Where has my DD gone ?

[artlady]

My DD continues to baffle and confuse me on her new ways. Again this is the DD that has always been on top of holidays, birthdays and family events for 31 years to someone that seems now to not care , recognize or is just aloof to what is happening in the world around her ( outside of her own doors). She told me mid week they were trying to decide to come on Sat or Sunday for Father's Day ( now remember they didn't come for mother's day, I've yet to get the card she said she mailed) . Now they decided to come next Sat ( (I'm sure it had to do with the SIL's dad/ stepmom's activities , his brother and/ or stepmom's son/ grandkids , as DD said they wanted to avoid SIL's brother ) . Anyhow we had another grandson here for 4 days , of whom they have never met so DH had the weekend off , but I"m not sure about his weekend for next weekend. She called him but while he was at work and couldn't talk. She had sent message 7am saying she was callling in a bit ( to him and me ) ,i had told her he went in at 1:00, she had time to catch him but she didn't call . Her messages are soooooo sweet and loving but her actions don't match her words. I'm truly concerned about her , this is not my child, friends and family can't understand ,this is not the girl they knew either. She has disconnected from some long time friends , now when she needs as much support as possible from all with a husband that may be facing a bad out come but hopefully not . It is like she is on her own island and the rest of the world doesn't exist.I"m totally perplexed as to who she is , what to do and if there is something I can do to help her through this phase. She has been a wonderful dd but I've watched her disappear now for the last 2 years . I feel the distance between us , with the baby she seems to have really changed. Many have said they think it might be post partum depression or she is under strain ( has been before baby too )from the SIL from mental and emotional abuse . Everyone misses the fun , out going , happy DD we all use to know , now where has she gone and can we find her again is the question . Anyone have any suggestions or gone through this to know the signs. thanks

[Scoop]

Oh my Artlady!  I really feel like you need to take a step back from your DD's life.  It just doesn't sound to me like you have all the information needed to be making all of these assumptions, i.e. that she's driven off her friends or that her and her DH are "facing a bad outcome' (which I understood as you thinking they might divorce).

She has a new baby and that has ROCKED her world.  And it's true, your perceptions shift a LOT when you have a baby.  Old friends who are not supportive or who are in a different phase of life DO get left behind.  (one of my friends was childless and  they wanted nothing to do with US after our DD was born.  Realistically, this made sense, I was focused on the baby and was no longer "fun".)  Father's Day and Mother's Day are no longer about your parents, they're about YOU and your spouse.

You have to decide what kind of parent you're going to be, and often you have to defend your choices (i.e. crying it out).  If your baby doesn't sleep then sleep becomes like CRACK for you, you'll do anything to get it.  And if someone wakes the baby, they'd better run far and fast.  (My line was "You wake my baby and I'll gut you with a rusty knife!  ... Don't laugh, I *HAVE* a rusty knife!")

And yes, you do argue with your spouse.  Your hormones are wacky, especially if you're nursing the baby.  Because then, you have a hormonal attachment too.  If my DH was holding the baby and she cried, I would have a full body reaction and would say "What did you do to her?"  Now, luckily, he's easy-going, and I was able to apologize and explain to him WHY I reacted like that.  I was also able to explain to him that *this* time, of me being more "into" the baby than into him, of me being hormonally attached to the baby ect, this time would pass.  And since he is SO mellow, he rode it out and we were good.  Can you imagine the same confrontation with a DH who is LESS easy-going - it could be disaster.  Hopefully your SIL will be able to realize that this is a short season in his life and will be able to ride out this rough patch.

Artlady,  to some extent, I think you need to give your DD a "pass" on all of this because she's a new mom.  Some parts of her old personality may return, but please accept that she may be like this for a couple of years, or maybe permanently.

However, I think that most of it is really none of your business (especially her friendships and her relationship with her husband).  You can offer support and help, but you can't give advice or opinions unless you're specifically asked for them.  Even then, you should keep it neutral "I'm sure you'll do what's best dear."

For example: if DD calls you to complain about her DH.  Say she's venting HARD about him and you say "Well, why don't you leave him then?"  You will never hear about the apology or the fact that they "made up", but if she tells him that you urged her to leave him, THAT is what will be remembered.

