: http://gizmodo.com/5692198/a-tsa-success-story (http://gizmodo.com/5692198/a-tsa-success-story)
.
Hi
I like all this info. I am going to fly alot in the next week as I'm headed for India so I'll be at
a number of airport but through security twice. I'm going to opt out. No way am I going to
get xrayed. Two of my brothers died of cancer. I printed the letter and will take that too.
I will be thinking of you as you travel to India. Have a safe trip.
Seasage, I definitely see your point - if there's even a slight chance of triggering something you're already at an increased risk for, it's wise to avoid it.
Tara,
When you return from your trip, would you kindly update us on what happened? I'd be interested to know if you think there are any
changes in the way things are handled at the airports due to the recent publicity; attitudes toward it now, both passengers and personnel;also, are you prepared for the very personal body searches? A man was fined $11,000 last week for aggressively resisting the searches.
Please let us know what happens at the airports.
Thank you, and have a safe (non-cancer-causing) trip,
Kathleen
Kathleen,
yes I will let you know. I printed out the letter Seasage suggested and showed my DH and
he said he would prefer to be 'patted down'. Me too. we will see what happens.
I don't think seattle has that machine as I fly out of there several times a year, but chicago might.
I can send you an email from a cyber cafe in India? :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
I won't be back til jan 8 but thought I could occ check in via the cyber cafes.
I'm so relieved to hear that you are opting out of the machine, Tara.
Have a wonderful trip - can't wait to hear all about it and how you managed with the security issues. Best wishes!
Thank you Pen!
For a good laugh, and to keep them safe, send this link to your sons.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/11/18/jonathan-mann-tsa-song-parody_n_785274.html
.
my hubby and I chuckled at this. He's opting out next weekend too when we fly so will have to get the pat down
This issue has been all over tv today.. I watched them pat down several people and I for one would be embarrassed to go through that type of invasion. They were showing a young woman probably in her mid twenties ... her stretched top was super form fitting and she was very thin, yet they felt the need to circle her breast with their hands.. if she had a M&M in her bra you would have seen it...I found it to be very invasive. They were also talking about physically searching children as well.. I know we should say thank you to our local terrorist, but now it looks like we are terrorizing our own citizens.
Something that was not mentioned today and I listened for quite a while is, what are the Muslims doing. I know that this goes against all their beliefs.. Are any religions exempt from this type of search?
I saw a few places where there are no religious exemptions.
http://www.latimes.com/sns-ap-us-airplane-security,0,1461496.story
things are moving right along:
https://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/12c6a8e15eadf005
I am so very torn on this issue. On one hand, I think in today's world, anything that can be done to protect me when I fly, I am all for. Knowing that everyone passed threw the full body scan gives me a sense of security. But, I also agree that any x-ray, MRI, etc. type of equipment could be harmful if used frequently. So for people that fly weekly, I wouldn't want to do it either.
I have seen the pat-downs and it is the same type law enforcement do to a criminal. To me, they are very invasive as a law-abiding citizen. I don't want anyone touching my breasts unless it's my hubby, doctor or Brad Pitt.
Plus...part of me says that no matter how much they do to the passengers to keep them safe....they just had the incident with the toner cartridge bomb thingy. So to me, the luggage and cargo is presenting a major problem now.
I'm driving.
Pooh,
Brad Pitt. Hilarious.
The problem is that these scanners do not catch everything that goes through. That has been proven. Trained dogs, according to Kate Hanni, who runs FlyersRights.org, are more effective. The question is raised, are dogs practical? I don't see why not, but they would have to be kept under tight control.
There is probably no way in this day and age that we can keep ourselves totally safe. Flying is optional; my husband and I have opted out; one of my friends feels that the scanner problem will not resolve until people boycott the airlines, which most people are not willing to do. But it is an option and as such, other people are in control of what they can and cannot do to their travelers.
