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From Helent:

Both my son and daughter (ages 20 and 17) refuse to be in the house with my relatively new partner.  About 6 weeks ago, i found that my partner was still seeing an ex girlfriend - this has now finished and there are many reasons and surrounding issues as to why i want to re unite with him and make the relationship work.  The ex girlfriend was a predator and although that is no excuse, she promised to make life difficult for him if he didnt agree to see her.  I know this woman and also know that she has psycho issues!
My partner and I have come to terms with what has happened and want to move forward.  He is a kind and caring person and we get along very well together. But my children see the hurt he caused me and refuse to see him.
My son has been living with his girlfriend for some months now, but hasnt been to my house to see me for two weeks.  My daughter goes to stay with her boyfriend if my partner is coming to dinner.
Its almost as if I am denied any kind of happiness. They can do what they like, have friends over, see who they want, be pig headed about everything etc etc.  Its like they are emotionally blackmailing me into doing what they want me to do!
I am going into this with my eyes open.  If i stuff up, I am a big enough girl to take the blame if the relationship fails.  But i want to see my children!
Thoughts???

I'm still kind of reeling, actually. DH & I spent about an hour with DS & DIL this eve. It was very pleasant! DIL chatted, laughed and seemed to enjoy being with us. She even mentioned the possibility of a future outing together. She did bring up her fabulous FOO, but didn't rub it in as before. She didn't criticize us at all. Progress? I hope so...I have to squelch my wariness and not overthink everything, just enjoy the moment.

OMG! Did anyone else watch Dr. Phil today?

Even the language is similar - boundaries, space, attachment...omg, I'm just flabbergasted.

DH & I rarely get time with DS w/o DIL. When she's out of town on business DS will call or come by, or might even invite DH & I, together or separately, to hang out (!) We have long, drama-free conversations about various topics, current events, life stuff. If DIL knows he's with us she calls or texts constantly. She spends a lot of time alone/with DS with her FOO, though.

We cherish the four short visits (4!) we've had with DS alone since the wedding a few years ago. Not that we don't want to see DIL, but she doesn't like us which makes the visits very awkward. She dictates what we talk about (her & her FOO only), how much we talk (more than a couple of sentences and she gets huffy), what we do (she doesn't share our interests), etc.

What's an MIL to do? If we express a desire for time we might be seen as demanding and needy. If we don't ask we'reoften left alone because all is apparently well (squeaky wheel syndrome.) Perhaps if some DIL's would loosen the reins their needy MILs wouldn't feel abandoned and could lighten up.

What's up with that? Why is it considered normal for DIL to see her FOO alone but MILs/FILs are odd for wanting to see DS alone?

"In The Way of the Scout: A Native American Path to Finding Spiritual Meaning in a Physical World (1995), Tom Brown, Jr. describes how when he was a child an Apache elder taught him to use an "expanded focus," where the task (i.e., any of life's pursuits) is but a small part of the whole picture. When we relax an absolute focus, we become more aware of life's flow around us, and, as a result, assistance in many unanticipated forms becomes available." from http://www.healingtherapies.info/Native-American%20Medicine.htm

SM announced that she and DF are making a trip and we're one of the lucky stops on their itinerary. DH is not happy about this, but he knows there is no graceful way out. Oh, this is fraught with the potential for disaster! However, I'm sure my wonderful WWU sisters will help me avoid a bad scenario and embrace a positive way of dealing with it all.

First, we were going to have to spend 6 hours driving on Christmas Day to pick them up. I have now reduced that to 2 by suggesting an alternative to their transportation plans (way to stick up for myself! Yay!) But 2 hours is still 2 hours when I have other guests to consider! They are requiring separate bedrooms, so I need to find another guest bed. DF isn't very ambulatory so he'll need a comfy reading chair. And so on, and so on with special dietary considerations, criticism of our holiday traditions, decor, etc. etc. Some BG: these are people who haven't been very nice to me in the past; SM has been cruel at times, DF rejecting.

I'm starting to twitch already, and I was doing so well    Buck up, Private! Smile! And as one of our WW has often said, wine helps
Let the holidays begin!

