What You Did Wrong

[cremebrulee]

I'd like to add something else to this discussion, it may not apply to any of you, just something to think about...

when I left my husband, I was just as devestated as all of you are now, I felt I failed...and asked so many questions...like
how could he do that to me
how could he throw away the trust I had for him, our marriage, our vows?
How could he even lie to me?
How could he manipulate and turn everything around on me...and so forth...
When you go thru a divorce, it is a death, a death of a relationship and devestating...

so, for 3 years, I  asked these questions...then, one day, slowly, it started to dawn on me, that it wasn't all him...
and I started to ask myself,
Why did I choose someone who could be so frivolus with our lives
Why was I attracted to someone like this and trust him with my heart...I saw flags...and on and on

The point I'm trying to make, is when I stopped blaming him, and yes, he was wrong, indeed, but why did I choose someone so insecure and with so little confidence? 

When I started answering questions about myself, a whole new world opened up for me....

when you look to the self for answers, that is when answers come, and I've applied that to my life ever since...
I know, I need to take ownership in some things, not beat myself up or be a door mat, but I know, when a relationship goes south, I need to sit back and look at me...and believe me, there are some relationships that are just not good fits...however, we  don't get to choose our DIL's or MIL's...we are thrown into it without choice.

I  read this and it makes sense...and thought it might help while it is directed at the DIL, I believe there is wisdom in this for all...to consider....

Parents develop an older and deeper relationship with their adult child, which is to be expected. Even so, healthy parents will welcome their child's spouse into their lives, if that person is loving and kind.

However, when a parent's preference for their own child over their child's spouse exists and is expressed, distance and hurt can result. During a visit or phone call, parents may show more interest in their child's goings-on than in a spouse's. Or they may give more lavish gifts to their child, disregarding a spouse. These gestures of favoritism can lead a spouse to feel left out and not valued when around in-laws.

I'm not saying anyone here does this....I'm just searching for answers right along with you...and throwing some ideas out there that I have read....

Another example:

Linda grew up in a traditional-style home. After she and Roy moved into their new home, they enjoyed expressing their own, more modern style. When Linda's parents were invited to visit, they questioned, "Is this some sort of phase you're going through?" Their opinions seemed disapproving and hurtful to the young couple.

Along the same lines as intrusiveness, some in-laws have difficulty letting go of their roles as parents. Instead of transitioning into a mutual adult relationship, they may offer unasked-for advice, criticisms, or even withhold approval if they disagree with the younger couple's prefrence

Emotional Distance.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, some parents maintain cold, disconnected relationships. They seem emotionally unavailable, self-absorbed, aloof, or unfriendly. Although the couple desires a warmer relationship, they find themselves rebuffed or ignored. Sometimes, unresolved issues or hurts may account for this problem between couples. But other times, it has to do with the character of the in-laws as people. They may simply be distant folks. Regardless of the cause, it is a painful situation.

Dependency.
Although we are told to care for our parents (1 Timothy 5:4), there are times when couples should not become involved in the problems of their in-laws. For example, parents may impose on the younger couple to referee their arguments, or try to get them to take sides. They may want the couple to rescue a drug-addicted child that they can't fix. Or they may be financially irresponsible, and ask the couple to bail them out. Taking responsibility for issues like these can be inappropriate for the young couple.

Choose Change

Perhaps you've attempted to "love them through it," or you've chosen to ignore them totally. Either way, you may have noticed that these types of in-law problems may not diminish with time. Many of the issues are generated from longstanding patterns that are rooted in character issues. This means that if you want to see improvement, you have to take some initiative.

Reality-check.
First, find out if there really is a problem, or if it's merely your perception. Sometimes we react to others based on our experiences, which can cloud judgment. A reserved husband may see his in-laws as intrusive, when in fact, they are merely outgoing. To help gain a proper perspective, ask a trusted friend to observe and verify your perception of the situation.

Do a self-inventory.
After you've identified the problem, ask yourself how you might be contributing to it. Jesus reminds us that we must first deal with our own actions before we help others correct theirs (Matthew 7:1-5). Deal with any unloving attitude you might have. Beware of promoting a problem by being silent, compliant, or rationalizing. By speaking the truth in love (Ephesians 4:13), we can foster growth and healing.

