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Problem Solving => Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters => Topic started by: oliveb on June 03, 2012, 09:22:44 PM

Title: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 03, 2012, 09:22:44 PM
my children have always put me down and verbally abused me, and 2 physically abused me. Their father was a very wealthy, abusive man. Just over 2 years ago I put a deposit on a house for my daughter and boyfriend, I  paid off his credit card of $20000 which they promised to repay,they never did, leaving me to pay off the card plus interest.  My son took his life 2 years ago, when I paid for the funeral instead of his young wife, I was ordered out of my sons house by my surviving children. I sated in a motel on my own for a week until my son was able to be buried. None of my children spoke to me at the funeral and I knew no one else as I was in another state. I have 8 grandchildren and have no contact with them. Today I saw my daughter and her children on a web page and I feel sad. What a loss.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 03, 2012, 09:52:29 PM
Welcome - Many of us here know only too well what you are describing. I'm so sorry have had to face and go through such pain. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 03, 2012, 10:06:43 PM
thank you for your reply. It is hard but I have no intention in contacting them.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 03, 2012, 10:19:24 PM
For many of us, closing the door has been the only way to go on. We were whole before we became parents and we are seeking the kind of inner healing that will bring us back to wholeness again. We did the best we could and it's up to our adult children (AC here) to make their own way. We can't make sense of the senseless, and we can't change others. Most of us had reasonable expectations about having continued relationships but we can't do it alone...and it's pretty much up to us to let go of those hopes and dreams. No one has to fulfill our expectations...no mater how reasonable they are. It's a very hard road to travel. I know, where I live, it's late but I'm sure others will be responding to you tomorrow. This is a very loving and supportive Web-community.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 03, 2012, 10:58:25 PM
thank you so much, I am glad I found this site
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Ruth on June 04, 2012, 06:06:03 AM
Olive, welcome to the site and to people who care and understand.  We know this struggle, all of us here have had broken relationships with our children.  We are all seeking how we choose to go on with our lives, and how we want to respond to our a/c rejection of us.  I have been grieving for my DS for 12 years now, with only intermittent periods of relief, when I remodeled the kitchen a couple years ago, for instance, I was able to refocus and enjoy something, and I remember a few years ago when I made the rock garden and fountain, for a whole summer I was able to experience uninterrupted joy.  It was heavenly.  But since the first of this year I have been pulled into a vortex of grief and loss.  It has been exacerbated by my retirement, but I can't run now for another distraction  because the time must come when I face this demon and chose a course for my life.  As of now, I am deciding that the grief must stop, and I must make a decision whether or not to relinquish my stronghold on my hopes for relationship with my DS.  As long as I live in hope, the grief will not stop.  I have been able to find closure that I know my DS does not hate me, or is not living in preoccupation of me, i.e. the things I did wrong and grievances.  No, it is worse.  I am only a triviality to him, an incidental, like a distant aunt.  I basically don't exist in my DS's life, and my absence totally would just mean basically nothing to him.  Nothing in his life would change.  So my pain is unproductive.  I can grieve the rest of my life and it will not bring my DS one step closer to me.

I am sorry I digressed a lot into my own story, but its what we do here.  We tell our stories and it helps us heal.  We are attentive to each other here, we have no where else to go.  Our families don't care to hear it anymore, it has become old news and they want us to just get over it and move on.  So we shove it inside of us, and it festers up there, until we can let it out, and get permission to let it out.  I have decided to look for a grief counselor here where I live, to try and help walk me through this process.  Sometimes we get stuck.  But as Luise says, there is a life for us beyond this.  We aren't meant to grieve all our lives.  They WERE our children, but they are no more, they are adults and we have to come to terms with that.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 04, 2012, 06:44:57 AM
Welcome olive and I'm so sorry for your losses.  I am glad to hear you are not contacting them.  Just because they are are children doesn't mean we have to take abuse.  Good for you!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Elise on June 04, 2012, 06:55:37 AM
Welcome Olive.  I am so sorry for all you have endured with your dc. When your loving gestures like help with the house downpayment and funeral expenses, etc.  are misinterpreted and turned against you, it is the arrows (ac) we sent out into the world boomeranging back to penetrate our most vital parts. Louse reminds us we shepherd our dc to the door of adulthood and from there they go on without us at their sides. This site is testament you are not alone in this terrible pain.  I hope you have time to read and read here - there are stages in coming to terms that are different for all of us here, yet some themes which emerge time and again on our way to healing and looking ahead to the sunshine. I am so sorry about your son's death.
Ruth - I had and have a really hard time with letting go of hope.  I saw and see however that as long as I held on to hope, those pesky expectations would come marching right into my very being and dash me to the ground time and again.  I struggle with hope now again and keep repeating the no expectations mantra.
I am happy to read you are taking the step to address your grief in an expanded way. I think of you often.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 04, 2012, 07:16:19 AM
Hi Oliveb-

I just want to echo what the other WW have said - welcome, find a comfortable spot.  Sometimes I imagine this to be like a big quilting bee online  - some are busy stitching and talking, some just stitching, some off getting coffee or taking a a break.

Just having a place to open up and talk about life is priceless.  You may discover all sorts of things  - like I wonder if Ruth knows what an gifted writer she is.  Maybe her new direction is going to have something to do with the written word?    For me, I've reclaimed some of my lost integrity by getting mad as &$^# over how some of the WW have been treated.    Maybe my direction will be to run a training camp to turn hurt, beaten down women into female warriors.  Maybe I'll change my name to Hippolyta.   8)

Anyway, we hear you and understand how you feel.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Ruth on June 04, 2012, 07:26:08 AM
Doe, what a spectacular post!  I could just see that so clearly, the quilting bee.  All of us sitting around working on our blocks.  Some of us have wild colors and patterns in ours, others have pastels and muted tones, some of ours are skillfully done, some of ours are just a lick and a promise, but in the end in is a beautiful quilt.  Thank you for giving me something so special to think on this morning, you are clever, Doe!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Elise on June 04, 2012, 07:30:10 AM
I love both those images Doe. You are no slouch in the wordsmith arena yourself. Hyppolyta indeed.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: constantmargaret on June 04, 2012, 08:14:09 AM
And I'm sitting here stabbing myself with my needle......over and over and over. Mine is the patch with all the little blood stains. haha

Welcome Olive. Sometimes it's so absurdly sad you must laugh.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 04, 2012, 09:26:19 AM
I can't find my quilting glasses! I'd better go make the coffee... :D

O - If you haven't already, please go to the Home Page and under the open Open Me First category at the top, and read the Member Agreement there plus the Instructive Posts. Directions to finding most of our abbreviations can be found there, too. It's a good place to learn what is expected and to know if WWU is a fit or not. For instance, there are a lot of Web-forums where anything goes...language-wise and attitude-wise. Our site is not for that kind of venting or aggression. We don't debate, attack or judge and we honor each others religious and political preferences by not getting into those subjects. We all try to stick to the "Take what you want and leave the rest" approach to the differing threads. We're into mutual respect and mutual support and...ultimately, deep healing for many of us. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 04, 2012, 09:35:43 AM
Welcome Olive, I'm happy to hear you aren't keeping in touch with them.  I would stay away from the social network sites that have photos of them, it just adds to the pain.

