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Dear pooh, Ty honestly for your post. It addresses my post, and I ty for that. Yes this is just an Internet forum, but rl problems, and I looked for help.

I apologize for getting involved in something that rl isn't what I wanted and Ty, and goodbye and I wish you all well.

Stand strong

Wow, I was not nasty to you, having a discussion based on what you said. Sorry but I'm not a bobble head, you say something I'm going to reply. Back and forth. Discussions.

I was nice to you and understood, only asked maybe you could see.

Dear allthatmatters,

Yes if true your poor 2 yo should be considered. Being seperated from from mommy at that age is hugely traumatic. Of course I certainly don't know your mil, but that part did stand out as odd. This post tells me more.

I'm sorry that you and your dh spend 12hours away from your children. I'm sure you're financially giving them a better life, believe me I understand, but maybe, just maybe, you're taking it out on your mil.

You said that friends are more important to you than family. While I agree that you chose your friends and not your family, you choose them because you want them to be your family.

So allthatmatters, to me, you really do seem like a lovely person. And someone that I would want to just hold, maybe, just maybe, you aren't all that and you could be wrong.

Dear allthatmatters,

Wow what I wouldn't give for a dil like you. Yes grandparents, like me, are important in a child's life but its a parent/family life now. They passed the torch so to speak. I would die for the time you describe. And yes two year olds are clinging, it's the nature of the beast. Lol

One thing only, although I completely understand that its a family, to me family isn't one generation only and discarding the rest. I completely understand you wanting your family time, but to me, and I know subsequent posts disagree, maybe his mother doesn't want to be in control, maybe she does want her own life now, but also wants a family.

I sadly don't have a dil like you that gives me anytime at all, but I have to be honest and say it really does sound like you begrudge her being in your life.

I did read the open me first thread and if I'm in the wrong place or posting something wrong, I won't at all feel offended if its wrong. I'll just try to correct it. I admit up front that I don't know if this should be dil or ds because it's really both.

It takes some background but I'm going to try to make it as short as possible. I've always wanted a loving family and never had it. Not with my own, and not with my in laws. I'm the youngest of my siblings and Even though I'm a very well grown adult, my mother always told me that I was never wanted, she cried from the day she found she was pg with me, I ruined her life, I look just like my father that she divorced, just on and on. She wasn't a functional person, she was the type of person that was very jealous and divisive and everyone had to only have her and no one else, including her  children. Yet of course when you are growing up you would do whatever sometimes for your mother to love you, it's your mother. I was guilty of that to an extent myself. I saw her as flawed and wanted a relationship with my siblings, yet I felt sorry for her and wanted to take care of her. Especially since my paternal grandmother didn't try to hide her hatred for her.

Long story short it of course didn't end well and I wanted my ds to have a mother and family that I never had. Because of another long story that nearly ended in death, mine, he's an only. My mother, and my mil continued their reign of terror with him. I'm not a saint by any means but I was willing to look past what they did to mean for him and if they would be good grandmothers. They sadly weren't and many times I saw him in tears and asking me what he did wrong. The answer, nothing. So yes, long ago I made the decision to cut them all, everyone one of them, out of our lives.  I couldn't stand him to be hurt anymore.  My dh agreed. It would take a book to write about his side.

Fast forwarding to years later, we gave our ds a loving childhood that neither of us had, filled with happy family, friends, laughter, love, everything neither dh or I ever had. But none of it mattered to us because that was the past and not current and really a lifetime that wasn't ours but our parents and what we really learned was we knew as a family what we wanted and didn't want.

I love my ds more than anything in this world, I think any loving mother does. But sadly I do finally have to agree with dh, that he's just not mentally well. Where did I go wrong? What did I do? I ask myself everyday. He hates me, absolutely hates me. He has so many "memories" that just aren't true.

Here's the dil and not sure where to post. When he first met her and then we did we were thrilled, we loved her to pieces. She actually would criticize her mother and family and I would basically say give them a break because..... I never tried to separate them. At different times she would tell me things that ds said about me or his childhood that were lies. I would tell her the falsehoods and she would say, I don't think I really know him. I would tell her that she knows him, his heart, he's kind, he's intelligent, he'll do anything for you. That's the type of person that he is. Judge him on that. Why he hates me I don't know. She said that what she saw was not the person he describe. Ok admittedly I couldn't help but cry actually hearing that he hated me so much. Anyway.....

I loved her, I loved him. I was so happy they found each other. Then all things changed. Something is very obviously wrong with him, which breaks my heart but I don't mean it like he's an innocent and free pass, but I haven't seen or heard from him or her in two years.

They moved to a different state where her mother lives,and even in her house. At first I was hurt that they wanted to be closer to her, but that was my problem and I dealt with it, and I didn't live, oh yea happy for them, I just went on with my life. Of course I was thrilled to keep in touch, although they both said it couldn't only be email nothing more.

Then after a few months she wouldn't even reply, then even deleted the email address that she gave me, Then he started being shockingly vicious.

Oh gosh, this is way longer than I intended as a simple post. I'm sorry.  I'm still trying to make sense of the hurt.