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Stilllearning, thank you for those wise words.  <3   You are so right-- I want my niece to have the support of the family.  And it would have been painful to watch her marry this man, knowing what I know.  I think what I wish would have happened is, I wish my sister would have come to me, even just emailed me, and said, "C., I feel horrible about this, but I don't really see how we can invite you to the wedding given how things have gone between our daughters, etc."  Going back a ways, I realize how much I am still  hurting over my sisters not attending my daughters' wedding, or at least just acknowledging it in some way, even just sending a card.  I wish, again, they'd have come to me or even written me and said, we feel horrible, but we don't see how we can attend.  I would have been sad, but I would have also understood and been accepting.  The silence seems crazy-making and eerie to me.

I am not the grudge-holding kind, but I am also not good with smiling and pretending things are okay when they are not.   I don't see my sisters often-- my sense is, now I will see them even less.  But  life will go on, and I have so much to be happy about and grateful for.  I do intend to send my niece and her husband a gift, just via their registry, to let my niece know I love her especially and that I care.   All of this is informed by my own past as a survivor of abuse.  I married in my early twenties, and my first husband tried to kill me and almost succeeded.  He went to prison for the rest of his life for this and died there in 1997.  I taught my children about abuse and battering, how to recognize it, how to avoid batterers.  All of these things figure in so far as how things have unfolded in my family. 

Well, anyway-- thanks again, Stilllearning.  I am so thankful for your wise words.  <3

Hello, all,

I have posted here over the past several years, though infrequently, but I read fairly often.  My past posts were about my adult child who had cut off all contact with me.  Later that child encountered serious life difficulties and moved back in with me for about a year.   I did my best to support this child through legal difficulties, unemployment and the end of a very bad relationship. Strangers looking on would have thought all was mended, and I had that hope, but I also had my doubts,  At the end of a year's time, my child moved out overnight, basically.  I went to work in the morning, and my child was gone when I returned home that evening.   We had argued, and I had had to set a boundary, and I didn't think that would go over well, and it did not.  I have not spoken with this child since, no family member has.  The child cut off all contact with all of us and moved quite a ways away.  I have worked hard to make my peace and move forward with my life.  I have a large family, a full time job, a long commute, a farm and beautiful grandchildren whom I regularly see and love very much.

I am 62 and the oldest of five siblings.  Both my parents are still alive and live independently on their own and do pretty well.  For many reasons I have always been the black sheep of the family, long story, but I have worked hard to maintain my connection with everyone, especially my parents, whom I visit regularly.  My siblings and I are not close, but we have always been cordial and warm towards one another.   A big issue for me and my kids has always been, my parents, especially my mother, have always greatly and unapologetically favored my youngest brother and sister and their children.  This hurt me and my kids over the years.  My kids are all grown now, and most of them have little to nothing to do with my parents and siblings.  Some harbor deep resentments. 

A couple of years ago, one of my nieces shared a house with my daughter her own age and two other roommates.  This did not go well, because the niece took up with a man who was abusive and caused many problems.  After a particularly bad scene, the niece moved out without paying her portion of the rent, leaving my daughter and the two other housemates on the hook for her rent for the remainder of the lease.  This caused some pretty bad feelings including with my sister, the niece's mother, with whom my daughter had strong words.  Not only was my daughter upset about the rent, she was very upset about the abusive boyfriend and scared for my niece.  My sister did not respond well to this.

During the time of the unpaid rent/abusive boyfriend issues, my daughter had been planning her wedding and my niece was to be a bridesmaid. Those plans went up in smoke in the fallout around the abusive boyfriend, the moving out, the unpaid rent.   Both my sisters took my niece's side.  One, a florist, had agreed to do the flowers for my daughter's wedding, but at the last minute, with only a couple of weeks until the wedding, she backed out and said she would not do the flowers. In the end, neither of my two sisters or their families attended my daughter's (large, beautiful) wedding.  They did not RSVP, they did not attend, they did not send gifts, they did not acknowledge my daughter's wedding in any way.  My parents and two brothers and their families did attend, and I was grateful. 

This past weekend, my niece married the abusive boyfriend.  No member of my large family was invited to the wedding.   The wedding photos are all over the family FB pages with me -- the oldest daughter -- and my entire large family clearly missing.  No family member has said anything about the wedding directly to me (or to anyone in my family), even though I've seen my folks regularly and have seen and had contact with my brothers and my sister, for that matter.  We were all just pointedly and silently omitted. 

