Daughters Intentionally Punish me with Silent Treatment for months

[firelight]

I have to say that this certain situation is one where I wouldn't contact either DD at all.  The next contact would be theirs to make even if that means months or years.  I'll bet they would wonder what is going on eventually if you stopped contacting.  I just feel badly for the GC.  I still wouldn't do it under these circumstances though.  If they wanted to contact, I'd just go from there and play it by ear.  This is an extremely hurtful snafu for you, Cherry.  You're worth more.

[firelight]

I wanted to share a positive quote here with Cherry that I think applies donated by a WW here Beth2011 (in the Grab Bag).....here's what she found: 

If you allow people to make more withdrawals than deposits in your life, you will be out of balance and in the negative.  Know when to close the account.
....Christie Williams

ain't it the truth.

[pam1]

Cherry, thanks for posting more.  Has your DD always been like this?  Or has this been recent behavior since the birth of her children?

I have to say you sound like one fun lady to me.

Thinking more this afternoon there was a book I thought might interest you.  "Women who run with wolves"  I think you would benefit from it, I loved it and I know a few of our members here liked it too.

[Cherry]

Thank you everyone for your help.  Thank you for the ideas, for your kind thoughts and support, and for pointing me to helpful resources.

It's hard to say if my daughter has always been this way, or whether it is since she has had children, since the major problem seems to be her use of her children.  When she got pregnant and was still single and in dire circumstances and it was clear the best thing for the baby would be to be somewhere where good prenatal nutrition and health care was assured I asked my husband to please help me go get her & move her back in with us.  Her younger siblings were still in our home, so our oldest grandson was born & grew up for the first 2 yrs around lots of family. 

For those first 2 yrs she mostly left him to our care.  She was a pretty good mother, but wanted to date and would be out late at night while her baby cried.  She cared enough to breastfeed him, which was wonderful, and at least late at night her boyfriend's car would be parked on the street outside our house while they "made out."  So when her baby cried & was clearly hungry we could get out of bed & take him out to her in the car.

I took care of him for her while she went to school. 

My daughter was rather tough to raise.  She was very headstrong.  If she got in trouble and was sent to her room, even at 6 yrs old she refused to stay in her room for the few minutes she was sent there.  I had read a book on how many minutes was appropriate for each age child & would set a timer. But she wouldn't even stay for 3 minutes.  She would constantly come out as if daring me to make her stay there. From that age all through her teenage years I would read book after book looking for something to help.  When she was in high school she would skip school constantly. It was a constant work just to try & keep her at school.  She's very intelligent & her grades never reflected this  She refused to study, yet she was smart enough to still pass! She was smoking, I figured she might also be drinking, she was shoplifting, having sex, & just hanging around with people who were not a good influence.

We found out one day while she was living with us after she had her baby that she was part of a group of boys who would burglarize homes during school hours.  This was evidently where she was when she was skipping school.  She happened to brag about it just out of the blue one day.  That's the only reason we found out about it.

She's very beautiful.  I mean she's gorgeous.  And has a million dollar smile.  She's a strawberry blonde & is just extremely attractive, loves to socialize & is very good in conversations, in making jokes, and is just real good at getting people to like her.

One day after she was married she said to us that the way she got her husband (her then boyfriend) to rent her an apartment during the time she was still living with us (& then moved into the apartment because she was tired of being under our roof) was that she told him I was beating her.  I'm not a large person.  I'm small boned & small shouldered.  There's no way physically I even looked like I could beat her.  And I certainly had not ever laid a hand on her except spankings when she was a child & never even in anger.  This was complete lies on her part.  I had never beaten her or even hit her. Never.  Yet she had him convinced that he had to rent an apartment for her own safety.  And it was me she told him had beat her (this is what she bragged to me).  I imagine he still believes it. 