Be direct.
Linda and Roy were passive in dealing with their in-law problems. As a result, they began to withdraw emotionally from her folks. In choosing to find a solution to their problems, they promised to be gently honest with her parents. In addition, Linda made a commitment to put her marriage first, and her parents second. Approaching the situation as a united front provided new courage.

Confront your in-laws gently, but directly. Though you may need to involve your spouse, don't avoid dealing with the problem personally. Let them know how you feel and that it gets in the way of being close to them. They may react with hurt, withdrawal, or anger. Or they may be surprised at what they learn, and thank you for letting them know.

Discuss the issue with true heart, feelings and knowing that the other person is just as hurt as you are....ask them the why's....ask them if your perception is off....and your being insecure, b/c you feel as if a wall has been placed between you all....don't point fingers, don't be accusive...ask them "What can I do to make this better", reassure them that you want a healthy relationship for everyone concerned...don't play on sympathy or try to manipulate they're feelings because your hurting, it won't work that way...remember, they are hurting to...

[Nana]

Dear Creme:

Thanks for answering my post.  You are right that I used the wrong term "common denominator".  Some dils do expect to have a good relationship with mils.    But again, not all.  Many do build a barrier.....just in case.  I swear to you in my case I didnt do anything but try to pleased her.    I did ask my dil a lot of questions when we reconcile?  I asked "Did I ever expressed my opinion in things that were none of my business"   "Did I ever visit you when I was not invited you?  Did I called your home everyday?  Did I every said "no" to something you asked for from us?   She answered no to all.  Creme, I was so careful when I spoke to her in using the correct words.  I always received her with a smile....and offered all I had.   All the family watching told me I was too  servile with her.  My relative's opinion was that she just didnt like me.     It was after all these that I decided to distanced myself from her.  I spoke to son and we both cried a lot.   He told me he loved me and of course saw what was going on.  He just said that he was loyal to me - that he never visited his in-laws because of the way she treated us.  He said he would still visit with the baby (then it was only one gc).    Until then Creme she (dil) got it.   After a month she came back to my house with a different attitude.  She was now again the dil that I knew before my son and her got married.  Now everything is fine....really good.   I love her very much now.  When our second child was born she called me from the hospital and asked me if I was coming.  She deliver her baby in San Diego, and I lived about 200 miles away.  She also said Ï love you.    That is why I always give hope  to all lovely ladies of WW...If it happened to me...it can happen to anyone. 

On the other hand.  All my friends daughter's arel always complaining about their mil.  My friends do not approve of therir daughters doing this to their mils.  They too dont have a reason.  They  say that they just dont want them  in their lives...only mom.   I speak to my friend's daughters about this and how they eed to accept their in-laws if they truly love their husbands.  They answer Ït is because my mil is not like you.  Of course they are not.  I am their mothers dear friend, not their mil. 

So you see.  It is what I have seen first hand.  I did have and still have a good relationship with my mil.  She is now 90 but we are very close.  My mom was also a very good mil.  My sisters in law loved her until the day she died.  So I see things have changed dramatically.  Of course way back...there were also some terrible mils, but in my side of the world, the in-laws were family. 


Creme you dont have to think I am offended.. I appreciate your advice.  They are outstanding.  I am just expressing my point of view in this regard.  You know a lot and are very wise and intelligent...no doubt.  I always read your posts and advice with pleasure.  You are like the salt and pepper of this site.  Good you are so sincere.  I know all us us at a certain moment cant stand the truth....I can handle it perfectly well.  I am a confrontable (?) person...I like to speak out when I  have something to say.  I am not afraid of words... and believe me....when I was having problems with dil....I was another person...I was intimidated by her...I lost my self-esteem and probably ...I also lost my spontaneous joy.    But I am back. 


Love you Creme....really do

[MLW07]

I have to say something to complement you, Kathleen and all others who ask this question.  At least you are asking what you did wrong.  My MIL would never ask that nor believe she had any part in our issues.  My hats off to you for asking yourself that question.  See, that is what makes this group different from the ones in the MIL jokes and the ones so many of us DILs have to deal with.  Why couldn't we all swap in-laws. 