This is really hurtful to me.  I knew it would be, but it's worse than I thought it would be.  It's as though my whole family has been erased from the extended family and the network of friends.  (My immediate family counting spouses and grandchildren amounts to 24 people.)   It is both painful and bizarre.  In a way, it's like all of the favoritism of the past decades has reached its final outworking, which is the erasure of me and my children.  (I am divorced and have been a single mom since 2008.)

I don't really know how to move forward now.  Do I have regular conversations now and just avoid any talk of the wedding?   I don't see that any good would come from bringing it up, but I also don't see that any good can come from pretending it didn't happen.  I did deactivate my FB page, no need to subject myself to that.  While I can possibly see my sister's and niece's predicament-- they didn't want my daughter at the wedding after all of the unpleasantness, but also didn't want to exclude only my daughter, so they excluded all of us.  Confrontation, disagreements and arguments are not really acceptable in my extended family.  That was the problem in the first place-- my daughter dared to speak up and say, hey, my cousin has taken up with an abuser, they are fighting all the time, he's hurting her, they moved out and did not pay the rent, what the heck.  (I was not in on any of this directly, I just heard my daughter's side, and, of course, my sister just heard her daughter's side.  The other two roommates did confirm what had happened though-- they all came to me asking for advice.) 

I would so deeply value any words of wisdom anyone might have.  I feel like though I have tried hard to be part of my family, it's kind of been for naught.  It does really hurt, and I am also deeply hurt for my kids.  Fwiw, my adult kids are all successful, college graduates, good jobs, nice homes, good spouses.  They're just all good people.

Thanks so much for reading, those of you who have taken the time!

C.

Wow, Karleigh!  Just reading how you have been treated makes my stomach hurt.  I can't add to the wonderful responses you've received but do want to commiserate with you.  You don't deserve to be treated that way, it's awful!  jdtm, thank you for sharing what you'd do differently-- so helpful.  I feel like I've put so many things on hold pending things getting better with various of my kids/relationships/family dynamics.    No more. 

 

Thanks so much, Footloose, Luise and Pooh!  <3  As it turns out, the big package I was concerned about had actually been delivered to my house via UPS and could not be sent back "Return to Sender."  I feel like I am so traumatized, honestly, by my many horrible interactions with a couple of my grown kids that my brain doesn't work the way it should at times.  If I'd looked carefully,  I'd have seen that this was a UPS-delivered package that I could not "return to sender -- I'm glad I couldn't fit it into the post office box!  E attempted to involve another one of my adult kids about this this past weekend, asking [the other adult kid] to go to my house and find out why this package has not been "returned to sender."  I explained there is no "return to sender" option when it comes to UPS.  (UPS is coming to my house to retrieve the package today.)  E actually did fill out a forwarding notice with the post office, but E moved out basically overnight so some things might have come before the forwarding order was in effect, but one of these was not this package.  I set it out for the UPS guy marked "Not at this address."  Done!  This is also the last time I am going to allow E to go through another of my kids this way.  So very done with this kind of thing.  Thanks again, all of you, for being here, such good encouragement.  xo

Hello, all.  So, E has been gone for about five weeks now and has returned to treating me just as E did before E's life fell apart and E moved in with me and stayed with me for 11 months.  All communication has been cut off, save an occasional, terse, demanding email about what I am supposed to do with E's mail.  Shortly after E moved out, I emailed E asking what to do with E's mail. In the case of packages, the post office does not deliver to my house (I live in the country).  If the package cannot fit into my mailbox, it is held at the post office until someone retrieves it.  This is difficult for me because I work Monday through Friday when the post office is open and it is closed on the weekends.  I literally have to take time off work in order to retrieve mail that is being held.  Anyway, E asked me to write on everything, "Not at this address" and send it back.  I've done that, with the exception of one large package that I have to bring back to the post office when it's open, because it doesn't fit into the blue post office bin outside.   E emailed me asking what the problem is and why I haven't I returned this and apparently another package (that I don't think I've seen).   Would you respond?  At this point, I am feeling like I am just going to ignore these rude emails that do not even include a greeting or a signature, just "what is the problem, why haven't you returned my mail."    I am trying to focus on not trying to make sense of the senseless.