I hope this doesn't sound too harsh, but I just really believe that you're too involved and you need to take a step back.  And if you can't practice acceptance, then practice avoidance.

[jdtm]

I agree with Scoop.  I also think your statement

she is under strain ( has been before baby too )from the SIL from mental and emotional abuse

might also be a major part of this situation. 

But it really doesn't matter - there's nothing you can do about it except trust in your daughter and support her.  Those of us who tried to "help" know that the results of this "help" is usually misunderstood and often leads to partial or total estrangement.  How I wish I could have done what Scoop suggests - "And if you can't practice acceptance, then practice avoidance." - so much less pain and suffering.  She is your daughter for your entire life but she is your "child" for only a short time.  That phase is over and to "let go" is very, very difficult (especially when there are major problems - some we might even be able to solve).  But, it is her life and her path and her decisions.  And as Dr. Phil says "when you choose the behaviours, you also choose the consequences".

[Pooh]

I agree with the others that you do need to step back and let it be.  She needs to figure out her own life and make her own decisions regarding her DH and family.  I don't agree that you have to sit around and wait on her to visit and make plans.  Telling anyone that you will be there on so and so day and then change it at the last minute is rude when they do it continuously.  Yes, everyone has things happen, but if it's a pattern, then it's rude.  You can't change that about her but you can change if you will accept it.  Make your own plans and don't change them for them.  If what they want to do fits in your schedule, then fine, but if not, tell them it doesn't work for you.

And this is just my philosophy, I also don't agree with Father's Day and Mother's day is no longer about your parents.  The day does belong to them now but parents can still be included, even if it's only a phone call or text.  We may not be the focal point any longer in our AC's lives, but we are still a Mother and Father.  I still call/visit all my parents on those holidays, or around then, and get a card/small gift for them.  I want them to know that even though I live my own life, they are still loved and appreciated for being my parents.  My "parenting" role is over, but not the fact that am still their Mother.  I don't buy into the whole either/or when it comes to relationships.  There are ways to include everyone that do not take much effort.

[Scoop]

I don't know Pooh, I still think that they deserve a "pass" this year, because it's their FIRST Mother's Day / Father's Day.  And really, when you have a small baby, your plans have to be fluid.  If they didn't sleep, or are feeling under the weather, or just had a poop-ageddon diaper, sometimes that nap, or that bath have to take precedence over other people's 'feelings'.

I think that we should make the same deal about Mother's Day and Father's Day as we do about Valentine's Day.  We know it's a commercial holiday, where people are expected to spend $$ to show love.  But we all wish that our loved ones would appreciate us the REST of the year, instead of just on *THAT* day.

So Artlady, give them time and see how they treat you and DH the rest of the year (except for this year, this year I think they should get a 'pass').

[artlady]

