Sassy we're all dying to know how the wedding went, that is if you've held it. Please fill us in when you can! How did MIL fair?
Thank you for asking! We're married and back from our honeymoon.
The wedding was beautiful, despite my MIL's efforts to destroy it. Hiring extra security was the second smartest move we could have done. (First smartest would have been following Luise's advice for an overseas destination wedding!)
Those who predicted MIL would crash our wedding, collect your winnings. Though all I have left in the kitty is some stale jordan almonds ;D
In the days before the ceremony, we caught wind of MIL's plans. MIL had emailed a list of what she saw were her "only options" to DH's aunt. Aunt's children (DH's cousins) FWD'ed it to DH. Some of them she had already done, like how she sent Facebook messages to friends on my page, asking them for dish about my romantic history before DH. As if.
DH went and tried to talk her out of her plans. MIL told DH that by my not continuing a relationship with her (the way she wanted one), to her was proof I don't love him. That if a woman loves a man, she'll respect his mother no matter what. MIL told DH it was her right and her duty to stop him from making the biggest mistake of his life. That's when he hired some off-duty police.
DH is still hurt about the lies his mother said (and still says) about me. DH is still hurt that his mother tried so hard to make him sad, on what should have been the most joyful day of his life. DH is sad that his mother only wants a relationship with him on her terms, and not adult-adult.
As for lessons learned, DH said he does not regret not inviting MIL to the wedding. Her later actions only cemented that assurance for him.
What DH says he does regret, in retrospect, is that he ever encouraged a one-on-one relationship between MIL and me. He admitted he felt some relief when I came along, because MIL put a lot of her social focus and demands on me, instead of him! But our fMIL-fDIL relationship was not strong enough to handle the demands she made on it (multiple calls and texts daily, expecting plans every weekend including Saturday nights, showing up at open houses, showing up anywhere she thought we'd be, getting jealous about everyone/everything else we had, even jealous if we went to a work party and didn't invite her to join us). I could not make her happy. She was very frustrated I had failed her. And she let me, DH and everyone we know all about it.
DH wonders, if we had only spent time togther just as a group of 3 (and not me taking her lunch, me taking her shopping, me helping her with her problems, me sharing DH and I's future dreams) then she wouldn't have had the access and information and ultimately feelings of entitlement to be involved in our lives at such an inappropriate level. The minister who married us reminded us, "Good fences make good neighbors."
If we had good fences to start with, it might have been possible for us to have a civil (although not very close) relationship. MIL is not a healthy person, but healthy boundaries from the start, were probably our only real hope.
When DH starts to heal, if he wants to try again as a group of 3, or even if he just wants to test it with just him and her, I will support him. Whatever he wants.
I do respect my MIL. I'm grateful how she raised my husband, and impressed she did so as a single parent. Part of me still truly loves her, despite all the pain she has tried to create for us. The other part has built a wall around my heart, so she can't hurt me as much. I understand she has a lot of deep emotional needs, and sort of loses it when she doesn't get them met. And that what MIL accuses me of is reflective of her actions, not mine.
But it still hurts to have your MIL tell your GMIL and DH's Aunt that you're an unloving golddigger who ruined her family and plotted to destroy her relationship with her son. Now she gets to add "and tried to have me thrown in jail".
I'm sorry, Sassy.
Wowser! If ANYBODY had treated me like this that would have sent me running in the other direction. My goodness. As her son though, not that it would help, but this woman really needs emotional help. It sounds like she's emotionally emeshed with her son at a very unhealthy level. Maybe your DH when he feels better should encourage her to get some help. I know my SIL has tried numerous times to get my MIL to try antidepressants to help with her depression ever since me and DH moved further away.
What's so sad to me is that people like this can't see what they're doing. They want to keep their families intact so bad that they're willing to demonize anyone who attempts to become apart of their child's life. I know b/c I've see this first hand. Instead of viewing the new girlfriend/wife as a new family member to love they view them as an someone who is taking away something from their lives and they react sometimes in horrible ways,(mine throws and breaks things.)
