How to Love Adult Children Unconditionally

[Hope]

Thanks for the great input, everyone!  Speaking of four footed angels, my DH and I were dog-sitting our granddogs Friday through today.  It was the first time in five years we were given the opportunity from ds/dil to watch their dogs (it has always been bestowed on dil's parents even though I have offered).  In a much earlier post I mentioned that I hoped we would not be promoted to dogsitters and our dil's parents promoted to babysitters in mid July when our first gc is expected to make his/her appearance.  Anyway, I was so preoccupied with our granddogs that I didn't check the forum till now.  Our granddogs took us on about 15 walks during their stay (we don't have a fenced in yard) and my legs are sore from bracing myself from being thrown into a 100 mph walk (they are both pretty big dogs).  I agree with Luise that pets have unconditional love mastered. 
Your various responses were very interesting.  Even though the priest's advice carries wisdom, I think in order to have a healthy relationship the give and take must go both ways.  I understand that sometimes the only choice we have if we want to stay in a relationship is to give, give, give.  I also agree that it is very difficult for people to make changes in themselves and you will most likely be disappointed if you expect them to do so.  At least my sister/bil's son and dil are being kind to them now.  They may not offer to help them in return for their good deeds, but at least they visit with them more when they are in town and they send them flip videos of their gc and extend an occasional invitation for them to visit (however, they expect my sister/bil to stay in a hotel even though they have two spare bedrooms).  Things have improved for them and if it keeps improving who knows what may transpire?  Maybe even a HEALTHY relationship?  We can only hope.   
I agree that expectations play a big role in our satisfaction in a relationship.  I find myself expecting common courtesy or good citizenship from people in general and get let down all the time.  My expectations from our ds/dil have pretty much fallen to zip so I have not had my feelings hurt for a while.  I know it will be difficult to control my expectations once our gc is here.  That's a love that just might spin out of control.  I will probably be looking to lean on you ladies a lot once that little bundle is here.
I loved hearing your opinions on this topic and am open to hearing others if anyone else would like to share.  You are amazing women!  Thanks for sharing your wisdom.
Hugs, Hope

[Nana]

Hope:

I think so very much like you do.  To have a healthy relationship is about giving and taking (at least some).    My expectations on my children are not very high.  My married son is very sweet though sometimes unthoughtful.  I give much more than I take and I have no problem with it.  At least when I take some, it makes me very happy.   Our children will pay it forward to their own chjildren.  It is a law of life.    After a tortuous relationship with my dil, things started to straighten up.  Now, things are pretty good.  My dil comes to me with a big smile , she is much more relaxed, she says thank you and is not so picky anymore.  As long as I dont give her children (my grandkids) with candy or chocolates, she is fine with what I do.    But as sweet Luise said.... In not expecting nothing from our sons/dil, yet  there is a line.  I do expect some things and will not settle for less.  What is that I expect?  Respect, appreciation for what we do (hubby and me), liberty to take our grandchildren out while in our care.  That is what we have now and I thank God everyday for this opportunity.    What we dont do:  We do not visit if not invited.  We do not try to advice them on how to manage their lives or that of our dear grandchildren.  We do not call their home or their cellulars if we do not have something important to tell them.    What do we give:  Everything we have.  Our love, babysitting as they wish (sometimes it is much too often ja ja), they come to have lunch with us at least saturday or sunday or both days.  We are attentive to their financial needs and we jump up to help them, we are constantly buying things for the kids (clothes and toys).  You name it.    So it not too much to have a little expectations from them.  As Luise says....we are human.   


There was a time when I just gave, gave and give again.  But I got nothing.  Well, I did....I got hit, hit and hit again.  I did snap... And having snap worked for me.  I took off...  I quit.  I said NO MORE.    ENOUGH.  And that, thank God... changed my dil attitude towards us.  I really got lucky.   When she spoke to me about the problems, I said to her. "" How have I offended you?  What have we done wrong?  When have we interfere in your lives ?  When were we all over you?  We just step in when you needed our help.  I added Ï only wanted ÿou to let me be your children'S  grandmother. 

HOPE:  yOU will  get all these dellis of life that we need and deserve from our children.  When the little bundle arrives...you will certainly get to  savor the joy of being a grandmother. 

expectations....cant live without them!

I hope the best for you.

[cremebrulee]

Hope, this approach is how my DH handles our situation with DS & DiL and it works for him. He's always saying "Let's be grateful for what we do have with DS & DIL instead of comparing what we get with what DIL's family gets." When I listen to him and follow the same advice it works for me too, mostly. There are days when it catches up to me and I mourn what was and what might have been. When I feel envious or hurt, or my sense of justice flares up, I'm miserable. I feel sorry for myself as well as petty and whiney, which just makes it worse.

