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Water Wings

Started by keeponsmilin, June 13, 2010, 09:47:09 PM

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keeponsmilin

Interesting responses.

I know my dad extremely well and have a very close relationship with him.  He has a "date" with my two oldest ones every week and sees the whole family on a weekly basis as well.  As some of the other posters stated, I felt I needed to comment about the "gift" because we had come over for the purpose of swimming.  My older two kids are from a previous marriage, and they both used ww in Grandpa's pool.  My two little ones are from my current marriage, and of course things will be slightly different, because now I have an active, caring dad that wants to help me parent my kids.  The whole point of my question has been misunderstood by some.  I am confident that we (hubby and myself) handled the situation correctly.  I supported hubby's position, and hubby was gracious to my dad.  My point was why is it harder many times for women (both MIL and DIL)  If this had happened with the women in potential conflict, both sides would be fuming, talking about "hurt feelings" and being disrespected.  So my question remains, why is it easier (in most cases) for men to deal with in laws.  My hubby loves my parents and enjoys their company.  I have heard this time and time again from many DILS.  So I am trying to find out what is the difference?

cremebrulee

because men and women are totally different
women think and speak with a whole lot more emotion
women's feelings become hurt a lot quicker

and there is a huge difference in the world today, compared to when some of us were DIL's.


Sassy

Keeponsmilin, I think the difference is you.  You were supportive to your partner's feelings, and that love begat more love.
That's how marriage and family is supposed to work.  The gift of love fills in the gaps to smooth it out.

Like Scoop said, if you had ignored or discarded your DH's strong feelings on the matter, or pretended they didn't exist, it's possible he would have felt differently (ignored, disregarded, unimportant, a little unloved) and his reaction to having his feelings ignored may have reflected that. 

As a woman, when I feel my DH's love and support, I feel it makes me a better person.  I have the confidence to be gracious.  While we were dating, that look of empathy and gratitude DH would give me whenever his mother got hysterical about something I did (such as attending my co-workers shower without telling her first), spread from him
through me to her.   From his love, I could see her actions through his eyes, and have compassion for her pain instead of feeling attacked.  Love begets love.

Maybe love let your DH could see your dad, and his good intentions, through your eyes.  Maybe DH just likes and trusts your dad because the chemistry between them as two people works, and DH wouldn't have minded anyway.  Maybe DH always said he HATED water wings because he was actually rather tempted by them, and the gift was a perfect reason to indulge a guilty pleasure guilt-free.   

Pen

I, too, am not convinced that Keep's DH was gracious and loving due to an apologetic look Keep gave him. It sounds to me like he assessed his options and decided that pleasing his FIL was more important than his predjudice against a certain gift. In doing so he modeled kind, polite behavior to his child, as Creme said. IMO, this is all on DH; he's a grown man who made his own choices about his reactions to a situation.

Perhaps some DILs these days need extra reassurance from their DHs in order to behave politely. I would hope all DILs would have manners, but perhaps the struggle for respect and control has created a pendulum swing we haven't corrected yet. And on the MIL side, the same dynamic may be at play which is a set up for tension if not disaster unless all parties are willing to be aware and forgiving.
Respect ... is appreciation of the separateness of the other person, of the ways in which he or she is unique.
-- Annie Gottlieb

luise.volta

I'm with Creme - Have you read the old standby, " Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus" by John Gray? Sending love...
Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible. Dalai Lama

justus

I think it has to do with context. Let's face it, some people are very passive/aggressive and use gift giving occasions as an opportunity to make a point. Sometimes a gift isn't just a gift.

DH told me once that he preferred to deal with men because all their issues are right there for you to see, but women hide things, and do underhanded things to make a point. Sometimes you don't know they have a problem until it is too late to do something about it. I pointed out that this may be because he is a man and can read men more accurately than he can women. I think he has a point in that women tend to be less obvious than men are. While we snap and bite, they take care of things in a more direct manner.

