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Problem Solving => Grandchildren => Topic started by: MotherOf3 on February 28, 2011, 07:52:01 AM

Title: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: MotherOf3 on February 28, 2011, 07:52:01 AM
Ok, I kept my mouth shut.  :-X  I went to DDs for a combined b-day party for her, her son, and her daughter.  The youngest boy just turned 2 and I he is really something!!  I know terrible twos, I have three children of my own, but he's a little tyrant and I don't see DD or her DH putting any limits on his behavior or correction.  If he doesn't get what he wants he screams and carries on.  Like at Christmas when I was there he wanted the necklace that my GD gave me and when I said no he went into a screaming fit.

Anyway, we were sitting at the table having pizza and the 4 year old had just gotten up from a nap so he wasn't eating yet, just sitting there on mommy's lap and waking up.  The 2 year old took the 4 year old's plate of pizza.  I moved it back in front of the 4 year old.  The 2 year old got upset and moved it back in front of him (he wasn't eating either of them).  I moved it back and said, "That is Bobby's pizza."  The 2 year old moved the plate back next to his, looked directly at me and in a very slow, low, very deliberate (and really quite mean) voice said, "Mine.  Mine."  And then "MINE".

OMG!!!  I felt like I was just totally told off by a 2 year old!  And I was.  I said one thing, one time to my DD that she shouldn't let him get away with acting as he does, it just encourages him to do it more when it gets him what he wants.  She didn't like that so... grandma is keeping her mouth shut.

It's her issue to deal with (even if she ISN'T dealing with it).  I just hate to see him being so rude and mean to the 4 year old all the time.  The 4 year old is very quiet and sensitive and he's being bulldozed by his brother and mommy isn't protecting HIM either.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: seasage on February 28, 2011, 08:54:58 AM


I have been sitting here trying to sharpen my own bag of tricks, because I know that someday I will be in the same situation.  I wonder if the mother of the 2-yr-old would be offended if I said something like this to the young child:  I think you are feeling left out because your mother is paying attention to your brother and not you.  Maybe I can help you.  First, put your brother's pizza back because that was not proper behavior.  Then, go stand beside your mother and gently touch her arm or your brother's arm.  When you show loving behavior towards people, they will accept you and notice you.

Does anyone think I ought to add this to my repertoire?
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 09:07:27 AM
I don't know, my parents didn't get involved in many of our childhood sibling squabbles.  They wanted us to learn how to fend and stand up for ourselves.  I think one issue of a 2 year old taking things from his 4 year old sibling is pretty mild and isn't really indicative of a whole lot.  Now if Mom was grabbing the 4 year olds food and putting in front of the 2 year old, then I'd start to worry.

Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: MotherOf3 on February 28, 2011, 09:10:25 AM
If I had my way I would have just moved his highchair over so he couldn't reach his brother's plate.  If he then had a screaming fit about it I would ignore that.  Correcting his bad behavior is what I wanted to, not reward it.

If it was simply a matter of him feeling left out, that might be different but, this behavior is common with him.  At my daughter's graduation from nursing school we had a sit-down dinner afterwards.  He was acting as usual, grabbing at everything everyone ELSE had and not minding his own plate, I mean aggressively.  My daughter tried to restrain him on her lap and he got MAD!  He grabbed a fork and threw it with considerable force.  Luckily it didn't hit anyone.

He didn't have an consequences then either.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 09:15:36 AM
Er, I do think two year old tantrums are the norm. They think only in terms of "me," they can't relate to anyone else. Further attention create a situation where their "me" feelings are validated.

I think ignoring that behavior can be very effective. I also think that your DD trying to restrain him in her lap (even though he threw a fork during) is a consequence of sorts. Children don't like restraint, some don't mind time-outs, but can not stand being forced to sit with their parents. 

What consequences did you think he should get?
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 09:16:28 AM
Yeah, kids go through stages.  It's a lot easier to be objective with other peoples kids though.  He will probably grow out of it, just trust your DD. 
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 09:22:32 AM
My husband and I had a saying as we waded through the terrible-twos twice. " Would we give him the keys to the car?" So every time it looked like either son was driving, (taking over), we would remove him from the situation and take the keys back. Time out...to rest, scream, reconsider, play alone, whatever and time after that to talk about it.

