One of my sons friends phoned me today complaining about her MIL.
Apparently she is very interferring. This young girl has just come home from hospital with a new baby and her 7 year old tells her "granny was here and she went through your cubboards" ::) :o >:
Apparently she asked her husband not to allow his mother there when she was in hospital because she is like this. Husband apparently did nothing to stop his mother from searching through her personal items.
I'd wait for something more serious than that. Some people are snoopy. She can't change the spots on a leopard and neither can DH. (IMHO.) MILs are just people and people come in every possible guise.
Hi Catchingup!! I do understand what you are saying, but if Granny was going thru the cubbards I am taking this as in Kitchen?! ( Which I do not feel is personal and that is in MHO... :-\ ) If so perhaps Granny was just going to cook something or checking out what was their to make this or that...NOW if Granny was going thru her dresser drawers, or her
purse than that is a definate YIKES!!! :( Plus, at times our little 7year olds can fabricate a story and make it larger than what it really was or is.......
HUgs, Faith
That was my first thought as well... I don't tend to keep my personal items in the cupboards. My mother-in-law when I had just gotten home from having a baby, went into my pantry, took note of what I was missing and then went to the grocery store to stock up on pantry items. Of course the final result was some extra goodies and feel good food items for both my children and myself. Mom even wiped down the cabinets etc since I had belly full of reasons to fall behind in housework.
This same person(mil of sd's/bff) might not think twice if her own mother was looking for an item and opened the cupboard door. Some people spend way to much time on those darn witch hunts.
"Wag n bietjie"" That means "Wait a minute" in Africans.
She went through my bedroom cubboards and draws.
Hubby confirmed it.
Oh sorry this referred to my sons friend. Her Mil went through her wardrobes.She probably confided in me because she knows what my MIL was like
Sorry.. different parts of the country concerning terminology. We don't even call them cupboards down here in Texas, they are cabinets, and pantries.. and wardrobes are my antique armoires and my closets are closets. No wonder why I didn't know what boxing day was.
Well I hope that while she was looking that she got an eye full. Maybe her son's hidden girlie magazines. Obviously her dh didn't mind his mom sorting through his private areas.. but once again.. where is the husband in all this? Why is the husband always excused like he's a moron sitting in some corner not noticing what his mother is doing? Everyone is so quick to jump on the MIL, which is at times well deserved, but the dh's hold no responsibility for anything.. makes no sense to me
Hi again, perhaps the husband should be questioned about this....And then maybe MIL did the laundry and was putting it away for them. I have done that for my DS and DIL. Perhaps just simply as MIL about this and the reasons will be uncovered.....Honesty is always the best policy. Peace...Faith :)
I'm the type of person who doesn't want someone other than me or husband to go into drawers. Its too personal. I frankly don't need MIL seeing my underwear. Plus, she told DH she didn't want MIL over there because of this. He disregarded her wishes while she was having their baby. Shame on DH. MIL may be doing laundry to help, but I somehow don't think so. I think she's just being nosy and DIL knows this.
If the mother was in charge of DH as he grew up (which she had to be) and his years of rebellion didn't quite work...maybe, to DH... his mom is still in charge in some way, even unconscious. If he wasn't allowed to question her or cross her without dire consequences, he may take that training into his adult life.
Just a thought...
Fair's fair. Some adult children "make themselves at home" in their parent's house but don't extend the same courtesy to MIL. My DS thinks nothing of coming in and rooting around for a snack, but we don't even us the restroom at his house w/o asking.
The same with gossiping about personal stuff - if a DIL/DS doesn't want MIL talking about their medical issues or finances, they need to be sure they aren't talking about MIL's. Just sayin'.
Pen - I'm sorry I didn't understand your last post. Are you saying its okay to root through DIL's things?
Louise - I like what you said. This relates alot to my DH. He had consequences from his dad if he didn't listen to his mom. Then he passed when DH was 18. DH feels in some way he still needs to take care of her, even though she's remarried. Sometimes I feel she is still in charge of him. She will guilt him nonstop until he's "compliant".
Mariatobe, of course not, and I think you know that. ;) I do not want to root around in DIL's stuff, trust me.
I'm just saying that there seem to be different rules for some of us. How many kids and their spouses come home and snoop in their parent's/IL's stuff? My SM was a major snoop at her MIL's (my GM's); she had all the good stuff scoped out and made out like a bandit when GM was moved to a senior facility. She would have flipped out if GM had opened so much as a kitchen cupboard at her house.
If DIL and DS were in my home and I wasn't around, I'm pretty sure DIL would snoop for ways to put me down - oh, look, the garage isn't tidy. Why isn't the Tupperware shelf better organized? Why doesn't your mom have a closet system yet? etc. etc. She's constantly commenting on our lifestyle and feels entitled to do so.
DILs have legitimate gripes about snoopy/gossipy MILs - I'm just saying it can go both ways and should be seen as equally heinous.
I have quite a few friends who will brag about snooping. I doubt their ILs are off limits. Supposedly, that's how you learn "a lot" about someone. ::)
My guess is: if someone does it, they are equal opportunity and do it to everyone; if they don't, they'd NEVER dream of doing something like that.
See, I have the opposite problem. MIL wouldn't think twice about going through anything in my house. And I do mean ANYTHING. But if I so much as open a cupboard in their house without asking, I'm accused of snooping. My MIL lives a few streets over, a few months out of the year. She got a brand new kitchen. My parents didn't see it for months as they left right after it was put in.
Fast forward 6 months, IL's come back to town. Invite family over. Says to my mom, "Well, I'm SURE you already saw it." Implying I took my mom over there to SNEAK a look. My mom looked at her like she was nuts. "No, I didn't have the pleasure." I can just see nanny cams set up in their house to see if anyone is snooping. She's quite the pill. I wouldn't go over there without my DH if I was paid too.
::)I would be accused of all kinds of stuff.http://www.wisewomenunite.com/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif
Quote from: catchingup on November 29, 2010, 01:38:07 PM
One of my sons friends phoned me today complaining about her MIL.
Apparently she is very interferring. This young girl has just come home from hospital with a new baby and her 7 year old tells her "granny was here and she went through your cubboards" ::) :o >:
Apparently she asked her husband not to allow his mother there when she was in hospital because she is like this. Husband apparently did nothing to stop his mother from searching through her personal items.
Personally, I think it is inexcusable....I never even went thru my son's things....his room was his personal sanctuary, and I could never do that....people need a certain amount of privacy and if someone came to my home and I trusted them enough not to go thru personal belongings, and I found out they did, that would be the end of our friendship and I don't care who it was....trust would be broken...period....what the heck would someone do that for? I'm sorry, but that really makes me very angry, that someone has to be so nosey?????
Unbelievable?????
Well, to some extent, I can see an adult child making themselves at home at their parents home. To me, it's still "home-home". Although, now that my Mom lives in a house that I never lived in full-time, it is a bit different. But to me, the parent-child relationship is NOT a two way street. So yeah, DD and I will go climb in my Mom's bed for a cuddle, but Mom would never come into MY bed. Because she doesn't have the same relationship with DH, whereas, when my Dad was still alive, it was still 'my parents bed'. If my Mom ever remarries, her (shared) bedroom will become off-limits.
I would not want my MIL to be going through my bedroom / bathroom cupboards or drawers. However, the guest bathroom and the kitchen is pretty much "public". I have nothing to be ashamed of.
That being said, my Dad would NEVER go through my DH's tools without his permission either. In fact, my Dad worried very much about stepping on DH's toes, and really made an effort to never cross any lines.
I think it is pretty strange to enter DS and DIL's house when not home and go through their bedroom drawers and closets.
The kitchen seems pretty innocuous.
This seems pretty subjective to me. I don't care who goes through what in my house. If they find anything interesting, I'd sure like to know what. It seems like a personal kind of code of ethics. I wouldn't do that because I think everyone is jsut as uninteresting as I am. Sending love...
You're right...the subject looks a lot better when it's not in CAPS. When we need to use ALL CAPS...we usually need to take 5, pour a cup of coffee and put off posting for a bit.
If in my closet the least they can do is to grab my dry cleaning for me..... I could have been accused of snooping once.. I needed toilet tissue while in my dil's bathroom.. of course I looked under the sink.. no tissue but she had a LOT of bottles of soap from Bath and Bodyworks... Tissue was kept in the hallway.. now why didn't I think to look there. I mentioned to my dd about the soap.. so she counted them.. 25 bottles of soap.. who keeps that much soap.. at least we know there is no reason for them not to be sparkling clean.
There! I finally got rid of the ALL CAPS subject line. :)
Laurie my friend had that many bottles of soap - because people kept giving them to her and she couldn't use it fast enough.
I have bunches of it too, because I do love it so my friends and relatives give it to me as gifts all the time. I have amassed a collection...but no complaints!
I just got an e-mail from them: 7 for 3 dollars a piece! Better hit the store! :D
whew!!
LOL.. no she buy soap each time she gets to the mall... I thought man if I ever needed to give a gift I'd be looking at soap.. now it would have probably made more sense to keep in the hallway closet and the toilet paper under the sink.
I agree with Pen....My house is always open for my son and dil and they can come in and go all over the house as it was theirs. I dont mind really.....I want them to feel at home (As Scoop says...it is where my son grew up). But different rules apply to us in-laws. Not that dil say anything but husband and I comment that we dont feel like we can go to the fridge and grab something. Or just drop in ......no way....we get like a strange look from dil. It is so funny, my son even goes to my husband closet and checks if there is anything new. They may also just drop in and tell me that they come to have breakfast with us or lunch....or whatever. We would never do that but it is fine with me. I feel so happy to see them. As long as dil seems happy and confortable in my house....no problem.....but yes Pen......it is not the same the other way around.
Now Scoop..... I have never thought about it being different, but you are right, because our children were raised at our house..... they just come and throw themselves into our bed as they always did..because we are still their parents..and they feel it is still their home...good point..... .
Mariatobe...Your Mil....is indeed nosy. Cant imagine going around my son/dil's house opening drawers or cabinets. She is really something.
Love
I agree here totally, my home is open to my son and DIL as well, however, I do not feel the same way about they're home...it is a code of ethics and I would never ever go snooping.
I love Bath and Body works....if the world ever comes to an end, at least I'll smell good going out.... ;D
Oh MAN Laurie! You're not trying to organize your DIL's house for her are you?
I think it's funny, because I have the same sort of issues with my Mom sometimes. She really believes that everything should have its "place". I believe that things should be stored near where they're used. I think my Mom keeps her spare rolls of TP in the laundry room. I usually have one on the toilet tank. We have LOTS of examples, and thus we've had this back and forth for years now! Thankfully it's a good-natured type of 'argument'.
PS - I know you're not trying to organize your DIL's house, I just wanted to point out that different people have different ways of organizing.
LOL, my DH is afraid to keep toilet paper under the sink in the only bathroom cabinet b/c he's afraid of the sink leaking (we've only been there a year, nothing like that has happened yet...).
We don't have a linen closet, just a table for towels.
So DH prefers to keep our toilet paper in the guest bedroom closet. I guess it's dry there.
I'm kinda loaded up on B&BW soaps too (I keep 5 extra, 1 in the kitchen and 1 in the bathroom), when I run out, I'll buy 7 more. I can't beat that 7 for 3 deal. Plus I only worry about it like once a year now.