[MLW07]

Anna, DS hasn't said this to us in so many words, but has implied many times that DIL has told him that it's her way or the highway, he loves her and her DD and feels he has no choice but to do what she says. We have never put him in a position where he has to choose, we know better than that, DIL has and he's afraid of her, a 4', 70 lb. woman. lol

Your DIL is wrong.  A marriage is about partnership, love, understanding, and compromise...and so much more.  Not one single spouse should rule the household.  This is so wrong...it should be an equal partnership.

[Barbie]

Creme, I don't think you understood what I wrote.  Nowhere in my post did I say that I didn't like you or didn't welcome your advice, but quite the opposite, what I didn't like was the fact that you used me as a bad example and you referred to me as "the woman". I have been posting here on and off for a while and I found that to be highly inappropiate and derrogatorry.  I look forward to reading your posts, I understand that you're speaking from experience and I really appreciate everything you have to say, I want to follow your advice and I'm trying, it just isn't easy when DIL doesn't care one way or the other.

And to all the DIL's here, I think I can speak for all the MILs, we welcome all your comments and suggestions, we want to learn from all of you, but please try not to be so harsh, we are in a very sad situation, those of you who have children, try to put yourselves in our shoes for a moment and remember we are trying our best to work things out with our dils, we're making mistakes along the way but we're trying.

[Barbie]

Glitterati and MLW07, as I said DS really loves his wife, he's a wonderful husband and father, he had a good example, he's really torn trying to please DIL and wanting to have a relationship with us, he's told me a couple of times that he's lost interest in the things he liked to do, admitted to be "almost" depressed, his self esteem is so low when he was such a mischievous little boy and as he grew, the life of the party, DS told me that DIL complains that he's not the man she married, he's losing himself trying to please her, it's like he doesn't know who he is or where he came from anymore.

He used to be so proud of us and who he was and now he's not allowed to show those feelings. He also mentioned some time ago that he had been talking to someone, didn't say who and I didn't dare ask, but whoever it was  doesn't have our best interest at heart but only DIL's.  I'll share a secret with you, he calls me everyday but only when DIL is not around he'll say "I love you" to me. 

DIL is not a teenager, I think she's a little too old to be acting this way. One of her sisters told us once that she was a spoiled brat used to getting her way.


Everyone tells me that DS is going to get tired of that someday but in the meantime it's devastating for us to watch from afar and not be able to do anything.

[cremebrulee]

Creme, I don't think you understood what I wrote.  Nowhere in my post did I say that I didn't like you or didn't welcome your advice, but quite the opposite, what I didn't like was the fact that you used me as a bad example and you referred to me as "the woman". I have been posting here on and off for a while and I found that to be highly inappropiate and derrogatorry.  I look forward to reading your posts, I understand that you're speaking from experience and I really appreciate everything you have to say, I want to follow your advice and I'm trying, it just isn't easy when DIL doesn't care one way or the other.

And to all the DIL's here, I think I can speak for all the MILs, we welcome all your comments and suggestions, we want to learn from all of you, but please try not to be so harsh, we are in a very sad situation, those of you who have children, try to put yourselves in our shoes for a moment and remember we are trying our best to work things out with our dils, we're making mistakes along the way but we're trying.

Guest

I have MS, therefore, I don't remember who writes what...I just remember the post about the card while I was writing...and yes, I refer to people as the woman or man or whatever, if I can't remember who said it or wrote it...it wasn't meant to be insulting...I was simply discussing an issue I remembered....and now, so sorry I did...

I honestly do not remember who writes what...my memory is bad...especially if I'm tired...but really, didn't think the author of that post would mind, b/c they did write it publically, sharing they're thoughts, your thoughts...your feelings, your hurt...

you are offended b/c I didn't agree with you...and you took it like I was saying your wrong in feeling that way...and that is not how I meant it...If I had agreed with you in my post to Anna, I don't think it would be an issue...and exactly the point I was trying to make to Anna and all....I don't think your DIL did it to hurt you, and if she would be me, I would have addressed the card in the very same way...but that's just me...doesn't say I'm right...Guest, and your wrong, it is simply how I would view it...or write it...I'd be overjoyed at my DIL doing something so nice....to me, it would be a breakthrough

And I guess I should remember everyone's individual struggles,but unfortunately I can't and don't...I can read books and watch movies over and over again, b/c I forget. 

