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Sometimes he can't see past the short term pain (3 total hours in the car with DS and him getting off schedule) for the long term gain (maintaining a relationship with his mom, fostering one between DS and her). We've given each other final say in plans with each others FOO for family events. It doesn't bother me to get DS off schedule for the occasional family function, but it winds DH up. He wasn't sure what he wanted to do Thanksgiving, but when he tells his mom 'maybe we'll come up' she assumes we're coming. It's one big miscommunication - he thinks he's just thinking out loud and she thinks we have a plan.

When he does that she comes across as very understanding (to DH) - it's ok, you're busy, don't worry about it, etc, etc. That's usually when I get thrown under the bus without his realizing it. Especially when he says we had dinner with my mom instead - who in reality said she would plan her dinner around whatever MIL wanted to do. She's aware of the tension and was trying to make things easier. MIL thinks I'm making DH go with my FOO, because he won't tell her he just doesn't want to drive.

I wish she would let into him about it, because it's not a nice thing to do. I think next time this comes up I'm going to have to say something. She probably never will, and I'm not sure he'll be convinced that it hurts her feelings. She's big on putting up a happy front to DH. When I told him he's hurt her feelings before (she looked absolutely crushed when he told her that DS is quite bonded to my mom) , he just couldn't see it. I think it's way easier for her to take things out on me instead of him.

I just wanted to add, DH is good about shopping for special occasions, as much as he doesn't care for holidays. He managed his parents gifts for years before we lived together. He doesn't need me to do it (besides the wrapping) and he knows them better than I do in terms of what to get them.

I do know women that have husbands that would just simply not done any of it and not cared one bit.

Oh and DS's gifts take up 75% of the space under the tree now anyways, that's way more fun

Our list got huge at one point, when we first started living together and got married. It feels a little more under control now with separating it, and my GPs have since passed away. MIL will still get a gift for DH and a gift for me, but instead of getting a gift from me and a separate one from DH, she now gets two or three with "from DH, NewMama and DS". Last year we got a few gifts from her, which were household things that had no name specified on them so basically they were for both of us. DS's were the only ones marked. Shopping separately saves us the trouble of pestering each other for gift ideas for each other's FOO too.

Thanks everyone for the replies. Hearing from other helps me get some perspective.

DH threw me for a loop when he last minute cancelled Thanksgiving on MIL, and I knew she was going to take that out on me. And sure enough she did, telling DH it's ok and then complain to me that we were supposed to come visit and didn't. I used to push him to go when he did stuff like that, but stopped. I think next time he does it I'm going to have to tell him it's making my life miserable and to stop. Whether or not he believes his mother is acting that way remains to be seen.

The Christmas gift thing is interesting, I see different families doing it different ways. My brother has always done the shopping for our family, and SisIL does hers. DH and I used to each buy a gift for everyone, but when DS arrived we were perplexed as to where to put his name on gifts. We decided that instead of each of us buying a gift for someone else, we'd buy 2 or 3 three things and put from NewMama, DH and DS. So he does the gifts for his side now, and I do mine. I still end up with the longer list since my side is bigger, but DH seems way less stressed about Christmas now. He still doesn't get why my FOO buys him gifts, no matter how much I tell him that since he married me, they see him as 'one of us' now. And I see his family the same - they're my family now too, but he doesn't see things that way. He's also not a sentimental guy, and doesn't care for holidays. Part of the reason he doesn't get that bailing on his mom on holidays hurts her feelings.

Pooh, I read your post as well, and boy do I feel for you too! I'm having a hard time lately holding back my inner mama-bear with MIL when  she's interfering with DS and I really feel like any time now it's going to come out.

Scoop, I started trying to detach some myself, and was feeling pretty good about it until lately. I stopped suggesting visits to him, however if he says he wants to go or can they visit I never say no. I see a change in their relationship too, I used to push him to visit if he was wavering, which he does frequently. We saw them probably half as much this summer as the one before (which was before this started). Every once in a while he'll ask me to send photos to him of DS so he can print them for his mom. I used to do this but stopped when the craziness started. I send him the copies, but it's up to him to print and mail them. And honestly, she's not getting as many as she used to. Thankfully she never calls me. DH and I have used our cell phones as our main numbers for years. So she always calls DH's cell. She mentioned how she thought she should call me but wasn't sure about my schedule. I do shifts (including nights) and it's quite wonky and there's no pattern to it. I made a point of saying that my schedule is hard to figure out and just left it at that. I think it's given us both a good out. I doubt she wants to talk to me right now, and I sure as heck don't want to talk to her.