Can you afford to move to another state? somewhere you could start a new life and meet new people and put all of those abuse people behind you.

I was told by a counsellor a long time ago that once a family decides who the scapegoat is, it is pretty much impossible to change those patterns.

You were a loving and generous person and perhaps it's time to find some people who might appreciate you (but I wouldn't be quite so generous in the future, there is always someone hanging around to exploit kind people).

Good luck,
KG

Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 04, 2012, 01:50:14 PM
 :)  thank you so much for your replies. What a wonderful group of women, full of support.
I only have a couple of friends, they know my situation but new people always ask about if I have children, where are they etc.etc. They say how wonderful their children are etc etc.  Mothers day is hard and Christmas, I am fortunate I have International students which I host, so they are here on those days.  I cannot move to another state as my home is my income and I now have a mortgage from giving my D a home.
I wont be going to any social sites again, I do not know why I did that yesterday, curiosity got the better of me.
On my 64th birthday this year, I decided this was my year, so I booked with a gym, got a personal trainer and have lost 7.5 kilos, only a few to go to my make my goal. I put on 10 kilos after my son died, so I want to feel good about myself.
Once again thanks to all for your support.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 04, 2012, 02:46:40 PM
Quote from: oliveb on June 04, 2012, 01:50:14 PM
They say how wonderful their children are etc etc. 

One of my favorite quotes is "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle."   It's possible that some of those people with wonderful children have other crosses to bear.  One friend of mine has great kids but is suffering financially (lost job with no retirement); the other has a great child but loathes her husband who she can't seem to leave.
Not saying that no one out there is happy, just that you probably have more company than you think.

Hippolyta  Doe
(thank God and his mom for Wikipedia for references that make you sound smart)

Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 04, 2012, 03:32:49 PM
Olive, I know what you mean about people asking about your children.

This year at Christmas, I'll be in a new spot, and might just tell anyone that asks that I don't have any children.  For all intensive purposes, I don't anyway, not having seen my son for a few years and not being invited to the wedding.

That will shut down the conversation I hope and send it into a different direction.

Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 04, 2012, 04:11:47 PM
Hi Doe and Keys Girl, thank you for your replies. Keys Girl, I have begun to tell people and my students that I do not have children and that stops the questions.
I was getting along fine until yesterday when I stupidly when onto the web and found my D site.  I wont go there again.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Ruth on June 04, 2012, 05:08:54 PM
Quote from: oliveb on June 04, 2012, 01:50:14 PM
:)  tThey say how wonderful their children are etc etc. 

I used to believe all that.  But after working in a career that consisted almost entirely of early to mid middle aged women, for years and years, I learned this -  don't you believe it.  Women talk about their a/c the same way they make resumes.  It sure looks very impressive on paper, job descriptions and affiliations.  Its amazing how easy it is to pull stuff out of obscure places in your life and make them look good on paper.  This is we talk about our a/c without really telling the truth....
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: justanoldgrandma on June 04, 2012, 05:27:14 PM
Olive, you have been treated so shabbily.  I'm glad you are moving on with your life w the exchange students for holidays, the gym, other interests.  You deserve to be happy.

It's true what others have said and your comment, too, Olive.....everyone has a cross to bear; most people don't talk about their children who disappoint them (it always seems that the kids are perfect unless we know them well.)  And health, financial, marital problems....no one is exempt....the grass really isn't always greener and I'm glad you know that, Olive, despite the fact that your family has mistreated you.

Hope you continue to find outlets for happiness, Olive, bc you deserve happiness.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 04, 2012, 06:06:14 PM
Ruth, I'm really glad you posted this.

The last few years there has been an outpouring of gushing about how wonderful their adult children are with the many friends that I see at Christmas.  I've always wondered how much of it was sincere, and how much of it was a type of competitive "my children are nicer/more successful than yours".   With your comment, I'm guessing that not much of it was truthful.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 04, 2012, 06:15:00 PM
my Doctor has told me that there are so many families with problems about their children but they dont tell anyone. Actually my Doctor who knew my children told me many years ago to stop having contact with them but at that stage I would say they are my children. He says it is sad to not have your children in your life but for me to realise they are toxic for me, which finally I have now done.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Ruth on June 04, 2012, 07:00:08 PM
I'll give you couple examples, Keys Girl, but I could give more.  These are 'sorority' mothers, I overhear conversation, 'and how is John?  Oh great!  We just got back from Florida, had a wonderful time, took him out to celebrate, he passed the bar, you know!'  ...same lady confided in me later 'John' lives in their basement, no job prospects, won't even look for work, and that he is just destroying the quality of their lives, they feel hopeless...another (same sorority) mother lives for show, impress impress, sets up son in a lucrative business in town (same son who was a known drug addict and dealer) mom made the down payment on their waterfront home, foots bills for just about everything, still footing bills.  same sorority  - another mom, brag brag about the college ds attended (doesn't mention he's now not going to school at all, nor working, and still living in the back bedroom...does a little ebay).  We are very good in this society about 'PR-ing ourselves'.   
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 04, 2012, 07:34:34 PM
I once knew a woman who went on and on about her perfect childhood. Perfect parents and sister, perfect home in the country, wonderful critters. It was so syrupy that I finally changed the subject one day and asked her where she went when she left home...and she said, "I moved to Chicago and became a gun-mol to a gangster." I'm serious! No wonder she talked about her childhood endlessly. I am seldom speechless but that was one of the times when I was pretty much struck dumb. People have their stories and their perceptions and I have learned to listen and not ask. I never knew whether to believe both tales or neither.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: nikncon on June 05, 2012, 03:06:00 AM
I know what you ladies are talking about.I have an acquaintance who is a milionaire.People think that she is so lucky.Can travel with DH on private jet etc.Very thoughtful family.Have been there for my DS when he had surgery last Nov This woman's only DD does'nt speak to her or her DH.GC is dropped off once a week for visits with gp.So like you all said. we all have a cross to carry.Some people just have wider shoulders to carry it.PS my DS called last night to say that new gf of three months broke up with DS on weekend.Feel bad for DS.But DH and I are moving next Tues.So I am very busy.No time for more drama!!!Have a great week ladies.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Lillycache on June 05, 2012, 04:41:05 AM
All this seems to stem from how women have traditionally viewed their role in society.  Women through the ages have based their self worth vicariously on WHO they marry, and the successes of their children.   There is a feeling that this reflects on them and their value.  It's pretty ingrained.  Even women who are intelligent and successful in their own right feel the need to embellish when it comes to their kids and family life.  Men seem content to base their identity on themselves... we tend to base it on others.  One would have thought that the strides women have made in equality would change our perception of self but it hasn't.   Nor has it done much to change societies view of women.   Look at how our personal lives and decisions are being bantered about on Capital Hill and in State Houses across the country.  It's like we still need others to decide who we are, what is best for us, and what our position is in society.   
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: firelight on June 05, 2012, 06:51:42 AM
Welcome oliveb,

You're in good company.  I, too, have given my all to my DD and SIL.  I rarely hear from them (unless I initiate it) and feel like I am only good to them materialistically. I actually had to evict them (with GD in tow and it almost killed me).  They took it all for granted and took complete advantage of me. We have since sold the property on a landcontract.  I used to think I was "helping" them, but now realize that not giving them so much is the real help.  Things certainly haven't turned out in the least bit of what I envisioned it to be once upon a time.  Most women here know exactly the kind of heartbreak you speak of, unfortunately. 