I hope you realize, I wasn't accusing you of not liking me...what I was saying is, I know women in here take offense to my posts, b/c I don't  always agree with them...and some don't like me, sorry if I worded it wrong and you thought I meant you...I meant everyone, and it doesn't matter...really...I'd prefer to be liked, but not everyone is going to...and I won't reply to posts always agreeing if I don't, just to be liked...

and it's ok, like I said before, I'm not here to win a popularity contest...I'm here to learn and to grow, right along with you all, and if by chance, something I've said might help someone, then all the better....if not, then it wasn't supposed to be...however, I really do believe from my heart, that being  honest, is not being harsh...and have tried very hard to post in a caring way all the time....however, you and others percieve it differently....and but please know I'm doing my best...

however, we can't all agree all the time...and I know it's very difficult to post what I'm feeling at the cost of everyone's friendship, and these DIL's who are here, are not here to hurt anyone, but to also help...being  honest, is not being harsh, b/c someone disagrees with you...I'm sorry Guest...

When I have a problem with someone, I want them to spare us both angonizing time wasted by not discussing it...even if what they say might bite a little, I'm going to think about it and take from it what I can to help our situation....I write as I am....and apologize for that...but I cannot be any other way...it is who I am...what I feel, and it doesn't mean, b/c I disagree that you or anyone else is wrong or a horrible person, it does mean, however, that I care enough to take the chance to tell you my feelings....opinions and beliefs...I don't know if you just want to vent and cry a little, or you want to look at things from a different perspective, does't mean that different perspective is always going to be right, or fit your situation, it's just an idea thrown out there....and I feel and maybe I'm wrong, but the DIL's here are not anything like your DIL's...otherwise, they wouldn't be here...they are trying to learn to...but if they participate and don't agree with you, it doesn't mean they are harsh, they are however, giving you they're perspectives...which has really got to be hard for them...cuz I know it's hard for me.

[Barbie]

Creme, with this I think we'll just have to agree to disagree.

[RedRose]

HI Guest1.  My ods has told me that whenever something doesn't go ndils way, she is packing her bags & saying she wants a divorce.  Ods says that the least little thing & she's out the door.  Ods is trying to get her to see, that you shouldn't react that way over the little things.  She has cut us out, over something we didn't even do, so ods is absolutely walking on thin shells.

Hi Anna,

It has been quite a while since I have posted...

My son's divorce will be final very soon.

I have to tell you that your ndil is acting the same way my x-dil acted. If she doesn't change her controlling ways she may get her wish.

On a happier note...my daughter had her baby boy last week.

I love being a grandma. 

[1Glitterati]

Glitterati and MLW07, as I said DS really loves his wife, he's a wonderful husband and father, he had a good example, he's really torn trying to please DIL and wanting to have a relationship with us, he's told me a couple of times that he's lost interest in the things he liked to do, admitted to be "almost" depressed, his self esteem is so low when he was such a mischievous little boy and as he grew, the life of the party, DS told me that DIL complains that he's not the man she married, he's losing himself trying to please her, it's like he doesn't know who he is or where he came from anymore.

He used to be so proud of us and who he was and now he's not allowed to show those feelings. He also mentioned some time ago that he had been talking to someone, didn't say who and I didn't dare ask, but whoever it was  doesn't have our best interest at heart but only DIL's.  I'll share a secret with you, he calls me everyday but only when DIL is not around he'll say "I love you" to me. 

DIL is not a teenager, I think she's a little too old to be acting this way. One of her sisters told us once that she was a spoiled brat used to getting her way.


Everyone tells me that DS is going to get tired of that someday but in the meantime it's devastating for us to watch from afar and not be able to do anything.

Guest...I was talking about Anna's ods and his new wife.

[LaurieS]

No one should ever be put in the position where they have to choose, and I don't believe any of us mother's have done that...however, what is so difficult for us to understand, is, they are married and have a new woman in they're lives, we are and shouldn't be no longer they're first priority...

Every mother goes thru this separation and depression of loosing they're sons to another woman...some worse then others b/c they can't let go....they want to be involved in they're son's life, however, it doesn't work....

Some of you have more then one child...I do not...I lost 3 children, b/c I couldn't carry them... 

