DIL problems

[Pooh]

I had a thought about this last night.  This is not directed at you NWIW, but all of us because others have faced scathing emails and text here too after an incident.

It hit me that is seems to be the pattern in stories here, that someone makes a mistake, then the DIL/GF/MIL sends a hateful email.   Why would you do that?  If someone would have done to me what happed for instance in NWIW's story here, and I was going to send an email to them, it wouldn't be hateful.  (Of course, I would have waited until after the dinner and discussed it with NWIW nicely, not by email) but just for argument's sake, if I decided to send her an email, it would have been done nicely.

"NWIW, I know you probably didn't intentionally set out to hurt and embarrass me last night, but I wanted you to know that it did.  When I discussed my Mono with you, I never thought you would bring it up in front of the entire family.  I was so embarrassed and tried to laugh it off, but it really did hurt my feelings.  Again, I know you probably meant no harm, but I wanted you to know and to ask you, in the future, anything that we discuss personally I would really like to keep between us.  If I decided to tell others, I will.  I want to be able to confide in you without having to worry about you telling others.  I will give you the same respect.  Deal?"

When I thought about this, it's almost like the party was just waiting for an opportunity to go off on the other one.  If I received an email like that, it would be so much easier for me to quickly apologize sincerely and try to make amends.  Receiving a very yuck email right off the bat, would make it harder.  I would do it, but I would probably still harbor some bad feelings over the tone of the email that would fester for next time.  One party making an error (not talking gross error here) does not justify the other party to have a free-for-all at them.

I still feel the same about NWIW's situation, and I think she does need to recognize that she made a mistake and apologize, but I think DIL owes an apology for letting her emotions get the best of her and sending a yuck email.  Wouldn't that be nice?

[Scoop]

Pooh - I have to point out an error in your logic.

Sure, if the DIL thought the MIL didn't INTEND to be hurtful, that's how you would expect it to go down.  However, if the DIL thought it was intentional, or was an attack vs a slip-up, then I can see where the harsh e-mail reaction would come from.

I think that the basic assumption that MIL & DIL don't MEAN to hurt each other is just not there.  Especially if the relationship is already tense. 

[pam1]

I agree Moonchild, conversation is a lost art.  If I'm truly sorry I want to say it in person and vs versa.  It seems to me if something is important it should be discussed face to face.  I can see the benefits for email/text to get info out  there quickly but it also has its major (IMO) downsides. 

[Doe]

Moonchild, 

The relatives I have problems with don't make themselves available for phone calls.  My calls would go right to voicemail but texts and emails would get responses for the most part. I think my DIL feels braver on email since she doesn't have to confront a real person in front of her.

[Shelby]

I don't think Pooh's logic is in error.  Why in the world would DIL think it was an attack vs a slip-up?  Original poster started by saying she has worked hard to avoid mistakes her FOO made.  Therefore she should be credited with good intentions.  Yes, she overstepped the line.  But if this was the first time it has happened, DIL should have definitely taken Pooh's approach, not blistered the MIL.  Even if the DIL was pretty sure it was intentional, DIL would be much wiser to STILL take Pooh's approach - as that is the high road.  Taking the high road makes DIL look better, and probably gets the message across better to MIL than does an attack.  I daresay that after reading this board and being gently informed by all of us that we think she did cross the line, MIL has learned and will not do so in the future.  But the blistering attack by DIL probably got MIL defensive, not looking at MIL's own flaws.  Catch more flies with honey than vinegar.  And DIL can more effectively achieve her desired end result (MIL keeping mouth shut) by not going into attack mode.   

[Pooh]

It was an assumption on my part that in this case, this hasn't been an ongoing problem with NWIW, so Scoop was right, I was assuming this was a first for NWIW.

Shelby caught what I was trying to get at, also what MoonChild was saying about communication.  Have we lost the ability to assume that the other party didn't mean any harm and made a mistake? And in an ongoing situation, where they have been nice and given opportunity after opportunity, why do we feel the need to send a yuck email even then?  I can get my point across, set my boundaries and still do it nicely without cursing, hatefulness and yuck and move on.   

[Shelby]

On MILs crossing the line and DILs not giving any benefit of doubt with respect to MIL's intentions.  Story from long ago - 30 years.  DH and I had not been married long.  MIL (the lovely lady who just died) and FIL had extra key to our house in case we locked ourselves out, etc.  DH and I both worked full time.  I came home from work one day to find a pot of homemade stew in our refrigerator.  Obviously MIL had let herself in and left dinner for us. 

Now I suspect that some folks on this board would be mighty unhappy that MIL let herself in for any reason whatsoever.  MIL was an absolute delight.  I knew anything she said or did was with love and best of intentions.  I found the pot of stew, and rather than get puckered about MIL coming into our house while I was gone, my reaction was that of delight at not having to cook after being in the office all day.  Served DH the delicious stew.  He asked for seconds, but there had only been two servings.  AFter dinner he called to thank his mom for the stew, and teasingly complained that there hadn't been enough - he had wanted seconds and there was no more stew.  The next day I got home from work, opened the fridge and there was MORE stew - because DH had teased about wanting seconds. 