Such insightful responses-- thank you.  I've been thinking about how our kids learn to to treat us rudely or uncivilly to the point that they don't even realize they are doing it, which is so true, I think, and I realized something else.  The more we distance ourselves from rude and disrespectful treatment, the more we, ourselves recognize it and can no longer tolerate it.  Treatment I tolerated for many years I do not and will not tolerate any longer.  This is mostly because I made a conscious decision some years back that I would not be mistreated ever again.  I was in therapy for many years with a very fine therapist who specialized in treating survivors of trauma.  It helped me so, so much.  During one session after I'd described something that had happened, she asked me, "After having gotten yourself free of abusive relationships with men, are you willing to be abused by your adult kids for the rest of your life?"  That was a real turning point for me and I purposed then that I would not be abused by anyone, including my adult kids.  I've removed myself, since then, from disrespectful treatment of all kinds, and I think what's happened is, when I am treated rudely, it is far more jarring to me than it ever was in years past when it was just simply the way things were.   

I am so tired of the way I am routinely treated/spoken to by some of my kids.  I have a large family, all adults now but one.  Some of my kids are so consistently disrespectful, countering/arguing with everything I say, just about, criticizing me or being critical of me in ways they would not criticize anybody else in their lives, taking what I do for them for granted, etc.   I'm a peaceloving kind of person and am not critical or judgmental of my kids, do not speak to them disrespectfully, on the contrary, I go to the other extreme probably and am overly forebearing and accepting.  This causes me to just not want to be around them or to not really want to talk to them which in the past some have interpreted as my not being interested/not caring.  It's a no win situation.  If I confront them over their disrespect, they don't like that, and if I am silent and distance myself, they don't like that either.  I don't really like the latter, either, I would much prefer to be treated with simple respect!  The kids grew up seeing me disrespected (and abused) by my exes and although they didn't approve of how their dads treated me, they seem to still demonstrate some of the contempt their dads showed towards me at times.  I'm single and have been for some years now (and intend to stay single) but I think that kind of adds to the problem, something like there is no partner in the picture to stand up for me, something like that.  Any thoughts?  Thank you for reading!

Luise, I know what you say is true and wise.  Thanks for the reminder.  A very good friend is coming to stay for the weekend.  She lives across the country, haven't seen her for some years now.  My youngest will be with her dad. I am so excited!  We are going to kick out all available jams.    I know it is time to move forward into this new part of my journey.  Thank you so much for the hand holding.  xo

Things seemed to go downhill badly before E left when E said something like, that the first time E left home (nine years ago), E had done things incorrectly.  E said E had been working and saving money, and that I had borrowed money from E to pay the mortgage one month.  Although I had paid E back, E said E still should not have loaned the money to me, because that was money E was going to use for a car, and things would have been a lot different had E had a car when E left home the first time, but since I had borrowed money from E, E had not gotten a car.   (Even though I paid E back, so I didn't really totally follow this, but I figured maybe E meant  E had been demoralized by loaning me the money and then having to wait for it to be repaid.)  E's logic was, this time, E should stay at home, save the money for a car, I should  not borrow it and E should not loan it and then E'd get the car E should have had the first time E left home and things would then go smoothly from here on out.  This annoyed me and I told E so.  It seemed manipulative, something like an attempt to obligate me to agree to E's plan, in that E was blaming my having borrowed money from E for E not having had a car, which caused E's earlier departure from home to be difficult, with the final result that E ended up back at home nine years later.   (I did tell E I regretted borrowing money from E, even though I paid it back.)  When I told E this framing upset me, E said that was not E's intention and there must be some other reason for my defensiveness, and then it became all about my defensiveness.  Things did go downhill from there. The craziest thing is, E's had several cars over the past nine years since!  The last car E had, E lost because E got in an accident because E had been drinking, and totaled the car.  E had had it only three or four months and it was a nice, late model vehicle.  E did not have insurance and got a DUI.  This is the reason E ended up needing to stay with me, this DUI shortly after having been arrested for an altercation with E's abusive ex which resulted in E having to spend four days in  jail.  Somehow, all of that is erased. 