What they don't realize as well is that when they try to smother their child and alienate the DIL/SIL then their biggest fears come true b/c the child/IL don't want to have a relationship with them. Its so sad, It's just a vicious cycle. That's why this poor woman needs help to break that cycle so she can have healthy relationships.
Did she come to the wedding? And if so did she try anything? Have you spoken to her since you've been home?
I have heard of this "unhealthy relationship" so much that it makes me sick. Unhealthy? To want to have a relationship with your own son? Just add unhealthy along with "manipulative, needy, guilter, narcissistic" It's endless.
Repeat: this was a great home but something here made both boys go for women who were extremely controlling. All info must pass thru her first. I guess that was my fault because I do blame myself all the time.
I am not needy, manipulative, a guilter, narcissistic or have an unhealthy relationship with our son! My Lord! How many more names can be given to a Mother who raised sons worthy enough to marry?
Yes, MIL showed up at the church, in the black dress and wearing a black hat, from what we're told. (Neither of us saw her ourselves). Apparently, MIL also brought one of DH's ex-girlfriends as her companion. The off-duty police officers DH hired immediately recognized her from her photo, and escorted her out. When she tried to re-enter through another door, they advised her she could be arrested for trespassing. That is when she left.
MIL also showed up at the hotel, but she did not make it up even to the floor of the reception. We cash bonused the security guys for their work. We were glad we didn't have to see her in action and carry that image in our mind.
As I type this, it feels like it happened to someone else? It sounds like something so callous. What's sadder than us hiring the security, is that we knew we had to. Never in 100 years would I imagined hiring security at my wedding because of one person, my groom's mother! Never!
We knew she was going to try to disrupt it. We didn't invite her because we didn't want "anyone" who would try hard to make it terrible to get a chance to do so. Most people hosting weddings or even parties don't want people there they know lie about them and want to break them up. That the "anyone" was my DH's mother is the part I kind of still can't believe?
DH's Grandmother (MIL's M)and his Aunt (MIL's S) did not attend, either. Although they both RSVP'ed, they were no shows. The holidays are coming up. I don't want to push DH reaching out to them just because of more social-type pressures. He's got to do it when he's emotionally settled and feels ready to go back in the shark tank. He feels rejected and even betrayed, but I don't want this to be a permanent rift.
It's sad. I wish my DH had the kind of mom and family he felt could support him on his wedding day. Could support his new family. Could share in the love. I wish I had a MIL who didn't try so hard to make me and husband cry!
So this is all new to your husband? His Mother's behavior suddenly started when he met you? Was she good to him when he was growing up or was she a bad mother all along?
If she's been a bad mother all along and nuts like this, I can sure see this having an awful effect on him and you.
My last post was answering Sassy's remarks. Absolutely I believe that this is unhealthy. Sassy's MIL doesn't just want a normal healthy relationship with her son. Obviously there's something going on with this lady. It's not about just how one person feels in this situation, there are several people involved.
I know it was directed at Sassy. Yes, there is something wrong with her. She is having an very hard time extricating herself from her son and his wife and wanting to be apart of their lives. It might sound crazy to you but sometimes Mothers think they're still 20, they feel 20 in their heads and just as much fun as someone half her age.
It would have taken her longer than most to back away. It's not just her son she's trying to have a family with...it's both of them. I'm sure this will do it, though. If she doesn't get the picture after being escorted out, then haul her off to an institution.
Sassy,
I feel that I owe you an open and sincere apology. I have put myself in your MIL's place and am overly sensitive about this topic. I know that you are trying as hard as you can. You wouldn't have come here with your heart open if you weren't really trying.
I know she's been a real pain. I can see that. The woman is in such shock right now.
At first, you don't know what is hitting you. This child you raised and loved? Where did he go? Sure, he's grown and married but you can't wrap your arms around where he went? He was here and all was great but then he gets a wife and if his mother does one thing wrong, she's gotta go.
We always do something wrong but strangely, the DIL's family doesn't. If we don't call, we don't care. If we do call, we're calling too much. We learn way too late that we need to stay away all together and let the chips fall where they may.