Well, we happened to see DS the other day. He told us how sad DIL's parents were because they were being snubbed by the spouse and ILs of one of their married adult children. The spouse wasn't allowing DIL's FOO to see their GC, and so on. All I said was, "It can go both ways, DS, so be aware." He didn't understand what I meant, and I didn't want to say anything more for fear it would cause a cut off. Later DH said to me privately that he hoped DS would figure it out and that he was proud of me for stifling any other comments (like Archie Bunker, LOL, "Stifle, Edith!")

DIL's FOO are the ones who snubbed DH & I and who have been so rude and cold to us. We've picked up hints that when our GC arrive we'll be shut out and DIL's parents will be the main GPs. Shoe, say hi to the other foot. Karma?

Hi, everyone...boo!With all the kiddoes running around in costume, I can't help but remember when my kids were little and we made their costumes from scratch every year (loved the glue gun). They always came up with very creative ideas that we couldn't just go out and buy. Such good times!

But the real reason for this post is to express some joy and also concern (there's that pesky ambivalence again) over a re-do of an event last year that turned out to be very painful for me. Last year DS invited DH & me to an event with DIL & her FOO, then had to uninvite us because DIL informed him she didn't like us. We ended up going but sitting separately and being totally snubbed by DIL & her FOO.

This year DH & I made plans to go again, and DS invited himself and DIL along. Then he said DIL's FOO wanted to join us! It's so sweet that DS is trying to get us together again; he has Norman Rockwell visions of the whole 'famn damily' spending good times together, I guess. But, I'm a little concerned about feeling wary around them, or feeling judged by them. Time to get a mani/pedi, LOL. It'll be a start, I hope, for less awkward meetups in the future. Wish us luck!

A study was done regarding physical pain and feelings of rejection. The first part of the article describes the study, and the second part gives some advice on handling rejection. I found it interesting.

http://health.yahoo.net/rodale/PVN/social-rejection-can-cause-physical-pain

Hi all! We've been on a little vacation with DS & DIL @ my family's homestead. It's good to catch up with all of you WW.

I've tried to make DIL's experience with my family a good one (best accomodations, etc.) She put on the charm around them and they are all smitten. However, on the few occasions she had to spend time with me alone she was her usual aloof, rude self. DH is hip & will validate my feelings, but the rest of my family has only seen the charming side of DIL. What hurts my feelings the most are her invitations to my relatives to come and stay with her & DS (we've not even been invited for dinner) and plans to meet for sightseeing/shopping expeditions when they're in town. She's the one who shuns us at events! I thought I had a handle on all this but I feel like I've taken a step backwards. At least I'm not in tears...just tired of this stuff. DS treated us well, very kind and thoughtful. He didn't see DIL's rude behavior and would more than likely deny it happened, so I'm trying to ignore it and move on. However, if the plans for a visit from my sibs pan out and we're shut out all bets are off.

She's an amazing young woman - smart, beautiful, talented, motivated, and she adores DS. We're truly happy for them, but it hurts to be shut out while others are let in.

Thanks for letting me ramble.

Sometimes events happen that put our problems into perspective. For me, such an event is the recent tragedy befalling the family of Nelson Mandela on the eve of his country's hosting the world's biggest sporting event, the FIFA World Cup. Mandela was to attend the opening game, but sent an inspirational message instead. I was reminded of his amazing life and all he and his family and country have endured to make it to this point, only to have tragedy strike again. Nelson Mandela handles it all with grace and dignity; truly a remarkable man.

Hi, all...those of you with children at home may not need to psych yourselves up for Mother's Day, but I find that I'm repeating the mantra "It's just another day" over and over to help me deal with it. All those smarmy, tear-jerking advertisements in the media are getting on my nerves. My mom passed on 32 years ago; DH's mom passed on 10 years ago. DH doesn't do anything for me since I'm not his mom, nor does he help DD, for whatever reason (she's a disabled adult.) I think DS has learned by example that I don't get a mention on Mother's Day, although DIL's mom gets feted. Yes, I know it's kind of a made up holiday for the greeting card/floral industries, LOL, but it still hurts to be left out after spending a lot of years being a pretty good mom. Thanks for reading my pity party post!