They didn't get the keys or drive.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: MotherOf3 on February 28, 2011, 09:29:06 AM
Yeah, I know they throw tantrums.  My kids tried that with me and I would usually put them in their room alone to deal with it until they got over it.  If we were out somewhere we immediately left. Tantrums didn't work with me and they learned that fast.

Consequences?  Take him outside at least so that his screaming isn't interrupting everyone else's dinner.

I'm keeping my opinion to myself.  I learned that when my first granddaughter was born.  My daughter was a very young mother and she gave into GD so much that if she didn't get her way by screaming and crying she would continue until she was vomiting.

I tried once to give her ways to deal with it and she didn't want my interferance.  So... I let her deal with it, and deal with it, and deal with it.  GD wasn't sleeping all night in her own bed until she was a few years old because of it.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 09:44:23 AM
It's okay to let her deal with it. She is the mom.

My DD is in my bed on a lot of nights so I can get some shut-eye. I know I'm going to have to deal with the consequences of that down the road. It doesn't matter; I'm prepared to deal with the consequences then, I just think an 8 month old needs a certain amount of sleep.

I watched my brother's DD act up in a restaurant, and told him the same thing that you suggested. He curtly told me, "That's exactly what she wants, and I'm not giving in. She needs to learn the world carries on like normal when she behaves like that." He knows his DD best. I think he's right. 

There are consequences to not allowing tantrums to ride out as well...but that was the best option for you, so it worked. It may not be the best option for her.

All parenting tactics have their drawbacks, and their advantages. I think most parent when choosing their tactics know that.

Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: AnonymousDIL on February 28, 2011, 10:45:32 AM
Ladies, as a "non-parent" at this time. I wish we could put other peoples kids in a "silence bubble" when we are out so we don't have to hear the tantrum lol! I see a LOT of kids of all ages with that entitled attitude and it makes me sad. :-( it is so tough to be a parent, I don't think I ever want kids.

When I was a kid, I never would have gotten away with that behavior. I would have been spanked for sure (was many times lol).
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 10:49:12 AM
And accepted parenting tactics come and go. My mother put me out on the front porch in a buggy because that was supposed to be good for me. I have no idea of my history of chronic bronchitis and now COPD has anything to do with that. Probably not. And in the '20s too much "coddling" was seen as lethal, so I can't remember ever being held (unless we were riding in the car,) hugged or kissed.   
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 10:52:11 AM
ADIL, I've watched my own parents changing tactics with the younger kids.  There's no way they would let us older ones act like they do know in restaurants and stuff.  I guess it has it's pros and cons though. 

I do know what you mean about the silence bubble though.  That's why whenever we get a free night, DH and I make sure to go to non kid friendly restaurants and when we do have a kid night, we go to kid friendly and not try to shove them in a stuffy grown up place and expect them to be quiet.  I don't know what it is about kids voices, but even when they whisper they might as well be shouting. 
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 10:52:45 AM
I never paid as much attention to tantrums and crying fits until I had my own DD.

I think listening to your own kid scream and cry (which is beyond your control at some points), is by far worse than listening to someone else's. Have some sympathy for the parents.

Now, when someone else's kid ruins my dinner, I breathe a sigh of relief (it's not mine!). I carry on and enjoy my food, b/c really, my dinner isn't ruined at all.

My DD has had exactly one meltdown so far. I'm not sure that kids act up that often in public. It happens on a rare occasion.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: AnonymousDIL on February 28, 2011, 10:56:11 AM
Quote from: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 10:52:11 AM
I don't know what it is about kids voices, but even when they whisper they might as well be shouting.

Exactly! We were at the Y yesterday and the two kids were really being "bad" just LOUD lol. The grandparents were asking them what different numbers were on the different signs. I would have like to ask them one on the main sign. The one that said the hot tub is NOT for anyone under the age of 13! These kids were like 3 and 6 (cute, really, really cute!, but they were NOT supposed to be in there).
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 10:58:29 AM
The Y hot tub isn't some place I go for quiet; our Y has it in the locker room. I can still hear kids in the dressing area.