Flying is less safe in all ways today than it ever has been. The pilots and crew are overworked; there is way too much pressure to keep on time vs. safety concerns of all kinds; too many flights, too little services. FlyersRights started because people were kept on planes for hours with no food or water or clean restrooms. How ironic that a survivor of 9-11 died in the Buffalo crash, probably as a result of an overworked crew and flying in bad icing conditions.
Remember the days when you could fly comfortably and enjoy a little hot meal in flight, all compliments of your paid ticket? To think we used to complain about bad airline food!
Kathleen
Quote from: kathleen on November 22, 2010, 07:29:49 AM
The problem is that these scanners do not catch everything that goes through. That has been proven. Trained dogs, according to Kate Hanni, who runs FlyersRights.org, are more effective.
Kathleen
I have been wondering about the effectiveness of these scanners. Supposedly they were installed in response to the underpants bomber. Supposedly these scanners detect PETN explosives that do not show up on the (higher-energy) x-ray scanners they use for our carry-on luggage. So what will the next underpants bomber do? Easy. Stuff the PETN explosive into his carry-on. Duh...
I believe that these scanners are being used because (1) lots of people are making a lot of money by selling them, especially our ex-head of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff, and (2) the TSA knows that a strip-search is still more effective than the usual walk-through metal detectors. But the fact is, a determined terrorist will not be caught by these newer scanners.
I agree. I miss the old days on more than just this.
I will say that trained dogs present their own problems. I lived with a drug dog for seven years, and although they are great, they are only as good as their training and upkeep. To train a dog to be expert in both bomb and drugs is very expensive. And they can not differ between prescribed pills and unprescribed pills, so you are still subject to pat-down if they hit on you. Plus they are not 100% accurate and people would still be subject to search.
I don't have the answer except I would rather drive right now.
I did not realize that when John Tyner (he was the one that first stated not to touch his junk) refused the millimeter wave and backscatter x-ray machines and then the pat down that he was then threatened with a civil suit and a 10,000.00 fine and was harassed about trying to leave the airport. So they are basically saying that once you walk into the airport you, your husband, parents, and especially your children belong to TSA. Criminal http://johnnyedge.blogspot.com/2010/11/these-events-took-place-roughly-between.html (http://johnnyedge.blogspot.com/2010/11/these-events-took-place-roughly-between.html)
Amazing. In very surprised that this is happening in this country.
Especially since I've heard (as may have been said here) that the company and government
will not let the scientists inspect and assess safety of machines.
I have been diagnosed with skin cancer.. I will have to ask for the crotch squeeze. Maybe I can do my best Meg Ryan as she amused me in "When Harry Met Sally".
Quote from: Laurie on November 23, 2010, 01:07:52 PM
I have been diagnosed with skin cancer.. I will have to ask for the crotch squeeze. Maybe I can do my best Meg Ryan as she amused me in "When Harry Met Sally".
aw Laurie I LOL when read this
Quote from: Rose799 on November 23, 2010, 01:42:07 PM
How about this solution?
http://www.10news.com/news/25885183/detail.html
But, then there's this...
http://www.10news.com/news/25881679/detail.html
Very entertaining Rose
What I don't understand is.. if walking through the metal detectors isn't good enough then why do we have them. Last time I flew I had on sandals, it felt a little nasty walking barefooted where others have walked barefooted all I could see was little athlete foot germs dashing towards me. The guy ahead of me all but stripped, I finally asked him as I stood there waiting forever if he brought soap and shampoo because he was down to almost nothing. And not to be gross but what if a woman had on a sanitary pad that would be extremely embarrassing during a invasive pat down. If someone really wanted to hide something they still could.. now I'm picturing all passengers bending over and touching their toes. The terrorist will still find a way, meanwhile we've been reduced to being treated like common criminals.
Tara & all,
I think a closer look at this issue results in seeing that our loss of freedom and dignity may be related to companies that make a profit from the machines and the former "Homeland Security" official who is making a ton off them. Laurie's point about being a captive in an airport is right on as well. There's often a tradeoff of freedom for security, and with what's happening now I'll take freedom any day.