My close DIL is good to me but she is also such a control freak and user that it's hard to not see that as we mix with them. She is rude to distant DIL, who oddly has been so rude to me. It still hurts me to see someone hurt like that.
All this is none of my business but really, when I see hurt for anyone, it hurts me. This whole thing with my DIL has really been a blow. Any Mother would feel the same.
You have to understand, it is beyond strange to us that we are fine with our sons until a DIL comes along. Some Mothers really might have an unhealthy relationship with their sons. I can't imagine that but okay...I guess it happens.
One of my sons has a close friend whose Mother raised him as a single mom and gave everything she had to him to make his life a good one. His new wife comes into the picture and doesn't like her. "It's either me or her", she told him. I know this because the guy told our son about it. He cried and said, "there's nothing else I can do".
I'm sad for him because his Mother was seen at the school where his kids go and his wife called the police. She's not worth a Police call, believe me. I know her and she was trying to see her grandchildren who don't know her even though they live in the same area.
I know that his life will be scarred forever because of this. He will never have a full life. You don't do that to your Mother and live a happy life if you have a soul. He was in this house too much for me to not know that he has a soul.
I want to say that I'm sincerely sorry for posting when I did. I know you're trying, Sassy or you wouldn't be here. I hope things get straightened out for all of you. I really do. I too hope you are blessed with children. You will know then what being a Mother is like.
You'll do a lot wrong but you won't do them intentionally. Your only hope will be to get a good DIL or Son in law. If you have Daughters, which I hope you do, you won't have this problem.
OMG... security at your wedding? So many things are running through my head right now that it is overwhelming !
In the spirit of not responding too strongly I will just say that I really do wish I had been presented with my lists of do's and dont's ( boundaries ) at the wedding. There is no happy medium !! scorned if we do and scorned if we don't.
Would it have been unthinkable to allow the mil to stand there and see her son get married and maybe throw her out if she did something unacceptable ?
Chickie Prissy, I know where you're coming from, and all you've been through with distant DIL, and all you do yourself to get along with Close DIL. So when I read your words, I understand why you say what you do. Your balance, and ability to feel for both sides despite your own struggles is part of what makes you a wonderful you.
My DH always treated his mother like gold, even after he moved out at 19 (and continued to pay her condo payments). She was always intrusive (for lack of a better word) and pushy and overenthusiastic. That is just personality traits, though, something we both could certainly deal with and even enjoy. As long as MIL is getting her way, she is actually quite charming, delightful, as fun as a 20 year old, LOL. Its when MIL encounters a "no" that the real problems start.
By "no" I mean: "No you're not invited on our honeymoon." "No we're not going to buy a condo in your complex, and no we're not buying yours from you."
When he stopped paying her department store card bills, because we were saving for a home, is exactly when she started calling me a "gold digger" to his other family.
To newer posters, I started coming here I believe shortly around Memorial Day? That weekend my then BF and I had rented a couples cabin for the weekend. When we turned the cell phones back on, we were treated to a series of crying messages from MIL. Followed by an accusatory messages from DH's Grandmother asking him "How could you leave your mother all alone on a holiday."
We had pre-marriage counseling before the wedding. The minister supported DH's decision not to have his mother there. DH knows she had a flair for the dramatic. She started getting upset when we she realized we wouldn't implement her creative ideas (live dove release, houseplants instead of flowers). We took her shopping for her dress, and the first one she wanted was pure white. She was visibly upset when the salesperson had the nerve to discourage the mother of the groom from wearing white. So she picked a black dress. DH says the last time she wore black was in the 80's after his father died. She wore black for a year then never wore it again. DH heard about the black dress and that's when he said "enough. "
Make no mistake, it BREAKS HIS HEART that the only way his M will have a relationship with him, is if we do everything she says to.
He got the bottom payment stub of an unpaid department store bill that she mailed to him in his mail today. Although she did generously put a stamp on the mail-in-payment envelope.
I understand what you're saying. As I listen, I know she has to be a pain to deal with. I will tell you that if I hear one more time, "your Mother is sooo dramatic", I think I'll scream or worse.