Mine are kept in the kitchen pantry. Now that I think about it, I have no idea why...
I sense a weekend of practical rearrangement coming my way...
Naw she can keep her toilet paper under her bed for all I care as long as there is some in the bathroom when I need it... I know those pesky expectations again... if not I could do what my son did which was to come into a room full of people with his unwiped dirty behind and announce that there was a paper shortage in the bathroom.
Hahaha. That's funny.
When guests come, I get nervous we'll run out, so I line the toilet tank with 3 rolls of toilet paper. That's about all the decorating my bathroom gets.
Quote from: Scoop on February 09, 2011, 04:22:42 PM
Laurie my friend had that many bottles of soap - because people kept giving them to her and she couldn't use it fast enough.
That is where re-gifting comes in handy :) But she does buy most of it herself.. my son and dil have this bad habit that I think many of us grow into and that is they can't leave the house without buying something. (I can do it without leaving the house now.. I love my computer) My son was once commenting on how he didn't know where his money was going.. I said well like when you don't know why you're gaining weight.. chart it for a month - two months and you'll see a pattern that you can then adjust.
My dil saw that as me saying that she is wasting money... which she is, but I was encouraging her to see it for herself.. I'm not about to say it to her (I don't think blind men want to be reminded that they can't see).. but I will say it to my son... if every time he walks into a store and buys something that he doesn't need.. he is wasting his money.. it's pretty simple... Eat the extra donut, you will gain the pounds.
Oh and now that a baby is on the way.. they have both said to me in the past week that their house isn't large enough for a infant... I will have you all know that I did not say a word.. but thought hmmm one of two things come to mind.. get rid of some of the 'crap' that has been collected, or wow less stuff and they might have had the money for a larger house. Instead I smiled and said oh well you'll find a way.
Oh Laurie - that reminds me, we bought a house with 1000 more square feet when we were expecting! And then DH said if we wanted to have another, we would need another 1000 sq ft!
When people talk about what they bought in preparation for the baby, we always laugh and say "we bought a house!".
As I have gotten older, I definately want less and less clutter. But when I was newly married, I had stuff everywhere because I was raised by a Mother who never threw anything away if it was good and it could be used again. So I was horrible about keeping everything. Now, I am totally different and will throw away something before you can blink.
But....Don't touch my Bath & Body works stuff! Them be fighting words! ;D
Holli, I am going after work today! 7 for 3 each...woo hoo!
My own mother is a hoarder... except she's clean unlike the people on those tv shows.. but still a hoarder... she is constantly buying things.. loves thrift shops, but will fight a one legged lady for that gaudy plaster statue if it's only a dollar. I stood in her house last time home with my mouth open... I don't think I've ever seen so much STUFF.. not much had any real meaning.. oh and you'd think in a hoarders world she would have a ton of pictures.. not one of her family, friends ect.. just thrift store stuff. I know she does this to make herself feel better about something in life.. I hope she finds that something before I have to deal with the end results.
I have learned that having an item in reserve so I don't run out doesn't mean that I have to have an over abundance of that item.. and my taste may change, so if I have 10 ginger-on-your-tata fragrances and I decide that I'd like to try something new.. not all 10 go on the back burner indefinitely. I'm a believer in moderation.
If you have a small house, I can see buying a larger one if your family is expanding.. but if you can't afford a larger one then you might need to figure out how to make what you have work. I had 3 kids in a 1,100 sq ft house... so I know it's possible.
I do absolutely love the lemon bath and bodyworks kitchen soap in the foam, and I just pulled out my back up bottle so the next time I'm out I'll pick up another... see I'm normal.. the only thing that I ever bought an abundance of was Jubilee Kitchen wax because most stores no longer carry it.. I love the smell of that product.. lol.. don't use it often but love the smell.. it smells like my childhood.
My favorite right now is the Black Currant Vanilla in the sensuality section. I don't like overpowering perfume or lotion and this is very light.
What's a tata? ;D
I was afraid to ask...Pooh. LOL.
I have all of the sensuality selection; they're my favorites!
I wasn't afraid to ask....but probably should be afraid of her answer....
I went into the Sensuality Section and the clerk asked me if I was lost....
well I couldn't think of the names of any of their collections... it was my all encompassing description :)
Quote from: luise.volta on February 10, 2011, 04:16:07 PM
I went into the Sensuality Section and the clerk asked me if I was lost....
Naw we all want to feel sexy for someone
:D
I had to go and see what the name is of the fragrance that I really like.. Sea Island Cotton... I also use the lemon in the kitchen... my dd just said that she'd stop and pick up six for 20 was the only ad I saw (she carries my cc for when I need for her to make purchases) and that she'll take 2 home with her.. so that is 4.. not bad
Quote from: holliberri on February 09, 2011, 04:54:06 PM
I just got an e-mail from them: 7 for 3 dollars a piece! Better hit the store! :D
hmmm I didn't see that offer.. was that just a email offer.. if so send me a copy..pretty please
Quote from: Laurie on February 10, 2011, 07:30:29 PM
Quote from: holliberri on February 09, 2011, 04:54:06 PM
I just got an e-mail from them: 7 for 3 dollars a piece! Better hit the store! :D
hmmm I didn't see that offer.. was that just a email offer.. if so send me a copy..pretty please
I didn't get that offer either Laurie, so I am wondering if it was one by area. I didn't make it by there yesterday, but I will this weekend to see.
Hey Everyone,
Uh-oh...I meant 6 for $20. I don't save my BB&W coupons. : ( I'll change that if you guys are interested. I get them weekly.
But I did look on their website: all their Anti-bac foaming hand soaps are $3 bucks a piece, unlimited quantity. That's the only time I stock up on them.
Ok.. the 6 for 20 is offered nationally.. good I'll try for every extra buck I can.
From reading your posts, it sounds like a lot of your ds's visit your homes - lucky you! We moved into our current home with only one of our three children still at home - and she was nearly out of the nest. A busy teenager - not home much. I don't think our adult kids think of our home as theirs. :-[ Except our odd/sil come over quite a bit - and we relish every minute. Hugs, Hope
Quote from: Hope on February 12, 2011, 12:19:38 PM
From reading your posts, it sounds like a lot of your ds's visit your homes - lucky you! We moved into our current home with only one of our three children still at home - and she was nearly out of the nest. A busy teenager - not home much. I don't think our adult kids think of our home as theirs. :-[ Except our odd/sil come over quite a bit - and we relish every minute. Hugs, Hope
Hope, when my parents moved, I didn't think of they're new home as mine anymore...I can't explain it, however, the home they lived in before, felt like home, b/c I grew up there, once they moved, it was a whole different feeling, and honestly I can't find the words to describe it, I don't know, felt like a guest, maybe is a good way, didn't feel comfortable going into the refrig and getting a drink, and my mom was always so accomodating, and would have never been insulted that I helped myself, however, do you think maybe that is how your children might feel? I dunno, just throwing an idea out there?
Thanks for your thoughts, Creme. I think you are right. It is not their childhood home and I can understand them feeling like guests. It's okay, but if only ds/dil would visit I would feel so much better. I finally called our ds the other day and asked if there was a way we could see our gs more. [We have seen him so little, that I could actually recall every visit with him over the last seven months.] He said that he's been thinking a lot about it and he thinks they should visit both sets of parents once a month. They live about 15 minutes from us and the same distance from dil's parents. I told him that I was glad he was thinking about it. It is progress, but I can't help but feel cheated b/c dil's parents and sister can drop in whenever they want to see him. Also, it's common for our dil's parents to babysit him and the only time we had the opportunity was once after his bedtime on a work night, from 9:30 pm to 1:00 am. I happened to be off work the next day, but my dh had to get up 4.5 hours after we made it home. Our gs was down for the night when we arrived at their house, but he woke later and we fed him a bottle before putting him back to bed. On the few occassions we get to see him, we are just two people in a sea of relatives since it is on holidays or special occassions. I can't wait till our dd's have children so we can see what it's really like to be grandparents.
Hugs, Hope
Quote from: Hope on February 13, 2011, 08:08:30 AM
I can't wait till our dd's have children so we can see what it's really like to be grandparents.
Hope.. did you say that jokingly or do you see this as the turning tide... I'm curious as I have a dd that will be married (eventually) and while I've thought oh this is my chance to help pick out a wedding gown, the thought of getting to see what it's really like to be a grandparent never popped into my mind.
I remember when you were asked to babysit late at night and we teased you about watching for the nanny cam.. was that the last time you got to interact with the child one on one?
My Home is open I have nothing to hide, you can look for whatever you need...BUT, if you go thru my desk drawers then I am going to have to question that....for toilet paper, tooth brushes and paste etc will NOT be in there... ::)
Faith,
I wouldn't like people rummaging through my personal stuff either. I must admit that when I am a guest in someone's home and the toilet paper is gone and there's not any tissues in sight, I will look to see if there is some tp in the vanity. That is where it starts and ends. And I have no problem with anyone looking for tp in my bathrooms either. :D
I don't ever recall anyone violating my privacy in my home. Guess I'm lucky.
Hugs, Hope
I can't wait till our dd's have children so we can see what it's really like to be grandparents.
Laurie, I know your question was directed at Hope, but speaking for myself, DH and I can't wait for our DD to have children so that we can experience what is like to be grandparents, unfortunetely she's having a very hard time conceiving.
Our only GD is 2 1/2 and we still don't feel like grandparents, it's sad. We see her every couple of months but she sees DILs FOO so much more, whenever i say something to DS he gets mad and blames me saying I don't have a good relationship with DIL, the truth is that even if DIL and I were on good terms, things would still be the same.
We're supposed to see her this weekend, we're all very excited and bought new toys for her to play with but we already know our DS will act like it's no big deal, nothing we do is good enough and a lot of the things we do are considered ridiculous.
Laurie,
I'm sorry - I did answer your question about whether I was serious about looking forward to our dd's having children so we can see what it's really like to be grandparents. The post disappeared! I didn't realize it till now.
Anyway, I think what my vanished post said was that the only time we were alone with our gs was that one night when we babysat. I did get to see him for a few minutes a couple times when we dropped something off at their house for dil/ds and twice I gave dil a ride home after bridesmaid dress shopping when we were planning ydd's wedding (they were having transportation issues at the time). I enjoyed holding our gs for almost a half hour on those two occassions after I asked if I could come inside (I would have felt more welcome if dil had offered first). Right after gs was born I helped clean their house for a showing and got to hold gs for a few minutes. Other than those times, we were only two people in a crowd.
This afternoon we were visiting my fil at the hospital (he just had his hip replaced) and low and behold, our ds/dil/gs walk in. Both my dh and I immediately felt the tension in the room. We held gs and made over him. My dh comes from a large family and there were five people visiting besides me/dh/ds/dil/gs, but we made sure we had time with him. The other people in the room had no idea that the last time I saw my gs was when they last saw him - on New Year's eve (except for the few minutes when we dropped off the large Christmas gift we gave dil that they didn't have room in their car to take home). New development - dil got upset with dh again. That dear man is so giving, considerate, and kind to her - I just don't understand it. She saw that my husband had a picture of our gs on his phone and she asked somewhat annoyed how he got that picture. He told her that he got it from her fb. After she got home, she posted on her fb that someone was downloading pictures of gs from her fb and she wanted to know what she could do to stop it. The only printed picture they have ever given us is one on Santa's lap. I'm pretty certain that dil's parents get pictures regularly. They have loads of professional pics taken. I don't read dil's fb any more, but our ydd read it and called me quite upset about how they are treating us. She's not alone. Our niece told my dh that they (neice, nephew, and their spouses) were noticing the poor treatment toward us and they just don't understand why. I know it's dil's problem.....and ds's.
