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The Holidays - share your stories

Started by MoonChild, November 22, 2011, 11:32:05 AM

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Doe

Quote from: MoonChild on November 22, 2011, 11:32:05 AM
Additionally, we have kept the exact same routine in my FOOs house on Christmas since my sister and I could walk; the only time it changed was one year when FDH and I tried splitting Christmas between both families (our first year together) but all that did was stress us both out and, at least, I felt a bit cheated and disappointed with Christmas that year (possibly because I felt I had to 'sacrifice' my Christmas morning – arrrrrrrgggghhhh – perhaps the fact that I thought of it as ME 'sacrificing' MY Christmas morning is the start of my problem, but how do I not think of it that way?)

Hi Moonchild-

Routines change when you marry and start your own household - I doubt that the tooth fairy is still visiting you or that the Easter Bunny still leaves a basket, right?
But you aren't married yet, and it sounds like you aren't ready to give up some aspects of your childhood - so don't. 
It seems to me that at some point, the pressure of your own created family will push you into wanting to move away from your FOO traditions and start your own. But if the pull of your FOO is still so strong that they are most important, then continue getting with them.   
If you feel cheated/disappointed about spending time with DH's family, then don't. 

After you and your FDH marry, you might consider starting your own tradition for Christmas day, some that you can build on if you decide to have kids.  Hey!  Invite both your FOO and his family to your place for Christmas!

justanoldgrandma

I hate to beat a dead horse, but MoonChild, you sound just like my dil on the "same routine since I could walk"......


No one who is a "true and faithful" member of the family misses Christmas, even the ones who live across the country to attend, every single year.  One uncle has attended all 90 years of his life.  DIL has stated w/o being asked by us, that she always has and always will be in Hometown, USA, all her life for all holidays (and she actually likes us!)

It's not a big problem for the majority who never left the hometown (they must attend dinner and presents and then are allowed to go to their own FOO.)  The problem comes with the people like ds whose FOO live miles away and other "outsiders" who also have FOO at a distance.  I've not heard (several years of marriage) one of the FOO mention that we will be alone for the holidays.

What happens if an "outsider's" FOO decides they want the holiday with their own?  The spouse must decide, do I want to upset my dw or dh or do I leave my children w the ILs and go alone to my FOO?  I do know some of the "married ins" do resent the tradition and just refuse to attend although the spouse does; the couples seem a lot less close..... 

Here's the problem.  Your fdh has already faced this challenge.  His mother wants to see him.  You won't go bc you'll be at your own FOO's..... I don't know if the gathering at your FOO's is huge, but why not alternate Christmas (unless, as suggested, you invite the whole gang to your house to do the cooking and such.)   

Already you are forcing your fdh to choose between you and the request of his mother who I assume wants your presence, too; you haven't mentioned any conflicts, but if you decide that your holiday tradition w your FOO is more important than the happiness of your fdh and his family, watch out.....

I don't know how many times my family had dinners w/o my dh, children, and me..... or we arrived late.... bc we had the respect and wanted to be with dh's FOO, at least some of the holidays.  Did my parents miss and perhaps resent my absence at times and let me know it?  Yep.  But yet they didn't make me choose between them and dh.

I guess I just question your concern for fdh and his FOO; why?  because it's identical to the situation dh and I are enduring now.  DS is caught in the middle, wanting to please us and dw & her FOO who would be incensed if she and children didn't show up.  There is no understanding of our traditions, of our being w/o ds and family. 


Decide how important your fdh and his family are to you so far as getting along now and in the future; believe me, there will be lots of other conflicts arise!; your future FOO may not be as duct-taped and silent on the subject as dh and I. 






forever spring

I agree with Sapphire, why make such a big deal over one day when there are plenty others near this specific day to be enjoyed and relished. It just doesn't make sense. This 'fuzzy feeling' that a traditional Christmas with all the trimmings brings to our heart must not be confined to a single day only because if we hold on to this, we do suffer so much when families merge. Forget about the calendar date and recreate a wonderful day with love amongst relatives near that 'fatal date'. If you are a Christian you can celebrate Christ's birthday on the 25th and then get on with family celebrations any day after that.

Shelby

Quote from: justanoldgrandma on November 23, 2011, 11:00:40 AM
Moonchild, I am a MIL who hasn't had Thanksgiving or Christmas with ds since he got "serious" bc the FDIL (then dil) had such strong traditions with her FOO and we didn't want the couple to split up going places, wanted them to be together, so we just said ok (we were informed by dil she would be at her FOOs  on all holidays till death, no kidding, so no choice there.)  We were so shocked we missed our chance to show alarm but it would have been useless anyway.