I wanted to share with you all this Mother Teresa quote and then I'll tell you why:

"I once picked up a woman from a garbage dump and she was burning with fever; she was in her last days and her only lament was: 'My son did this to me.' I begged her: You must forgive your son. In a moment of madness, when he was not himself, he did a thing he regrets. Be a mother to him, forgive him. It took me a long time to make her say: 'I forgive my son.' Just before she died in my arms, she was able to say that with a real forgiveness. She was not concerned that she was dying. The breaking of the heart was that her son did not want her. This is something you and I can understand."  ~Mother Teresa

It's always stuck in my mind where she says "he did a thing he regrets" as to whether he really did regret it.  I wonder.  But we surely can understand what that heartbreak feels like when our AC do not want us.  I understand the saying "they died of heartbreak". It certainly feels that way doesn't it.  When we raise our kids with great love (or so we thought) and then they act so loveless toward us, we feel like failures.  But their thoughts and actions really are there's to own.  Maybe they'll regret it and we'll still be alive to see it or maybe they/we won't.  I heard a saying that you get to see the product of your efforts and you'll know what kind of a parent you were when you see how your AC are.  BIG GULP.  I don't really believe that now.  Maybe I gave DD too much and she appreciates nothing.  who knows.  I do know we're all our own journeys, including them.  As luise says, our expectations are ours alone and it's no one's responsiblity to live up to them. 

I am so genuinely sorry for the loss of your son.  I don't think anything I could say to that would be sufficient. 

Keep posting here as you are now amongst friends who truly can relate to you.  Work on your self-preservation to survive the pain and we really advocate for that.  No place to go but up.  We know what you mean about the holidays too....you'll find we all take 1 step forward and 2 steps back sometimes especially when holidays roll around.  Here, you are OK to be yourself. 

Warmest thoughts oliveb.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: jill on June 05, 2012, 07:03:50 AM
Lillycache and Firelight,
Your posts echo my feelings.  I feel I have failed as a mother because my daughters do not like me, yet I know in my heart I did the best I could and no one is perfect and neither are they.  Although they will not forgive me for things I have said (unintentionally) that have hurt them, I am trying to work on forgiving them for treating me the way they do.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: justanoldgrandma on June 05, 2012, 07:07:46 AM
That story of Mother Teresa is so touching; it shows we have to go on and forgive even if the son being forgiven doesn't repent or realize how he has hurt the mother/father......the forgiveness is for US, not for the son and others who neglect us.  Otherwise we do die of heartbreak.

I haven't thought much of the forgiveness of AC who hurt us..... but that probably is the first step to healing and going on w our lives.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: firelight on June 05, 2012, 07:44:45 AM
I agree with the forgiveness.  Even when it goes against every fiber of our humanity at times.  Just like that mom who was thrown into the garbage dump in the story and she could hardly fathom "forgiving" her son for doing it to her.  I'm all for doing what I have to do, even if my inside is doing it reluctantly, to heal a festering, open wound.  I prefer a healed scar rather than the open wound.  The scar is still there, but it doesn't hurt as much as the open wound.  So as the feelings sway from pain, to anger, to numbness and back again, I will try to focus on forgiveness today (and I'm not saying this won't take practice! hence:  "practice" forgiveness).  Hoping that instead of "practice makes perfect" (which we are not), but rather work toward "practice makes permanent". 

Dictionary definitions:

"forgive":  pardon; to cease to feel resentment against; to give up resentment of or a claim to requital for; to grant relief from payment; to cease to feel resentment against (an offender); pardon (one's enemies); to grant forgiveness. 

"forgiveness":  the act of forgiving.

I have to be honest....for some reason I awoke this morning feeling offended and slightly angry about my DD's treatment of me and the life choices she has made.  It wasn't the usual sad feeling I get now and again over it all.  Then I thought of that story about the mother tossed in the garbage dump I haven't thought of in years.  And I felt a small amount of relief come over me....with the thought on forgiveness.  Even though we may do it silently and it may take some effort, I think it's worth it as a mother (for me).  Forgiving isn't saying, "hey, I'm a doormat and your treatment of me is just fine, no matter what it is."  It's simply saying that "as a loving mom, I am pardoning you for it and ceasing resentment over it and I am moving on."     

Much love.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Footloose on June 05, 2012, 09:01:39 AM
Dear Oliveb,
Welcome to what you can already see as our sisterhood.  Just reading these posts and feeling the intimacy of hearts and minds here makes me cry but ALSO gives me strength.  I am so glad I too found this oasis of support and love.

I find myself visiting here often as it does help but my pain is rising these days as a new life will be here soon.  My 4th GC, the 1st girl, w/ 3 big brothers is due any day but this grandma remains in time out from only child, DS who I raised alone. I put him first with great joy and thought during his entire life but his manhood led him away.  He does not need me and he does not want me or any of his family to be included in his sequestered, nuclear family.

I have to believe I will not be notified of the new birth as it appears that my son takes pleasure in throwing me in the dump too.  I too cannot forgive him.  Maybe in the future but this loss is the very worst I have endured.

My life has seen so many struggles and hardships but I always managed.  Each time I actually gained something good from the experiences.  Every time!  Until now.

I was in the hospital with a flesh eating bacteria destroying my limbs. (meningitis) Every day, enduring the removal of dead tissue, picked away, one small piece at a time.  4 hours a day for 2 months! I endured, I was actually curious after a little time and learned a lot about anatomy.  From the inside out via the morphine haze!