Hugs, Hope
Dear Hope and Barbie
I feel like you do. Yes we do think/wish about our girls having children and know what is like feeling as real grandparents. I know it perfectly well because I once was in your shoes. And that was exactly what I told my dil at one time that she did come to me to talk about our distant relationship. I said "I know that you are the mother...I never pretended to be the mother....I just wanted you to let me be your baby's grandmother": So I do know the feeling....and it is very sad. I truly in my heart hope you get lucky just like I did, and you get to enjoy your gc.
My two daughters haven't married yet....and when I was having a hard time seeing or holding my gs because of my dil, they will tell me "Mom, when I have children they will all be yours to enjoy "and of course I would start crying.
I will pray for you both.
Love you
Here let me try this again. Hope there is absolutely nothing wrong with your husband obtaining the babies photo for him to carry on his phone. Your dil is sadly mistaken if she thinks that her postings are private and pictures not able to be copied by anyone who can see them on facebook. What is with these young parents to feel the need to take a power struggle to this level of hurt.. to me if they don't want to spend the money and have a picture printed for you then they should at least send you a electronic file so you can print your own... Where is your son on these decisions?
Maybe the DIL was upset because if her FIL could get the pictures, then ANYBODY could. Some people are really private about pictures of their kids, and with good reason too - there are some CREEPY people out there.
And please stop assuming that the DIL's parents have pictures. You don't know for sure. And it only hurts yourself to make that assumption.
If you want pictures, ask your son. If you know that professional pictures were taken, ask him where, and if it's okay for you to go and buy some for yourselves.
I don't know, it seems like a lot of the Gma's here have these HUGE expectations on how much they should see their GK's. Okay, my Mom & my IL's are both out of town, but my brother is local and we haven't seen him since Christmas. And we don't consider it a big deal. We haven't seen the IL's since October and we saw my Mom at Christmas. We often go a couple of months without seeing each other and think nothing of it.
Scoop, all families are different. If all members are happy seeing each other a few times a year, that is fine. I used to see my odd and gd more frequently,maybe once or twice a month, but now it is a few times a year. It is the lack of contact, no phone calls, that bothers me the most....Jill
Just to add on to Scoop's (good) post, I think it's something to keep in mind that not all people/families are the same. I wish my MIL would have just accepted that there are differences and different doesn't mean bad. In my family we don't speak every day or even every week. We go a couple months or more without seeing each other. It's all gravy.
So it shocked my system when someone wanted to see me a couple times a week and talk about private issues constantly. And I think my MIL perceived it as rejection when I didn't want to do that.
It's not, it's just how some people are.
I agree Pam, it was a hard lesson for me to NOT take it personally when my MIL was being "different".
Okay guys, what's the solution if the GP's want to see the 'little family' more often than they're comfortable with? Who wins? Or better yet, what's a good compromise?
If it's just about 'contact', you could send cards or letters - kids LOVE getting mail. Put a sheet of stickers in there and you're GOLDEN.
If you both have computers, you could try SKYPE. It's actually really easy to install (and free), but you need a webcam and a microphone. My DD loves-loves-loves to sing and dance for Grandma (mostly because she can see herself on the computer screen).
As always, I suggest working on your relationship with your son. One of my lines is "You can't MAKE me do anything, but you can almost always make me WANT to do something". So make them WANT to have a relationship with you.
No one wins if both sides aren't willing to give-and-take. It takes at least 2 people to have a war and at least 2 people to sign the peace treaty.
Quote from: Hope on February 13, 2011, 08:08:30 AM
Thanks for your thoughts, Creme. I think you are right. It is not their childhood home and I can understand them feeling like guests. It's okay, but if only ds/dil would visit I would feel so much better. I finally called our ds the other day and asked if there was a way we could see our gs more. [We have seen him so little, that I could actually recall every visit with him over the last seven months.] He said that he's been thinking a lot about it and he thinks they should visit both sets of parents once a month. They live about 15 minutes from us and the same distance from dil's parents. I told him that I was glad he was thinking about it. It is progress, but I can't help but feel cheated b/c dil's parents and sister can drop in whenever they want to see him. Also, it's common for our dil's parents to babysit him and the only time we had the opportunity was once after his bedtime on a work night, from 9:30 pm to 1:00 am. I happened to be off work the next day, but my dh had to get up 4.5 hours after we made it home. Our gs was down for the night when we arrived at their house, but he woke later and we fed him a bottle before putting him back to bed. On the few occassions we get to see him, we are just two people in a sea of relatives since it is on holidays or special occassions. I can't wait till our dd's have children so we can see what it's really like to be grandparents.
Hugs, Hope
Hope, I know how difficult this is for you...all I have to offer is try and be patient....and next time you and son talk, maybe you could inquire if you and your Dil's parents could share the babysitting. It is so important for a child to interact within different members of the family, it helps them learn that there are different rules in different households.
Sounds as if son is on his way to realizing, that you need a relationship with your GC....lets keep our fingers crossed, and know your in my thoughts....
Hugs
Creme
Quote from: Barbie on February 13, 2011, 04:14:01 PM
I can't wait till our dd's have children so we can see what it's really like to be grandparents.
Laurie, I know your question was directed at Hope, but speaking for myself, DH and I can't wait for our DD to have children so that we can experience what is like to be grandparents, unfortunetely she's having a very hard time conceiving.
Our only GD is 2 1/2 and we still don't feel like grandparents, it's sad. We see her every couple of months but she sees DILs FOO so much more, whenever i say something to DS he gets mad and blames me saying I don't have a good relationship with DIL, the truth is that even if DIL and I were on good terms, things would still be the same.
We're supposed to see her this weekend, we're all very excited and bought new toys for her to play with but we already know our DS will act like it's no big deal, nothing we do is good enough and a lot of the things we do are considered ridiculous.
Thanks for sharing, Barbie. It's looking like we have the same situation. Enjoy your gd this weekend - I bet she will feel really special and loved. What a lucky little girl!
Hugs, Hope
Quote from: Nana on February 13, 2011, 10:46:23 PM
Dear Hope and Barbie
I feel like you do. Yes we do think/wish about our girls having children and know what is like feeling as real grandparents. I know it perfectly well because I once was in your shoes. And that was exactly what I told my dil at one time that she did come to me to talk about our distant relationship. I said "I know that you are the mother...I never pretended to be the mother....I just wanted you to let me be your baby's grandmother": So I do know the feeling....and it is very sad. I truly in my heart hope you get lucky just like I did, and you get to enjoy your gc.
My two daughters haven't married yet....and when I was having a hard time seeing or holding my gs because of my dil, they will tell me "Mom, when I have children they will all be yours to enjoy "and of course I would start crying.
I will pray for you both.
Love you
Thanks for your prayers, Nana. I'm not very good at confrontations or getting my feelings across without blowing it. I don't know if I'll ever have the opportunity to tell my dh/dil that I just wanted to be their baby's gm. I have never tried to advise them on baby issues, nor have they asked my opinion. My ds never calls me and I try not to interfere in their lives, so I don't usually call him. My dil and I don't call each other either - I'm trying to respect their space. It's so different than the way I brought up our kids. We visited both sets of grandparents (our parents) equally and often. I'm trying not to have expectations - but I really thought we would always "be" in our children's lives - even as adults. I didn't expect any of our kids to all of a sudden drop off the face of the earth. I'll never stop loving them.
Hugs, Hope
Quote from: Laurie on February 13, 2011, 11:05:20 PM
Here let me try this again. Hope there is absolutely nothing wrong with your husband obtaining the babies photo for him to carry on his phone. Your dil is sadly mistaken if she thinks that her postings are private and pictures not able to be copied by anyone who can see them on facebook. What is with these young parents to feel the need to take a power struggle to this level of hurt.. to me if they don't want to spend the money and have a picture printed for you then they should at least send you a electronic file so you can print your own... Where is your son on these decisions?
Laurie,
I'm so disheartened. To answer your question, my ds has pushed me out of his life - he doesn't call me, he snaps at me the few times he sees me, won't smile at me - he is a changed person since he married. I have no idea who he is any more - or where he stands on these decisions. My dh thinks our ds is unaware of some of our dil's behaviors toward us. I don't know what to think. I'm so confused. All I know is that all we tried to do is love them. Sadly, now my love is expressed by giving them their space....lots and lots of space.
Hugs, Hope
Quote from: Scoop on February 14, 2011, 06:00:58 AM
Maybe the DIL was upset because if her FIL could get the pictures, then ANYBODY could. Some people are really private about pictures of their kids, and with good reason too - there are some CREEPY people out there.
And please stop assuming that the DIL's parents have pictures. You don't know for sure. And it only hurts yourself to make that assumption.
If you want pictures, ask your son. If you know that professional pictures were taken, ask him where, and if it's okay for you to go and buy some for yourselves.
I don't know, it seems like a lot of the Gma's here have these HUGE expectations on how much they should see their GK's. Okay, my Mom & my IL's are both out of town, but my brother is local and we haven't seen him since Christmas. And we don't consider it a big deal. We haven't seen the IL's since October and we saw my Mom at Christmas. We often go a couple of months without seeing each other and think nothing of it.
Scoop,
I know you are trying to help me understand and I appreciate that. I don't know how to express what we are going through to you. We have not even talked to our ds's cousins about the situation and they noticed - they told my dh that everyone sees how bad they are treating us and they don't understand. I guess you have to see it firsthand to understand. I believe that the dil's on this forum are trying to have good relationships with their mil's and I commend you for it. We are trying to not have expectations and we don't complain to either ds or dil about any thing. That's why I love this outlet - I can share my feelings here so I don't have to guilt or pressure ds/dil. But there's no avoiding the hurt you feel when you see your ds appear to not care about you any more. On top of that hurt, I feel like just another relative to my gs. I would have never treated my dm or mil this way, so it's so hard for me to understand. You don't know me, but please believe me when I say that I have never said a cross word to dil or ds. We have helped them out financially and with labors of love. They are never satisfied - they will always find fault in something. It's depressing, but we need to let them go. I'm much better if I don't see them. When we see them, the tension is so heavy that it takes away any possible joy.
You are correct that I am assuming that dil's parents get pictures of gs. But I'm not assuming when I say that mil bought her own crib for gs's visits at their house (dil's mother told me), dil told me that her mom and dad babysit for them, dil's gm told me that she bought a swing just like dil/ds's baby swing for her house for when they visit, and dil's mother has told me that she spends the night at their house (even though she lives 15 minutes from them - the same distance we live from them). My ds told me that he's tired of his mil spending the night at their house. Dil told me that she talks to her mom at least twice a week. I know what you mean about being private about pictures - not wanting creeps to see them. My dil put our gs's pictures on her fb (that's how my dh obtained the pictures for his phone), is allowing gs to be a professional model, and is additionally permitting his pictures to be posted on the photographer's website. I am adhering to the expectations she gave me before his birth - I do not post his pictures on my fb, we don't drop by their house unexpectedly, and we don't "call a hundred times a day". As sad as it makes me, I know I have to let them go.