You have a Husband, I have no one...if I did, I'd certainly not miss my son as much...b/c I'd forget about my son and consentrate all my attention to starting a new life now with hubby. 

Creme.. you brought up some interesting points and I can see how with the right frame of mind some of your suggestions could work for the better... I highlighted sections from your first posting on this subject matter that did concern me and I was trying not to take them out of content. 

As a parent and the mother of a married son, I would hate to wake every morning feeling that I lost my son to marriage.  Marriage is a bond of two people in part to show each other that they are truly committed in all ways.  I never thought of it as loosing him to another woman, gosh that turns the entire tradition of matrimony into nothing more then a rugby competition or worse a boxing match.  Are you not saying that for yourself that you've actually lost 4 children if this is how you really view your son's marriage.

I and my friends who have had sons and daughters marry have not fallen into depression and began to suffer from separation anxiety. And yes while I am myself married (99% of the time happily), I could never simply forget about one of my children while I concentrated on what you refer to my new life with hubby. Remember we are mother's and great at multi-tasking and multi-loving.

While I do agree that my children once married do need to make their union a top priority, but never should marriage be their only priority.  I think that most importantly they need to continue their own self growth, secondly to support the growth of their spouse, but then their extended family/God/jobs etc really should have a high priority in a balanced individuals life. 

I'm sadden to think that any parent whether it's the parent of the bride or the groom, should ever look at marriage as a means to an end.  Instead it should be the opportunity to watch your children come into themselves and explode into adulthood and doing so with someone they can intimately love. 

Hurt feelings begin when that balance is off kilter, and personally I think it should not be that challenging to stay balanced.  Mutual respect is a must by everyone.  To say to the mothers of the sons that they should excuse themselves and not be a part of their son's life or worse to say that this mother/son relationship simply can't work is not right and I don't know if I could disagree any more strongly.   

[kathleen]

If anyone can tell me how to post a quote, please let me know.  I can't figure it out and wanted to reply to ML, who said I was to be complimented for thinking about what I did wrong.

ML: It's all I thought about for two years.  I kept myself awake nights picking over my relationship with my son like I pick over a pot of uncooked beans, looking for that one hard bean or little rock that will spoil the batch.  Eventually I saw that---trying to accept blame for what they were doing---as part of my son and DIL's manipulation.  Eventually, through my other son, he sent back some of the reasons for the distance and then the cutoff.  I saw he was perfectly willing to bash his parents to his brothers, almost as if he was inviting those brothers to join them.  I saw that his reasons were as flimsy as wet noodles and could have gone the other way, just as I wrote in my first post.  So this was something that he and his wife wanted to do, so she could spend all her time with her family and none with us. 

Nana I appreciate all your remarks; you understand what I was trying to say, and that is, for some people, they are going to find fault no matter what you do.  I've given up on guilt and self-blame.  It leads nowhere except to insomnia and even health problems.  It's a total waste of time; even picking over a pot of beans is time better spent.

If you love and care for someone, you don't spend your days looking for their faults and mistakes.  That may be the hardest thing of all to accept, that somehow these adult children (how I love that phrase, adults acting like children) just do not care enough about us to make a mature relationship.  When I say "us" I don't mean all of you, for only you can judge that, I mean my husband and me.

Kathleen

[cremebrulee]

LaurieS

As a parent and the mother of a married son, I would hate to wake every morning feeling that I lost my son to marriage.  Marriage is a bond of two people in part to show each other that they are truly committed in all ways.  I never thought of it as loosing him to another woman, gosh that turns the entire tradition of matrimony into nothing more then a rugby competition or worse a boxing match.  Are you not saying that for yourself that you've actually lost 4 children if this is how you really view your son's marriage.

for lack of a better word, I used the word lost my son...he isn't lost, he's gone...and yes, I view a son's marriage to his wife as a huge change in my life, he is now another's woman's man and not my child any longer..he is his own man...has his own life and responsibilities...I've not really lost him, I've lost that child I guess is what I'm trying to say...however, as many people say, who have sons and DIL's they get along with, when your son marries, he becomes a different person, as he should, he's grown up now with a wife (another woman) and he is no longer mine, or never was for that matter.  He is now, his wife's husband and man...unlike a rugby competition, but when the two women are arguing over them, I can see the similarites...LOL

And yes, when two woman are fighting over they're son/husband, it is in fact similar to a love triangle.  I didn't say is a love triangle, but very similar to one.  I've had two counselors tell me that...and it puts them in a very uncomfortable/pecular position.  Also, put it in a perspective for me....I felt ashamed that I couldn't see how ridiculous I was being for fighting over him...constantly feeling like he'd changed so much he wasn't the person I once knew, and kept saying, we were so close, and now that is gone, referring to it as like a death...being a mother, I wasn't able to let go. 