TMI, yes but the loss of my family, my only child, my legacy, my grandchildren, my future?! So very hard to manage THIS! How does a mother's broken heart EVER mend?  Time?! I know, that blasted thing called time!  I find patience a very hard thing to manage!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Ruth on June 05, 2012, 10:21:54 AM
I used to say this often, that a mother's love is the only love in the world that can love for a lifetime, gaining nothing in return.  The Mother Theresa story choked me up.  No, I don't actually believe the estranged children are living with regrets.  They feel no regrets.  They are living in the present, we however are living in the past as well as  in the present as well as in the future, and all of it is diffused with pain.  I have often felt I was that woman thrown into a dumpster, or thrown under a bus.  And then I read some other stories here, such as Footloose who went through his horrible ordeal and lost her limbs in the process, yet she exudes love and generosity to others, and then I slink off ashamed because I have never been totally abandoned and hopeless.  Thank you for sharing these stories and Footloose, pull up.  You know how to fly above these clouds.  Your DS is flexing his arrogant muscles right now, but there's not a single one of us exempt from having our rugs torn out from under us, and then coming to the realization that we're not omnipotent. 
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Ruth on June 05, 2012, 10:46:21 AM
And furthermore, I think will will all agree today (no need to take a vote, thank you) that flesh eating diseases trumps anything the rest of us have to bring to the discussion table, therefore, FOOTLOOSE, you are hereby nominated as EQFD (estranged queen for the day).  (everyone curtsies).  Here is your crown!  WE LOVE YOU!  And I know you well enough, of course, to know that you can cough up a little bit of giggle, old girl.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 05, 2012, 12:37:51 PM
Quote from: luise.volta on June 04, 2012, 07:34:34 PM
"I moved to Chicago and became a gun-mol to a gangster."


Still laughing about this - Luise, you do have such colorful characters in your life!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 05, 2012, 01:37:33 PM
Footloose, I am so sorry for what you have been through, I cannot imagine what it is like for you.
Firelight, I have forgiven my AC for they do not know what they have done. Only until their C grow up will they know having C is not always easy.
The day my son died I had a heart attack and was rushed to hospital, my AD who lived near me at that time, caught a plane to be near her father.
My children are toxic for me, which is sad, I know we can never be a family, for me to survive I cannot have toxic people in my life, lonely, yes.
I agree, mothers are blamed if the AC are not in their lives. When I used to tell people who did not know me well that I didnt see my children, I could tell when they said it was up to me to contact them that they didnt understand.
Thank you everyone for your thoughts, I truly appreciate hearing from you, it is great to know I am not alone but sad we are here.
LOL I DONT KNOW HOW MANY TIMES I GET THE VERIFICATION LETTERS WRONG
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Elise on June 05, 2012, 03:21:18 PM
Just throwing this out there. Surgeons say scar tissue is stronger than the original tissue, not harder, just stronger. Doesn't help much when the wounds are open and bleeding or festering, yet a reason to push through to healing in ourselves emotionally and spiritually, just as the physical body tries to do. Maybe even a little motivation to try to forgive and let go of the anger and resentment we have every right to feel as well.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 05, 2012, 03:40:36 PM
I'll throw my two cents in........I'm very apprehensive about "forgiving" my son and his wife, if the day were to come along. 

Manipulative people use the "forgiveness tactic" as an excuse to open the door open to play the same old game.

I think it's important not to carry around hostility about our children, but I also think it's wise to watch someone's actions, because talk is cheap, and if people tell you what they think you want to hear, it's just the same old song as far as I'm concerned.

I think that we are living through a very difficult time.  When I was young, it was considered shameful if a woman worked because her husband was too lazy to provide for her, almost 60 years later, so many things have changed but the old stereotypes remain. 

It's always the woman's fault (or Mom's fault).........a variation on the "Head's I win, tails you lose" theme.  Horsefeathers!!

I say the best way to deal with this is to go out there and have a great time, ignore what people are saying, never mind who forgives you and who doesn't.  We only have today and don't know if tomorrow is going to show up.

And of course, tell everyone who asks at Christmas that your children are in the witness protection program and you haven't a clue where they are but you are soooo happy they put those bad guys away!

Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 05, 2012, 03:44:09 PM
Well put, E. I know when I broke my ankle and had to have it pinned...the doc said it would never break in that spot again! I just read this...changed it a little, just to be safe:

Some folks think that avoiding challenges will bring them peace. As if the peace they now know didn't come from earlier challenges that were faced, and mastered.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 05, 2012, 04:04:50 PM
KG - That's a perfect answer! LOL!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Beth 2011 on June 05, 2012, 04:31:50 PM
Hi Oliveb,

Welcome to wwu, we are a tenacious group.  :)  I, myself am estranged from DS.  He is perfectly happy in the world (bio dome)they have created.  We have left it up to them if they want to have contact with us and it is not just FOO, it is extended to GM, DA's, DC's everyone.  You say, I didn't raise them like that, we were always close, what did I do, how can I fix it.  And none are the answer it is just them, not us.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 05, 2012, 06:04:00 PM
Quote from: Keys Girl on June 05, 2012, 03:40:36 PM
I'll throw my two cents in........I'm very apprehensive about "forgiving" my son and his wife, if the day were to come along. 

Keys, this has been on my mind recently - my son reached out a few weeks ago, tentatively and there are some conditions.  I've been wondering how much I want him back in my life.  I can maybe move on, but I'm certainly going to keep out of punching distance now that I know how fast his uppercut is.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 05, 2012, 06:25:48 PM
Hi Doe, my GD emailed yesterday to say it was her birthday and to say how sorry she was for all the trouble she caused when she came to my home last December.
I have not seen or heard from her since then. I am very wary about any contact from my AC and their C. I emailed and wished her happy birthday and said my life is good and I am please she is happy. Thats all. I am so wary, I know I have repeated that but when my AC are in my life it is so abusive, put downs, nothing that I do is right. I walk on egg shells and I know I ca not do that any more :)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: firelight on June 05, 2012, 08:22:20 PM
oliveb, you have every reason and right to be weary.  We all have to do what's right for us.

Keys Girl, I loved the ending of your post!  That was great and gave me a big, fat smile.   :D
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: firelight on June 05, 2012, 08:25:14 PM
Footloose, what you have gone through with your skin issues is amazing to me.  4 hrs a day for 2 mos of excrutiating treatment must have felt like an eternity and would shake anyone's foundation.  I, too, believe you get to have thequeen's crown for at least 1 day....  wow.  The things we learn what others go through here. 
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 08, 2012, 07:07:50 AM
Doe I think if someone wants to have a relationship BUT there is a list of conditions attached (when you haven't done anything crazy wrong), that's not a relationship, that's a dictatorship.  My true relationships accept me, faults and all and loves me anyway.

If my Son wants to offer a relationship with his conditions, I probably would politely tell him that I don't do screen tests.  I'm either already great for the part, even if we have to do a retake now and again, or he needs to hold auditions.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 08, 2012, 07:16:19 AM
Quote from: Pooh on June 08, 2012, 07:07:50 AM
If my Son wants to offer a relationship with his conditions, I probably would politely tell him that I don't do screen tests.  I'm either already great for the part, even if we have to do a retake now and again, or he needs to hold auditions.

What a great analogy, Pooh! 

Last night there was some dry lightening going on outside and a moth was frantically trying to get at it, trying to create some effect on it, banging itself against the window.  I lifted the blinds so it could have more space and get out but it ignored my offers of help and kept banging and banging. I actually offered freedom twice to no avail. 