Hugs, Hope
Quote from: pam1 on February 14, 2011, 07:32:02 AM
Just to add on to Scoop's (good) post, I think it's something to keep in mind that not all people/families are the same. I wish my MIL would have just accepted that there are differences and different doesn't mean bad. In my family we don't speak every day or even every week. We go a couple months or more without seeing each other. It's all gravy.
So it shocked my system when someone wanted to see me a couple times a week and talk about private issues constantly. And I think my MIL perceived it as rejection when I didn't want to do that.
It's not, it's just how some people are.
Hi Pam1. I know what you mean - it's difficult for people to adjust to being a part of someone else's family. It's also difficult for people to accept that their own family has an important piece missing when a member of the family seems to vanish from the family portrait - so to speak. My response to Scoop's post explains that we are not nearly as involved as dil's family. We are here if they want or need us. We love them, but aren't feeling love in return. But love is a gift and you can't force it.
I hope things get better with your mil and you can find a good middle ground.
Hugs, Hope
I wish I had something wise or encouraging to offer. I don't. When someone drops you, you often don't have any way to turn. I have been there...trying to understand...trying to undo what doesn't seem real...trying and trying.
All I can offer you is my love and compassion.
Hope, I know how difficult this is for you...all I have to offer is try and be patient....and next time you and son talk, maybe you could inquire if you and your Dil's parents could share the babysitting. It is so important for a child to interact within different members of the family, it helps them learn that there are different rules in different households.
Sounds as if son is on his way to realizing, that you need a relationship with your GC....lets keep our fingers crossed, and know your in my thoughts....
Hugs
Creme
[/quote]
Creme,
Thanks for your encouragement. I'm trying to be patient. I don't know when I will talk to my ds again to ask him to share the babysitting with us. I have a feeling he doesn't have much say in anything in their marriage. We are in the midst of a very strained relationship right now - for what reason, they haven't said. I don't know why the big mystery - but my hunch is that there will always be something to find fault in. After all, we are only human, right? Dh and I will never be perfect, so I don't think we will ever meet their standards.
Hugs, Hope
Quote from: luise.volta on February 14, 2011, 07:05:17 PM
I wish I had something wise or encouraging to offer. I don't. When someone drops you, you often don't have any way to turn. I have been there...trying to understand...trying to undo what doesn't seem real...trying and trying.
All I can offer you is my love and compassion.
Thanks, Luise. I really appreciate your concern. Your love and compassion are comforting. Knowing this happened to you makes me realize that it can happen to the best of us. Trying and trying is right. Just trying to understand what the heck is going on...
Btw, how is your eye doing today?
Lots of hugs, Hope
Quote from: Pooh on February 14, 2011, 08:24:44 AM
No one wins if both sides aren't willing to give-and-take. It takes at least 2 people to have a war and at least 2 people to sign the peace treaty.
Pooh,
I like that saying, but what is it called when one person is pushing away and the other person is just trying to understand, but can't make sense of it?
Hugs, Hope
My eye feels a little better today. Thanks! (And we just can't understand the non-understandable. All we do is clutter everything up with logic. :( )
Luise - take good care of yourself and your eye. I hope you aren't overdoing it on your computer. ???
It's great to hear from you, though. You are very loved.
Hugs, Hope
"Pooh,
I like that saying, but what is it called when one person is pushing away and the other person is just trying to understand, but can't make sense of it?
Hugs, Hope"
Hope,
sometimes a version of this is one person pushes away, the other chases after and its called
"pursuing and distancing" But it doesn't sound like you are pursing too much
more like giving ds and dil space.
I can appreciate the grief you are feeling with ds distancing sooooo much. I've been doing some grieving myself
these days.
Quote from: Hope on February 14, 2011, 07:28:42 PM
Quote from: Pooh on February 14, 2011, 08:24:44 AM
No one wins if both sides aren't willing to give-and-take. It takes at least 2 people to have a war and at least 2 people to sign the peace treaty.
Pooh,
I like that saying, but what is it called when one person is pushing away and the other person is just trying to understand, but can't make sense of it?
Hugs, Hope
I call it banging my head on the drywall.
And I am in the same position as you, so I do understand. I think it is harder for some of the DILs to understand what a MIL feels about the loss, unless they have experienced it. Because as a DIL, when my Ex-MIL and I couldn't get along, it was no great loss to me. Don't get me wrong, I hated it and would have liked it to be different, but this was not a person I had known my whole life. This was not my flesh and blood and I held no automatic love for her. But when a Mother loses her DS/DD, it is hurtful. We have loved this person since they were conceived. We have given our heart and soul for this person and they are the most important person in the world to us.
It annoys me to see people put on here, "That's how it's supposed to be. Those are your expectations." No, it's not how it's supposed to be. Yes, those are my expectations. I want to have a relationship with the person I gave birth to, nutured and loved my entire live. Do I have expectations that when he/she has children that I get to love and hug that little person? You betcha. It's it because I feel entitled? No, it's because I feel love and want to share it with that little person that has some of my genes and hopefully, some of my spirit.
So hold your head up Hope. We see them and know who they really are...hopefully one day they will see us and remember.
Pooh - I really liked your words. I know that I cannot understand, because I haven't been there.
But I do like how you put it, because it's true, my MIL doesn't mean ANYTHING to me. In my plus/minus chart, she has more minuses than pluses.
However, I believe that my DH and my DD mean something to her. And she should mean something to them. That's why I recommend that you (the generic you, not you specifically) work on your relationship with your son. And it's also why I hate seeing the "evil DIL" get all the blame for the relationship problems. (I know, there ARE some evil DIL's, I can't argue that.)
To Hope, have you asked your DS what you can do to make your relationship with him easier? Ask him and let it sink in and even give him a couple of days to think about it. I'm thinking of my SIL - she's a pill, not evil, but just VERY different from "us". We know that to have a relationship with my brother, we have to 'put up' with her. We also know that if we "toe the line", she has to 'put up' with us.
Thank you Scoop. I do know you are trying really hard and I applaud your attitude that just because MIL has issues, you never hinder any kind of relationship between her and DH/DD. And you are right, the blame can not all be on a DIL/SIL. The DS/DD has to take responsiblity for their actions or inactions.
Scoop,
it was hard for me to read what you wrote:
"But I do like how you put it, because it's true, my MIL doesn't mean ANYTHING to me. In my plus/minus chart, she has more minuses than pluses."
esp the caps ANYTHING. I'm pretty sure my dil feels that way too but, its sad.
I'm not criticising either by any means. Its just a painful reality check.
..... I think it is harder for some of the DILs to understand what a MIL feels about the loss, unless they have experienced it. Because as a DIL, when my Ex-MIL and I couldn't get along, it was no great loss to me. Don't get me wrong, I hated it and would have liked it to be different, but this was not a person I had known my whole life. This was not my flesh and blood and I held no automatic love for her. But when a Mother loses her DS/DD, it is hurtful. We have loved this person since they were conceived. We have given our heart and soul for this person and they are the most important person in the world to us.
It annoys me to see people put on here, "That's how it's supposed to be. Those are your expectations." No, it's not how it's supposed to be. Yes, those are my expectations. I want to have a relationship with the person I gave birth to, nutured and loved my entire live. Do I have expectations that when he/she has children that I get to love and hug that little person? You betcha. It's it because I feel entitled? No, it's because I feel love and want to share it with that little person that has some of my genes and hopefully, some of my spirit.
So hold your head up Hope. We see them and know who they really are...hopefully one day they will see us and remember.
[/quote]
Great post, Pooh. I think this is one of the big differences in understanding between DILs and MILs. We MILs are often seen as trying to smother our darling baby boys if we simply want a relationship with the person we nurtured and loved for so many years. It's impossible to suddenly shut off that spigot when a DIL comes along who can't understand that she may be the DW, but we've always been the DM. If I text DS once a month I feel like I could be accused of smothering.
It also gives the insecure or insensitive DIL power and she knows it. If the MIL "misbehaves" according to DIL standards (which may be reasonable, but may in another person's situation be unreasonable) she can be cut off with no worries for the DIL, but with major consequences to the DS, ILs, and their extended family. That's a lot of power in the hands of one person who may or may not have the best interests of DS's family at heart. When my DIL began wielding power and we were cut off in her eyes (DS continued to communicate when he could) it changed our dynamic, our communication, our activities, our celebrations. Who should have that much power over a family that they married into? If DIL can have that power over DS's FOO, can DS have that power over DIL's FOO?
If we MILs seem a little overly emotional/dramatic about this sometimes, it's because we know there's a chance that no matter how awesomely wonderful we are or have been as moms or MILs, we can be cut off in a heartbeat. I walk on eggshells in fear of the one little mistake I might make or the one misunderstanding that will send DIL into a tizzy. It totally affects the free and easy relationship our family had. Now our gatherings have an edge of awkwardness; I never feel as if I've truly connected with DS and I miss him.
Tara, it was hard for me to read Scoop's words too, but as I said above that's the power DILs have over MILs. Scoop has a reason because her MIL did some really hurtful stuff, but some of us mean nothing just because we aren't blood relatives to DIL.
It's probably hard for me to articulate, but by default, my MIL means something to me, if only because she means a lot to DH.
I guess it goes back to what Laurie was saying about trusting your spouse's opinion on things. I also have to give her credit for helping him become the person that I married. To a certain extent, I think that means I have to take the good with the bad (the bad excluding outright abuse and violence). If DH doesn't like someone, I generally don't; if he likes someone, I generally do. His opinion and feelings do shape my own, even if they don't match mine exactly. I certainly consider it.
It's a little better every day. thanks. I go back to the eye doc on Thursday.
Quote from: Hope on February 14, 2011, 07:02:25 PM
Quote from: pam1 on February 14, 2011, 07:32:02 AM
Just to add on to Scoop's (good) post, I think it's something to keep in mind that not all people/families are the same. I wish my MIL would have just accepted that there are differences and different doesn't mean bad. In my family we don't speak every day or even every week. We go a couple months or more without seeing each other. It's all gravy.
So it shocked my system when someone wanted to see me a couple times a week and talk about private issues constantly. And I think my MIL perceived it as rejection when I didn't want to do that.
It's not, it's just how some people are.
Hi Pam1. I know what you mean - it's difficult for people to adjust to being a part of someone else's family. It's also difficult for people to accept that their own family has an important piece missing when a member of the family seems to vanish from the family portrait - so to speak. My response to Scoop's post explains that we are not nearly as involved as dil's family. We are here if they want or need us. We love them, but aren't feeling love in return. But love is a gift and you can't force it.
I hope things get better with your mil and you can find a good middle ground.
Hugs, Hope
Hope (((Hugs))) You have a good heart.
You guys are right, I don't know what it is like. I really hope to never know what it is like to have a child shun me, I can't imagine the pain. When I first came here I think I came on like raging bull towards the MIL title and I even sometimes am still guilty of generalizing and being too blunt. I'm sorry for not taking better care with my words, sometimes I read what i wrote and dang, I can see how it was taken a different way.