And yes, Lorie, I lost 3 babies which I couldn't carry, before my son...

yes, we are mothers and woman who are great at multi tasking...however, our son's are gone out of our lives...they have moved on and are evolving, as it should be...as we should be...we are so ridden with the schedules of everyday life, while our children are growing, that now, life is ours, and our husbands, in which we can utilize the time to rekindle our love, and continue with the dreams we put on hold when the children started arriving.

While I do agree that my children once married do need to make their union a top priority, but never should marriage be their only priority.

Yes, absolutely...as well as they're children...not they're only priority, but think about it....he works full time, some two jobs, has responsiblities at home...cleaning up around the house, like lawn work, landscaping, etc...trying to fit in time for his wife and children...and when we mother's insist on having some of they're time, it really weighs on them...they want to feel like they want to come, not made to feel guilty or they're bad for not coming around or calling...I know when I get home from work the last thing I want to do is be on the phone, it's my down rest time and I don't want to have to think about anything...I remember those horribly busy days when my son needed me as a mother, confidant, taxie, sunday school teacher, youth group advisor, cook, cleaner, worked full time and took care of laundry, ironing, etc.   

I think that most importantly they need to continue their own self growth, secondly to support the growth of their spouse, but then their extended family/God/jobs etc really should have a high priority in a balanced individuals life.

What life is balanced...?  Really, there is no balance except what you view as balanced, and if you feel that way, I have no quarrels...however, I know how busy my son is, and even if he lived around here...I would never expect him to be as close to me as we once were, he has other priorities, and I am his mother...his life is full of activity running his daughter around, and taking care of his wife, trying to capture some quality special time with her...I raised him to believe, that once married, always find time to play, if that is a get away weekend, dinner and a movie...but never get caught up in a routine that doesn't include spontinuity and change where his wife is concerned...buget money for vacations and get aways, and they do.
 

I'm sadden to think that any parent whether it's the parent of the bride or the groom, should ever look at marriage as a means to an end.

It is the end of life with our sons as we knew it...life evolves, continually and nothing ever stays the same forever...it can't, that is nature, the planets evolve, constantly, and evolving is like a growth, or as I view it, a change.  We have a choice, we can make it great or we can stay stagnated in our old routines, and fight those changes, and when we fight those changes, we stagnate and the rest of the world doesn't wait for us, it continues to evolve.  Change is inevidable...and a means to an end if you so wish, but with every ending, there are new beginnings, new doors open if we care to walk through them...or not?

Instead it should be the opportunity to watch your children come into themselves and explode into adulthood and doing so with someone they can intimately love. 

Indeed, if we're lucky we get to see that, but from a distance...not involved in they're every day lives...I have girlfriends many, some in they're late 30's early  40's, and they get along famously with they're MIL's or DIL's.  We've had this discussion and many of them say they're MIL's just seem to know, that they're son's need to move on and are now grown and they accept it.  I so wish those same people would be posting about they're experiences...and they cherish they're DIL's/MIL's.  Personally, I think it is a very good thing that my son lives away.  He calls me every week and always has, and we have the nicest chats...however, there are no inlaws to interfer with they're lives.  Personally, they moved home for a year and moved back to where they're living now...and believe inlaws were part of the reason, his father and step mother can be very smothering, stopping by without asking if this is a good time or not, and continually interferring in they're lives, telling them if this is a good thing to do or not...I know his father, his mother was the same way and it drove me nuts.
She wasn't interferring b/c she was a bad person, she felt she was doing the right thing...but made our lives misrable and part of the reason why we broke up...way to smothering...

Hurt feelings begin when that balance is off kilter, and personally I think it should not be that challenging to stay balanced.