So, a gift from a MIL, or a DIL might be rife with hidden messages while a gift from an FIL or SIL probably isn't. If it is inappropriate, it is most likely just cluelessnes instead of an intentional slight when coming from a man. And, lets face it, women tend to see these little slights even where there aren't any and take them to heart where guys are more likely to let it slide or to not see what is so obvious to a woman.

And, about gift giving...My mom was a master at giving gifts that were statements about how I sucked as a parent or as a daughter. No one else would guess at the meaning, an outsider would think she was being so generous, but we both knew what she was saying. When we got rid of cable and decided to drastically reduce the amount of TV viewing done in our house, she bought us a DVD player and each of the kids a personal TV/DVD player. She also took this as a judgment of her and refused to turn off the TV when we would visit even when it interfered with the visit. She taught me that you turn off the TV when you have company, but I guess we weren't worth that courtesy. When we decided to wait until Christmas to buy DS a BB gun instead of for his birthday because he needed to show us he was responsible enough to have one, she bought him one to keep at her house and I could go on and on with such examples. I regret smiling sweetly and thanking her for these gifts. It felt like thanking her for punching me in the gut. I let her undermine me as a parent and teach my children it was OK not to respect my decisions, and my children paid for my spinelessness.

While in general, the thing to do is smile sweetly and assume the best one one receives a clunker for present, but when the intent is to hurt or to make a point, there is no reason to sit and take such abuse. It is all about context.



Pen

Justus, I agree about context, but I still smiled and thanked DIL for an extremely cheap, unattractive holiday gift although I knew she'd spent way more effort on her mom and was letting me know how little she cared for me. I even made a point of actually wearing it to a function that she was attending, without any passive-aggressive agenda (honest.) I'm not likely to wear it otherwise, but it doesn't hurt me to wear it every now and then when she's around.
Respect ... is appreciation of the separateness of the other person, of the ways in which he or she is unique.
-- Annie Gottlieb

cremebrulee

Quote[quote author=justus
Sometimes a gift isn't just a gift.
So, a gift from a MIL, or a DIL might be rife with hidden messages while a gift from an FIL or SIL probably isn't. If it is inappropriate, it is most likely just cluelessnes instead of an intentional slight when coming from a man. And, lets face it, women tend to see these little slights even where there aren't any and take them to heart where guys are more likely to let it slide or to not see what is so obvious to a woman.

OMG, I don't believe this statement????  I mean no insult to you, I'm just so shocked that people would think this way??????? 

QuoteAnd, about gift giving...My mom was a master at giving gifts that were statements about how I sucked as a parent or as a daughter. No one else would guess at the meaning, an outsider would think she was being so generous, but we both knew what she was saying.

Now I see why you think the way you do?  Sad...I hate to say this, but your mother sounds like an extremely insecure and controlling woman....

Just Us, believe me, not all women think like this, maybe a few, however, trust me....most women in my circle consider giving gifts as generous way to say, I was thinking of you, saw this and thought of you....we also take a bottle of wine and/or flowers when invited to someone's home for dinner....there is no thing meant behind it other then love....


cremebrulee

Quote from: penstamen on June 15, 2010, 05:54:43 PM
Justus, I agree about context, but I still smiled and thanked DIL for an extremely cheap, unattractive holiday gift although I knew she'd spent way more effort on her mom and was letting me know how little she cared for me. I even made a point of actually wearing it to a function that she was attending, without any passive-aggressive agenda (honest.) I'm not likely to wear it otherwise, but it doesn't hurt me to wear it every now and then when she's around.

same thing with gifts given to grandchildren in the way of clothing.  I hated some of the stuff my Mil and mother bought for my son when he was little, however, I always made it a point to dress him in they're things when they were around, or to say, "look" "see" how nice he looks in those coverall's....etc.  It won't kill anyone to do that....

I just don't get this concept today, some people seem so unaware of the feelings of others...it's all about them...me, me, me, I want...sheesh...?  I don't mean anyone here, I'm just stating a fact of what I see going on out there....no wonder people retire?  Things change so drastically....