And then we payed for her wedding when she married him.  He's always been very stand offish from me. I guess the things she tells him must have something to do with this.  He's a smart man & very talented & I would love to be able to treat him as my son, but she seems to have made sure he will never trust me.

I really wish I could have a good relationship with them.  We've always been there to help them.  We helped fix up each house they moved to, financed their first house, and were always there to help care for their children. 

You've all given me a lot to think about, so as I get my work done each day I am thinking about what you've all said.  It gives me different perspectives to think about & different angles from which to look at this, so I really appreciate it.

I really appreciate everyone's help and input.  I really hope for a resolution.  I would love to love her as I have always loved her.  I would tell her each time I would see her what a great mother she is and how proud of her I am.  Still it seems that has never been enough.

If anyone has any more ideas I would really appreciate it.  Since she is still "taking a break from me" (even though with her nastiness toward me I would not contact her anyway, but would wait for her to initiate contact) I have not heard from her since October when I asked her to come to see my therapist with me. 

[lancaster lady]

Hi Cherry ,

I'm so sorry you are having to put up with this behaviour after all you have done for your daughter .
It sounds like she has created you to be a monster , so you and her husband do not become friends
in case he finds out what a monster SHE was before he met her .
That is the reason she gives for not leaving you alone with your GKids .
You know too much about her past and is scared in case you tell him .
Do you think this might be the case ?
I really wouldn't want to be around people who thought so little if me , especially my daughter .
I would use this break to make another life without them .
Good luck to you , it's not easy but less hurtful .

[Ruth]

I honestly agree with you, LL, about why Cherry is not left alone with the g/c.  I think that DD has woven such a web of lies, that the only way she can protect her world is to keep you outside of it.  I think she has a love/hate relationship with you, Cherry, and I think in some cases such as mine also when a parent is raising a very defiant/aggressive child, that the a/c still feels the angst against the parent that they felt as a child, the hatred of the authority and the intimacy that the parent had, especially if the child is ultra protective of their right to privacy and their own space.  I will even go so far as to say that much of their emotions are still immature.  I can get this far, but I can't get any farther as solutions go, that is.  I also liked what Luise said about many people being provoked by 'free spirits', or people who are comfortable in their own skin with their sense of humor and/or eccentric personality.  I believe also that probably much more often than we think, there lies a lot of angst between dm and dd, the same as dil/mil.  It may be gender.  I think that you will have to play the waiting game, and leave the ball in her court, as I have to do with ds.  Some things just have to hurt, and we have to learn to live with it.  It is a different, more tolerable hurt, however, when you understand that it isn't a situation you created or that you can fix.  Maybe you will have to wait until the g/c are older to achieve the relationship you want so much with them.  I don't know, but I would find a way to keep tabs on what goes on with middle g/c who gets some borderline abuse from her.  I also really do think your dd has some mental illness, just a guess but it seems to me that it goes over the line, especially the lying about abuse without any remorse, and being able to sustain this counterproductive relationship with you without any real periods of remorse or self doubt.

[Kate]

Cherry, your daughter has created a fantasy world where she is the hero and you are cast as the villain.  She can't allow you into her life, because the whole fantasy would come crashing down.  Sadly, I think the only thing you can do is to get on with your own life and limit your daughters ability to hurt you.  Don't contact her and thereby give her a chance to reject you.  Don't give her gifts and thereby give her the opportunity to throw them back at you. 

I am worried that your husband seems to be complicit in her abuse of you.  I think that if he visits them and you are not invited then it is reasonable that you don't discuss his visits with him.  I know you want to know what is going on in your daughters and grandchildrens lives, but I suspect that you are right and he is getting a bit of a buzz from being the 'good' parent.  And I think you should find something fun to do while he is visiting them.  Don't sit around at home and mope.  Go out with friends, go to a movie, go shopping, have a girls night in, anything you enjoy! 

I know you have given your life to your children, but now is the time for you to take your life back. 

[Kate]

Oh, and a punching bag is a very therapeutic was of working out your pain and frustration!

