when is it ok?

[2chickiebaby]

Penstamen,
Such true words...thank you.

[doormat]

Personally I don't think an inlaw relationship is any different to any relationship in our lives.  If you are empowered and strong you know how you should be treated.  Asking someone to suck it up and put up with someone because "that's just the way she is" is no different from telling a wife she should stay with a husband who abuses her.  Who among us would suggest that?

My answer to that's just the way she is, is that this is the way I am, I don't believe I deserve to be belittled and bullied, so I won't!  I wouldn't care if it was my mother in law or my son doing it.  Blood has nothing to do with it.

YES!  You have a way with words!  I absolutely refuse to take poor treatment from anyone whether they're related or not. 

[RedRose]

Poor treatment (short of any abuse) can be worked on...if you want any kind of a relationship with that other person. If your willing to anything is possible.

But I also believe that family is the most important relationship in my life...my family is worth it.

[Postscript]

RedRose both parties have to be willing to work on the relationship.  As the song goes, it takes two.  If the other party carries on with the same behavior, then you are rowing with one oar.

In my case, my mother in law treats her sons as if they are still 10, she is cut out of all her sons lives, at least 3 of us daughters in law have told her why.  She's been allowed back in several times and repeats the same exact behaviors of interfering and backstabbing.  It's been over 20 years, how long do you excuse that?  At what point should she be able to work out that she is cause in the matter and be prepared to make changes?

[2chickiebaby]

RedRose both parties have to be willing to work on the relationship.  As the song goes, it takes two.  If the other party carries on with the same behavior, then you are rowing with one oar.

In my case, my mother in law treats her sons as if they are still 10, she is cut out of all her sons lives, at least 3 of us daughters in law have told her why.  She's been allowed back in several times and repeats the same exact behaviors of interfering and backstabbing.  It's been over 20 years, how long do you excuse that?  At what point should she be able to work out that she is cause in the matter and be prepared to make changes?

You didn't address this to me but I hope you don't mind me answering.  Would you cut your own Mother out of your life? 
This always baffles me because in most cases the woman replies that her own Mother is just perfect and would never
do what your MIL does. 

[willingtohelp]

If anyone has an answer to Postscript's questions then I'd love to know it, too. 

For Chickie....as far as my mom goes, she hasn't done anything to anger either my DH or I.  And if she did, I'd be the first to tell her to stop it ASAP.  I think that's one problem.  The DH's let the tension build to a breaking point before they try to do something and by then resentments exist. 

I did "take a break" or whatever you want to call it from an aunt for about 12 years.  She was addicted to pain pills but wouldn't admit it, and playing the charade of "ignore aunt B's weird behavior" became ridiculous.  I did restart a relationship with her after she finished rehab and had been sober 6 months.  It's a guarded one but maybe with time we'll progress to what we had.  I think that if things become emotionally draining and the person isn't willing to work with you to fix them to some mutually satisfying outcome, then you have to stop beating yourself up.  If and when things can be reexamined to reach an outcome you're both happy with, then go for it then, but until then, stop putting yourself in that situation.  It's not going to end well.

[RedRose]

Maybe she doesn't feel she has to change...maybe she feels she is not the problem.

[2chickiebaby]

If anyone has an answer to Postscript's questions then I'd love to know it, too. 

For Chickie....as far as my mom goes, she hasn't done anything to anger either my DH or I.  And if she did, I'd be the first to tell her to stop it ASAP.  I think that's one problem.  The DH's let the tension build to a breaking point before they try to do something and by then resentments exist. 

I did "take a break" or whatever you want to call it from an aunt for about 12 years.  She was addicted to pain pills but wouldn't admit it, and playing the charade of "ignore aunt B's weird behavior" became ridiculous.  I did restart a relationship with her after she finished rehab and had been sober 6 months.  It's a guarded one but maybe with time we'll progress to what we had.  I think that if things become emotionally draining and the person isn't willing to work with you to fix them to some mutually satisfying outcome, then you have to stop beating yourself up.  If and when things can be reexamined to reach an outcome you're both happy with, then go for it then, but until then, stop putting yourself in that situation.  It's not going to end well.

Throwing people away because they have problems is something I can't wrap myself around.  I know that your Aunt is
sick....sick people need help, not to be thrown away.  I know that my first DIL told the second DIL that they needed to
band together against us.  This is when they first met.  I guess that says a lot.

It really goes back to having a son, which is not a good thing to have in our society.  His wife holds all the cards and in
her hands lies your future with your son.  It's sad but it's true and I envy those who have a great family.  It's all I ever
wanted.  Just a family, not fame, nothing....just people to love and to love me.

It has just about destroyed me.  I'm not the same person I used to be.  I hate that.  I hate that for me.  I feel like I had
a lot of love to give but she nipped that right in the bud.  For the contest.  She has 3 sons.  I wonder what her future
holds. 