By now there are absolutely horrific stories of these scanners coming out, such as the airline stewardess who had to remove her prosthesis (breast cancer) for the machine, and a completely humiliated man I saw on CNN who had a colostomy bag which broke under the pressure of the search. Obviously in great distress, he said this is the fear of every colostomy survivor. What is wrong with this society for accepting this in any way? Brutish force against those with these health situations? It's increasingly apparent that the more liberties we give up, the more will be taken away, if these examples continue.
I was reminded of my sister-in-law's visit three years ago. She had early Alzheimer's and desperately wanted to see us before it was impossible for her to travel. It was a long, cross-country trip and as she also has trouble walking, we marveled at her pluck and determination in coming. Accompanying her to the airport for her return trip, we learned exactly how much pluck was required. I approached security as she needed medication while on board and asked for permission for her to carry a water bottle (in case the plane sat there for hours while staff refused her water). The first guard was helpful and said all I had to do was explain to the police and they would give her a pass on the water; no such luck; apparently they didn't even have their rules straight among themselves, these guards. They searched all her bags carefully and handed me the water and a tiny bottle of maple syrup, plastic seal intact, back to me---she had purchased it in Canada. Pleading with them only resulted in the guard becoming angry. The next thing we knew they took her in her wheelchair off through large swinging doors, with instructions for us to say goodbye as she had to be searched personally and privately. We asked to please let us accompany her to the plane when they were finished with her; denied. So this is another aspect: private body searches out of range of relatives or anyone else by the searchers, of an elderly woman with early Alz. They never explained why they had to take her into a private room. It was absolutely terrible; it felt very invasive; it was extremely anxiety-producing and stressful and ultimately frightening. They were very harsh and abrasive in their manner, tone of voice, and treatment; almost threatening; there were three guards searching her. We never saw her again and may never see her again and my last image of my very beloved sister-in-law is of uniformed airport police rushing her wheelchair through those steel doors. And all the time she was in the air I worried whether she got her medication. I hope the airlines are liable if water is denied (water!!! simple water!!!) and an elderly person or anyone else becomes ill.
I cannot possibly think of a kinder, more wonderful, more sweet-natured & caring, more intelligent person than my sister-in-law. A former Catholic nun, a school teacher, a lover of children and her dogs. This is the person they treated like a criminal. They say they don't want "profiling" because it is "racist." Well, it surely felt as if she was "profiled" and punished for being an innocent citizen with not so much as a speeding ticket on her record. She was definitely treated with more hands-on scrutiny than if she had been an ordinary passenger.
By the way, my comment that everyone has the choice to fly or not may have sounded elitist. I realize many people must travel for business, so I apologize if my remarks were untoward. Many others of us have a choice, however.
Why is it that in any other situation these "pat-downs" (which seem far more than that to me) would be regarded as illegal sexual assault? Is it because when we fly, we are thought to be giving permission to be man-handled? Does anyone know exactly how many plane bombs have been avoided now with the "new security?"
Believe me when I say I have a very personal connection to 9-11---my son lives in lower Manhattan and witnessed the second plane going in. Nobody is more sensitive than my family to what happened. But when this event is used to destroy basic liberty and personal dignity, as far as I'm concerned the terrorists have a victory.
Nothing fun about this. I wish all of you who have to fly this holiday the least possible stress and all safety on your trip, and please let us know how it goes.
In growing outrage but happy on the ground,
Kathleen
The nearest airport to me is a smaller regional airport, they have budget carriers like Airtran that fly out of it to most places that I go to (for as often that I travel anyway), cities like Miami and Las Vegas. My regional airport doesn't have the scanners. The larger airports do, but not this one. Check around to other options, they can't possibly to a pat-down on everyone.