I thought 'how like me at times' with this son thing.  I fixate on him, bang my head against this wall over and over when there is so much life left all around me.  How idiotic!  It's a no brainer, really but  I still get confused.  Thanks for the attitude example!  I'm going to walk around today with my hand on my hip and be saucy.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 08, 2012, 07:25:23 AM
That a girl!  You just be like, "I'm all that!"  Cause you are! 

The moth thing, great analogy too!  I have a feeling we can all relate to that one.  Hmmm.....let's decide from now on, we'll be butterflies!  Saucy butterflies!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 08, 2012, 07:46:25 AM
I agree, P. I've learned that when someone has a list of how I should be it is pretty clear that they don't want me to be who I am. Not gonna' happen, I don't know how to be anyone else. And harder yet, I see that when I have changes I would like to see in others, I'm doing the same thing and not honoring where they are in their own growth and development, (or lack thereof.) I have been guilty of making someone up to my specification and then being upset because they didn't follow the script. It's usually someone very close...like my eldest son and his dad, who both completed the picture by making me up to be someone I'm not remotely related to. Then there's that part of the same equation where I make myself up to be someone else...and so do others. Lots to sift through and cope with. To make it even more of a challenge, we are all shifting and changing moment to moment. Like diamonds, we have many facets. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 08, 2012, 08:28:22 AM
"I'll have a relationship with you with conditions (that I set attached??)"..........oohh, is that a subtle type of blackmail or are you expect to audition while trying to qualify for the Olympics?

I wouldn't touch that offer with a 10 foot pole, like in the high jump or otherwise.  Another heart twisting offer.

One of the affirmations that I watched recently on a program with Wayne Dyer talked about family dramas if you lived your life the way you wanted to and not how others wanted it and it goes something like this:

"I would rather be hated for being who I am instead of loved for who I am not"

(I hope this doesn't infringe on copyright issues, I can remove the post if necessary), but it sure did resonate with me.



Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 08, 2012, 08:45:50 AM
This is one of my favorites too.

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Suess
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 08, 2012, 01:14:11 PM
Your words of wisdom are so reassuring. I have hosted students of all ages and genders for 15 years, 99% love me to bits. I am totally myself with them. So I ask myself, why have my own AC walked away and hate me so much.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 08, 2012, 01:43:02 PM
Oliveb, you will never know why.  None of us will know why our adult children treat us with with hatred and scorn, with 100% accuracy, even if they eventually tell us, they will hold back something I believe and maybe they were mad that we made them walk to school every day.

I don't care about the why anymore, I care about what I do and where I go, who I spend my time with and whoever hates me is welcome to do so.   Many people are jealous of others and use all those negative emotions as a response and perhaps your AC are jealous that you are the object of the affection of so many people.

Don't waste another minute you can't get back by trying to figure it out, that minute is better spent in eating chocolate or ice cream, IMHO!





Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 08, 2012, 02:35:52 PM
I agree with KG. Please don't to expend any more energy on trying to make sense of the senseless. Rejoice in all that you have shared with us that is so supportive and loving. You have a wonderful "extended family!"  :)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 08, 2012, 03:16:15 PM
 :) Hi Key Girl, I am on a mission, just lost 8 kilos so the ice cream will have to wait  LOL You are all right.  I had an abusive husband and would never want him in my life, so why would I want my AC in my life.  I suppose it is a mother thing, empty nest thing. If my AC contacted me I would be very wary as I would expect they needed money not me for myself
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Elise on June 08, 2012, 03:26:10 PM
Hmmm - is requiring ds to be respectful in communication with me telling him how he has to be/change?  I have let go of all other expectations I think. Your posts made me think and I am confused on this now. While his abuse has stopped, I did have a laundry list of his emotional abuse over recent years which brought me to the point of walking away completely - and in a few months he began to approach and meet the respect 'requirement'/boundary I require. Thoughts?
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 08, 2012, 03:32:09 PM
 :)I would love to be able to comment Elisa but I cant as my AC have not spoken to me in almost 3 years. As long as he stays respectful and loving that would be great
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: firelight on June 09, 2012, 02:16:07 AM
That's a great mirror to look in, luise.  The street goes both ways as we remove our expectations of others and just live and let live.  I saw my own DD last week and that darn question popped out of my mouth:  "So how are you guys (re:  DD & SIL) making it (re:  paying the rent with no income)?"  Neither of them working yet.  You would think that as a mom that is a perfectly normal question......I suppose I shouldn't have asked.  It generally doesn't generate any good vibes.  I guess I'll always have to accept my DD loves skid row and that is who she is.   The questions about work only creates a barrier for me I have learned.  I need to shut up with that.  (but it doesn't mean I won't be wondering) 
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 09, 2012, 06:28:04 AM
Quote from: Elise on June 08, 2012, 03:26:10 PM
Hmmm - is requiring ds to be respectful in communication with me telling him how he has to be/change?  ]

Elise, I don't think so - for me, that comes under the heading of basic communication guidelines.  Along with things like don't interrupt each other, don't yell, don't burp in my face.     The conditions in my case were more along the lines  of "Sit Down and Shut Up" (not verbatim, but the sentiment was close).
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 09, 2012, 09:22:36 AM
It seems to me that we're still talking expectations. For me at least that has been the hardest lesson of all. Mine are both minimal and totally reasonable. I thoroughly dislike the "so what?" part. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: lancaster lady on June 09, 2012, 01:11:55 PM
I'm having a tough time with my DD living with me at the moment .
She really hates being back at home and lets everyone know it , especially the weekends
when she has no plans .
Staying in her room , no communication etc .....typical teenage actions , except she's 29 !
Hope I can last the three weeks she has left before she moves out .
I know its hard to move back home after having your own place , but I wish she would realise
hey , this is my place please respect it and the people who live here .
My DH wonders why it effects  me so much , when most of it goes over his head , I wish I had the
selective hearing and senses that he has .
I don't ask questions as '' I don't have to know everything '' , but surely we can be civil and communicate .
You know what ? After she moves out , all will be well , and we'll be friends again ....weird isn't it ?
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: constantmargaret on June 09, 2012, 05:59:50 PM
LL, my 26 year old DD lived here for over a year and just recently moved out. It was rough having her here, because she acted like she was still a teenager too.


I'm glad to have my house back to myself, and since she moved out, she has barely spoken 2 words to me, excluding the time she needed a dress hemmed. I expected that she would not thank me for giving her free room and board for over a year. It's the first time one of my kids has lived up to my expectations.

Just let one of them try to get back in the front door. I'm thinking about getting a scary loud barking junk yard dog.

I'm starting to see my kids who ignore me as the empty half of the glass. I would rather focus on the other half.