But I do think there is a difference and there is no use in comparing tragedies whether it is what a MIL can lose vs what a DIL can lose. We are all stuck in the same boat with bullies.
Quote from: Pen on February 15, 2011, 08:23:57 AM
but some of us mean nothing just because we aren't blood relatives to DIL.
..and there again, I've never been one to say "blood is thicker than water." That saying has wrought havoc in my mom's family because you were expected to submit, always help (even if it meant being taken advantage of), and put family before friends. I've never been able to do that, and I am very weary of families that behave that way.
So, that argument falls apart in my case as well: my family is not more important than DH's or vice versa; they're all just people to me. I'm related to them, and I love them, but I wouldn't necessarily think they come before all friends, and a few of my relatives wouldn't even come before strangers (a few stinkers in my FOO :) ).
Actually, if I consider family more like friends, as opposed to family, their minor transgressions are a lot easier for me to take. If I wouldn't get mad at a friend over it, I wouldn't get mad at them over it. Conversely, I don't break plans with friends b/c family expectations have arisen. I think this is where MIL and I butt heads from time to time.
I still drift (pun intended) toward my fantasy of putting the offending IL on a raft and pushing her out into shark infested waters.
(The pun is about those who want to do the same with me. ;D ;D ;D)
Holliberry,
I relate to what you said about friends. Reminds me of a saying: "Friends are family you choose for yourself"
Some of my friends are very much as close and important to me as family.
Also, to dil's: my mil from first marriage was as my dh says "sometimes evil ". really bad. but I think of
her more like an sometimes evil, unwell person vs a category of evil mil. if that makes sense. I've done alot
of work on forgiveness which I think has served me well enough to have inner peace most of the time about
her.
Tara,
When I take the titles out of it, it becomes a lot easier to wrap my brain around. MIL isn't doing things to bug me b/c she's a MIL; she'd probably be doing it no matter what position in the family she held. I've seen her treat her mother the same way she treats me: crying, foot stomping, suggesting ridiculous changes in plans to accomodate her own wants and needs. It's a learned behavior for her; it works, on a lot of people; that's why she does it.
It eliminates my intimidation and really helps me define good versus bad behavior; instead of trying to define what a MIL should be doing. It also helps me b/c I know that there are some things that she says "as a MIL" that get to me, that if she were saying it "as a friend" I might feel differently.
Regardless, where it gets hard is when she does things I wouldn't tolerate from a friend. I haven't solved that dilemma yet.
Yes, because we choose our riends and can un-choose them.
Hope:
After our family dispute ,my Ds said to me ''When you make up with F/DIL then you can see your GD ''
He couldn't chose me over her ..and quite rightly so ,hard for me to admit that but she is the person he has chose to spend the rest of his life with.Perhaps I taught him something of loyalty and love .
There was no row .shall we say , just a misunderstanding that the type of parenting she chose did not include GP's ..My argument was only to be told when my GD was a year old ,a year of rejection .in my eyes .
So we had to build bridges ,and through emails we were able to iron out out differences . no more eggshells ,just hopefully a mutual respect .
.Although perhaps she omitted to tell me about her parenting ,I chose to believe this was an oversight on her behalf ,I would have understood ,had I known .
I was very open with her and told her how hurt I felt not being able to bond with my GD .
I didn't want to be another mom ,just a close GM .
So perhaps dealing with our DS is not the right approach for access to our GK .
He will not go against his partner no matter how much he thinks of his FOO.
The only way is through the mom, like it or not ,takes courage .
Hopefully your DIL will show compassion if she realises how hurt you are .
It's a horrible feeling for a family rift with your DS ,I had many a sleepless night .
It doesnt need to be a confrontation , but it has to be done .
I just spent my first night babysitting my GD , on the eve of her first birthday .
So it was worth it . Depends on the individuals I know ,I wouldn't like to meet some of the
MIL's described on these pages .
We are not all monsters though and can really help you DIL's if you let us .
I'm glad you guys understand where I'm coming from. And I do feel badly for the MIL's here that had absolutely no chance with their DIL's.
Quote from: luise.volta on February 15, 2011, 08:38:21 AM
I still drift (pun intended) toward my fantasy of putting the offending IL on a raft and pushing her out into shark infested waters.
(The pun is about those who want to do the same with me. ;D ;D ;D)
Heh, on some of my darker days I would have willingly swam out there alone just to get away from her!
Quote from: pam1 on February 15, 2011, 09:32:04 AM
Quote from: luise.volta on February 15, 2011, 08:38:21 AM
I still drift (pun intended) toward my fantasy of putting the offending IL on a raft and pushing her out into shark infested waters.
(The pun is about those who want to do the same with me. ;D ;D ;D)
Heh, on some of my darker days I would have willingly swam out there alone just to get away from her!
And my Ex-MIL was so horrible, the sharks would have ran from her!
But seriously, I wish we could pair up the DILs in this forum with the MILs in this forum. Oh what fun we would have!
Perfect! Put 'em on the raft together! Bye....
Wait ... what? Are you putting the MILs & DILs on this forum together on a raft in shark infested waters?
Hey now!
Gosh, no...just the ones we complain about... ;D ;D ;D
[[/quote]
I call it banging my head on the drywall.
And I am in the same position as you, so I do understand. I think it is harder for some of the DILs to understand what a MIL feels about the loss, unless they have experienced it. Because as a DIL, when my Ex-MIL and I couldn't get along, it was no great loss to me. Don't get me wrong, I hated it and would have liked it to be different, but this was not a person I had known my whole life. This was not my flesh and blood and I held no automatic love for her. But when a Mother loses her DS/DD, it is hurtful. We have loved this person since they were conceived. We have given our heart and soul for this person and they are the most important person in the world to us.
It annoys me to see people put on here, "That's how it's supposed to be. Those are your expectations." No, it's not how it's supposed to be. Yes, those are my expectations. I want to have a relationship with the person I gave birth to, nutured and loved my entire live. Do I have expectations that when he/she has children that I get to love and hug that little person? You betcha. It's it because I feel entitled? No, it's because I feel love and want to share it with that little person that has some of my genes and hopefully, some of my spirit.
So hold your head up Hope. We see them and know who they really are...hopefully one day they will see us and remember.
[/quote]
IMHO
Hi Ladies, I'm traveling right now; but could not stay that much longer without cking WWU!
POOH almost brought me to tears, her statement is so true. We (DIL) all have to remember, one day we'll be wearing the MIL "hat"; and how painful it must be to be push aside just because..... I know some situations are "extremes" and you should not tolerate any kind of abuse or disrespect from ILs or anyone. Hugs
P.S. The raft idea is freaking me out ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: lancaster lady on February 15, 2011, 09:22:50 AM
He will not go against his partner no matter how much he thinks of his FOO.
The only way is through the mom, like it or not ,takes courage .
I see what you are saying LL, but doesn't the real courage come to light when he knows that he has an equal partnership in his relationship and he can think about and react to the whole picture. This 'new' parenting style, I don't understand how they could be into this style for almost a year and your son never mentioned it to you, was he aware of this style or is he protecting his gf at this point? This should not be about him saying, I stand by my dw/gf and forget all the values that I strongly believed in my entire life. I think it takes a stronger personality to not to totally lose yourself in someone else's thought process.
Okay guys, what's the solution if the GP's want to see the 'little family' more often than they're comfortable with? Who wins? Or better yet, what's a good compromise?
If it's just about 'contact', you could send cards or letters - kids LOVE getting mail. Put a sheet of stickers in there and you're GOLDEN.
If you both have computers, you could try SKYPE. It's actually really easy to install (and free), but you need a webcam and a microphone. My DD loves-loves-loves to sing and dance for Grandma (mostly because she can see herself on the computer screen).
As always, I suggest working on your relationship with your son. One of my lines is "You can't MAKE me do anything, but you can almost always make me WANT to do something". So make them WANT to have a relationship with you.
Scoop,
DH and I would love to see our GD once a week, interact with her, take her to the park, etc., but that's impossible since they live 3 hours away, however, we could see her more often than we do but we're not allowed, DIL has no problem getting in the car and coming to see her FOO and by the same token, her FOO is always welcomed in their home but not us, this is where my jealousy kicks in because we're not treated the same way.
DS and I are always working on our relationship, we take a step forward and once in a while a step backwards, I admit it's mostly my fault because of my jealousy.
Quote from: Scoop on February 15, 2011, 10:32:44 AM
Wait ... what? Are you putting the MILs & DILs on this forum together on a raft in shark infested waters?
Hey now!
Well here is a good one.
This was listed for sale on internet as ideal for framing MIL's picture but "Be careful you dont tear it the teeth are very sharp"
To me that is more sad than funny. I don't know why...maybe too graphic. Or maybe because it's out there and my raft was a kind of in-house fantasy? Probably just me.
It's the social stigma that is attached to the title Mother-in-law For that reason I introduce my MIL(which i use here for clarification) as my mom.. funny when I introduce my own mother.. I say this is my mother.. even if I don't call her mother in real life. they are both just Mom.
I could almost understand a comedian using MIL jokes for a laugh, but to many times even women do this without any forethought. As I said before at my DIL's wedding shower held at her church, with 98% church women, one said.. let all get up and say who we are and how we know this young lady.. as an example she said well you can say, I'm the dreaded MIL.. blah blah blah... I raised my hand and stood at the same time.. NO ONE was going to go ahead of me and said yes well I guess to you all I am the dreaded future mil.. but I prefer to be known as my son's mother. Ok that kinda shut them up, at least till my back was turned... I may have been given a new title other then mil at that point.
Quote from: Pooh on February 15, 2011, 10:07:19 AM
Quote from: pam1 on February 15, 2011, 09:32:04 AM
Quote from: luise.volta on February 15, 2011, 08:38:21 AM
I still drift (pun intended) toward my fantasy of putting the offending IL on a raft and pushing her out into shark infested waters.
(The pun is about those who want to do the same with me. ;D ;D ;D)
Heh, on some of my darker days I would have willingly swam out there alone just to get away from her!
And my Ex-MIL was so horrible, the sharks would have ran from her!
But seriously, I wish we could pair up the DILs in this forum with the MILs in this forum. Oh what fun we would have!
Yes, it would be :)
Now I feel really bad for my stepmom lol. When I introduced her to DH I said to him "this is your future step mother in law, dun dun dunnnnnn!" Double whammy, that.
thats it Laurie! The term Mother In Law does involve stigma. why did it take me so long to realize that?
Hee hee...I was talking about all the GREAT DILs here and the GREAT MILs here would have fun together....but I guess the other would work too!
Quote from: luise.volta on February 15, 2011, 12:59:36 PM
To me that is more sad than funny. I don't know why...maybe too graphic. Or maybe because it's out there and my raft was a kind of in-house fantasy? Probably just me.
Sorry if I offended Luise.
Some MIL's are great and some DILs are great
My Mil was great. A Great big pain!!! Thorn in the flesh.
Enough now.
:-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X
Quote from: Pooh on February 15, 2011, 02:14:16 PM
Hee hee...I was talking about all the GREAT DILs here and the GREAT MILs here would have fun together....but I guess the other would work too!