I"ve been doing good with the avoidance and acceptance. My new thinking is not to have expectations just be pleasantly surprised.  I know better than to offer advice or suggestions when not asked, have seen too many get hammered. I always listen and only reply with " I'm sure things will turn out fine etc" .I've not visited as much to give her space ( she is only 70 miles away) and I've only seen the baby 7 (in 5 months) times and that includes the hospital. I do think the "cry out " has worked for them , at first I was afriad of it but now I'm glad for her as it seems to be working out great. This decline in her personality started with the marriage , no I don't see or want a divorce , what i referred to was the outcome of this new medical issue for SIL as it is rare and consults are going on between Duke and Mayo , so I'm very worried this might be a life changing problem for all of them. I"m a cancer survivor myself so medical issues are of great conern for me when it comes to others. As far as special days , all families treat them differently , new traditions for new couples are important but also when everyone can celebrate parts of it as a family in some way makes them even more special. I have no problem with new traditions as I was young once and I do remember those times. If i was the only one that sees this change or is concerned then i would say I was an over active mother but too many are concerned so that is why I'm so worried. To explain this is a girl that modeled in college as a part time job. She has always taken pride in her looks, clothes and style . She worked in a very professional setting and looked the part . Now there are days she doesn't dress or take a shower. When I have visited sometimes she is in her pj's all day, even when she has slept from 7:30 til 5 as baby has . The last visit the first day she never dressed , the next day she took a shower, didnt' dry her hair, just wadded it in a bun on her head, put on some non ironed sloppy clothes , no make up and out to lunch we went. She would have never done this before . Now she is upset or cut off contact with all of her bridesmaids for one reason or another. Her maid of honor has been her best friend for 31 years, joined at the hip, she got mad at her , sent her a blazing email over a photo shoot schedule for baby ( her friend does this on the side from teaching and lives 100 miles away, photo shoot never happened either). Her college roommate is getting married in 3 months to a cousin we introduced her to at one of DD;s parties, she use to come by before and after baby but no more and DD has yet to go to one of her parties ( they live in the same town and parties have been within 5 miles of her house . ) Not sure but we think she turned her down to be in wedding( maybe due to expense and SIL isn't a social person doens't like social events). Her work buddy that was in the wedding she got mad out about a person at work ( DD is working from home ) so now she took her off her fb friends list and has no contact with her . The friend( that introduced them , very close to until now) who was in the wedding along with her husband, she is not happy with and they dont' see them much, when I'm there she is very critical about her and how she rises her kids ( 3 and 5). So I'm just perplexed on this shutting so many out , with a new baby, a husband with a rare medical condition , she might need lots of support in the future and where will they be ? I want to help but I'm not putting my nose in it , this is a look from the outside , venting here as this is the only place I can as I"m not going to say anything to her as not sure what all is going on or how things are in that house . She has enough on her plate so i'm not going to dare add anymore by upsetting her with my thoughts , H--- no , no way. I come from a family that keeps things to themselves until their dying days and if they ever say anything it might be some of their last words. I know having a baby changes things but to see this drastic a change it as big concern for me and add it to the previous changes i just hope she is not in a type of depression as there are times when with her , it is like there is something on her mind she wants to discuss but doesn't , she leads up to things but never quiet gets there or finishes it . So I just don't know . I'm giving her lots of space , time and finding her way but on the other side I hope I"m not missing a cry for help , as she  becomes more and more isloated from the outside world.

[Footloose]

Artlady,  I can tell how this burdens you.  My heart goes out to you as you only want for her to be happy.  While there is nothing you can do at this point except hope for the best, it hurts!  Her happiness comes from within her now and it always has, really.

Motherhood can be humbling and maybe she is figuring out that the dress and primping are not needed and are too time consuming.  She is keeping up with hygiene and maybe that's all that can be expected as she is figuring out her new role.  Maybe she just feels icky and fat, hormonal and exhausted. 

She may think that no one really wants to see her, just the new baby.  She is no longer the "queen",  baby is and that can be hard to accept for some women.  I know when I went to full time work at home 10 years ago, my fashion went down hill too.  i now wear clothes that are more active and comfy and hardly ever wear make up.  Thinking I will stop dying my hair too.  Heck, I was made to look how i do and I really don't care about trends and fashion anymore.  Maybe it's because I no longer have to fit in in corp America?

Keep giving her space and time will reveal if this is temporary or just her growing into the woman and mom she is at this time?

Hugs!  <3 

[artlady]

Thanks so much for you kind words FL.  I know the fashion etc part is fine and she doesn't have time to do all of it anymore, staying home there is no need to be stylish. She did comment the last visit when she got back in the car , why did you let me go out looking like this ? I guess she saw herself in a mirror or glass but I thought that is how she wanted to go so I didn't comment. I love her no matter how she looks. She is not fat , she the 40 pounds in the first 2 months , you can't tell she has had a baby, tall and thin ( except her boobs are still big as she is nursing ). All I hope and want is her happiness and that I"m not missing a cry out , hope she reunites with her old friends and doesn't become a hermit in her own home . I'm moving on doing things , but it still doesn't stop my mind from worrying about her all  the time . I've made a huge "to do " list for the summer and I"m going to do it if it kills me   lol. So going to do some right now . thanks for understanding and hugs back to you .

[Doe]

Lots of good advice here (seems to me).  AL, maybe you could consider that yes, this person you are dealing with is your daughter's new persona.  She isn't going back to being the girl you knew as she was growing up.   Instead of viewing her through that old filter,can you, as you said,  just really truly not have any expectations and just be pleasantly surprised with the person in front of you? 

Is there something that you could do personally to move yourself away from that standard that you have in mind for her? 