[firelight]

I hardly know what to say.  My sis's sis-in-law was diagnosed as a "sociopath" at the age of 13...who is now 32.  So many similar symptoms I can't believe it.  Might want to look up some info on that.  Seriously.  What you are saying with her actions and no remorse/no conscience/lying so much she believes herself, sounds just like this sis-in-law of my sister's who's husband recently passed.  She's been a living nightmare for her parents and her family since she was very young,  and still is, especially for her small children.....1 of which is 5 and in therapy already  (the other is 3)  due to her mother.  But she can put on a great show if she doesn't know you or if she doesn't want you to see the illness....like a total professional.  If not the sociopath diagnosis, there is a very strong possibility there is some mental illness present, which makes this all the more difficult for you.  I wonder what a psych Dr. would diagnose her as (if they would ever learn the truth of her actions).  Sometimes when we know someone is suffering from a mental illness, it can make a parent even more protective of them even in their worst behavior and living in denial for the parent is so much more comfortable and less painful.  I hope she can get help but I'm going to be honest to say that sometimes there is no help for certain mental illnesses (only the doc can determine that for sure, but it happens).  I found it interesting when you said how gorgeous this DD of yours is.  My sis's sis-in-law is also....in fact, she looks like a Kardashian sister.  The toy is beautiful on the outside but badly broken on the inside. 

I don't see the "good mother" here when you say you tell her she's a good mother.  Sorry.  I wouldn't tell someone they are when clearly they are not.  (you had to take the baby out to the car to be fed because she wouldn't come in??  destroying her own son's self-esteem in front of her so-called friends enough to reduce him to tears and seeing nothing wrong with that, etc)....not to mention lying to her husband and has never told him the truth about her lying about you and treating you extremely poorly? 

I still feel badly for your heart though, Cherry as it's very, very hard when you unconditionally love your child (many of us are guilty) to see them act in this manner.  Don't reward the puppy though for bad behavior.  However, I think that she's going to do whatever she wants at anyone's expense no matter what you do.  This does not sound good at all.  I feel badly for you and more importantly, your GC.  Your SIL has no idea who he is really married to if she honestly has painted you in this totally false light and letting her family live it.  How very sad for each person in this family.  My heart breaks for you. 

Please focus on taking care of yourself and finding a new normal that revolves around your wants and needs.  Do your own thing and relish who you are.  It's really important to find some self-preservation at this point. 

I'm with Kate on this one.

[firelight]

excellent post, lancaster lady.

[herbalescapes]

I think you should get your husband into counseling with you.  Either he is selling you out to be on his daughter's good side, or he is privvy to info that explains the whole situation and for reasons known only to him, he ain't sharing.  He should be supporting you and telling his daughters that in under no circumstances can they treat his wife this way.

Sometimes for good, sometimes for ill, the smallest things can have the greatest impact on our lives and relationships.  There may be some minor instances from your DDs growing up years that have cast you as the evil villian in the family (remember that time you were 15 minutes late picking me up from soccer practice?  remember when you promised I could get my ears pierced then you changed your mind?  How about that time you wouldn't give me a ride to school so I had to take my social studies project on the bus and it got crushed and I got a D?  Yeah, I dont' care that you had broken your leg and couldn't drive, you should have called a cab!!!!!).  Maybe counseling with your husband can bring some of these things out in the open.  Or help in other ways.

Good luck!