Cheers!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 09, 2012, 06:57:17 PM
You guys know my story...when my kids moved out they were told it was a one-way ticket into maturity and they couldn't come back again. I was given the same treatment and it taught me to solve my own problems...and when my grandchildren arrived, they were given the same deal. Now, my great granddaughter is in college and it applies to her. For us is works and has helped build mutual respect.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 09, 2012, 07:41:54 PM
I was crazy. What ever they wanted they got. I could never say no. Now they dont want to know me
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 09, 2012, 07:44:50 PM
One of my sons turned out like that and the other one is our ever-lovin' Webmaster. Go figure!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Beth 2011 on June 10, 2012, 12:02:44 PM
Sometimes, I just wonder if they think we will always be around to help pick them up as we have in the past???  Cutting all communication and waiting can be hard but is has been very peaceful and drama free except for the few bumps in the road when mutual friends or acquaintances that we run into ask about DS or DS and his family.  It has been over 2 months since DH made last and final attempt at communication with DS.  Heard it through the grapevine that he always has the GC with him minus DIL where ever he goes and he does all the shopping now too.  It seems that DIL is seen quite a bit shopping and not for groceries minus DH and GC.  Now all that said,  it is just so funny that we never run into any of them at the stores.   :-\   I told my DH are we really that scary???   ;)  You have to smile and keep going and that is what I do everyday.  8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 10, 2012, 02:28:12 PM
Hang in there...you're doing great in the middle of something that is the opposite of great. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 12, 2012, 03:53:26 PM
 :)I am interested to know what other mothers say to people when asked about their AC I dont want to tell new people that my 3 children do not talk to me, I have said I dont have any children that puts and end to the questions, so I would like to hear what others say.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 12, 2012, 04:20:23 PM
I always described Dwight and his profession and family...no one ever asked if he liked me or if we spoke to each other.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Beth 2011 on June 12, 2012, 04:21:51 PM
oliveb, if people are being polite in making conversation, I am just polite right back with a simple, fine, or wonderful.  Nice one word answers usually say volumes and then I move on to something else. 
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Doe on June 12, 2012, 07:40:26 PM
It seems to me when people ask, they are just keeping the conversation going, good cheer and all that.  They don't expect the whole story, necessarily.  Sometimes, I've gotten into detail with someone I thought was interested and found out it was way too much information.  On the other hand, I spoke with one of my DIL's peers the other day and when she asked, I told her a little of what was going on.  "I'm not surprised, she's a total nutjob" is the answer that I was surprised to get.   Some understanding!  In fact, she wanted to unload on DIL, more than I wanted to hear.  She is family after all - I was surprised to feel that way.

Funny, I've been craving some understanding and when I got it, it brought it all back to life.  I had to work at it a little to tamp it down again.  I don't think I want to get into the story much anymore with people who know her.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: firelight on June 12, 2012, 08:08:37 PM
I sort of went through the same thing, Doe.  One of my DD's friends who mentioned something to me said something surprising and it only rubs salt in the wound.  Even though our relationship isn't what it once was, it still hurts to hear someone else say something negative.  It's the momma thing.  I didn't respond negatively but rather briefly and politely and just went in to another topic ever so casually. 

Some clever WW here posted very recently that she tells people who inquire that her children are in the witness protection program and she has no idea where they are....and they're so glad they put that criminal away!  LOL  I loved that.  Gave me a chuckle.   ;)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 13, 2012, 05:47:35 AM
Good for you, D, for not going there. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 13, 2012, 07:09:05 AM
I'm going with, "I don't know.  Everything was fine until we went on Jerry Springer and I flashed my boobies.  I think that embarrassed them."  Shrug.....
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 13, 2012, 07:15:56 AM
Oh, Pooh...you're such a hoot! I honestly think most people just ask about my kids to be polite when what they really want to talk about their own. Something like "I have two grown sons, two grandsons and a great granddaughter" is enough of an opening so they can tell you how much better they have done in the propagation department. LOL!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 13, 2012, 07:23:29 AM
I think you're right.  I think most ask out of politeness because my close friends, already know.

I just figure at this point, it's all my fault, for the non-relationship and people are going to believe what they choose to believe so if I'm taking the blame, I'm going to make sure that it's a good story to tell.  People that really know me and care about me, either already know we don't speak, or wouldn't believe anything that is being told by them.  If they are just being polite, it will either clue them in that I don't want to talk about it, leave them speechless or if they are just looking to gossip, give them something to talk about.  :)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 13, 2012, 07:40:05 AM
Atta' Girl!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Footloose on June 13, 2012, 08:12:28 AM
Boy did you guys get this right!  They ask cuz they want to tell you about their family!  They do not really care about the answer regarding your situation.

I love the story telling ideas!  LOL!  Can u imagine the reaction to, "I was seeing my son and his family often and the GSs would even stay over night...until the indecent.  It appears my DIL did not appreciate the child porn video family nite!"  or "She disapproved of my enrolling the boys into the KKK Junior Comrade Scouts."  The more shocking the better!  Shuts the nosiness right off too!  Don't try this at home ladies, just being silly here!

When my son was in football,  I made friends with fellow parents.  There was a trio of gad flies  that would only pay attention to others when they were fishing for gossip fodder.  They were the stuck up types that were "better" than the rest.  I came back one season and had been dieting since they saw me last.  One of them was probably sent by the gaggle to get the scoop.  "WOW,  you have really lost a lot of weight!  How'd you do it?!" i didn't even plan my reply but was annoyed by her intrusion.  So right out of my mouth comes, "I have Cancer."  Her faced dropped and she was speechless!  I said no more and let her tell the whole world about me.  LOL!!

I tell stories to rude intruders about my legs too.  Oh this is fun!  I'll say:
Damned Toyota Prius!
Killer Whales in Orlando
Unfortunate airboat/ alligator incident in everglades (told this to a neighbor at a boat marina when taking a trip w/ a friend. When we got back to the dock, I realized this guy was friends with my friend so I said, "man, I gotta let you off the hook, I really lost them to an infection."  He cussed and said, "now I gotta go and tell everyone the real story!")
Shark!
IUD (instead of IED to measure ignorance)
i once passed by some teens who had been sneaking cigarettes by the pool and casually said, "u may want to reconsider that habit.  that's how I lost my legs." LOL!!!!