I think I'm getting stuck in anger partially because we do have a new baby coming, and I'm getting myself twisted into knots over how she's going to react to all that comes with that. That my mom will be our on-call babysitter for when #2 decides to arrive (or get evicted). That there'll be more family gatherings following that she'll have to share with my mother - birthdays, baptisms, etc. Those should be happy things, and I'm still a little bitter that when I think about DS first birthday I associate it with the drama she caused between DH and I. I should've been able to enjoy that. I never thought about anything like that when awaiting DS. It also makes me sad (and maybe there is some grieving here) that even if she stops all this stuff, I think it's permanently damaged our relationship. I used to think she was incapable of behaving this way, and I don't feel like I'll ever trust that she wouldn't again. I can be civil, polite, and caring, but that will always be there.

I think I'll probably end up also picking up an ornament for her (this lady is a one weekend only at a craft show type of thing), because DH would appreciate it. He was very thankful for the things I did for her birthday, even if she wasn't. So I can suck it up for him

I felt like I had been doing a good job of detaching from my MIL and being ok with choosing not to confront her, for the sake of DH and DS not being in the middle. Lately though, I find myself getting very stuck in being frustrated and angry at her. I had hoped things might be getting better by now, but they only seem to be getting worse. Her jealousy towards anyone in DS's life is getting worse, and the passive-aggressiveness is getting way, way worse. Part of me wants to say something to DH, but she puts on a totally different act when he's around or listening, so I figure he'd just think I was over reacting. I'm dreading what she might do when #2 arrives in the spring - DH hates going anywhere with DS that involves long distance driving, so I know he really won't want to go anywhere with a toddler and a newborn. Which means less time visiting her, which means more blame put on me and more p-a behaviour towards me. He cancelled Thanksgiving on her last minute and of course I got stuck with the snarky comments about it. I feel like I'm very stuck in this circle of what-ifs and anger at the moment. Sprinkled with some pregnancy hormones on top.

I've been thinking about getting an ornament for my mom for Christmas, there's a local lady who does beautiful hand painted ones that she'll customize with names and such. If I come home with a grandmother one for my mom, DH will wonder why I didn't get one for his mom too. And I feel like I should for the sake of DH, but last time I went out of my way for her (her b-day) she repaid me by starting to schedule visits for when she believed I wouldn't be around. And boy was she not happy when it turned out I was actually around. I don't want to go out of my way and expense to do something nice for her at the moment, but I feel like I'm being petty if I don't and I should for DH and to at least say I'm trying.

Pen, if the earlier time works better for you, DH and your DD, then I don't see anything wrong with switching back to it. Considering the amount of accommodating you've been doing for DS/DIL, things are still tense and you still feel him slipping away. Accommodating them again won't probably change anything, and if things are hanging by a thread that much, it could be anything that breaks it. Thanksgiving just happens to be the upcoming event. Maybe he needs to see that you, DH and DD get a vote here too and that it's not all about him and DIL. 

Don't get involved at all, no matter how hard it is. If she starts talking about it, you can acknowledge that she said something and change the subject. If she persists, there's nothing wrong with telling her that her marital issues are between her and her husband and that you'd like to be left out of it.

You're getting thrown under the bus for doing what comes naturally - defending your daughter. Don't let the two of them make them you a scapegoat for their problems. She's probably running to him saying that you agreed with her, which causes more issues between you and him.

Best of luck.

I think Doe has a really good point there, too.

It reminds me of a situation I had with a good friend - she's funny, chatty and great fun to hang out with, but is notoriously unreliable. It used to drive me crazy when she'd show up late, not show up at all or say she was bringing something to a party (food/music/decorations) and just not do it. We also used to make plans to accommodate her schedule and she'd just bail without notice at the last minute. It used to me make me insane and I'd get so furious. Eventually I realized she's never going to change, I had no control over her behaviour and I needed to adjust my approach to our friendship. Now I never, ever ask her to bring something integral to an event, we just tell her when/where we're doing something and if she shows, she shows. If not, not my problem. If she's late and misses something big, her problem, not mine. And I don't make one on one plans with her anymore because she's left me in the lurch so much. I'm much happier and we're still friends.