This country is in for a rude awakening, very soon....and I don't mean biblical...however, if you look back in history, when did every great nation fall?  When they became immoral and corrupt...well, this country is immoral and corrupt and we're broke, broke, broke.  Do you know that New York City is so broke, they were thinking about closing down all police stations, emergency personal and fire companies for 1 week to help recoup money???????  When are we going to stop and believe, that every single action, though, reaction, effects others in a negative or positive way.  Obama in his speech last night said, he'd like to print more stimulous money?????  They are continually printing money we don't have??????  It is unbelievable how greed has ruined this country....

I'm so sorry...but this all begins somewhere, and the stories I read in this forum, and the concept of some people????  Is it no wonder these things are happening...it's a trickle down affect, or ripple affect...and it all starts with greed, the inability of awareness and individuality....

Whew, OK, I feel better now....hope you guys don't mind me venting...

I guess what I'm saying is, if your leaders are corrupts, so to, will your people be...and we have exceeded what is corrupt....however, most of us don't even know whats really going on out there....we build these little protective plastic bubbles around our world, and ignore the real issues at hand....

I so pray for my grand daughter....


cremebrulee

Quote from: penstamen on June 15, 2010, 05:54:43 PM
Justus, I agree about context, but I still smiled and thanked DIL for an extremely cheap, unattractive holiday gift although I knew she'd spent way more effort on her mom and was letting me know how little she cared for me. I even made a point of actually wearing it to a function that she was attending, without any passive-aggressive agenda (honest.) I'm not likely to wear it otherwise, but it doesn't hurt me to wear it every now and then when she's around.

Good for you!!!!! that is the right thing to do....big hugs Pen

Creme

luise.volta

Over and over I have seen in my life that how I perceive something has little or nothing to do with the perceptions of others. Whenever I get to make a reality check, it is amazing to observe the webs l weave. Sending love...
Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible. Dalai Lama

justus

Pen, I know that most people are not like my mother. Despite her, I assume any gift is given with the best intentions and even if it is a bad gift, I smile and thank the person. Long ago when I was engaged to my xH, a neighbor who was an old woman who was not firing on all cylinders gave me a wedding gift she bought at a flea market she loved to visit. It was awful, but it was also precious because it came from her at a time when she could barely afford food. It made me cry. My xH hated it, but I displayed it anyway because it made me think of her and of home.  Even when my boss from he-double toothpicks gives me a gift that is a statement I smile and thank her and send a thank-you note. My refusal to play the game by simply not reacting or acknowledging the point she is trying to make usually drives her nuts. She is a bully and very much wants to see her punches hit their mark.

But, any gift from my sister is accepted with trepidation. Her gifts always have very long, thick strings attached and I will pay for it one way or another even after she asks for it back, which she will inevitably. She doesn't give gifts per say, she redistributes resources which she expects to be able to redistribute at a moments notice and if you aren't careful, she will redistribute all of your property along with what she originally "gave" you. Those pans she gave us as a wedding present 11 years ago? Well, we got a new set, so she expects us to send those pans to her DD who lives several hundred miles away. Oh, and am I using those champaign glasses she saw in my cabinet which have been in DH's family for three generations? Because if we aren't, her DD could use them. I won't even go into the great car debacle which caused lots and lots of drama.

It would be nice if everyone were generous and their gifts weren't sometimes wrapped in whatever issues the giver wants to press, but that isn't the real world. There are people like my Boss, my sister and mom who use any gift giving opportunity to take a swing at people. I would rather not receive anything from people like this. I have friends such as yours and treasure their gifts even more because of my bad gift experiences.