Story possibilities for my DS issue:
-Witness Protection Program (i luv it!)
-My drug, alcohol and prostitution problems
-buying the 3 year old a hand gun w/ ammo and concealed permit/ allowing him to have full control.  GS is a packing!
-No grooming at grannies and clothing is optional
-Teaching foreign language cuss words
-Camping while awaiting for the mother ship to return us to our planet of origin
-aliens!
-Something about me driving them around.  My lawyer J Cochran got me cleared of that DUI -vehicular homicide charge

Ain't I a stinker?!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: sassy56 on June 13, 2012, 09:21:50 AM
It appears that most of you were on here last June 4th 2012. I hope I'm not too late to join in.
I too am going through the pain of adult children refusing to have anything to do with me. I am not sure why they are doing this, but no matter why, It hurts. I have been going through this for about 3 yrs. It began gradually. I lived near my children about 3 yrs ago and would rarely see my kids and grandkids. I was not included in B-day parties, Christmas and other important days. They would drive right past my home to visit oneanother, and never included me. I attempted to include myself, when I was told I was only thinking of myself. So, I stopped trying to include myself and waited to be included. I wasn't even asked to come to my son's wedding. That almost destroyed me. I thought my son and I were very close. About a year ago, I decided to move hundreds of miles away. Ifelt it would be easier to have the excuse ( inside my head ) that I'm too far away, thus unable to attend or even be asked to attend any family gatherings. Therefore, it wouldn't hurt so bad. Yeah right! I had an accident about a year ago and had a truamatic head injury. My youngest daughter had always told me that if I were to ever get to where I had to have help, I would stay with her until I got better....or stay indefinitly should I need to. So, when I called her to see if she was still willing to help me, because I was having so many problems with swelling on the brain and on-going medical problems I knew I shouldn't be alone. And where I moved to, I know no one at all. She told me that she would be forced to make a decision ....me or her sister ( my oldest). Thus she said no. Of course I would never want her put in that position and told her not to worry about it. That I would be fine. a few months went by and I tried to talk to my son and my youngest daughter and they both rejected me and said it was my problem since I chose to move so far away. Later my youngest daughter told me I was dead to her. I still have no idea what I have done. All I really know is that I must find away to move on and rebuild my life. I had raised all three children alone most of their lives. Once their father abandoned us, I decided to go back to school and get my Degree in Social Work. I knew I wouldn't be able to raise my children trying to work 2 or 3 min. wage jobs. I recieved my Degree in SW and did very well financially and was able to take care of my children without any help. I lived and breathed my children. My whole life was to be the very best mother in the world and make sure my children had a great start. I did it!! To just let you know a little history, I had no prior education to my degree. So I really had a rough time getting through college....But I did it!!
Anyway, now I feel like all I did was forget about me. In my attempt to carry on alone....I am having such a hard time. I have already had one heart attack and many other health issues. I must say though, I feel I am doing much better today than I was doing. I will find a way to make it...even if its alone. However, It would be so nice to have a support system. May I ask all of you that have gone through this for advice? I have read all your comments and replies. All of you appear so strong and able. I pray I'll get there, and I will with your support.
Thank you for reading.
Respectfully;
Sassy56
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Footloose on June 13, 2012, 09:37:52 AM
Sassy,  Welcome to our family!  You are NOT alone!  We will never understand the why but we all know that it is NOT our faults for the issues our adult Children have with their past, current and future lives.  We did our BEST.  No parent is perfect and I believe that is part of the grand design! Cognitive Dissonance (Peewee Herman's Word of the day?!) rears its head again and it motivates people to grow and overcome.

Your degree and profession are evidence that you are more than a mom and you are not done cooking yet.  I feel my loss as it is very similar to yours every day but at least I am feeling a bit better and have a plan for my growth and future.  You can do it too.  It just takes baby steps,  And when you fall or go backwards, we are here to cushion the blow, my dear.

Becoming a mom made me feel selfless and I did not mind a bit because it felt so natural to my care taking/ codependent personality.  So now I must try to go from selfless to selfish in order to grow past this pain.  Instead of selfish, let's call it self LOVE?

hugs to you! <3
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: lancaster lady on June 13, 2012, 09:57:57 AM
hi Sassy and Welcome ..

I'm glad you found us but sorry you had to ....

We try to encourage ladies to return to looking after themselves rather than a family and learn once
again to indulge !
You may never know why it all happened , best not to try and fathom it all out .
Life is beginning once again for you , so grab it with both hands , not easy but it gets better .
Log in here whenever , we are always lurking ....lol
And treat yourself ....DAILY .... :)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 13, 2012, 12:13:16 PM
Welcome Sassy and I echo what the others said.  Baby steps, one foot in front of the other and remembering daily that our AC do not define us as individuals.  If you haven't, please take a moment to read the two posts under "Open me first".  It's the history, the rules, etc. to see if you think it's a good fit.  We ask all new members to read them, nothing wrong with anything you wrote.

Footloose, I was cackling at those responses and even worse giggles at the reasons about your legs!  Sassy, I should have also added that remembering your sense of humor is very important.  I think laughter is truly the best medicine and remembering the fun, enjoyable things in our lives.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 13, 2012, 01:23:27 PM
Welcome home, S! We may all appear strong and able but we all still take tumbles now and then. New members keep coming and we listen and understand an nurture. Healing happens...a lot. Our strength is here, in our 'family of choice.'
One day at a time, dear one. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 13, 2012, 02:32:14 PM
Hi Sassy, I am new here too. It is comforting to know I am not the only one where the AC dont speak to their mothers but also sad. Footloose, like you mothering suited my codependent personality so well, I loved being a mum, until my children became teenagers. Then I didn't know what to do, so I bought them what they wanted and did what they wanted, said yes to all their demands. I know now that was not the way to win my children's love. When I buried my son, I really buried 4 children as we have not spoken before or since he died, including my 10 grandchildren. I never imagined my life to turn out this way. I find it hard when my friends talk about what their children do for them, the presents they get for mothers day etc. A couple of these friends were to me very hard on their children, gave them very little and yet I know their children love them. My Lawyer asked who I wanted to be my power of Attorney for my will, I said I do not have anyone. Even if my children decided to contact me, I could never trust them again, I would wonder what they were after. I have put a lot into myself this year, spending on myself as I am not spending it on my children. I go to the gym, have massages and now that I have lost weight I am having a arm tuck in July. I am proud of what I have achieved, I am grateful for the things I have, my students for income, a lovely home which I love, a warm bed, I am able to pay the mortgage on my home which I have when I gave my daughter money for her to have a home. So now all I can say is, I did my best with what I had at the time. Poo, I agree, we must keep our sense of humor.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 13, 2012, 03:05:23 PM
And our best was pretty awesome! :-)))) No rewriting of history can change that! Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 13, 2012, 03:07:17 PM
thanks Luise
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 13, 2012, 06:21:27 PM
Welcome Sassy and Oliveb, I arrived here a few years ago in a state of shock and disbelief, and I know that I wouldn't be as far along on the path to happiness without the wise women here and I know you'll find a lot of support here.

KG




Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 13, 2012, 08:11:53 PM
To Ritinha: I moved your post from this thread to your ownand called it "I'm New Here"...so you could get acquainted. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: tired on June 16, 2012, 10:04:21 AM
keys girl,
I've never heard that once a scapegoat is decided it is pretty impossible to change ...but HOW TRUE. Ive been the scape goat and have attempted to change this and it will never happen. I have my own motto. The only way to win is to NOT participate. this tends to make people angry when you walk away from the drama they want to stir up. I know in my heart i have been the very best person i can be. i do have faults but no better or worse than anyone elses. i refuse to the let the abuse continue but....it still hurts when your family turns on you.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Footloose on June 16, 2012, 10:40:33 AM
Their complete rejection proves that we did our job so very well that they got EVERYTHING they NEEDED and no longer have time to even send a thought our way.