Again, balanced is a perfect world, what works for some, might not work for others...what is balanced for you, may not be balanced for me or for my DIL...we're all different and have different expectations and percepceptions about how we should live our lives...

Mutual respect is a must by everyone.  To say to the mothers of the sons that they should excuse themselves and not be a part of their son's life or worse to say that this mother/son relationship simply can't work is not right and I don't know if I could disagree any more strongly.

I feel the same way...no one should not be a part of they're son's life...however, mothers need to realize life as you knew it with your son b/f he was married, well, it just won't be there any longer...it changes, he moves on and so must we...
and why not utilize this time productively, persuing dreams and trips with out husbands that we put on hold, why not go back to school or find a career...get involved in art, reading classes, book clubs, art classes, or community projects...?  People who do this, who get involved in change, do not have problems with they're dils or if they do, they realize, if they don't do something about it, they will stagnate a gift that was given to them...LIFE....and life is change, change in attitudes, change in life styles...etc.

Here are some more things I've found that may help...


•Remember that your children and daughter in law have their own lives. If you want to see them, call and ask when they're available.
•Be flexible. For instance, if they can't see you on Christmas Day, then gracefully enjoy their company on Christmas Eve. Flexibility is a prime way to be a great mother in law.
•Ask "why" if your daughter in law asks you to change your behavior. Ask why to understand better, not to argue or defend yourself.
•Be patient if you experience hostility, suspicion, or distance from your daughter in law. Build a good relationship with your daughter in law by not reacting immediately to slights.
•Ask before you help with dinner, housecleaning, or rearranging the furniture. Building a good relationship with your daughter in law involves knowing your boundaries.
•Accept and learn about your daughter in law's generation, culture, nationality, age, and mindset – which is supposed to be different than yours!
•Sign a contract if you lend or borrow money from your son's wife.
•Talk openly, honestly, and humbly about miscommunications, arguments, or other conflicts with her. Talk about building a good relationship with your daughter in law and your experiences as a mother in law.
•Be responsive to your daughter in law's needs and feelings even if you don't understand them. Building a good relationship with your daughter in law is about empathy.
•Treat all your children equally – including your in-laws. A great mother in law is impartial and fair.
•Tell mother in law jokes!

I realize, there are some DIL's out there who are very evil as well as some really frumpy MIL's who are also evil and can't let go...and DIL's who keep they're children from they're grand parents are to me, well, that is dispicable...to use the children to hurt someone, let alone her own children...

There are also personality conflicts where two women are never going to see eye to eye....and are or never will be a good fit, however, there is no reason why the two of them cannot get along and be respectful and civil to each other when together...

But when you say hateful things, you can never retract those words...and I can tell you from the bottom of my heart...I said the most God awful horrible things about my DIL...and she was not one of those things.  I was angry, hurt and unable to see beyond my own feelings...I refused to realize, that she may have different perceptions and everything that happened, I built upon...and said, ahhh hah...see, there's another thing, she's trying to tell me she hates me, or she's telling me I'm not welcome, and she wasn't doing that at all...what she was doing was being herself and I took it so personally, I read into her behavior as a personal attack against me...that she was trying to drive a wedge between my son and myself. 
She thought I was doing the same thing to her...

As an inlaw, you do spend time with your kids...but it's never the same, and unfortunately, if DIL is close to her mother and father, and sibblings, they will go where she wants to be...probably more then the son's parents, b/c he wants to please her and make her happy.  It makes him feel successful when he sees her smile....

LIke I said before, I know MIL's whose DIL's call them a lot, and come visit them more then they're own parents...and some that can't due to distance between them...I don't expect anything from my son and his wife anymore...I can't....they are good to me when here, and she is very nice to me, and we have a good time, but anything more then what they can give me, I won't expect, b/c I never want them to feel like they have to come, or be with me...I know what that is like, and the more someone makes you feel like you have to be there, the less you will be there....

OUr son's are still the wonderful people we raised...and they still love us...you don't and can't turn love off....and they don't as much as any of us at one time would like to believe, however, there are some son's here who need to really stand up to they're wives and give they're parents quality time...and I blame them more then the DIL's, for allowing themselves to be manipulated or bullied into staying away, and whats worse, keeping the grand children away...