Your replies have made me cry this morning.  I can't thank you enough!  The past couple of days have been so sad and hard, all the old self-accusations and sadness have been crowding in, I should have done this, I should have done that, and so on.  It's very true-- when E moved back in, I was a different person and much of that had to do with the work I'd done and help I'd sought since the last time I spoke with E (about three years before).   When E first moved back in, (October 7 of last year), I said I was happy for E to come and stay and really wanted to help, and I thought we should talk more in a month, see how it was going and renegotiate then how long E's stay would be.  THAT was a huge step for me!  Just setting that limit and saying we would talk again.  And E seemed fine with it at the time.  In a month we did talk and E then asked to stay to complete E's associates degree.  I agreed to that, with many reservations and fears, since I knew that would likely be a year or so, but E seemed very contrite and really seemed to want reconciliation and to move forward in a good way.  The crisis really came when E received what would be E's last financial aid for this final quarter and then E'd have had the AA.  The plan we'd been talking about was for E to continue to a four year school after that which would have been very easy in all likelihood.  E has a good grade point average and is eligible for good financial aid and would be entering the four year school as a junior.  Suddenly, E wasn't motivated to go to a four year school anymoire, E was applying at warehouses?, wanted to stay at my place longer, find a job, I'd be responsible for transportation until E gets a car, etc., then E'd save for a place.  This was not anything we'd ever discussed previously-- in fact, E had said this had not worked for E in the past, hence the return to school?   But when I opposed this -- and I admit, I was pretty intense in opposing this plan, felt strongly about it, though I was never unkind or mean and said repeatedly I was willing to work on something we could both live with -- that was it, E was gone the next day, no goodbye, no phone call, no email, nothing, gone acrimoniously, as in the past.  Very painful.  Really?  After 11 months and many long, intense conversations and discussions, some VERY intense and meaningful, seemed like, after all that driving around and doing all I could to provide support and seeing you move forward, get past the legal issues, get two quarters of college done, now this?  It really hurts.    Your support and encouragement helps so much, I can't tell you.  Well, you all know.  THANK YOU!

Luise, I reread, thanks, it makes a lot of sense. 

Thanks, Luise.  I keep feeling haunted about one thing.  While E was here, I was not always as responsive as I think E wanted me to be.  It was sort of like E wanted to come back and have everything the way it was before E severed E's relationship with me.  That wasn't possible for me-- I couldn't give myself to E without reservation knowing how things had gone before.  I did try to be as loving and supportive as possible for as long as I could be.  But I wasn't always available for long conversations or for outings, I didn't always want company when I had errands to run (so sometimes I'd just go where I had to go, without inviting E to go along).   Sometimes I just wanted to be alone when I was off work on the weekends.  (I didn't say that to E, I just was kind of unavailable.)   I guess I am just asking for feedback and encouragement here.  I tend to take on way too much responsibility and to feel guilty about everything and to think I should have done more, no matter how much I've done. 

I know this thread is a couple of weeks old but just want to commiserate with you, Didi.lost.    Several years ago, my child, E, used the same hateful word on me that you describe your child using.  It was Thanksgiving, we were all at another of my kids' homes, E had been drinking, and suddenly E looked at me out of the blue and asked me, "Why are you looking at me like that?"  I don't remember what I said, but I do remember I was not looking at E  in any unusual way and I said something to that effect.  Up to that point it had been a pleasant evening.  E got very loud then and started to scream at me and attack me, so I got up and gathered my things and walked out the door.  I got into my car, and as I left, E came out onto the porch and started screaming at me.  I pulled out of the driveway and drove away in terror and such heartache.  Years passed and I had no contact with E and was in a lot of pain about it but did my best to move forward.  A year ago E moved back in with me after getting into trouble and for most of the year things seemed to go well and I was really happy.  Recently it all fell apart, and E is gone again.  As it was falling apart, E and I argued and that Thanksgiving night came up.  I'd figured since E'd been drinking, E'd likely forgotten it, but E hadn't.  E remembered and was not sorry.  E felt, still, even after a year of staying with me and putting E's life back together and many  pleasant moments together (apparently?) that what E did was understandable and did not need to be apologized for, that this abuse was deserved .  This is all just to tell you how much I hear you and respect what it takes to gather oneself together and move forward after this kind of experience.  The level of rage is hard to understand and absolutely gut wrenching.  It has helped me to read your story and I am so impressed that you have quit smoking anyway!
So grateful for all of the amazing women here. 

"Don't let other people treat you in ways you would not treat anyone." 

Thank you so much for this!  I know this is true but constantly need reminders.  I am going to write this out and put it somewhere I can see it every day.