Our son thought we didn't celebrate on The DAYs or even close to them as his wife makes the plans (I know, he doesn't get into it and it's probably better that he doesn't) and also bc my mother and ILs were flexible and would alternate, being considerate, so he didn't remember how we sometimes had the family at our house, sometimes at someone else's to accommodate the ILs; I explained once, and he now knows we miss them on holidays but he wants wife happy, so we keep duct-taped; who wants a dil who doesn't want to be w us, makes ds miserable, all of us; better to be just dh and me.....

BTW, when the family does come to visit (not on holidays, of course, other times) we do all get along; dh and I go out of our way to make dil and ds and all happy; there are no arguments or resentments bc we want to keep the family.

I'm requoting what amflautist said bc frankly it's how much fun and great it is w your FOO and frankly, it's that feelings of your fdh and of his family don't matter.  You won't go to your fdh's FOO; you'd rather be w your FOO even if it means not being w FDH?  Really?  Just because it's so much fun and what you always do?  Your mother and sister wouldn't consider an alterate date on alternate years?  It doesn't make your heart hurt to hear you FMIL say she wants to see her ds (and probably you, too!?)  And how fortunate that fdh's mother had to work on last year's holiday so it all worked out!  Wow!


My dil's FOO doesn't feel bad for our being alone, so of course dil doesn't either, only of their own celebrations, traditions, everyone falls in line, those who don't go to their own FOO alone!  How sad that FOOs don't volunteer to alternate any holiday to make the "outsiders" happy; I hope you reconsider and give up some of your happy times (alternate, ok?) bc believe me, even if your mil or ds say nothing, it isn't a good way to start a marriage, thinking only of your own fun and not someone else's feelings.  I'm saying this bc no one must have said this to my dil.

Please reread jdtm's post also..... it's not how many people are at the celebration, how far the distance, how deep the traditions; it's being fair and considerate; FOO should instill this in their children/young adults bc if they are willing to make the to-be ILs and fsil happy at the expense of having to alternate, share, etc., they will have gone a long way towards making the future couple happier.

This is all said not in malice but just in what could happen if you don't consider fdh's feelings and that of his FOO.  Believe me, I wish my dil had had this guidance.

Amflutist implies she's glad you won't be her dil.  (It's bc your FOO and your enjoyment with them are what counts.)  You are my dil. 


Quote from: amflautist on November 22, 2011, 05:10:06 PM
Quote from: MoonChild on November 22, 2011, 11:32:05 AM
Good Morning Ladies and Happy Holidays as the season has now begun.
......
For me: I am extremely close with my family, and my Mom, my Sister and I always spend the holiday cooking an extravagant holiday spread and enjoying the day together, and I really just cannot see myself not being with them on the holiday.
.........
However, I also know that I cannot expect FDH to just 'jump on board' with my family celebrations and drop his family.
.......
his mom wanted to see him on Christmas day. Of course I am trying to remind myself that of course a mother wants to see her son on Christmas, but I cannot help but feeling a bit bummed that now I won't be spending Christmas with my FDH; and also a bit torn wondering if FMIL is expecting me to come as well, because I won't be, not because I don't want to, but because I have numerous obligations (granted I do not treat them as obligation because I enjoy cooking SO MUCH) with my own family.
......
I felt a bit cheated and disappointed with Christmas that year (possibly because I felt I had to 'sacrifice' my Christmas morning – arrrrrrrgggghhhh –

OK -- I just checked -- you are not going to marry my DS -- whew!
Carry on then.

Moon - You express a seemingly sincere desire to have a good relationship with your future in-laws.  Please give deep thought to both JustanoldGrandma's and Amflautist's comments.  They have both been down the road with DILs who favor their own families, give the in-laws second-class status, and the hubbies just go along to get along.  That tactic does NOT result in good in-law relationships.   

The path you seem to want to take - always going to your FOO, not giving equal time to your future husband's FOO, resenting the thought of missing your FOO's events - is not a path to good relations with your in-laws.  So you'll have to make a choice. 

1.   Be mature and be fair to both families - such as by alternating years, or having everyone from both FOOs at your place -- (after all, your fiance would not expect YOU to ALWAYS go to his FOO for holidays and NEVER go to your FOO - so why should you expect that of him - or for his FOO to put up with that?) or

2.   Be so wrapped up in what you want that you don't consider the feelings of your husband's family. 

I have a DIL who follows path #2, and I can tell you that if you choose that path, it won't matter after a few years because your in-laws will get so fed up they won't give a rat's rear end if they ever have you for holidays or not.  They will only care about their son and tolerate you in order to maintain the relationship with their son. 

I don't think that's what you really want - but actions now will have consequences later. 