Now I'm guessing that I could have gotten miffed, changed the locks, etc.  But this lovely lady had gone to the trouble of making a delicious meal, shared it with us - and I took her actions as they were intended.  (Hey, who wouldn't want catered meals delivered?) Had I been insecure, I might have guarded "my territory" - but we both loved the same man.  Different facets of him.  She as a mom, me as a wife.  There's plenty of him to share. 

Now would I go to my son and DIL's apartment, let myself in and leave something.  Not only no, but HECK no.  Never in a million years.  Not only are they across the country now, but I never had (nor asked for) a key when they WERE in town.  I am very careful (save that gift delivery slip-up - but then I have learned from this board) not to cross any lines, even though it means putting any personality in a straight jacket when we (rarely) visit.  But I sense that some of today's DILs wouldn't give MILs the benefit of the doubt, and I think that is unfortunate.  Everybody loses. 

[Doe]

Shelby and Pooh, you're both making great points.

It's a challenge trying to maintain old school manners sometimes.

[Shelby]

Manners?  What are those? 

[pam1]

I think most people are reasonable and will give  passes  for a one off or mistakes here and there.  For most, it becomes a problem when it is a consistent pattern of behavior.  And the sad part is that the person with the consistent bad behavior will be the last to ever admit they are wrong.  It's frustrating to deal with anyone like this no matter if they are in your FOO, an in law, co worker  or friend.

That's why I think it's important to look around the person.  Do they have lasting friendships?  Good standing at work? 

[Pooh]

I know it works both ways.  I know there are MILs that don't give the DIL the benefit of the doubt either.  I wouldn't uphold either one of them sending a hate filled email.  I just don't see the point.

Shelby, I'm like you.  If I came home and found my house cleaned, food made, etc. as a surprise, I would be thrilled and grateful.  My Mom has a key to my house to this day as was my OS/DIL given one if they ever needed to come in for any reason.  I also am the MIL that would go to my OS's house and leave dinner or flowers for DIL as a surprise, if they let me.  No snooping, no intruding into spaces I shouldn't be in...just helping...oh wait...I haven't even seen their new house! LOL.

I agree...everyone loses.

[Pooh]

I think most people are reasonable and will give  passes  for a one off or mistakes here and there.  For most, it becomes a problem when it is a consistent pattern of behavior.  And the sad part is that the person with the consistent bad behavior will be the last to ever admit they are wrong.  It's frustrating to deal with anyone like this no matter if they are in your FOO, an in law, co worker  or friend.

That's why I think it's important to look around the person.  Do they have lasting friendships?  Good standing at work?

Great point!

[Pooh]

I went around the world with this, trying to figure out what I was trying to say, and I still can't get it out.  Sorry.

[Scoop]

Pooh - *I* understand where you're coming from.  Lucky for you, it's a position where you knew your MIL's intentions were good.  What I'm asking about is, if there's a history of a tense relationship, then the DIL doesn't automatically assume the MIL's intentions are good.

And you have to admit that the exact same behaviours can be seen many different ways, depending on the person's filter.  So, same situation, DH and DW both work hard, MIL comes in and leaves a pot of stew.  Good right?  But, what if, during previous visits, MIL had made comments about the DW's career interfering with her "taking care" of the DH?  It colours the DW's view of the situation.

The reason this comes up for me is because my MIL would fit right in with the MIL's here.  You all would have GREAT sympathy for her, having to deal with me.  She would deny making any rude comments to me, or just "not remember" them.  But I do.  And it colours our relationship.  It goes both ways too, I'm *sure* I've said things to her that offended/hurt her unintentionally.  That's why I can see, in the OP's situation, where the MIL might think this was a 'first offense', but in the DIL's eyes, it probably wasn't.

I've told you guys before about the internet joke about "What men wish women knew", where the one point was "If I say something to you, and it can be taken 2 ways, and one of those ways makes you cry.  I meant the OTHER way."  I'm really trying to follow that, especially with my DH, but also into my other relationships too.  It's hard with my MIL, because of our history and the fact that I have to break the habit of jumping to the harshest conclusion.  Maybe because I can see that in myself, I can see it in the OP's DIL.

[Shelby]

oh wait...I haven't even seen their new house! LOL.

I agree...everyone loses.

My son and DIL lived in an apartment 3 miles away for over a year.  I was only there once (invited) - the complex is one of many complexes in that area.  I couldn't begin to find the right complex, let alone their apartment - unless I had their street address and Garmin.  But again, when one has to neuter one's personality to be considered tolerable company, it's not really fun, anyway.  I'm going to hang with Pooh and Doe and Pen and Keys and we're all going to Amflautist's party this weekend.