[Postscript]

Chickie yes I would and I have.  She once called my house at 7am and abused my husband until he hung up on her.  When she called back I answered.  She accused my husband of keeping me from her because when she'd called the night before I was asleep and my son told her that.  Because of that she decided that my husband was keeping me away from her and it all became his fault.  When I spoke to her she was completely unreasonable and I told her that, I work, I get tired and I have a life to live that means I am not at her beck and call.  I told her that was enough, she couldn't treat my husband that way and cut her off.  Eventually she came back and apologized.  Some months later.

This was a few years ago now, my husband doesn't want to deal with her and I make sure he doesn't have to.  She sees me maybe once a month, she comes over when my husband is at work and leaves before he gets home.  She's lost the freedom she once had.  And it's not a one off either, that was the last straw for my husband.  My mother has a history of aberrant behavior towards everyone.  She's a strange person, even her own parents couldn't handle her.  I think she has something not quite wired right.  She is elderly now and I am all she has, my brothers cut her off years ago, as did her sister and brother.  I take care of her out of duty but I have made it clear that if she is on her last chance.

[2chickiebaby]

Chickie yes I would and I have.  She once called my house at 7am and abused my husband until he hung up on her.  When she called back I answered.  She accused my husband of keeping me from her because when she'd called the night before I was asleep and my son told her that.  Because of that she decided that my husband was keeping me away from her and it all became his fault.  When I spoke to her she was completely unreasonable and I told her that, I work, I get tired and I have a life to live that means I am not at her beck and call.  I told her that was enough, she couldn't treat my husband that way and cut her off.  Eventually she came back and apologized.  Some months later.

This was a few years ago now, my husband doesn't want to deal with her and I make sure he doesn't have to.  She sees me maybe once a month, she comes over when my husband is at work and leaves before he gets home.  She's lost the freedom she once had.  And it's not a one off either, that was the last straw for my husband.  My mother has a history of aberrant behavior towards everyone.  She's a strange person, even her own parents couldn't handle her.  I think she has something not quite wired right.  She is elderly now and I am all she has, my brothers cut her off years ago, as did her sister and brother.  I take care of her out of duty but I have made it clear that if she is on her last chance.
[/quote

I'm really sorry to hear about that.  I don't have a mother but always thought if I did I'd never do anything to hurt her no matter what she did. I guess there are exceptions. I can't imagine but I've heard of it.  It seems so cut and dry to me.

[Postscript]

Maybe she doesn't feel she has to change...maybe she feels she is not the problem.

I'm sorry but how many people have to cut you out of your life before you realize that you are the common denominator?  I am sure that is exactly how my mother in law feels, but it's not just one person, it's multiple people who are telling her the same thing and putting distance in their relationships with her.

Disclaimer: Not meaning you specifically RedRose, just couldn't make the question work without making it sound direct

[RedRose]

I don't know what to tell you here...I have never had this experience.

I can say that when I did have disagreements with my mother or mil I would never cut them. In fact, I think cutting someone from your life is never an answer.
Maybe staying away for a while...to cool down and think about things.

[Postscript]

Chickie it's not cut and dried.  Being a mother doesn't excuse us from treating others well and avoiding the consequences of treating them badly just because they are related.  If my mother wasn't my mother, I certainly wouldn't be her friend.  Both my mother and my mother in law get to have relationships with their children, simply because of a feeling of responsibility my husband and I both feel towards our mothers.  I would hate to have my children "suffer" me, the way I suffer my mother.

My husband happily puts up with my father and stepmother's eccentricities, he particularly enjoys being with my father, even though once many years ago, they had an argument that resulted in my father threatening to "punch him on the nose".  They sorted out their differences, shook hands and never brought it up again.  They happily potter around together working on home repairs, learning from each other about their different trades and have for over 20 years now.  I wish I could have that sort of relationship with my mother in law.

[Pen]

Being thrown away for any reason is sad, but that's the mind set these days. Don't help people get a grip, let 'em go! Don't help people do a better job, just fire them! Don't fix up that lovely old building, tear it down! No matter what "evil" we might be doing now as MILs, we gave birth to and nutured our sons. That's got to be worth something! My crime? I'm not a city-dwelling, mall shopping, money-mad success freak. Pardon me, and plow me under with the other old stuff.

When our DDD was diagnosed with learning disabilities, my dad and his wife couldn't handle it. They still can't deal with our dear disabled daughter. Maybe I should have put her in an institution to make everyone more comfortable. You know, she just doesn't "look right" in the family photos; ruins the illusion that we're all intellectually hot poo (degrees are everything in my family.)

I know I sound upset. I've never gotten a "minus" on this site until today, so something must be going on. I hope I earned it fair and square!

Postscript, regarding your statement about someone being a common denominator, sometimes (not always) it can be due to a mob mentality, like bullying. It spreads like a virus amongst a family or another group of people via snide comments and gossip until the one who is "the problem" is completely shunned, which just breeds more odd behavior. I know my behavior has changed since I started being treated poorly by DIL; I'm probably proving her point every time we get together!

[Postscript]

Penstamen some people when attacked come out fighting and spitting, some back off.  I backed off and out.  If she wants a relationship with me, she's making no effort to have one.