I am dramatic but all those who love me love that about me. They laugh at me and think it's hilarious. Now, it's like Marianne Dashwood's hysteria in Sense and Sensibility to the DIL.
A Minister of the Gospel supported your husband to not invite his Mother? Does that person know his Mother? Has he/she formed the opinion of her based on what he/she was told? Unbelievable. Makes you lose all faith in men/women of the Cloth.
I don't get it....one little Momma.. now a Pariah. I think I completely understand what is going on here. It's too bad and too sad that his own Mother was so dangerous and security had to be called to stop her.
It breaks my heart but Sassy, I know you are writing to find understanding here and that's always what I hope you get. Just know that this is very hard to see from my side.
Sassy,
There are few women that aren't dramatic!
I can't even begin to imagine being thrown out of my sons wedding but I am from a different generation and was taught to respect , I always knew order. I ran my household after I got married but even then, when I was at my parents or inlaws homes I knew that ( although I was an adult ) I was not in a position of authority. I always felt that any man who would hurt or disrespect his own mother was certainly not husband material... if he could be that cruel then what could happen to me as a wife?
Was it planned to have mil thrown out, by security, if she showed up at the wedding? If so, was she aware of this ? I hope so because she could have saved herself a lot of humiliation and embarrassment. I think that is a very drastic measure.
Granted, your mil should not expect her son / your dh to pay her bills... that is insane! I hate to hear this because it is a family torn apart and I doubt that could ever be repaired. Too bad for all of you.
QuoteWas it planned to have mil thrown out, by security, if she showed up at the wedding? If so, was she aware of this ? I hope so because she could have saved herself a lot of humiliation and embarrassment. I think that is a very drastic measure.
Yes and yes.
My MIL had a written out plan of how she was planning to stop my husband from making "the worst mistake of his life."
At the risk of repeating myself, DH went to MIL and asked her to stop telling lies about his future wife and she didn't. When he got copied on her sabotage plans (she was very open about them) she told him she had every right to try and protect her son from marrying me. He told her he was hiring police to stop her, because she wouldn't.
I wrote extensively about our marriage counseling and the excellent minister before.
I am sorry if anyone believes my DH has to be a bad person or a bad husband, because he did not want ANYONE making up terrible lies about HIS (future) wife. DH is not bad husband material, because he does not invite those who intentionally trying to hurt me and him, into our lives. I will not view his basic self-respect and sense of morality as something to hold against him.
God help you all - you handled this well, but I'm sorry you were put in that position!
I do worry about what she's going to do next :-\ This is NOT normal behavior!!!! And while it almost has comedic tones to those outside, (it could be a scene in a sit com, because it's soooo bizarre it makes us laugh ) it isn't funny and it truly concerns me. (When my ex decided to get married on my wedding day although our divorce wasn't final, I joked about showing up at their wedding in black - -but I DIDN"T DO IT!!!) Showing up with an ex of her son's as an escort -- this is ridiculous! Your MIL has crossed the line - her vision of reality is very twisted.
Be very careful.
Annie B,
You are so right. Sometimes I have to laugh at it all (like how she put a stamp on the bill-stub return envelope) because otherwise it would be too dark, too sad. And sometimes it's too hard to laugh at (still grateful I did not get a visual picture of her in the black hat) and I just, well avoid it. Like DH had done for years.
For the first year or more, of DH and I's relationship, I did do whatever MIL wanted. I loved DH, and quickly loved his mother, too. This man's mother was a smart, fun, impulsive, creative, and not like most of the women I know. I truly appreciated that about her. I answered every call, text (several a day, every single day), let her in when she showed up at my home for an unannounced drop by (about once a week), took her to lunch, dinner, went shopping almost every weekend. I probably spoke to and saw fMIL more than anyone else in my life - including my sister and lifelong friends and parents and even fDH!
At the time, I thought it was The Right Thing To Do. I would have liked to see her maybe once a week or every two weeks, but I followed her lead. I respected what she wanted. But, was it respect or fear? Looking back, I think I sensed the trouble that would ensue if I didn't do what she wanted of me. There were signs. I'm not even sure anymore, though. Can anyone understand this?