Shelby

And Pen is another one whose DIL has assigned her second-class status.  And I can't imagine anyone more delightful to spend holidays with than Pen, JAOG and Amflautist.  Be careful what seeds you are sowing. 

justanoldgrandma

Thanks for the kind words, Shelby.  I hope I haven't been too harsh with Moonchild and scared her off the forum.  To your credit, Moonchild, you have been honest in your feelings! and you don't seem to have bad feelings toward your mil or fdh.  And it's great that you have such good times with your FOO; that bodes well that you can get along well w your ILs, too.

How did I get through to my ds that we were lonely on holidays and that I wasn't having a "pity party" as he put it?  (Boy, did that make my blood boil!)  But I kept my tempter and simply said, "How would you feel if someday your children did this to you?"  (Meaning always going to the spouse's for holidays and weekends and vacations and forgetting about them.)  I then reminded him that we didn't always have get togethers weeks after/before holidays, (oh, forget M.Day/F.Day/Easter, etc. altogether.)  He then understood two things:

1.  He had bought into his ILs and dw's traditions, content in the belief that mom and dad wouldn't mind.....
2.  That someday he might face the same situation someday.

He talked w his dw and she has made an effort to see us more often which we do appreciate; gotta take what we can. 

But it's true:  you do sow what you reap, and we do want you to have a happy married life which makes your fdh and ILs happy; it's not good to have your ILs unhappy, believe me!  And your fdh needs his FOO as well.  You may find, as our dil has, that ILs can be of tremendous help and support (dh and I are)...... it pays off in so many ways!

Doe

Spending a holiday with someone who feels cheated and disappointed about having to spend it with me?  I'd rather not.  That vibe is coming through loud and clear, no matter the social veneer!

I think MoonChild isn't ready to leave the FOO and move into the realm of doing what's best for the larger family.  I don't mean that as disrespect, MC, but just an observation.  It sounds like the childhood rituals are more important to you at this point in your life and that's the starting point for deciding what you're going to do.  If you were my FDIL, and you admitted that you felt lost about missing your family on the holidays, I think I would understand and let you have your time.  But I would hope that you'd give me plenty of other time with DS!

lancaster lady

My DIL mentioned that she just has to be with her DM on Christmas Day ! to no one in particular , just a statement .
So what if my DS said the same thing ?
He doesn't ..............just does his usual puppy thing and follows where his leash takes him !
I have adjusted , and adapted , and tried not to comment .
Perhaps ONE day I will see my GD and DS on Christmas Day , not holding my breath .

justanoldgrandma

Quote from: Doe on November 24, 2011, 08:20:42 AM
Spending a holiday with someone who feels cheated and disappointed about having to spend it with me?  I'd rather not.  That vibe is coming through loud and clear, no matter the social veneer!

I think MoonChild isn't ready to leave the FOO and move into the realm of doing what's best for the larger family.  I don't mean that as disrespect, MC, but just an observation.  It sounds like the childhood rituals are more important to you at this point in your life and that's the starting point for deciding what you're going to do.  If you were my FDIL, and you admitted that you felt lost about missing your family on the holidays, I think I would understand and let you have your time.  But I would hope that you'd give me plenty of other time with DS!

As soon as I met and fell for dh, I was more than willing to go to his family's home even though there were some complaints from Mom at times; but we alternated dinners and such and there was little problem.  I agree with Doe that MC isn't ready to leave the FOO  (maybe carrying it further, maybe not ready to be married ((hope not sounding too harsh here.)))  DH and I have been married a lot of years and no way did I want to or even now have him go his way and I go mine on holidays, etc., no matter how inconvenient it might be.  The vow of forsaking all others, I think means not just other lovers but also devoting oneself primarily to the new union.  Let no one ..... asunder (can't remember); ILs are not to interfere w the couple either.

1.  I love him and want to be with him, esp. on holidays; we'd both be lonely w/o each other (we are independent people but don't divide up our family even if it's just he and I now.)
2.  I wouldn't hurt his FOO any more than he would mine.  Granted, we don't have blowups or hurtful times w each others' ILS even though some aren't our favorite people; but we can enjoy the times together anyway.
3.  To keep ds and his family happy and (her family from exploding) we don't even suggest they split up their holidays.

Granted, I never had a close sister and/or mother relationship where I had a ball cooking and decorating, etc..... that's a great thing; I have no sister and my mother was all business during holiday preps with me and other relatives helping.  It wasn't a happy, happy time; it is more fun sometimes w dh's FOO as the group of women is larger and usually laugh more.  In my dil's FOO there are several women and I'm sure it is more fun for her and even for ds as there are more male relatives to watch football with.

However..... to me, so long as people get along, the "who's the most fun factor" shouldn't factor in.... not when it means one FOO never sees their children or gc at Christmas or even close to Christmas. LL, I'm with you; I'll never see my ds, dil, or gc on Christmas Eve or Day or watch them enjoy the presents, go to church with them on an Eve, etc.  Dil and her FOO know this and simply don't care or are in denial or think we can survive w/o the family.  So I take what I get bc like Doe said, even if I won the battle (and no way could I) who wants a sulky dil and miserable ds who would be paying for making his wife leave the people she loves:  her FOO. 