You want the great dil's and great mil's to float around in shark infested water and you call this fun.. wow can we at least take one of those little umbrella drinks with us
Quote from: Tara on February 15, 2011, 01:47:38 PM
thats it Laurie! The term Mother In Law does involve stigma. why did it take me so long to realize that?
So does the term grandmother in some eyes.. suddenly you age by 20 years and sprout gray hair... well I beat them to the punch.. I already have gray hair
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:24:06 PM
Quote from: Pooh on February 15, 2011, 02:14:16 PM
Hee hee...I was talking about all the GREAT DILs here and the GREAT MILs here would have fun together....but I guess the other would work too!
You want the great dil's and great mil's to float around in shark infested water and you call this fun.. wow can we at least take one of those little umbrella drinks with us
No no no....oh geesh. I wanted the GREAT DILs and GREAT MILs to pair off and......oh I give up! LOVE YOU GUYS!
Why is this thread highlighted in pink? Just curious. ???
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: Tara on February 15, 2011, 01:47:38 PM
thats it Laurie! The term Mother In Law does involve stigma. why did it take me so long to realize that?
So does the term grandmother in some eyes.. suddenly you age by 20 years and sprout gray hair... well I beat them to the punch.. I already have gray hair
I always pictured you with blonde hair lol and as I was thinking that, I realized that I have ideas of what most regular posters look like. How funny
hmmm did you start the party with the little umbrella drinks before us
Quote from: pam1 on February 15, 2011, 02:33:41 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: Tara on February 15, 2011, 01:47:38 PM
thats it Laurie! The term Mother In Law does involve stigma. why did it take me so long to realize that?
So does the term grandmother in some eyes.. suddenly you age by 20 years and sprout gray hair... well I beat them to the punch.. I already have gray hair
I always pictured you with blonde hair lol and as I was thinking that, I realized that I have ideas of what most regular posters look like. How funny
I like to think of it as God given blonde highlights... no I'm brunette.. was brunette
Quote from: catchingup on February 15, 2011, 02:31:57 PM
Why is this thread highlighted in pink? Just curious. ???
WHY??????????????????????
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 11:45:24 AM
Quote from: lancaster lady on February 15, 2011, 09:22:50 AM
He will not go against his partner no matter how much he thinks of his FOO.
The only way is through the mom, like it or not ,takes courage .
I see what you are saying LL, but doesn't the real courage come to light when he knows that he has an equal partnership in his relationship and he can think about and react to the whole picture. This 'new' parenting style, I don't understand how they could be into this style for almost a year and your son never mentioned it to you, was he aware of this style or is he protecting his gf at this point? This should not be about him saying, I stand by my dw/gf and forget all the values that I strongly believed in my entire life. I think it takes a stronger personality to not to totally lose yourself in someone else's thought process.
You are absolutely right Laurie ,and if I had waited for my DS to step up and say something my GD would be 21 before I saw her .
I also mentioned before that she has given him a witches brew and cast a spell on him .
He is a total wuss !
My siblings are losing patience with him daily over wedding plans ,we are all still in the dark .
Whether he is waiting for her to fire the starting gun I don't know .
He is terrified to upset her !!! This is a grown man of 32 !! So back to the spell .
I could get involved and start the ball rolling ,but do I want all that conflict again ?
In order to see my GD I chose to interact with my F/DIL .
I feel like giving him a good shake ,but he seems so removed now ,not my little boy any more ,which of course he isn't .
why they chose to hold the parenting thing back I've no idea , maybe they thought it was nothing to do with me . I am enjoying the peace for the moment and enjoying seeing my GD .
It's on a need to know basis ,maybe I don't need to know .
It is highlighted in pink on the home page.
Goodness it is 12.30PM in South Africa I must go to bed.
It was very hot today--hope it does not keep me awake
Quote from: lancaster lady on February 15, 2011, 02:37:57 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 11:45:24 AM
Quote from: lancaster lady on February 15, 2011, 09:22:50 AM
He will not go against his partner no matter how much he thinks of his FOO.
The only way is through the mom, like it or not ,takes courage .
I see what you are saying LL, but doesn't the real courage come to light when he knows that he has an equal partnership in his relationship and he can think about and react to the whole picture. This 'new' parenting style, I don't understand how they could be into this style for almost a year and your son never mentioned it to you, was he aware of this style or is he protecting his gf at this point? This should not be about him saying, I stand by my dw/gf and forget all the values that I strongly believed in my entire life. I think it takes a stronger personality to not to totally lose yourself in someone else's thought process.
You are absolutely right Laurie ,and if I had waited for my DS to step up and say something my GD would be 21 before I saw her .
I also mentioned before that she has given him a witches brew and cast a spell on him .
He is a total wuss !
My siblings are losing patience with him daily over wedding plans ,we are all still in the dark .
Whether he is waiting for her to fire the starting gun I don't know .
He is terrified to upset her !!! This is a grown man of 32 !! So back to the spell .
I could get involved and start the ball rolling ,but do I want all that conflict again ?
In order to see my GD I chose to interact with my F/DIL .
I feel like giving him a good shake ,but he seems so removed now ,not my little boy any more ,which of course he isn't .
why they chose to hold the parenting thing back I've no idea , maybe they thought it was nothing to do with me . I am enjoying the peace for the moment and enjoying seeing my GD .
It's on a need to know basis ,maybe I don't need to know .
kinda sad huh LL, but I'm glad that you are seeing your grandchild
Quote from: catchingup on February 15, 2011, 02:40:57 PM
It is highlighted in pink on the home page.
Goodness it is 12.30PM in South Africa I must go to bed.
It was very hot today--hope it does not keep me awake
I'm not seeing that.. maybe it's a built in temperature gage.. since you're the only one in South Africa we wouldn't see it.... it might be gone by tomorrow.. let us know
G/nite...CU. Sending cool breezes...
I see it too Catchingup. As soon as you click on the subforum "Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters" the title "Is This The Kind Of Things MILS DO?" is stickied at the top of the forum and highlighted in pink.
It's been like that for a few days.
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:35:30 PM
Quote from: pam1 on February 15, 2011, 02:33:41 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: Tara on February 15, 2011, 01:47:38 PM
thats it Laurie! The term Mother In Law does involve stigma. why did it take me so long to realize that?
So does the term grandmother in some eyes.. suddenly you age by 20 years and sprout gray hair... well I beat them to the punch.. I already have gray hair
I always pictured you with blonde hair lol and as I was thinking that, I realized that I have ideas of what most regular posters look like. How funny
I like to think of it as God given blonde highlights... no I'm brunette.. was brunette
Yeah, I had you pegged as a honey blonde, brown eyes and tan lol
Quote from: pam1 on February 15, 2011, 03:35:11 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:35:30 PM
Quote from: pam1 on February 15, 2011, 02:33:41 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 15, 2011, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: Tara on February 15, 2011, 01:47:38 PM
thats it Laurie! The term Mother In Law does involve stigma. why did it take me so long to realize that?
So does the term grandmother in some eyes.. suddenly you age by 20 years and sprout gray hair... well I beat them to the punch.. I already have gray hair
I always pictured you with blonde hair lol and as I was thinking that, I realized that I have ideas of what most regular posters look like. How funny
I like to think of it as God given blonde highlights... no I'm brunette.. was brunette
Yeah, I had you pegged as a honey blonde, brown eyes and tan lol
Let's try true brunette, hazel eyes and no more tan since I was diagnosed with skin cancer... But years ago I was a honey blond with a great tan... we didn't have colored contacts back then
Hmmm...ok, well I think Pooh looks like a young Sophia Loren. Am I anywhere near close on that one, Pooh?
Hmmmm....I had to go look. I don't think so. The closest I have had anyone tell me I look like someone famous, is a couple of people say I look like Helen Hunt. Shoulder length, highlighted dirty blonde hair, blue eyes.
I am tall, naturally blond, blue eyed, slim and young.
LOL!
This is funny, well obviously I have no psychic powers.
Quote from: Pooh on February 15, 2011, 03:48:27 PM
Hmmmm....I had to go look. I don't think so. The closest I have had anyone tell me I look like someone famous, is a couple of people say I look like Helen Hunt. Shoulder length, highlighted dirty blonde hair, blue eyes.
did you say shoulder length, highonlife, dirty minded blonde with eyes?
...of course she has eyes!
And I got the pink out of the heading. 8)
Quote from: luise.volta on February 15, 2011, 04:02:30 PM
And I got the pink out of the heading. 8)
Well it's about time you did something useful around here today Luise :) Did you ever ask Kirk about the 10 pm per hour limitation?
Yes, did I forget to report back? He said it was default.
Can he change the default?
Yes, but he suggested it be left at that which is a PM every six minutes to encourage people to use the Forum most of the time. He asked if I got a lot of complaints and I said I hadn't.
Quote from: luise.volta on February 15, 2011, 04:56:11 PM
Yes, but he suggested it be left at that which is a PM every six minutes to encourage people to use the Forum most of the time. He asked if I got a lot of complaints and I said I hadn't.
this wasn't a complaint.. it was a request
Wow! You ladies sure were busy today. ;)
I've been gone all day and most of the evening and just now got a chance to check wwu. I was surprised to see all the activity. You are some good people, I'll say. I've never felt that dil's or mil's in general were "bad" - as a matter of fact, until I ran into difficulties with my own dil, I never gave it a thought. But since I've been torturing myself over the fact that our relationship with dil is so strained (which in turn effects our relationship with ds and gs), I've come to the realization that it's not b/c you are a dil or mil that makes you hard to get along with - it's just the individual person who happens to be a mil/dil. When I read what some of the dil's write about their relationship with their mil, I think their mil sounds just like my dil. Soooo, I think it's fair to say that we are all friends - no matter what role we are in - sharing the same hurt..... and are looking for ways to improve the relationships in our families. Thanks to everyone who addressed my situation. I am just exhausted emotionally and physically from this and I let it effect my attitude at work yesterday, which I truly regret. Well, it's very late where I live - and I need to get to bed. I just wanted to thank everyone for their input. I value you all very much.
Nighty night, good friends.
Hugs, Hope
Ladie...Yes there has been a lot of activity in this post.
I do think that while it is not a competition of who hurts more...mils or dils..., that mils pain is more painful by all means. Why because we have our hands tight up and completely powerless. And the pain of losing our baby (son) and smetimes our baby's babies (gc) can make us lose hope and love for life. It might sound dramatic but still it is the truth for some of us that really really did not do anything to cause this.
Imagine when we got pregnant, little did we know...we would have wanted to have only girls because of the fear of completely losing our boys to their wives. This shouldnt be like this. I know it wasnt with my mom and mil....I loved my mil and still do (still alive 89 years old), and my sisters-in-law all loved my mom. I had 6 sisters in law because mom had 6 boys....and all loved my mom (their mil) deeply. So things were not always like they are now.
I used to hear about evil mils when I was Young....and of course there were many . I now think that these deserved reputation did not help the future mil's to be lol. We were all labeled and there is where the problem started, I believe. The new generations made their minds of setting strict boundaries toward mils, and here we are, all paying the price for those wicked mils.
Lets keep in mind that dils will someday be mils hi hi hi....lets see what happens (joke).
Love you all ladies...mils and dils (the good ones).