Again, none of us did anything wrong, we were just being ourselves, being a mom, maybe even some of us love our kids way to much, or think of our kids as our only purpose in life...especially if we don't work or never did...I believe working full time purposely estranges you from that perception...however, we didn't do anything wrong, what we did, was taken in the wrong way, by our DIL's...because she is a totally different culture then we are...she is her own person, with her very own habits and ways of doing things, she may have never been close to her parents, or very close to her parents...in my case, I wanted inlaws...and a large extended family...and pictured us all getting together...

What I did to eliviate the Christmas thing at two homes was, I hosted Christmas dinner myself and had both parents there...

boy for years, we ran around trying to spend time with each parent and it was horrible...horrible, and more tiring, plus we didn't get to have our own christmas, getting up in the pajamas, opening gifts as a family...and lounging around the house...it was the  most hectic horrible day of my life, and I used to go somewhere and really cry about it...I really hated Christmas, b/c I felt like I had to...and it wasn't fair...I wanted my own Chrismas in my home with my child...

I was on both ends of this, and perhaps that is maybe why it's easier for me to see it...however, it took me 12 long years to wake up....way to long...way to long...

[cremebrulee]

I wanted to add, that I rarely call my son and DIL, even when I'm home sick or not feeling well...I email them and let them take the lead...they have they're own lives...and are very busy....and I respect that...I know when they can they will write or call...and I would never ever again, call them and ask them if I could come down there to visit...I will wait for an invitation...with no expectations what so ever...it isn't that they wouldn't want me there, but they need quality time with they're own family...meaning, them and my GD...

Yes, it's true, my GD hardly knows me, and that is hard...however, I cannot base my whole life and happiness on that....when I hear my friends talk about having they're grand kids for sleep overs, yes, it hurts, and it also hurts that she knows my son's father's family more then me, but that is the choice I made when I cut them off....worse thing I could have ever done, however, at the time, I really believed I was doing what was best for all of us, not just me...it was a horrible time...anger was flaring and there was no telling me that I was wrong at the time...so, I'm certain, they needed that break as well...none of us liked it...but it was well needed...and it was for approximately 3 years...but we all grew in that time...there were losses...great ones...but now I'm able to accept that my life with them will never be the same but hold onto the fact that maybe in time, it will even be better, and if not, that's life...but I won't harbor any regrets now, or make them feel like they have to....that would start trouble all over again...and I never want to go back there, it was a very dark and despairing place. 

[cremebrulee]

Hey Creme.  You know how much I appreciate your input, but I have to agree with Guest1. I am not, & never have been a clingy Mom.  I knew that my sons would one day marry, & I would not be their first priority.  I accepted that fact long before they married.  What I didn't expect was to be pushed totally out of my sons lives.  Now maybe that was not the intent, but that sure is what it felt like.   
Sometimes Creme, it feels to me that you are using my situation with my dils as an example of what not to do in a relationship.  Believe me, I know I made a lot of mistakes, & I am trying to move forward. Trying not to repeat these mistakes.  I know you are just trying to share your wisdom, because you are very wise, but sometimes it does sound a little harsh.
I'm sorry Creme, I just feel that way sometimes.  It's hard cause your post have taught me a lot, I've learned from reading them, & I know you have a huge heart.   (((((hugs)))))     Anna.

Hi Anna, I'm not using anyone's experience as an example of what not to do, and I'm real sorry if I made you feel that way...what I am doing, is taking experiences that you've all written about and say, that I don't feel that way, here's how I see it...I know I probably should go into the thread you've all posted and posted my feelings there, but I honestly don't remember who said what, and that's the truth...I'm not saying your wrong, what I'm suggesting is, that perhaps this is what your DIL's view and insulting or hurtful...I don't know, I'm not living in your worlds...I can post a thought, and let you all take it from there, and you all know much better how you handle things then I do...
actually, you have more answers then I do...I'm trying to help you understand, that while you all are wonderful ladies...maybe, your DIL's are viewing your actions as intrusive or smothering...not that you are, but maybe that  is how she views it...b/c she was raised differently and has her own ideas about how she wants to live her life....with her husband....

Does that help at all or make sense...gosh I really really wish I could write like Luise...