I'm sure that "no kids under 13" has a lot more to do with liability than it does for relaxation.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: AnonymousDIL on February 28, 2011, 11:06:29 AM
LOL the Y dressing room! Gotta love it when you walk into the women's dressing room and see a 6 yr. old boy streaking! lol

It is one of my pet peeves when mother's take there kids onto the 18 and older side too. Can't anyone just follow a few simple rules? lol Maybe you're okay with your kid seeing you naked, but I'm not lol
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 11:07:15 AM
Ours hot tub sing says "No one over 10!" (Just kidding.) I was recently in it with someone who is 104. She still hasn't needed to move into assisted care, is writing her biography on her, yes!, *computer* and volunteers in our Manor Mart.

(I don't know what that really has to do with anything but the mention of hot tubs brought it on.)
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 11:08:53 AM
lol, our neighbors (thank goodness they moved!) kept letting their younger boy slip n slide and play with the water hose naked.  I couldn't figure out if the mom thought no one could see him or that she just didn't care.  The kid certainly didn't and he was 7.  DH and I kept having to scope out the area before letting DD out to play.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 11:11:40 AM
They should have joined a Family Nudist Park. We have three within driving distance.  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: AnonymousDIL on February 28, 2011, 11:14:25 AM
Quote from: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 11:11:40 AM
They should have joined a Family Nudist Park. We have three within driving distance.  ;D ;D ;D

REALLY?!  :o
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 11:14:39 AM
Really?  I've always wanted to check one out, without kids though!

I would have been ok with the kid if he had been younger but 7 was a little old for both him and DD to see at that age. 
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 11:20:34 AM
Val and I belonged to one for years. I sat on the Board. It was lovely to watch the kids in the lake. They just grew up with it  and didn't think a thing of it.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 11:25:09 AM
I spent 3 years in Europe. Co-ed saunas, hot tubs, no age limit, no clothes. There was no such thing as nude beaches b/c there was no such thing as not-nude beaches.

I was able to be a lot more comfortable about it after that. I forgot my body hang ups as welll. I thought it was a great experience.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 11:29:06 AM
Yup, that's the up side of it. Wonderful!
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: seasage on February 28, 2011, 11:50:46 AM
Quote from: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 11:25:09 AM
I spent 3 years in Europe. Co-ed saunas, hot tubs, no age limit, no clothes. There was no such thing as nude beaches b/c there was no such thing as not-nude beaches.

It's clear you and I were in different places in Europe.  On my last trip, I saw 1 nude beach, perhaps 15 not-nude beaches.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 11:55:23 AM
Oh, shoot! I haven't been to Europe!There must be areas where it is more prevalent and others where it isn't. I found a nice one on Long Island and another great one on Hawaii. (That's as far as I have gone East and West.  ;D
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 12:04:26 PM
I've been all over, I lived in Italy, mainly...nudity was optional at most beaches I was at. I beached mostly throughout Eastern Europe, again...nudity optional (Croatia, Slovenia, Montenegro). My point is there wasn't an explicit "no nudity beach" that I encountered.

It's not mandatory to be nude, but it's not frowned upon either. Nobody cared what you did as far as I could tell...they didn't care if your children were naked either.

As for co-ed saunas, they were all over Germany, Austria, and the Czech Republic. I've found them to be quite common place.

Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 12:12:14 PM
Luise,

You've seen more of the  U.S. than I've seen, then!

Nude beaches are the Pennsylvania Poconos best kept secret from what I understand. My mom has found 3 of them (fresh water, of course!).

Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 12:17:22 PM
I think this is called "hijacking a thread" and I'm guilty. We need a new topic regarding nude beaches. Anyone?
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: LaurieS on February 28, 2011, 02:56:34 PM
I always tried to keep in mind that while something my child did may not bother me, I have to realize that others could be offended by poor behavior at any age.  If a child is acting up and the parent is obviously trying to maintain their role as a parent, I have no issues... but when a child is allowed to carry on and the parent is allowing poor behavior and it directly affects me. then yep I'm going to have some issues.  The first time your kid runs over to my table while I'm eating I'll smile.. the second time I'll think about tripping him.  We went out for dinner not long ago to what I thought was a place that was not real child friendly.. the hostess tried to seat us next to a table with 3 kids and one was acting up.. of course she quickly asked, will this be ok.. I smiled and said NO.  I don't know why but kids seem to be attracted to us, like little mosquitos, and while they may be small they can be quite irritating :)
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: cadagi101 on February 28, 2011, 03:09:34 PM
Quote from: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 10:58:29 AM
The Y hot tub isn't some place I go for quiet; our Y has it in the locker room. I can still hear kids in the dressing area.