Quote from: Nana on February 15, 2011, 09:03:58 PM
I do think that while it is not a competition of who hurts more...mils or dils..., that mils pain is more painful by all means. Why because we have our hands tight up and completely powerless.
Nana,
I feel tied up and completely powerless against my MIL too. It takes a mountain of energy to get her to back down, so it's just easier not to.
I do think she'd agree with your statement. I'll never understand b/c I'm not a MIL. But that doesn't warrant the comments over the years about my fidelity (or infidelity), and it doesn't mean that I'm the source of her pain when DH asked me to marry him. Regardless of how we feel about boundaries, there are some boundaries that don't need crossing, and that's one of them. I've never cheated on my DH, and I shouldn't have needed to "prove" my fidelity to her. Even when I got pregnant (and stayed pregnant) there was comments that the baby could've easily been someone else's. When we finally talked to her about this, she pulled the "you're not a MIL" card, and it totally invalidated my personal feelings about sensitive topics and unwarranted comments. I don't get an A in her book for staying by DH's "side" when he deployed for a year, making sure the house was tended to and the bills were paid and he didn't have to worry about a thing. I don't get an A in her book making my appearance at every one of their family functions in place of DH while he was away.
This started immediately once she found out we were getting married, because it meant that DH was overseas for not 2 years but now 3 years. She decided that I took him from her. I did not. I don't deserve that kind of power. Instead of looking at it like a relief that yes, her DS was going overseas, but at least he found someone to love and wouldn't be alone...she couldn't take "her" out of it.
She has the perception that I took her son and that I want to keep her away, and it's a false perception. I've never cut her off, I've called her, I've included her....I can't do much more short of moving next door to them, and I get the feeling that wouldn't be enough.
My point is, I can't get anywhere with her until she stops using the one trump card I don't have. My feelings don't count simply b/c hers are stronger than mine or more important or just something I'll never understand. Her MIL didn't do the things she's done, so she can't understand where I'm coming from, despite having been a DIL herself. It's an individual thing, not a MIL/DIL thing.
My mom also made several comments to me about "finally being a GP" when I had kids (after my brother had his). She wasn't aware of my subfertility at the time, but I felt that pressure was a little unfair. I may never have wanted to get married, and I may never wanted to have kids. That's not my job to make sure her desires as a GP are met, and it's not my job to make sure my MIL's desires as such are met either.
Holly......I would love you as a DIL ....and a DD!.....I really don't know what she expects from you .You would be an.asset to any family.....how you remain faithful to your MIL I never know !
It is an individual thing and the hurt abusive MILs and DILs cause is the same. It hurts everybody and everybody hurts. When I said it can be harder for a good MIL than a good DIL in a bad situation, it wasn't to imply that it was a competition or that it didn't hurt either way. Since I have been on both sides of the fence, I can tell you that I was very hurt by my Ex-MILs behavior and it caused much stress, for myself and between me and my Ex-DH. But it was much easier for me to remove myself from the situations because I was not so emotionally involved with the MIL. It is much harder to remove myself from being a Mother.
I have a best friend that I have been friends with since we were twelve. 31 years. If something happened to her, I would be devastated. I would hurt very badly. I have another best friend that I have been friends with for 2 years. If something happened to her, I would hurt and be upset. But I have a lifetime of memories and love for the first best friend, and it would be much harder on me to lose her. It doesn't mean I wouldn't hurt for my 2 year friend, but it would be easier on me. That's the best way I can describe what I mean by what I said.
I in no way want to invalidate what any of our DILs here are going through. I know, it is still very hard.
I dunno, I'd be a lot more upset losing my husband than just backing off from my dad.
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 05:52:39 AM
I dunno, I'd be a lot more upset losing my husband than just backing off from my dad.
When talking about DH, that is a different story. You love this person or you wouldn't have married him. You don't have to love your MIL or DIL.
My MIL never gave me a kind word in her life .
My children never received a gift or card from her ever .
She never abused me either ,just didn't want to involved in my life .
My DH didn't have a close relationship with her either .
So when she died it didn't have any effect on me at all .How can you grieve for someone who was never
there in the first place .
We attended her funeral out of respect but no tears were shed .
So shall you sow ,so shall you reap ....is that the correct saying ?
you only get out of life what you put in .
Had my MIL made any effort whatsoever to befriend me , I would have returned her friendship ten fold .
Likewise my kids ...that was her loss !
Quote from: Pooh on February 16, 2011, 06:00:05 AM
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 05:52:39 AM
I dunno, I'd be a lot more upset losing my husband than just backing off from my dad.
When talking about DH, that is a different story. You love this person or you wouldn't have married him. You don't have to love your MIL or DIL.
Exactly my point. We can't gauge others pain or say a label such as MIL or DIL will carry more pain.
Do you think my MIL has more pain than I do in our situation? You know what happened Pooh.
Pam,
You're one of the DILs that I wanted to cite, but I figured I'd better not. I'd emphatically say no, she's doesn't.
I think the amount of pain no matter how little or more is suffered is pain plain and simple .
how it effects the individual is another matter .
Depends on their personality and how strong they are in the first place .
If the person is heartless to begin with ,the the pain just slides down their backs .
Unlike the person who feels every little heartbeat ,for them its torture .
Thats why some people remain aloof all their lives ,so as not to be hurt .
Better to have loved and lost ....as they say .
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 06:10:39 AM
Quote from: Pooh on February 16, 2011, 06:00:05 AM
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 05:52:39 AM
I dunno, I'd be a lot more upset losing my husband than just backing off from my dad.
When talking about DH, that is a different story. You love this person or you wouldn't have married him. You don't have to love your MIL or DIL.
Exactly my point. We can't gauge others pain or say a label such as MIL or DIL will carry more pain.
Do you think my MIL has more pain than I do in our situation? You know what happened Pooh.
In your case, no. And I never said a label carries more weight. There is just no way to write who you are talking about without using a label here in the written word. Ok, let me rephrase what I said so that no one thinks I am speaking about everyone. In my case, the pain of losing a child outweighed my pain of shutting out a MIL whom I barely knew.
Quote from: Pooh on February 16, 2011, 06:34:39 AM
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 06:10:39 AM
Quote from: Pooh on February 16, 2011, 06:00:05 AM
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 05:52:39 AM
I dunno, I'd be a lot more upset losing my husband than just backing off from my dad.
When talking about DH, that is a different story. You love this person or you wouldn't have married him. You don't have to love your MIL or DIL.
Exactly my point. We can't gauge others pain or say a label such as MIL or DIL will carry more pain.
Do you think my MIL has more pain than I do in our situation? You know what happened Pooh.
In your case, no. And I never said a label carries more weight. There is just no way to write who you are talking about without using a label here in the written word. Ok, let me rephrase what I said so that no one thinks I am speaking about everyone. In my case, the pain of losing a child outweighed my pain of shutting out a MIL whom I barely knew.
The thing is, most DIL's I know didn't just simply shut out a MIL they barely knew. They took hits to their marriage constantly, almost lost their husbands, had special moments intended for them and their child repeatedly taken away from them. I have met a few DIL's online who have cut off and it wasn't a matter of just getting the MIL out of her life and they are in pain over losing *that* relationship.
I don't mean to sound harsh but I think the pain most DIL's feel isn't really connected to losing their MIL, it is to their husband. And most people consider their marriage to be #1 in their life.
Holli, you are very kind.
They are out there. We have several here, including me, that have them and are dealing with being cut-off just because. Just as I knew many wonderful MILs and until I had a bad one, it was hard for me to conceive that an MIL would treat a DIL badly. But it happens on both sides. People are people.
I don't think you are harsh. I think you are stating your opinion.
DILs have a choice to marry into the family or not. MILs don't; we've got to deal with a situation not of our making and perhaps lose our sons as well.
Pen,
You say a lot that you were blindsided by your DIL's actions after she married DS. I was blindsided by my MIL's as well. I didn't have enough time with her, but that's how I felt. I was rushed into marriage to stay with a man that I love (due to military lifestyle); I didn't realize that once I married him, my *possible* very private life would be used for fodder and dinner table talk. It wasn't on display before I married him, maybe b/c she thought I'd just be passing thought by the time he got overseas...I'm not sure. I assumed (and I know where that gets me), that people knew I was making a very serious decision to stay with one man for the rest of my life, and that I really wouldn't dream of doing the things she suggests are all possibilities in my repertoire. She doesn't get a pass from me b/c she had no choice in who DH married. If anything, when she says things like that (and she does remind me that she wishes she had a choice), it only makes me feel more inadequate when she's around.
I think I'm a pretty good wife. I don't think it's fair to tell DH that b/c of his family, I can't marry him. If he loves me, and I love him enough to take care of him in the way that he deserves, somehow, I see the rest of the family (mine included) as having very little to do with it. I oblingingly stay quiet after the comments due to that fact, but it doesn't make it right, and it doesn't make it easier to take, and I think comments like that, no matter how my MIL feels, are on par with abuse and shaming. Still, I love him enough to put up with the outlaw whoopie cushion, I just have to come here to gripe.
Outlaw whoopie cushion....Oh that's priceless...love it! ;D
Ok, this one is all my fault. I take the blame for somehow managing to turn this into a "who feels the most pain, MIL or DIL". That was not my intention, I promise. Been on both ends and they both stink!
Holliberry,
I'm sorry that you are having to deal with yr mils behavior and I agree it is abusive. I'm so sorry. You shouldn't have to deal
with this.
Love and Blessings
Every single situation is different, that's all. I can't say that my pain's worse b/c I haven't been there, but my MIL hasn't been in my shoes either; in fact, not even close.
People are people, and I think that's what we've all been saying here. I can't mish-mash my experience with Pen's or Pooh's, simply b/c that wasn't my ride to take in life. I believe, in hearing their stories, that yes, their pain is more real than their DILs. But, in my own experience, I believe the pain my MIL seems to think she's in is a little bit exaggerated, and I think that she causes pain a lot more often than she actually feels it. I'm just not willing to say (on here, of all places) that her pain is greater than mine and I just can't understand. I guess I hear that enough on the homefront.
HB, I'm not saying your pain is less or that MIL should get a pass, far from it. No one should have to deal with outright rudeness and cruelty. The fact remains that as a DIL I had a choice. When I married the first time my MIL was heinous - I knew it going in so I just dealt. I was pretty certain by the time she was middle-aged and set in her ways I wasn't going to be successful at changing her, so I didn't try to do that, nor did I try to get DS to limit time with her or cut her off.
My second MIL was fabulous - I knew that too, and it's one of many reasons I said yes when DH proposed.
My DIL is a bit of a problem, but I had no say so. If I'd expressed my concerns before the wedding I would have been cut off right then and there. Like I said, I had no choice and no voice.
Pen,
I know we've talked about this before, but I don't think everyone is given a chance to gauge their choice appropriately.
My MIL never said those things before I was married. She really didn't sour until our extension overseas came to pass, and that was 6 months after the wedding. Plus, she never had the chance to start discussing the possibility of my unfaithfulness (ugh) until DH and I were separated (neither he, nor I, deployed before we were married, so we were together, albeit for a short time).
She seemed perfect beforehand. And yes, since she didn't have a choice, I've certainly let a lot slide down my back. I think she acts out like this b/c she wanted a choice. Sometimes, just like when DILs get married and the horns come out, the very same thing happens with MILs. That's all that I'm saying. I really thought everything would be hunky dory when I got married: no problems with ILs, ever.