I wasn't sure what category to put this under; didn't want to put it in Grab Bag because Luise's important post may not have been seen by everyone yet. It's a cautionary tale for DILs and MILs, perhaps...

I've been thinking about my narcissistic father and his mother (my grandmother) who was the woman who turned out to be a very horrid MIL to my mother. When DGM was raising DF, she insisted that her son fawn all over her constantly and exclusively. She cut off all ties to her family (to this day we don't know anything about them) and also to her husband's family (luckily we have lots of documented info on his side.) She wanted to control who her son talked to and spent time with, and she felt like everyone but her nuclear, immediate family was a threat. She didn't want her son to get physically hurt, so she limited activities with his outdoorsman dad; she hovered and controlled; she was inconsolable if he went off on his own for an afternoon as a teen (he says he just needed to get away from her grasping neediness and would take his dog for a walk in the woods or some other boy thing.)

Not everything was bad; they travelled and gave dad a lot of wonderful experiences, but being the focus of his mother's attention and having to cater to her whims and needs made him want to leave as soon as he could and to stay away. It's no wonder he was a narcissist. And it's no wonder that his very needy, clingy, demanding mother became a needy, clingy, demanding MIL.

Because my grandmother wanted to keep her little family away from all relatives (we never knew why) the present generation has no clue about medical history, genealogy on her side, or a sense of where we came from. Her selfishiness, or fear, or need for control has made her disappear from family stories because we don't have anywhere to place her historically. She wanted to be the center of attention - now she's forgotten. If she's thought of at all it's not with fondness, that's for sure.

Hi, WWU sisters! Some of you might remember my story about being shunned at an event by DIL and her family. At that time I was devastated; really, really hurt. Another similar event is coming up, without DIL's family as far as I know, but with DS & DIL. Of course I'm keen to invite them to join us for dinner first, etc. etc. so we can spend some time visiting with them. We really miss DS. DH is wary. I'm not sure I'll be able to handle more treatment like we received before, but I guess I want to take the high road.

DIL has been acting nicer around us lately, but we haven't had very many opportunities to see them. This event is very important to DH especially. It used to be something he and DS shared. I was looking forward to it, but now that it's getting closer I'm starting to get nervous about being around DIL. She notices minute little details about us that are wrong in her eyes, things that I either don't notice or don't have time to deal with. If she mentions something and I try to laugh it off or make light of it, she thinks I'm making fun of her for being so fastidious. Actually, I've always admired fastidious people since I am so not one of them. I try my best, but there's always some stray something out of place My feeling is that she's looking for any excuse to hate us and to validate her desire to separate DS from his FOO. It's hard to just be myself with all this going 'round and 'round in my head!

I wish we could have an easy, fun relationship and be able to enjoy each other without all the stress. I also know that in the big scheme of things this is really small and insignificant compared to what others here are going through. But, it's on my mind and I could use some good sisterly support!

How true, and how uplifting. I also like how it embraces all of us (oops, except for Heartstrings, our lone FIL ranger...)

DS heard first hand what DIL felt about us, and saw her and her parents treatment of us in person. I think something must have been said by him, because she has been polite to us for a few weeks now (counseling maybe?) I'm still leery and not able to breathe out yet, but I'm hoping I can relax soon and  trust again. I'm not comfortable visiting, calling or emailing either one of them, since I don't want to be seen as hovering or smothering, God forbid!

I'm still dealing with my envy towards DIL's parents who get to see them every day and have the time and resources to pull out all stops for celebrations, holidays and birthdays. (When DS was growing up, he knew kids from all income levels, and we were right in the middle. However, he decided that spending big bucks = love, and always felt shortchanged no matter what we did or how much we spent, 'cos it was never enough compared to the wealthier kids he knew.) I think he's beginning to see through the IL's "control through money" agenda, but I think those old emotions hit him, as they do for all of us sometimes, based on past experiences. Other than repeating "I love you" until I sound like a freak, I don't know how to prove to him that he is, and always has been, loved truly and well by his family.

