Abusive Relationships - Open Discussion

[Pen]

I think of you everyday, Invisible. Your granddaughter will grow up to understand how important you are to her. In my experience, behavior like your DIL's usually backfires - the "shunned" party becomes all that more attractive to the child. Keep being your loving, strong self.

[Sassy]

Creme I found the info you posted about Abusive Relationships very helpful, and very accurate.

Something else about abusive relationships I have read about is the long-term, even expotential, effects they have.  Its been observed that they tend to replicate themselves in other relationships.  From what I've read, unless there's an interruption in the abusive pattern of some type (therapy, self-examination, confrontation, something?) happens, it's not uncommon for abuse to be repeated in further partner relationships, or even passed down generations.

It seems to be true that people who stay involved in abusive romantic relationships, almost always had a childhood trauma of some kind.   We don't know why.   One theory often bandied about is by seeking out an abusive partner, it's a way victims to try to heal themselves.  Almost as if by thinking "I will relive this, but this time I'm going to win."

Sometimes the effects of abuse are passed in ways other that typical TV-movie style of  "child who was hit, now beats their own child", where the victim becomes the abuser. Sometimes, instead, the child may instead grow up to identify with the victim role.     

So if a child has a loving mother, who does not abuse them in any way, though it would seem they have a shot to grow up to be attracted to healthy relationships, that's not always the case. 

Proabably because there's more than a mother in the family system, and far more going on than one parent alone can possibly regulate.  If the child's mother had a very abusive mother, herself.  (Her mother likely being a victim of abuse up the line).  If the child's father is abusive to the child's mother.  If the child's step-parent was abusive to the child.  The child may identify with the victim, or the victim role, and so recognizes the abusive dynamic as "love" or as "normal".  Excusing the abuser's behavior can becomes a powerful habit that, unless addressed, is hard to break.  And if the "this time I'll win" theory has any validity, then perhaps they're thinking "this time I'll win."

I think what you have shared here is valuable, and worth being aware of.   I add what I've learned to as part of the open discussion.   It breaks my heart to think of anyone's sons and daughters in abusive relationships.  Even saying that word "abuse" out loud hurts, like a physical strike.

Unfortunately, from experiences not related to the nature of this particular forum,  I know more about abusive relationships (and ACOA, and co-dependancy) than I, or any soul, should have to know.  It stinks!

And in the event this post is taken by anyone in a way I certainly do not intend it, I do not think and am not implying there is one single MIL on these boards who abused their sons, no way, no how.

[2chickiebaby]

Sassy, I'm trying hard to understand....if a child is with an alcoholic parent, for example, does that make the child more dominating or does it make them a victim? Or, can it be both??  Sorry, I'm not up on this to be able to understand.

I can see that you do know and I would love to learn. I know I have problems myself so knowing anything that I can see that would help I'd so appreciate your knowledge on the subject.    HELP!

[Invisible]

2 chickiebaby,
I am not special....I am doing what each and every mother on this site would do. I raised this wonder person. He was/is the light of my life. Only his daughter is his living legacy. My GD is all I have left of my son. He would want and expect for me to protect her from harm.

Isn't it amazing, Creme..that Invisible is there, even in her grief to be all there is for her Granddaughter!  How wonderful that she is.  Maybe we could look at it like that....a blessing that she is there!  Nothing can take the place of such grief but Invisible is there.

[2chickiebaby]

Well, I think you're very special...and I think the world of you

[cremebrulee]

Well, I think you're very special...and I think the world of you

I think she's pretty special to...I've been thru this and have personally known women who have also been thru this, and it takes an awful lot of stamina to get thru it...patience, fear, a lot of fear, and stress....it's more then upsetting, it's devestating....believe me....I know....and she is a very special lady to endure such pain....so lets give her all the prayers we can. 

Love you Invisible....

[Invisible]

cremebrulee,

Thank you for your kind words...sounds like you understand what I am going through. Perhaps my GD and I need a few prayers.  But I want you to know your understanding and kind words give me strength.

Well, I think you're very special...and I think the world of you

I think she's pretty special to...I've been thru this and have personally known women who have also been thru this, and it takes an awful lot of stamina to get thru it...patience, fear, a lot of fear, and stress....it's more then upsetting, it's devastating....believe me....I know....and she is a very special lady to endure such pain....so lets give her all the prayers we can. 

Love you Invisible....

[cremebrulee]

cremebrulee,

Thank you for your kind words...sounds like you understand what I am going through. Perhaps my GD and I need a few prayers.  But I want you to know your understanding and kind words give me strength.

Well, I think you're very special...and I think the world of you

I think she's pretty special to...I've been thru this and have personally known women who have also been thru this, and it takes an awful lot of stamina to get thru it...patience, fear, a lot of fear, and stress....it's more then upsetting, it's devastating....believe me....I know....and she is a very special lady to endure such pain....so lets give her all the prayers we can. 

Love you Invisible....

Hey Invisable, we're all in this together, if you hurt, we hurt...