[artlady]

Doe I have no problem seeing a different person in her , my concern is that it is truly a new person or is there an underlaying problem that is a mystery to all that know her . I am a firm believer in having that very close or best friend (s) as they r there for you regardless of what is going on in your life and you for them. If she is cutting off from those and her family what happens when things are really rough , who will she turn to ? Women talk out their problems where most men hold them in so just like this site we turn to each other . My concern is she won't have any of it . If his medical issues get worse where is her support group coming from ? I've loved watching her growth through the years , she has really been amazing and the phases in her life have all been a joy to watch. I"m very proud of who she is and who she has become , watching  her as a mother is so sweet and she is an excellent mother. i just am worried about her well being more than anthying . As a mother I'll always be there for her thru thick and thin I just want to feel I'm not putting too much distance and avoidance there  trying to allow her to find her way when really she needs a big hug from mom sometimes to feel OK.she texts and emails all day every day , so she wants the contact. thanks again

[Doe]

I understand what you're saying.  My son transformed from "my son" into "my DIL's husband" and I hardly recognize him when he does get in touch.  All his life long friends are not life long friends anymore.

My question is - what if it is something deeper, a more mysterious problem that she's hiding from everyone who loves her?   If she's not giving you access, there isn't much you can do except what you are doing. It sounds like you are there for her in spades and she really appreciates that if she she texting/emailing a lot.  Maybe you just need to hear that you're doing all you can do, mama.

I just read on the Legacy Pjt website, one old dad wrote that the best gift we can give our kids is our time and attention.  He likened children to clams - you never know when they are going to open up and spill some important information.  From what you wrote, you are there and she knows you are there and so the framework is there to help her if she needs you.

Would it work for you to just trust your daughter to let you know if she needs more than you're giving?

[artlady]

Oh I think she knows , she has called me in the middle of the night with boyfriend problems crying in the past. She even called me early in their relationship when they (SIL) broke up or had a fight , she wanted me to come up the next morning , she talked to me off and on the rest of the night , needless to say i was without sleep and we didn't get much the next night. She has had other things go on , from money to car etc , now who does she call  "" mama"" to the rescue . I think now she wants to prove to herself , me and others that she is her own person , she is independent and can it alone. Yahooooooooooo , no more crazy hour calls but then just hope that it isn't a big cover up. If she gets my trait , I was able to hide a bad marriage ( 1st) from everyone but the one who had my number and I didn't think she did was my mom. After he was killed in a car accident ( DD was 2) I was able to tell her but of course she let me know she had figured a few things out except for the physical abuse she wasn't so sure that was going on , when in fact it was . So I learned early how to hide things from everyone very very good . I do hope she doesn't get that trait from her mom, who still does it . LOL  ( my marriage is great this time )

[Doe]

. So I learned early how to hide things from everyone very very good . I do hope she doesn't get that trait from her mom, who still does it . LOL  ( my marriage is great this time )

Ahh. There's the rub!  Glad to hear the 2nd one is a keeper.

[artlady]

Got a new look at it , pretend you go to bed wishing you were smaller, let's say you are 75 pounds over weight ( i know I could lose 50).  You dream you lost the weight and when you wake up you did lose the weight you  are 75 less, in shock, no clothes to wear and don't' know what happened from one day to the next that caused the weight to drop off. That is how i feel i went to bed knowing my DD and woke up , she is totally gone . ( just thinking back and being reminded as I clean out drawers , closets etc. ) of the piles of cards and sweet notes we have from her ( from when she left for college until she married) thanking us for something we did , or for supporting her , for listening etc etc. to the one now that can't send even a holiday card of any kind .  So this is a shocker dream  , now hope that helps describe it better, now got to go find all those new clothes for this new skinny me  LOL  . Soon maybe I'll get a size down or two to shop for new  lol

[Footloose]

Gosh, AL, I understand!  i too "lost weight"  175lbs to be exact! (my DS)  LOL!  but I cry on the inside too!

I do not recognize my son either.  Invasion of the body snatchers? Bottom line is that according to the way they are, we have to butt out!  Any interaction is considered interference.  So we watch, we worry, we honor their separation, take our crumbs and...we wait....but are ever present as we do love them so.

We gave them life but they are the ones living it!  Still hurts but we have to separate and let them "fly".  Even when they crash at times, we cannot guide them any longer.

Hugs! <3

They alone own their destiny......