Your mother is the way she is, and you can't change her. Getting stuck on the wishing she wasn't that way will drive you crazy.

Pen, sorry things went that way. You, your DH and DDD deserve better.

When you posted what DIL said about DS being stressed out, that he was in the middle was the first thing that popped into my head. She seems too self absorbed to get that she's contributing to that big time.

I know previously you've mentioned that you felt that speaking up would lead to a bigger estrangement. I was wondering if you'd considered speaking up now - not in a confrontational or angry sort of way, but more of an assertive "we don't deserve to be treated like that." You've gone above and beyond trying to be accommodating, so to me it would just set a boundary. Despite you trying to be the mature adult here, their behaviour is still leading you down the road to estrangement.

stilltrying, I'll second that Scoop gave some good advice there about detaching. Sometimes you have to for your own sanity. And it's nice when someone can validate your feelings - in your case, your looking for that from DH - but sometimes we never get that and it doesn't mean your feelings aren't valid. He may never really understand. Holding a grudge to me is wishing revenge or something bad on a person. Maintaining some sort of relationship with someone, just polite and civil, but not opening yourself up to being hurt isn't a grudge to me. It's self preservation.

I had to let go of the anger I felt towards my MIL over trying to include her as much as possible and then being told it's not enough. It's never going to be enough, so I'm at peace with knowing I tried. But I've detached a bit - I don't suggest visits to DH anymore (but I never say no if he wants to visit), it's up to him to send photos, keeps his Ps in the loop etc. And he does, but not as much as when he had a lot of prodding. The last time I tried hard to maintain things I went pretty out of my way to make a nice birthday for her, and after that she started not wanting me present at visits with DH and DS. It was also right before that she put up a big stink about having to share DS's first birthday with my FOO; DH and I had a BIG fight over it. DH didn't really get it, but we found a compromise. If that ever happens again, it's just going to be here's the date and time for the party, hope you can make it. End of story. I don't think I'm holding a grudge there, however I don't feel like I have to open my marriage up to fights like that again.   

Oh my, I'm sorry he said something so hurtful. Hugs to you.

Smiles, your situation seems to me to be about mismatched expectations. He's expecting you to spend family time together and babysit GD so they can go out, and your expectation is that they find a babysitter so you all can go out together. Some people get so enamored with their own children it's truly unfathomable to them that anyone wouldn't want to spend all their time the kids. Asleep or awake. It really reads to me like you're balking at meeting their expectations but getting upset that he's not meeting yours.

If you've been clear about what you will or won't do in regards to their expectations - ie, not babysit GD while she's asleep, then maybe you need to just flat out ask DS if he wants to go out as adults. And as an adult, he's allowed to say no for whatever his reason is. Just as you're allowed to say no to babysitting for whatever your reason is. Speculating about if he does or doesn't want to spend time with you (without GD) and the reasons why seems a lot like 'spinning your wheels' and asking seems like a simple way out of it.

Frustrated, I know it's easier said then done but you really need to take a step back from her life. She chose to move out and as an adult needs to learn to deal with the consequences of her decisions. Giving in to her gets you nothing - she's mean and spiteful to get what she wants, and even when you give in she's still mean and spiteful because she wants more. Does she ever say thank you? There will always be something more and she'll keep ratcheting up the verbal abuse til she gets it. Unless you're prepared to live the rest of your life this way, you have to say no to her. She'll probably throw an epic tantrum, but in the long run it's better for all of you. Like the previous poster said, why on earth would she change her behaviour? She gets what she wants, and never has to deal with any fall out from her bad decisions.

Helping with household stuff doesn't mean no baby interaction ever. It just means helping out a couple of sleep deprived new parents. We were so overwhelmed with looking after our son that the household stuff just fell to the wayside. We ate take out for weeks. I would've been eternally grateful to anyone that came over to help us with any of that.

And I'm sorry, but to say 'I'll only give helps if it meets my needs' means it isn't help. I could barely meet my own needs to eat, shower or sleep, so for someone to turn around and say you're not doing enough for me would've just made me blow a gasket.