She would get upset if I did something and she didn't know about it in advance. Once I went to a friend's shower and mentioned it after the fact, and she seemed, well hurt. "I didn't know you had a shower to go to. Why didn't you tell me?" It was confusing, why would she be upset I went to someone's shower and didn't tell her? It wasn't a secret, it was just... irrelevant.
Once she (said she) booked a "girls weekend" to Las Vegas and was devastated when she told me and I didn't want to go. When she asked me if Saturday nights could be "our girls night" and I told her that's the night I like to see her son (my boyfriend), she withdrew and pouted for several days.
As long as the relationship was maintained on her terms, it appeared to be a "good" relationship. I think I was so hesitant to create "boundaries" for a long time, because I knew she would see them only as rejection of her. Not as something about my own privacy, or basic respect, or my own social desires. She trained me well. She gave signs that all would NOT be well if I did not meet her terms. So for a long time, I met them.
I don't know how to explain that although us not inviting MIL, us not paying MIL's bills anymore, seems like we're rejecting her - it very much IS her rejecting US. She rejected her son and me. And to be honest - it HURTS.
MIL didn't want to see her only child get married - she told DH what she wanted, was to stop him from getting married to me. How does a man recitify that, with his own desire to marry? How do I?
MIL doesn't want to have dinner with us once or twice a month, and chat once or twice a week. She wants to be a part of our daily plans and decision making. How does a grown man rectify that, especially when he's lived as an independant adult for years? How do I?
And - is it SELFISH of us to "only want" a relationship on "our terms" instead of "her terms"??? I read a lot here, and elsewhere, and struggled for a long time with the ideas of boundaries. But if MIL has no boundaries, doesn't that leave it up to someone to have to make them?
I still hope that MIL will become more relaxed, or enlightened, or fulfilled in other ways... (I don't know exactly). So that she can spend time with our brand new little family, and us with her! So that my DH can feel whole, like his M is a part of his life. I still want her in our lives! ( If I did not want that, things would be so much easier, I know...)
Hi. Sassy..your lived through it and found a way to outfox the fox. Good for you. And I have to admit it felt good to hear you say that my solution would have been the way to go. ( I wonder if I am going to be pelted with rotten e-tomatoes for saying that?)
It's very easy to type-cast people and identify with one participant or the other but each situation is unique. Your issue with your MIL is not necessarily the same as any issue any of us might have with a DIL. Possibly similar but I doubt it. For instance, can anyone here picture Sassy's MIL coming to this Web-forum with an open mind? I didn't think so.
The woman has problems and she is a problem. She has been consulted, listened to, asked to cooperate, given reasonable boundaries (oh, that hated word!) and treated with kid gloves. In return she has been a ten-ton bulldozer without a driver.
You can either have that be the focus of your life, Sassy, or you can hold her able to address her own issues and work her way though them if and when she decides to do that. They belong to her. I know the door is open should she ever choose to face what sets her apart...which is her behavior. It's not anything anyone else is doing. In the meantime, a new family unit has been established and new parameters have been set.
It is her job to adapt. It is her job to fit in. It is her job to ask, cooperate and align. It is not her jurisdiction. In her home she reigned supreme...in yours, you do. (Ouch..I think I just got hit by one of those rotten e-tomatoes.)
When we get someone who thinks a married child is still a dependent, we have a problem. She will continue to make and try to enforce the "rules." And raise hob if they aren't followed.
When we have a DIL who is disrespectful and thoughtless, we have another kind of problem...and once in a while we have both. Heaven forbid!
This not a situation where a DIL has declared war either openly or covertly. We have here a patient, understanding and loving DIL who has been chewed up and spit out.
There are consequences to antisocial, destructive and overtly pathological behavior. All MILs are not kind. MILs are people and they/we come in every conceivable form. Having a child and raising a child does not guarantee anyone the right to mistreat, dominate or control the adults they become.
All DILS are not awful but/and they aren't all wonderful. We often don't get what we wanted. Our sons sometimes pick losers, tyrants, liars and messed up women. They may get a perfectly wonderful MIL and never know it...not with those blinders on. And...remember...some are great!