Are we good or what?

SuperMoms Unite!
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 16, 2012, 10:42:34 AM
From one scapegoat to another...we can all learn not to play. If our half of the game is dropped, there is no game. Yes, it can be disappointing and lonely...but/and we can create new, non-realted families and extended families (even WWU qualifies.) We have the power to do that. My family of origin is now gone. They will never know that I turned out OK but I do. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Keys Girl on June 16, 2012, 07:14:20 PM
I've found that within my own FOO when I stopped participating in any events, they became a little nicer to me.......'cause it's like playing basketball without the ball when the scapegoat leaves. 

Every once in a while I feel like going to a farmer and asking him if he can deliver a dozen goats to my family members with a little note that says, "Hey, you lost your scapegoat, but you've got a new nanny goat now!" Make sure to put a big red bow on them all, will ya?

KG :-)



Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 16, 2012, 07:20:41 PM
:D :D :D
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Begonia on June 17, 2012, 09:01:16 PM
Oliveb: My heart goes out to you for what you have been through.  So good that you are reaching out.  This site really has been a great source of support for me and I know you will find that too.  Your life is your own now to plan and play and get healthy (like you say you are going to the gym).  Keep posting!! 
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: sassy56 on June 19, 2012, 05:13:47 AM
Hey All you gals! Those that have responded to my post. I really want to thank all of you for your kindness and support. I have wrote this before but feel like maybe it didn't get posted. I'm still figuring this out. I am at my wits end with my children, and today is my oldest granddaughter's B-Day. I'm going to try and call her, but doubt that I'll get through. I called the other day and they picked up the phone just to hang it back up. They never spoke a word. My oldest GD is 17 yrs old. I do know my daughter has turned her against me. But although I have always known this, it has never stopped me from trying. Every day I tell myself I will make it. And that its my turn now. It's time for me. Where do I start? I do not know anyone. I have no friends. No one seems to like me if I try. Today I want to know what's wrong with me that every one has always hated me. No! TRUELY!! it has always been this way..........I'm just now acknowledging it. I don't feel like a bad person and infact I always try harder than anyone to get people to like me. I will give the shirt off my back and everyone knows it. But then they beat me up with the shirt and tell me I'm crazy. Now, like I said before, I am a educated woman. I have always gone above and beyond the call of duty..........have had three children had 4 foster children....took care of grand kids. And now, I'm just dirt under their feet. Listen..........by no means am I having a pity party............I'm trying to figure out what it is I'm doing wrong that I have become sooooooo hated.
Again you guys, God Bless you all and thank you for putting up with me.
I hope I can lean on you all for a while in an effort to vent all this, ya know?
Respectfully;
Sassy56
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 19, 2012, 05:40:56 AM
Hey Sassy.  I modified your post and removed the "not nice" word.  I know you didn't type it out and used symbols, but we don't allow that either.  If we can figure it out, it's a no-no.

I guess from what you wrote, are you trying to figure out why your DD hates you or are you trying to figure out why you perceive that everyone hates you?  Including friends, etc.?

I'm asking because when it comes to an individual or a few family members that don't like us, there is no figuring that out sometimes if there wasn't something big.  As Luise says, you can't make sense out of the senseless.  If you are saying in general, everybody, then I do think there are some things to figure out for you.  If you have noticed that everyone you come in contact with seems to not like you, then what in your personality could be causing them to run?  You said that you try really hard.  Could it be that you are trying to hard?
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 19, 2012, 04:03:10 PM
thanks Begonia.  I like your comment Luise. I am feeling a bit down this morning, I gave up smoking on Sunday..Help...I am climbing the wall.  I have just come back from the gym, I did kick boxing with my trainer, my lungs feel so much better.   Sassy56, I only have a couple of friends, who I know would truly be there for me, I have no immediate family or my children. I have my sad days but life must go on.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pen on June 19, 2012, 04:10:18 PM
Oliveb, good for you! I know that's a tough thing to do & I'm glad you're taking care of yourself. In fact, you've just motivated me to work out :)
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 19, 2012, 04:21:30 PM
Hi Pen, I have lost over 8 kilos since my birthday in March, approx. 3 kilos left to lose. I am having a mini arm lift 5/7/12, I feel so much better working out.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: Pooh on June 20, 2012, 05:28:04 AM
Congrats Olive on the weight loss and stopping smoking.  That's my one crutch I have left and I so need to kick it to the curb.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 20, 2012, 08:00:38 PM
The best thing I have ever read on quitting smoking is in the book recommended here recently (that I got) by Augusten Burroughs: 'This Is How'.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 20, 2012, 08:13:00 PM
Hi Luise, I read Allen Carr's  EASY WAY TO STOP SMOKING.  It is recommended by Richard Branson, Anthony Hopkins and others. I know it helped me.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 20, 2012, 08:16:40 PM
Great.  :) Books speak to us. When the book I mentioned was recommended by our member (I think it was Keys Girl), she  said if she could only have one book in her library, that would be it. I have never felt that way about any book ever. That's why I sent for it and after reading it, I agree. It isn't a book about quitting smoking...but that is addressed in it.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 20, 2012, 08:36:52 PM
I have people say, why dont I contact my children, someone has to break the ice. I know why I dont, I will not be abused anymore.
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 20, 2012, 08:46:14 PM
Only once did anyone say that to me but the memory is very clear. I responded, "The ice has broken me."
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 20, 2012, 10:04:54 PM
I didnt think of that Luise
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 20, 2012, 11:19:23 PM
Next time time you might. You aren't the one who created it and for that reason alone, you can't fix it. Sending love...
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: oliveb on June 20, 2012, 11:49:03 PM
I was not the best mother, I had 2 marriages, O loved my kids but from a very early age they showed contempt of me, maybe it was their father influencing them
Title: Re: adult children dont speak to me
Post by: luise.volta on June 21, 2012, 07:48:51 AM
We can get lost in trying to make sense of the senseless. Being a mother is a 24/7 job. There is no perfection available with those hours. When you can, look at no longer trying to find the 'whys' as an opportunity. There is emancipation in ending that search. I wonder sometimes if we don't look for the reason for abuse (that's what contempt is) because we fear if we don't find one...or better yet many, we will obviously be to blame. We aren't...we never were and we never will be. We didn't have that kind of power. The kindness we all deserve is within us. Seeking it in others is a pretty 'iffy' proposition. Look where its gotten us, so far. You are a wonderful, unique, loveable person. Give yourself what you so deserve. Giving yourself WWU is a great start. P.S.: I have been married 5 times and my surviving son thinks it was courageous of me not to give up!