I'm sure that "no kids under 13" has a lot more to do with liability than it does for relaxation.

what is Y?  or is that priviliged information?
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: cd1029 on February 28, 2011, 03:11:23 PM
By addressing the 2 year old at all, you were engaged in a power struggle as he saw it, and he was going to win.

Unless your daughter has asked for your help, I'd back off.  You don't like seeing the little one act like that but you ahve no control over it.  It's mom's call.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: cadagi101 on February 28, 2011, 03:12:31 PM
Quote from: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 12:17:22 PM
I think this is called "hijacking a thread" and I'm guilty.

tut tut
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 03:15:40 PM
Quote from: Julia on February 28, 2011, 03:09:34 PM
Quote from: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 10:58:29 AM
The Y hot tub isn't some place I go for quiet; our Y has it in the locker room. I can still hear kids in the dressing area.

I'm sure that "no kids under 13" has a lot more to do with liability than it does for relaxation.

what is Y?  or is that priviliged information?

The YMCA.  (Not the song the Village People sing.  ;) ) It's a great family gym in the  Northeast. It's been great going there and having DD with me. I can't wait until she  gets older so we can do Mommy and Me Dance Lessons.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: LaurieS on February 28, 2011, 03:17:31 PM
Quote from: Julia on February 28, 2011, 03:09:34 PM
Quote from: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 10:58:29 AM
The Y hot tub isn't some place I go for quiet; our Y has it in the locker room. I can still hear kids in the dressing area.

I'm sure that "no kids under 13" has a lot more to do with liability than it does for relaxation.

what is Y?  or is that priviliged information?
Yes it's the first letter of that awful 4 letter word song
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: pam1 on February 28, 2011, 03:57:08 PM
lol, my dad and stepmom just came back from a beach that they didn't realize going into was going to be nudity allowed.  They kept saying they weren't told anything about it!  Probably cause it's not a big deal over there.  They wouldn't tell me if they tried going nude on the beach lol.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 07:20:44 PM
YMCA and YWCA...Young Men's (Woman's) Christian Association. Very old, widespread in the US,  concept for socializing in a ethical context.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YMCA
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: LaurieS on February 28, 2011, 07:25:06 PM
OR....  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k)
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 07:28:40 PM
Quote from: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 07:20:44 PM
YMCA and YWCA...Young Men's (Woman's) Christian Association. Very old, widespread in the US,  concept for socializing in a ethical context.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YMCA

They've made a huge comeback in the Northeast (they all were pretty run down). Now, they have huge facilities where the whole family can go. I'm glad they've turned around from what they were around the Northeast in the early 90s.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: LaurieS on February 28, 2011, 07:30:53 PM
How do they obtain their funding?  It's not all private donations and membership fees, is it?
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: holliberri on February 28, 2011, 07:35:55 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 28, 2011, 07:30:53 PM
How do they obtain their funding?  It's not all private donations and membership fees, is it?

They get funding from the state, but the membership for us is still like $60/month. They also have a daycare that charges a ton of money.

So, private donations, membership fees, state funding and other usage charges. It's not cheap. But, DH needs a softball/soccer team, I need a treadmill and pilates and I just love taking DD for a swim on some of the winter nights in their heated pool.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 07:39:08 PM
And they are legally non-profit.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: AnonymousDIL on March 01, 2011, 05:28:49 AM
Quote from: luise.volta on February 28, 2011, 07:39:08 PM
And they are legally non-profit.

That just means that when it all comes down to it that their financial statements have $0 income. Not really that they aren't out to make money. Just that they have to "dispose" of the money.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: luise.volta on March 01, 2011, 11:32:34 AM
Great at Tax Time!
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: Sheen on April 09, 2011, 11:14:13 PM
They have no where to carry their money either lol.   Beaches, bathhouse, lakes and anything in between are all basically left to your disgression here in sweden.
Title: Re: The entitled 2 year old again!
Post by: Pen on April 10, 2011, 07:13:37 AM
I think it means the bottom line (so to speak) is the facility & the needs of the clientele, not big payouts to investors or CEOs. Not being in the investor or CEO bracket, I like that set up. That's how I chose my bank and my HMO.