Pooh

June 16, 2010, 07:24:23 AM #27 Last Edit: June 16, 2010, 07:27:03 AM by Pooh
Keepsonsmilin, here's my take.  My husband comes in from a long day at work, grabs a beer from the fridge (he doesn't drink often).  I sit down beside him and say, "Oh honey, rough day at work? Want to tell me about it?  He looks at me perplexed and says, "Umm, no today was a good day at work.  Why would you say that?"  Of course, in my woman brain I am thinking, "Yeah, right...you come straight in and grab a beer.  To me, that says stressful day.  Like I can't see that...geesh. I know better."  "Well honey, you grabbed a beer immediately so I know something is bothering you."  He looks at me, looks at the beer and says, "Well, no, I just wanted a beer."

I think we as women, tend to try to rationalize people's behavior and "we know" there has to be a reason for it.  My hubby, simply wanted a beer.  No reason, he wanted it.  I think men are much more straight forward and don't go all Psychologist on everything.  They take things at face value and we tend to want to know the "Why" behind it. 

Who's right?  No one.  We are just different and I am trying to learn that people are who they are and they don't always have a hidden agenda.  Now some people do, but that doesn't mean I have to feed it.  Most men, just simply take most things at what is said.  I am learning from my husband that life it too short to analyze everything someone says and does, and to let more things go.  He is learning from me that sometimes, issues do need to be addressed and solved.  Great balance between us.

We are all here, doing it right now.  Yes, we support each other, yes it is great to get opinions and simply to vent sometimes, but truly we sit here and type our analysis on issues and the "hidden messages."  If my husband had read this story, he would have said, "So what color were the WW?"  Lol.....
We must let go of the life we have planned, so as to accept the one that is waiting for us. -
Joseph Campbell

cremebrulee

justus
well I'm going to give you a gift, with no strings attached, and I don't know where you live....

here are a whole bunch of big hugs....

I'm so sorry that innocence and joy was taken from you by these people....the joy of receiving is as precious as giving...

sometimes we get carried away giving, that we forget, receiving a gift gives the giver so much joy...my foster mom, loved to give, give, give, but hated it when someone gave her something, which so took the joy out of giving.  Once I told her, when you refuse a gift, or when Mother's Day is coming, and you tell all of us, not to get you anything, your taking that same joy away from us, that you get out of giving, and it's not fair...I think she understood...

but before any holiday, and before anything was even said, she'd always say, "now don't get me anything" and that really hurt me....

but Justus...believe me, not every woman is like your boss or your mother or sister....and I'm so sorry you've been made to know and feel like this....

Please know, we here love you for who you are and expect nothing of you.....

Creme

cremebrulee

Quote from: Pooh on June 16, 2010, 07:24:23 AM
Keepsonsmilin, here's my take.  My husband comes in from a long day at work, grabs a beer from the fridge (he doesn't drink often).  I sit down beside him and say, "Oh honey, rough day at work? Want to tell me about it?  He looks at me perplexed and says, "Umm, no today was a good day at work.  Why would you say that?"  Of course, in my woman brain I am thinking, "Yeah, right...you come straight in and grab a beer.  To me, that says stressful day.  Like I can't see that...geesh. I know better."  "Well honey, you grabbed a beer immediately so I know something is bothering you."  He looks at me, looks at the beer and says, "Well, no, I just wanted a beer."

I think we as women, tend to try to rationalize people's behavior and "we know" there has to be a reason for it.  My hubby, simply wanted a beer.  No reason, he wanted it.  I think men are much more straight forward and don't go all Psychologist on everything.  They take things at face value and we tend to want to know the "Why" behind it. 

Who's right?  No one.  We are just different and I am trying to learn that people are who they are and they don't always have a hidden agenda.  Now some people do, but that doesn't mean I have to feed it.  Most men, just simply take most things at what is said.  I am learning from my husband that life it too short to analyze everything someone says and does, and to let more things go.  He is learning from me that sometimes, issues do need to be addressed and solved.  Great balance between us.

We are all here, doing it right now.  Yes, we support each other, yes it is great to get opinions and simply to vent sometimes, but truly we sit here and type our analysis on issues and the "hidden messages."  If my husband had read this story, he would have said, "So what color were the WW?"  Lol.....

Wonderful post....very much enjoyed reading this...thank you Pooh.