And it still hurts that I can't enjoy an easy, comfortable relationship with DS like we used to have. I miss him.

Which leads me to feeling so grateful I still have him in some form, some of the time, and to want to express my deepest sympathy to those who are not able to see their DSs or GKs for one reason or another. My heart breaks for you, and I send good wishes/prayers your way every single day. This site is so amazing for the love and support we find here. Welcome to all newbies, and love to all who venture here.

Cherishing ourselves is often difficult due to many things, but I believe it is one of the most important things we can do while dealing with MIL/DIL issues that are often gut-wrenchingly brutal. Even little irritants can affect our health and how we deal with others, IMO.

After months of putting it off (excuse after excuse) I finally made an appointment to get accupuncture and massage for my stiff neck and shoulders!!! Yay me! I hope I can continue to value myself, and maybe others will start to value me, too.

How do the rest of you cherish and value yourselves?

I now realize that my hurt and pain have made me say and do some things that are unacceptable (see "I think I blew it" topic.) I've also said gossipy things, out of pain, to a couple of close friends who know DS. This behavior must stop if I am to maintain a good relationship with DS & DIL! So today I confess my sins and vow to put my entire family first - if I'm hurt over something (and there are a lot of things to be hurt over) I must let it go and think about the strength of my family and my love for DS & DIL. Any other behavior will backfire on me eventually. DS would drop me in a hot minute if he suspected I'd discussed his wife w/anyone!And if anything I did caused DS to cut us off, DH would resent it forever.

Yes, I know this is how "they" get to us...they know we'll do anything to preserve our family. I just don't know how else to do this. Family above all. My needs must be dealt with by taking care of my health and self-esteem, not by verbal outbursts to DS or others.

And I may backslide, since I am not perfect, but I know I have my "peeps" here to get me back on track

As DS & DIL were leaving last evening I said something to DS along the lines of "I wish we could do cool things with you, too." You see, they spend most of their time with wealthy DIL's family. Some of the things they do are big trips that we couldn't afford to take them on, so I don't resent that. What I do resent is missing out on the activities that used to be OUR thing and have now become THEIR thing (they had not gone to these events until DS encouraged them.) DH & I have continued to go to these events as usual, where now we are shunned by DIL & her family. Last night DS & DIL were sharing photos of a recent trip; I was fine until some photos of a few of these other events came up (where we had been shunned) and I suddenly felt like I'd been kicked in the gut. For some unknown reason I felt like I had to say something, and chose a really stupid time/place. I'm afraid I've lost whatever strides this fragile relationship w/DIL has made in the last month, all over being reminded of a deep hurt. I don't know what to do. I really miss our son; I have an ache that will not subside.  Even when we are able to get together it's on a shallow, almost fake level. We used to have great discussions and share activities we loved. Now DIL's family gets the big fun and we get the leftovers. When I don't say anything I feel bad; when I do say something I feel like I'm not supposed to be feeling the way I do - but I can't help it. A part of me has been torn away. How can I fix this?

Aaaarggghhh! They've done it again! It's their world and we just live in it.

I was so looking forward to a day with DS & DIL. They invited themselves over to cook holiday favorites, but DIL's parents, who they see every day, have pulled us all back and forth with drama and scheduling issues. After a very rough week of home and work emergencies, I wasn't in the mood to be a doormat, so I told DS I needed a definite date/time; I'd already spent lots of time and money on the project. DS sounded tired and frustrated, and of course I don't want to be part of his stress...I'll do anything just to spend a little time with him, but darn it I'm sick and tired of coming last.

Kudos, though, to DS; he told DIL his top priority was seeing us and then doing the charity work that would take up the other free day they had. DIL actually agreed, although I know it's hard for her to go against her parents. Well, DIL's parents pushed and now the plans are changed again putting me, DH and DDD in a mad rush to get everything together in a moment's notice. DH said NO, they're jacking us around again. I explained that it wasn't really DS & DIL's fault this time...I'm a sucker, I know.

Like I said, "Aaarrrghhhh!"