As far as our ds coming to see us while dil and gc go to her FOO, I can't see that happening.  He'd be feeling guilty and who wants that.  But..... we do try to compensate by going to see them and inviting them to see us at other times when the ILs don't have all weekends occupied (and that is hard but we look for openings; and fortunately our visits are good.)

Don't get married unless you are willing to sacrifice some for the person you love and his FOO; time to cut some apron strings; if not, your fdh will find himself being neglected at other times and this is not good..... sorry for the bluntness.

sapphire

Ultimately, it's between you and your significant other where you decide to go. If spending time alone together is important to you for those days, then by all means do that. Just please make sure to consider that you are doing something that makes both you and your partner happy. Whether that means alternating days, picking a different day to celebrate with one family versus another, or perhaps doing your own thing like a vacation...it is up to you. You and your partner have to be happy with one another and the things you decide to do. It's of little consequence in your relationship whether or not your parents or your in-laws are happy with your decisions or not, because if the both of you are happy, that is where your strength will come from.

Moonchild, as long as you are communicating with your significant other about what one another wants to do and compromise with one another one what is going to happen, you will have no problems.

alohomora

I may need to re-read Moon's post, but I'm not sure she mentions how imporant the holidays are in her FDH's family.

I have a similar situation as Moon over the holidays with my FOO. However, in my case the IL's live across the country. Initially when we got married MIL joked about us alternating but we let her know, gently, that wasn't realistic. Between plane tickets, days off work, not to mention travelling over the holidays, it wasn't going to happen often.

However, in their case, they don't make a fuss about us not being there and instead we do what we're doing this summer - DH and I will go for one week to the IL's and spend it solely with them. A lot of family time. That's what they want and I appreciate their understanding over the holidays.

tryingmybest

My DIL is in no way ready to leave her FOO, demanding every holiday , attendance at traditional family vacations, extended family events, and DS follows right along. With us she is sullen, non communicative and clearly eager to bolt at the earliest opportunity.I'm not even pushing for more time with us, they should however have more time as a couple, they need time to form their own family unit and an important part of that is the chance to form their own family traditions. She feels no need to do that, she still has Mommy's. I don't think the girl was ready for marriage. it's so much more then the fancy wedding, it's mutual consideration. if you're not ready to leave your FOO behind, then by all means don't, but don't get married either, you are setting yourself and everyone else up for big problems.

lancaster lady

Tmb........my DIL in a nutshell ! They have moved in walking distance of her Foo. ! She's had the designer wedding , got the baby , my DS is now surplus . They are miles from his workplace , so traveling expenses are escalating ! Looking at what happened 9 months ago with their finances , it doesn't make sense !  She is ecstatic , so that's the main thing , isn't it ? Happy wife , happy marriage ? I hope so as long as the money holds up !...........................Happy Thanksgiving to all my US buddies .........may your blessings be many ...x

tryingmybest

Yeah making the " adjustment " so dear son can start his own family is bitter sweet but it's the way things go. BUT giving it all up so his MIL can avoid any loss is infuriating. The kid didn't get married he got adopted. But I know him, and this won't last. I think the same developmental change that pushes sons away from their FOO mandates they form their own. if their wives don't do that, content just to continue their happy chilhoods with Mommy and Daddy, I think the marriages are in trouble. Might explain part of the sky high divorce rate.  :o

jdtm

QuoteBut I know him, and this won't last. I think the same developmental change that pushes sons away from their FOO mandates they form their own. if their wives don't do that, content just to continue their happy chilhoods with Mommy and Daddy, I think the marriages are in trouble.

After 14 years of marriage, our elder son divorced.  Can relate totally to above quote.  Selfishness and self-centeredness rears its ugly head in many situations.

QuoteYou and your partner have to be happy with one another and the things you decide to do. It's of little consequence in your relationship whether or not your parents or your in-laws are happy with your decisions or not, because if the both of you are happy, that is where your strength will come from.

After almost 10 years of marriage, this quote describes our younger son and DIL.  By the way, not only is our younger son's marriage strong but it is also financially better than our elder son's (the price of divorce is high - both emotionally and financially and physically and mentally - and I haven't even touched on the effect of the children or extended family or friends).

Moonchild - I hope we haven't scared you but marriage is not "your way" or "his way" or a "combination of both" but "our way".  Even if everyone else disagrees ....  And yes, I agree with tryingmybest - I believe the high divorce rate is partially due to this self-centered and immature aspect of those involved (and I'm referring not only to the young married couple but also the entitled baby-boom generation (of which I am a member).  Nothing worthwhile is easy, is it?