It's a trade-off, I guess, and the pay-off is time with DS, DIL & GC. To get it we must let go of our need for fairness and our expectations. It's so difficult; I'm impressed by your sister and her DH for making it work. Thanks for sharing their story.

Pen, I'm sending hugs...I think when Our sons get married, we expect things to stay the same...we expect that our DIL's are going to be just like our sons, love and respect us unconditionally...
We also have dreams and huge expectations that, now we have a larger family, however, we forget that "the person" our son's marry is they're own individual person, with a family to...

When our expectations are not met, or when we're hurt or let down, b/c they spend so much time with her family and/or friends...well, it hurts, and then we become angry...jealous, etc...

I've experienced the very same thing with my son and his father and step mother....so I know that kind of hurt and disappointment...

then, there is also her mother and step father to consider as well...so, it's hard for them, however, I will give them credit....they attempt to make the rounds when they do come home...and I tell you, true, they are to be commended for that....must be awfully hectic for them....but they do seem to enjoy it....otherwise, they wouldn't come home....

But, I do know and understand your feelings Pen....I do.

[Pen]

Thanks, Creme..I'm really trying to let the little things go. And there are a lot of little things! This past visit did contain a bit of criticism, and I didn't bite although obviously I was aware of it since I'm mentioning it now, LOL. I completely forgot about using "Is that so" as a response; I'll have to write it on my calendar next time

Thanks for understanding and for the hugs. Back atcha!

[kathleen]

Luise makes an excellent point that taken to the nth degree, we sometimes cannot love and accept unconditionally.  Luise, I hate to use that overworked word "abusive" but it seems your ex would qualify in that category.  At the least he was disloyal and deceitful and you decided to have no further expectations of him at all vis a vis leaving the situation.  Having "no expectations" to you at that time did not mean sitting around accepting what he had done (and might have done again.)

Here's one thing I have been thinking about and these posts brought it back to mind:

What are these parents teaching their children, our grandchildren, about how to treat people, if one set of inlaws is so favored over another?   My husband says that given five more years, my granddaughter will be "just like her mother and not someone I want to know." What do you all WWUers think of this?  Children follow examples, don't they?  Will my granddaughter become a liar, a spenthrift, a manipulator, and a person who takes real pleasure in cruel behavior toward others?  Will she do the same thing to her husband that my DIL is doing to my son?  (Again, and each time I write of this please know I do not hold my son blameless for what has happened.) 

Sometimes I think my DIL would make a great Lifetime movie:  a sociopathic Elizabeth Taylor-like beauty who charms and then disarms, stabs behind the back whenever possible, and enjoys extorting money from her in-laws. 

I agree about no expectations and have come to that point.  At the same time, I do not accept my DIL's behavior and my husband two years ago reached a breaking point of inability to tolerate it.  We can leave it be, we can even go on loving our son from a distance, but to us that does not mean that we participate in, continue to accept and therefore support DIL's sociopathic behavior.

Baskets of flowers to you Hope, I keep my fingers crossed all this works out for the best.

Kathleen

[luise.volta]

You know, Kathleen, it's always been a mystery to me regarding what role models are picked. Great kids (and eventually wonderful adults can come from a home full of pretty nasty examples. Maybe there are children who can discern that the available examples are not to be followed. It's a "puzzlemnt," isn't it? Keep you fingers crossed!

[Hope]

Kathleen,
Thanks for the good wishes. 
I've seen what Luise wrote about happen as well.....people living with poor examples and rising above it.  Creme wrote about her experience - being determined not to be like her biological mom.  I hope and pray that your granddaughter has more exposure to you so she can have a good example to emulate.  Oh, and thanks so much for the basket of flowers - mmmmmmmmmm, they smell fragrant!
Hugs, Hope

[kathleen]

Luise and Hope,

I hope you are right and my granddaughter will turn out to be a good person.  However, she is so saturated in my DIL's family that I don't think there will be another influence ever allowed.  Her other grandparents lived with them for two years then bought a condo very close.  Every weekend is filled with family events.  If children learn what they live, as that poem goes, she will be a super clone.

I also thought about something in relation to your comments about religion and tolerance, Luise.  I have come to see this one-sided cutoff business as a form of bigotry similar to mistreating others simply because of their religion, the color of their skin, or any other reason unconnected to who we really are as human beings.  What else can you say about people who practice terrible unfairness toward in-laws simply because they ARE in-laws and not related to the family by blood?

Flowers,

Kathleen

[kathleen]

Yes, Anna, we are related to our gc, but my three-year-old granddaughter is not the one doing the cutoff.  It's my DIL and son, mainly DIL.  In the beginning my son tried to include us far more but I think he has just given up.

Also, my son in all this was adopted and I have often wondered if that is a factor in any of this.  I wonder if it was a mistake to have an adopted
child with two biological children, if that made it harder for him.  However, his genetic makeup includes a biological father and mother who walked out on him at birth---and both were highly educated (Ph.d and a Master's degree) and certainly not desperate financially.  I wonder if there's a gene for abandonment. 