As I have mentioned before, at age 20 I married the wrong guy because I just loved his mom and she loved me. We divorced 18 years later but my MIL and I stayed tight until she passed at age 104. I have written about her here under Success Stories. She got a "lemon" of a DIL in me and helped turn me into lemonade. :)
Quote from: Pen on February 16, 2011, 08:57:28 AM
DILs have a choice to marry into the family or not. MILs don't; we've got to deal with a situation not of our making and perhaps lose our sons as well.
I dunno, I married my husband for him, not his family. I assumed that they were normal people with flaws and relationships in general take time to develop.
I personally don't think I'm dealing with a situation of my own making or even DH's making. This is all MIL/FIL there.
Marrying your husband for him is much smarter, I agree!
Luise,
I know I've said this before, but I was in love with a guy's family when I was younger, but not him. I couldn't marry him. I also am in love with DH, but not his family. I'd rather have it this way.
When it comes right down to it, even if I was aware of what would happen, I'd still marry DH. Not b/c it's not so bad (it could definitely always be worse), but b/c I love him. I didn't choose who I fell in love with. I'd like to hope he loves me enough to recognize he had no choice over that either. But...then again, I'm mushy like that; and he's a bit of a realist, so maybe he sees it differently.
Quote from: holliberri on February 16, 2011, 11:57:39 AM
Luise,
I know I've said this before, but I was in love with a guy's family when I was younger, but not him. I couldn't marry him. I also am in love with DH, but not his family. I'd rather have it this way.
When it comes right down to it, even if I was aware of what would happen, I'd still marry DH. Not b/c it's not so bad (it could definitely always be worse), but b/c I love him. I didn't choose who I fell in love with. I'd like to hope he loves me enough to recognize he had no choice over that either. But...then again, I'm mushy like that; and he's a bit of a realist, so maybe he sees it differently.
Same here. I asked DH the other day would he have still married me too and he said yes, but he wishes he never brought his mother in our life. He didn't think she would get so out of control and just assumed she'd settle down after the wedding.
And dang, I wish I had that awareness back when I first met them.
I was really dumb when I was 20. :(
Quote from: luise.volta on February 16, 2011, 12:00:31 PM
I was really dumb when I was 20. :(
I didn't think it was dumb, I thought it was sweet.
And 18 years is nothing to laugh at!
Oh, I love being given the benefit of the doubt! And I did stay in for the long haul. I also got Kirk, who I would crawl over hot coals to have for a son. (In a way, I did.)
Sensitive issue, my parents divorced after 17 years. No doubt in my mind that each one of them did the best they could!
Here we are again. I have posted this before. It's my most recent Kirk and Mom picture. The day this was taken, he had called me to wish me Happy Birthday. As you all know, he lives in Hawaii and I live in W. WA. I was entering a restaurant with a friend...(it was a set up)...when Kirk tapped me on the shoulder. I still had my cell in my hand thinking he was in the middle of the Pacific Ocean when I got my Birthday Bear-hug.
(http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc491/luisevolta/mom_and_Kirk_2.jpg)
I married at 19 and yes I was dumb. Stayed in it for 21 years, which was also dumb, and got two Sons out of the deal. And like Luise has said before, one thinks I hung the moon, the other doesn't contact me.
Quote from: holliberri on February 16, 2011, 12:12:23 PM
Sensitive issue, my parents divorced after 17 years. No doubt in my mind that each one of them did the best they could!
Do you think your parents stayed in the relationship longer for your benefit? If so do you think you would have rather they parted earlier in your life?
Mom had two affairs and the divorce was awful.
Out of 17 years...I think 22 months were pretty rough going for a while.
Other than that, everything was usual. I don't consider myself having come from a broken home (my MIL likes to say that to me a lot too). I was a very happy child, what was going on between my parents was really going on between them. High school was bad, but I think I was self-centered then.
I think that if they lasted 17 years, they may not have been "in love" but they must've loved each other. When I hear them talk about one another (they're good friends), I think they see the same things I do.
It may not have been easier if they divorced earlier; it was quite convenient for me to have my parents married. If they did divorce earlier, I'm sure I'd find a way to be happy about that too.
What is it with the broken home stuff? Seriously...ugh, I'm sorry you had to hear that Holli. I can't stand when people use that line
I feel like the term 'broken home' is just used when someone doesn't know what else to call it.. you would feel worse if they referred to you as coming from a 'dysfunctional family" oh the one that gets me is you are a product of a divorce. It would be insulting if your families situation was used as a weapon as if to say that you are acting out in a certain way because of "your broken home"
Hey Holli.. glad your parents are now able to call each other friends.... I would hope I could find it within myself to rebuilt that relationship based on friendship, for the sake of the kids, but more so for my own sake.. Bitter divorced women have more wrinkles :)
I was the "victim" of parents who loved each other dearly and stayed married forever. They shouldn't have done either.
i don't feel like it is the term "broken home." It's the intent usually said behind it. It sounds much more sinister for my MIL to say I come from a broken home rather than oh Pam's parents divorced. It's a p/a jab when said in most cases.
yeah I guess most words can be delivered with a sting if that is the intent.
so Pam.. now that you have the support of your husband and he is seeing life much more clearly.. what is it you want to do about your in-law situation.. It kinda sounds to me like he is saying.. it's time.
No, he isn't saying anything at all. He knows how I feel and it aint happening. And he told me he doesn't want it to happen anyway, so guess we are just....there...lol
I'm not saying that he wants to cut his mother out of his life.. but he does see that this isn't working the way it is right now, or did I misread something
Yeah, it's a little confusing. She is cut off for now. If she gets professional help and we see real improvement there may be a possibility one day to reconnect with her as a family.
As it is now, DD and I haven't seen her since it all went down and DH has avoided her as much as he can without taking legal action. For example, calling and showing up at his work. That's his thing so I don't ask much about it, other than the V Day stuff she took to work, but I figure it's his battle and I don't need anymore worrying. I figure he will get embarassed enough one of these times to do something about it.
Quote from: pam1 on February 16, 2011, 01:58:00 PM
i don't feel like it is the term "broken home." It's the intent usually said behind it. It sounds much more sinister for my MIL to say I come from a broken home rather than oh Pam's parents divorced. It's a p/a jab when said in most cases.
Oh, ditto. It's synonymous with product of divorce and dysfunctional family (which family isn't dysfunctional?). My home was still a home. Nothing wrong with not talking about my divorced parents at all, unless it comes up, and I can't think of many situations it would.
MIL likes to imply that she's the authority on my marriage b/c she has 34 years experience (or something like that). I couldn't possibly have any leverage in my own marriage b/c my parents are divorced. She really sat us down the day after our wedding to explain that, "I think the length of my marriage demonstrates tremendous success on mine and DH's part, so if you both need help in working out arguments or how to talk to one another, I think we'd make excellent candidates to talk to."
This followed by a, "Oh, sweetie, it must be so hard coming from a broken home, I can't imagine you felt very loved."
Classice one-two punch, if you ask me.
Then again, I never liked being called a victim of circumstance.
Pam, sometimes I wish I could buy you a coffee.
oh I like skinny vanilla lattes if you're offering
I was fine until you said that. Now, my mouth is watering!
I'd mail it, but it might get cold on the way down!
Who needs lattes in TX? It's not cold there. ;)
I don't know about that you know we just had snow.. all 1/4 " but it was snow.. some areas got a little more and Dallas.. well between you and me Houstonians don't consider Dallas as being 'real' Texans :)
My favorite drink is Carmel Macchiato
(http://i1201.photobucket.com/albums/bb341/LaurieSS/coffee.jpg)
looks yummy doesn't it... lol.. I'm picky.. I get mine, upside down, extra hot, no foam
OK, I'm gonna get one the next time I'm in there...if I can pronounce it. 8)
Quote from: luise.volta on February 16, 2011, 08:36:26 PM
OK, I'm gonna get one the next time I'm in there...if I can pronounce it. 8)
You might want to pronounce it Skinny Vanilla Latte... less then half the calories.. no since in hitting Curves then over indulging right?
Wrong! ;D ;D ;D
I was trying to be good
Oh Holli. I agree with you. Every situation is different. I would have never dared crossing the boundaries your mil did. In fact I never did cross none. And I had a total rejection from dil at first. I really was so careful not to push, intrude, ask questions, give advice, visit without being invited. I would only open my mouth to offer dil and ds my help . We (well, my husband) paid for half of the delivery fees, we would buy cloth, milk, pampers, toys for the baby (then it was the first gc), and you name it. I was so nice to her, buying her nice things. I know Holli...I was trying to buy her affection. Things started to change when I decided that enough was enough....and pulled myself out of their life. I wanted my son and her to have a good marriage, and it was the most important thing to me. I understood perfectly well that my son had a new family. Thank God, she realized (and she accepted it) that I had done nothing to be treated as trash. Now, they have three children and I am now a real grandmother to their children. But Holli...it was so painful, that even if I sound dramatic...I wanted to die at that time. That is why I feel real compassion for all mils that are going through this pain.
But as a poster said.....pain is pain...regardless if it is mil or dil that is hurting. But I thought that maybe it was worse for us mils lol.
Yours is a different story. Of course you dont have to prove your mil anything. You dont have to meet her expectations. You are not married to her. You dont steal a son....our sons have their own wings to fly. Our sons have to make their own lives.
You sound good-heartd and I am sure that if she were different, you would have had a good relationship with her.
Take care and may God Bless You.
Love
It seems that the ones (mil vs dil) who hurt the most as the ones who feel powerless to make decisions about their own lives. To me that pain is equal for all.
Holli, that would be a lot of fun! it's too bad most of us don't live closer.
Back off Laurie! You can't have Holli all to yourself
I'd share.. I just want holli to figure out what I can do differently with my own dil.. and then I was kinda hoping she'd take the rats home with her
I'm being used. I must be more similar to your DIL than I care to admit.
Pam, I really can't believe how much we have in common...but you manage better with humor, guts and a little dash of "I really don't care" thrown in. I love it.
Holli, you made me blush. Thank you. Although I have to admit I wonder if my sitch would be different if I had used some of the Holli way in approach of my in laws.
Laurie, I went to Starbucks and did the deed. Oh, my! What a treat while I was pushing my basket around selecting stuff. I got the "skinny"...they said it was 140 calories and I worked it into my Nutrisystem daily intake maximum. I'm going to mention you in my will. (I haven't decided what I will say yet but you will be to blame for my eventual downfall, that's for sure!)
Beyond that....THANKS!! ;D ;D ;D
I love that drink.. I get the regular carmel macchiato .. I tried their skinny once but it wasn't nearly as good... one day go for the real thing you'll really be cursing me.. it's that good.
Next time try the skinny vanilla latte.. it's really not at all bad and 90 calories I believe
You missed it but another absolutely fantastic drink there is the pumpkin spice latte.. I do not get the whipped cream and then I trick myself into thinking that I'm making wise choices.. they typically only have that in the autumn and early winter.
Glad you enjoyed it... that is why when I do a me day.. it's the mani/pedi and a starbucks
I am going to remain blissfully of what the real thing must taste like! The fake was heavenly!