Oh Kathleen, what a horrible experience. Not just for her, but for you too. There is nothing worse in the world than feeling helpless to do anything about an injustice. I am with you on this. I understand that they are trying to keep people safe, but I too think it is coming at a great cost.
I think our society is becoming more and more dependant on people that have an agenda. Not bringing religion into this, but the situation baffles my mind how someone picks and chooses. The government says that you can't have prayer or religion at school, but they are paid salaries with money that says, "In God We Trust". And they say there must be a seperation between Church and State is why, but yet I watched on CNN a broadcast of the President presenting the Medal of Honor to a soldier's family and they prayed right before, with the President participating?
And that is not a religious statement, just an example of how I think their are many double standards going on.
When I went through the airport body scanner, I didn't know you weren't suppose to pose.
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5281/5229810554_a46f1cf583_z.jpg)
LOL Laurie!!! ;D And Katheen I was just in shock to read your post about your SIL, how horrifying that she was treated so disrespectfully~~I feel so awful reading about that.....
Well, I guess I will go with the getting patted down~however NOT by some strange man, I will ask for a woman...Less embarrassing. The next thing you know we will all be lined up against the wall and have to strip. HELP..... >:(
You watch these commercials about ADT home security devices and in all actuality if a burglar is going to break in no matter what kind of security you have...he is going to get in.... Unfortunately, the same applies to terrorists~~no matter what they will find a way...
Ladies, "America is no longer the land of the free..." :(
Always becareful...HUGS, Faith
We've no plans for immediate plane travel right now, but if we did I don't know what I'd do. I've had a lot of xray action in the past few years due to one health thing or another and hesitate to add more. Even at the dentist I balk at all the xrays they want to give. The pat down sounds really humiliating too, but since I have no colostomy bag or sanitary pad issues it's probably the choice I'd make though I've heard that the agents don't wear gloves to protect us but rather to protect themselves so they don't put on clean ones for each passenger. People supposedly have gotten chiggers, etc. from the person in front of them - eeewwww!
Seasage:
The following is from Andrew Weil MD's web site: You can find the whole text there:
Winter Travel, Part 1: Airplane Air Quality
The air quality in airplanes is a real problem for both travelers and airline employees. The National Research Council found evidence suggesting that air circulating in passenger cabins may contribute to a wide variety of health problems. Among the hazards noted: overexposure to ozone levels, inadequate oxygen pressure and air contaminated with traces of engine oil, hydraulic fluid, de-icing solutions and even pesticides (sprayed on international flights).
In addition over the weekend my husband read me the story of a boy who dropped from the sky over Massachusetts. They think he stowed away in the "wheel well" of an airplane, froze to death, then fell on the lawn of of a frightened suburbanite. To date they said there have been 83 people who stowed away in the "wheel well," whatever that is, of airplanes.
It struck my husband and I as absolutely ludicrous, all this security, when if you want to blow up a plane all you have to do is hide in the wheel well. Where are the people supposed to be checking on the wheels before takeoff? Actually you wouldn't even have to stow away yourself---just plant explosives.
More and more disgusted,
Kathleen
So those of us who are "below the salt" and can no longer afford to fly are actually lucky? It's like being one of Teresina Cortez's children in Steinbeck's Tortilla Flat who thrived on a diet of tortillas and beans but became sickly when they ate food from more fortunate tables.
Whoo-hoo! I guess?!?
Pen, you raise an interesting point. Some years back I read a study on the South that said black people at one point in history actually lived longer than whites because they could not afford the more affluent meat-fat-based diet and raised their own vegetables, so they were eating many fresh greens that they raised themselves.
I think anyone today who doesn't have or can't fly is lucky. My last trip was so bad that even without the security issue, I never want to go through it again. Neighbors next door came back from a long-awaited trip to Hawaii saying the same thing; the return trip was over-jammed planes, and delays to cause them 36 hours of cramped sitting & trying to get something to eat or drink, etc., etc. They were utterly exhausted for days after.
Kathleen