I do see what you mean,

Kathleen

[kathleen]

Anna, wow, you are giving me hope. How wonderful your husband must be to have overcome so much in his childhood to turn into a great man.
Maybe it IS possible our granddaughter will arrive on our doorstep one day wanting to know us.  Maybe she WON'T turn out to be a clone of her mother and other grandmother.  I hope.

Good for you that you married such a terrific human being. 

I don't know what to say about your MIL making negative comments about your husband's father.  My parents were divorced and my mother used to do this, too, and it always hurt me.   Yet I somehow never had the courage to ask her to stop.

My husband researched studies on adoption and the latest studies show that genetic factors are more prominent than environment in the way personalities develop and mature (or don't.)  A study of separated twins showed incredible similarities, even though the twins had individually been raised in completely different environments. Of course, a negative environment can certainly influence and bring out the worst.  Food for thought,

Kathleen

[Pooh]

We can leave it be, we can even go on loving our son from a distance, but to us that does not mean that we participate in, continue to accept and therefore support DIL's sociopathic behavior.

Kathleen, that has got to be the most 'eye-opening' statement that has reached me yet on this site.  Thank you very much for putting into one sentence how I have been feeling.

[Pooh]

Anna, I know exactly what you mean.   I used to make excuses but then I ended up feeling resentment towards her because I felt like she was putting me in situations that I had to make her excuses and I felt like I was a liar (and I hate liars).  It finally dawned on me that she wasn't doing it to me, I was doing it to myself.  Yes, she was creating the situation, but I was choosing to make excuses for her actions.  And in my soul-searching I realized I had done that for my ex-husband for 20 years.  I always made excuses to family, friends and his own sons for his irresponsibilities.  I was repeating a pattern.  I did it.  No one made me.

Now, I don't make excuses for her, but yet it comes off that I am bad-mouthing her.  I still haven't figured out how to not make an excuse, but not sound negative about it.  I tried to say something like, "I'm not sure why they are not here, you will have to ask them", and that came out like I didn't care what they were doing.  "I really don't know," comes out as I don't care and I am lying because I do know.  So I am still struggling with what to say.  Everything I can think of either sounds callous, another excuse or if I tell the truth, it would be bad-mouthing her.  And I don't want to do that either.  Maybe someone here can give us a good statement to use? 

And you are right Anna.  People figure it out on their own eventually and come to their own conclusions no matter what we say.

[Pen]

This has been tricky for me as well. DIL doesn't want to see our friends, so I've had to disinvite them to celebrations at the last minute when DS & DIL have suddenly decided to show up for something they'd previously declined to attend. When DS & DIL had just gotten married I would say, "We're working on building a relationship with DIL, and things have been tense lately. Thank you for understanding." I can't use this excuse forever, and I don't want to hurt my friends feelings. These are people who have loved and supported DS all his life.

[Pooh]

Right there with you Pen.  I was saying, "You know how newlyweds are?" for a while, but that one's time is up.  And you are in a tough situation.  I can understand where you are taking any opportunity to see DS, but hate having to hurt lifelong friends to do it.   I truly do understand wanting to see DS, because I am that way too because I see him so rarely now. 

How unfair and selfish they are being.  Now this is where I am constantly learning, and this forum has helped me see much of it.  I am going to have to take a stand at some point and so are you.  We are going to have to get through our thick, loving skulls that we can't change them, no matter hard we want to.  But that doesn't mean we allow them to run over us and abuse our love for them.  And that is my reality check for the day. 

When you have to do this, are you truly enjoying the time with them or feeling bad, hurt and resentful because you know you possibly hurt your friend's feelings to do it?  I am only asking this because that is what I do.  I cooperate with DIL's demands to get to see DS and then end up feeling bad the entire time, or afterwards because of what I had to do to cooperate. 

[Hope]

June 1st quote from Nana:
"HOPE:  yOU will  get all these dellis of life that we need and deserve from our children.  When the little bundle arrives...you will certainly get to  savor the joy of being a grandmother."

Nana - so sorry for the delay in responding to your thoughtful reply.  I read your entire post with interest and I'm happy that things have improved for you after drawing the line with your ds/dil.  Sometimes I think we are "tested" to see how we will allow others to treat us.  You passed the test with flying colors! 
Our gc is due in a little over two weeks.  Our dil looks as cute as can be as she nears her due date and I hope and pray that her delivery is as uncomplicated and painless as possible.  She has been more emotional due to the pregnancy and her hormones playing havoc with her.  I'm excited to experience first hand the joy many of you have described and I'm trying not to hold my expectations too high for fear of let down.
I'll keep you all posted.
Hugs, Hope