Well...that felt good! ;D
I was going to write something here in response to this, Luise. But, in my mind came the thought that I have been trying to live by: when in doubt, don't.
Strange to have to be off-line almost all of the time and then when I get a chance to post I get absolutely no response. Oh, well...no new minuses. Yet...
Luise, I was just about to respond....I know it's disappointing to not have your former DIL there. After 15 years, that has to be disappointing.
I'm curious, the people coming for Christmas...that is so good that you'll be with them. I'm glad. If you were near me, I'd have you with us and you could make conversation with the people in my faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamily. You'd run off after you ate, believe me.
You say, "I've got to run!! I've got to go back to Washington to wash my hair!!!!" ;D
oy
Quote from: luise.volta on November 16, 2009, 03:34:42 PM
Strange to have to be off-line almost all of the time and then when I get a chance to post I get absolutely no response. Oh, well...no new minuses. Yet...
I myself didn't respond because you said everything so beautifully -- I'm always so happy when you are able to post, because for me your words add a lot of much needed clarity and light and love. I wish you could post more more more!!!! But I know you are going through some difficult times now.
Pluses always from here!
I'm sorry. I didn't respond because I thought you wouldn't be back for awhile because of your responsibilities. Is your DH doing better I hope?
I never know when I am going to get back online with all of you because I never know when I am going to get some relief here...like a neighbor stopping in to "visit" with Val. And then I never know what to do first! There is a lot to do, always. And I get really tired, so when I can, I often just lie down for a bit.
I just don't often get to MILU, as you know. Maybe I should just post my status occasionally under Grab Bag.
With dementia setting in we have things like Val putting his bridges in a box and soaking his hearing aids in hot water. The list goes on and on. Every day seems new and different and what worked yesterday is often obsolete today. I am committed to not putting him in our on-site nursing facility if I can continue to keep him with me and our little dog in familiar and comfortable surroundings. If money were no object, we would live in a larger unit and a live-in caregiver but we live in 600 sq. ft. and must be very conservative. And, I kid you not, the dog is old and unwell and sometimes I'm up at night with him! (Sometimes it sounds like more of a comedy routine than a tragedy, doesn't it?! ;D)
I'm in a Caregiver's Support Group...and a Peer Support Group of old ladies! (One is 98 and still driving. Scary!) I am also in private counseling that is offered free here by our County Senior Services. All in the hopes that I can ace this one. (And I have to be covered every time I leave.)
Chickie...I think you were referring to another thread about Christmas plans. This one is/was about Sassy's wedding. She is such a dear. And look how far off the thread I have taken us!
Did my response make any sense to you, J2B?
I want you all to know that I care and I feel connected even when I don't have a clue about what's gong on. This isn't what I planned when i created the forum. And it won't always be like this but I dread my impending "freedom."
Annie, thank you so much. We all need a vote of confidence once in a while. As you all know, I have ten (10!) karma minuses after my name! I sure did make Kat mad. Oh, well...right?
Luise, your DH is so blessed to have you there to care for him. I know its hard, my uncle is going through the same thing with my aunt, since her many strokes. God Bless
Quote. [And I have to admit it felt good to hear you say that my solution would have been the way to go
Luise, you do know your stuff. I still love the image of you showing up a week early to someone else's mainland luau.
Thank you for all of your support and blessings.
;D I actually did that once before in my 20s. I was invited to the wedding of a college friend. It was 100s of miles away but I just decided to make the trip and surprise everyone. I got there just in time and sat in the back. Big church. I actually cried and when they were pronounced man and wife and came up the isle together, I had never seen either of them before in my life! :'(
I asked the priest and he had double- booked and my friend's wedding was next. So, I went through the whole thing again but I didn't cry because I was laughing at myself. Since I lived so far away, and hadn't done a RSVP, they didn't notify me of the change.
I may be the air-head queen!
Oh, that is such a sweet story! I can see it in a movie like Bridget Jones' Diary or other funny chick-flick. Luise could totally be played by Renee Zellwegger :)