[Ruth]

I hardly know what to say.  My sis's sis-in-law was diagnosed as a "sociopath" at the age of 13...who is now 32.  So many similar symptoms I can't believe it.  Might want to look up some info on that.  Seriously.  What you are saying with her actions and no remorse/no conscience/lying so much she believes herself, sounds just like this sis-in-law of my sister's who's husband recently passed.  She's been a living nightmare for her parents and her family since she was very young,  and still is, especially for her small children.....1 of which is 5 and in therapy already  (the other is 3)  due to her mother.  But she can put on a great show if she doesn't know you or if she doesn't want you to see the illness....like a total professional.  If not the sociopath diagnosis, there is a very strong possibility there is some mental illness present, which makes this all the more difficult for you.  I wonder what a psych Dr. would diagnose her as (if they would ever learn the truth of her actions).  Sometimes when we know someone is suffering from a mental illness, it can make a parent even more protective of them even in their worst behavior and living in denial for the parent is so much more comfortable and less painful.  I hope she can get help but I'm going to be honest to say that sometimes there is no help for certain mental illnesses (only the doc can determine that for sure, but it happens).  I found it interesting when you said how gorgeous this DD of yours is.  My sis's sis-in-law is also....in fact, she looks like a Kardashian sister.  The toy is beautiful on the outside but badly broken on the inside. 

I don't see the "good mother" here when you say you tell her she's a good mother.  Sorry.  I wouldn't tell someone they are when clearly they are not.  (you had to take the baby out to the car to be fed because she wouldn't come in??  destroying her own son's self-esteem in front of her so-called friends enough to reduce him to tears and seeing nothing wrong with that, etc)....not to mention lying to her husband and has never told him the truth about her lying about you and treating you extremely poorly? 

I still feel badly for your heart though, Cherry as it's very, very hard when you unconditionally love your child (many of us are guilty) to see them act in this manner.  Don't reward the puppy though for bad behavior.  However, I think that she's going to do whatever she wants at anyone's expense no matter what you do.  This does not sound good at all.  I feel badly for you and more importantly, your GC.  Your SIL has no idea who he is really married to if she honestly has painted you in this totally false light and letting her family live it.  How very sad for each person in this family.  My heart breaks for you. 

Amazing, Firelight.  This is so insightful.  I am so very sorry, Cherry, if you're still reading.  I'm so sorry that you're having to read things that I know break your heart, Trust me, I know how you are feeling.  I agree, as I said in my previous post, with Firelight that in light of what you've described, DD has some mental illness.  If you've read any of my history, you know that I've also had to struggle with these emotions.  I wish I could make your hurt go away, and tell you something that I thought would change the future.  As I cannot, I will tell you the one thing that does give me home and comfort.  Prayer.  This is what makes the impossible possible.  When your back is to the wall, and there is no human help out there for you, take the problem higher up.  I will be remembering you, and I will also pray with you.  Please grab hold and stay strong.  You will need insight each day to meet the challenges of watching out for your G/C.  Options will come to you that you never imagined would.  Doors will open in strange places.  Just stand back and wait patiently.  don't project your thoughts into the future and imagine worse and worse things to come.  We life in a realm of hope and possibilities.  Much love to you.

[Nana]

Dear Cherry.

Your daughter obviously feels embarrass of you... she is a vain and materialistic daughter.  The cost of our cloth does not make us better or worse.  I might like wearing nice expensive clothing but I respect and love those who dont.  What is important to some, is not to others.  I dont mind traveling (have never been in Europe) but I love to spend in home refurnishing.  Sometimes we cannot afford things, and some other times we really dont consider it a priority. 

I agree with other posters that your daughter does not want you near her children and husband because she is insecure... because of all the lies she has said. 

Now you know you cannot count on your husband.  My husband stands by me when someone hurts me, and when I am wrong he lets me know it, and even reprimands me behind closed doors, but will not permit anyone to abuse me or him.   I think your husband feels flattered that he is not an embarrassment to his daughters.  Your daughter must be so happy having daddy by her side....ughs....I am so angry at him. 

Cherry, I also agree that you seem a nice fun person.  They are missing all these.  What good is to gain all material things if you lose your heart (speaking of your daughter of course).  You have a good heart......what they think about you is their problem....you are awesome. 

We show people the way we want to be treated.  Dont take more abuse from any of them.

Love