[peggyrice@triad.rr.com]

My son and I were really close until I became the MIL.  This past Christmas she seemed to "take over" and has made the situation really uncomfortable for I and my son.  He emails and says he loves I and his stepfather very much and hopes we can work this out.  It is just so crazy for a DIL to try to ruin  the husband's relationships - if you really love a person, you do not want to hurt them this way.  She first distroyed the relationship my son had with his only brother and now me.  It has just broken my heart so deeply that I can hardly bear it.  We have worked through many situations over time and this is the first my son has "shut down" this way.  The more silent time that passes, the more it hurts.   

[2chickiebaby]

We understand, Peggy, we do.  I know you will find help here.  Welcome.

[2chickiebaby]

Dear Peggy,
I'm so sorry you're going through this.  I want you to know that this is one of the things the DILs do.  It's a stand-off....it is unbearable to be in it. 

She is likely "cutting him from the herd", as Luise says.  He is trying to deal with that right now and it is, I'm sure, very difficult on him as well as you.  I don't know why the DILs do this but they do.

We've all been there and it is the most hurtful thing that can be done to a Mother.  She will demand more and more of his distancing and either he does it or she gets meaner.  It's just the facts.  He has to live with 'it'.  This type of woman doesn't qualify for human hood. It's an 'it'. 

Please know that we are here for you.....stay tuned....

[cremebrulee]

Creme I found the info you posted about Abusive Relationships very helpful, and very accurate.

Something else about abusive relationships I have read about is the long-term, even expotential, effects they have.  Its been observed that they tend to replicate themselves in other relationships.  From what I've read, unless there's an interruption in the abusive pattern of some type (therapy, self-examination, confrontation, something?) happens, it's not uncommon for abuse to be repeated in further partner relationships, or even passed down generations.

It seems to be true that people who stay involved in abusive romantic relationships, almost always had a childhood trauma of some kind.   We don't know why.   One theory often bandied about is by seeking out an abusive partner, it's a way victims to try to heal themselves.  Almost as if by thinking "I will relive this, but this time I'm going to win."

Sometimes the effects of abuse are passed in ways other that typical TV-movie style of  "child who was hit, now beats their own child", where the victim becomes the abuser. Sometimes, instead, the child may instead grow up to identify with the victim role.     

So if a child has a loving mother, who does not abuse them in any way, though it would seem they have a shot to grow up to be attracted to healthy relationships, that's not always the case. 

Proabably because there's more than a mother in the family system, and far more going on than one parent alone can possibly regulate.  If the child's mother had a very abusive mother, herself.  (Her mother likely being a victim of abuse up the line).  If the child's father is abusive to the child's mother.  If the child's step-parent was abusive to the child.  The child may identify with the victim, or the victim role, and so recognizes the abusive dynamic as "love" or as "normal".  Excusing the abuser's behavior can becomes a powerful habit that, unless addressed, is hard to break.  And if the "this time I'll win" theory has any validity, then perhaps they're thinking "this time I'll win."

I think what you have shared here is valuable, and worth being aware of.   I add what I've learned to as part of the open discussion.   It breaks my heart to think of anyone's sons and daughters in abusive relationships.  Even saying that word "abuse" out loud hurts, like a physical strike.

Unfortunately, from experiences not related to the nature of this particular forum,  I know more about abusive relationships (and ACOA, and co-dependancy) than I, or any soul, should have to know.  It stinks!

And in the event this post is taken by anyone in a way I certainly do not intend it, I do not think and am not implying there is one single MIL on these boards who abused their sons, no way, no how.

Sassy, Hi, I very much enjoyed reading this...thank you for taking the time.....

and, your right on...my son's step mother is brutally abusive, more so, verbal, but brutal....she needs to have center stage at all times, she also can be hugely evil, in order to get her way....she hasn't changed, but she's probably surpressed it, and I do know that her mother was dysfunctional....

so allowing my son to live with his father and his step father, at the time, I thought there was no chance of any more physical abuse, being my son was way taller and stronger then her....and I was willing to trust his intuition, but never, at that time, realized the damage that could be done, by him sitting back and watching his father take all of this...and to this day, if I should bring anything, anything up about his stepmother, he defends her to the hilt....so, yes, he saw this behavior and interripted as love....

I also believe my son is co-dependent on my DIL...you see, she is so good at manipulation....she knows exactly how to get to his heart, and he loves her, therefore, she gets whatever she wants, in return, she gives him a huge amount of attention, and pretends to be so needy of him...she's not and never was....she got along fine before she met him...but I believe, the lack of a mother's love, in his most formative years...made him co-dependent...I don't know...at the time, I felt he was older and needed his father's influence...and I SO wanted to do what was best for him....but fear, I did him more harm....then afterwards, he joined the Air Force, then put himself through school, we were apart a good many years...while he did still come to our home every other weekend, it wasn't the same as his step mother and father's behavior influencing him more....

I mentioned to him once, that he and his wife were co-dependent on each other, which isn't healthy...and dooms one to fail....and he argued that co-dependency was good in a marriage relationship...I replied, "No, interdependency is good, but co-dependency is not healthy."

And We mother's can also become co-dependent on our children for happiness...b/c for so many years, our children were our purpose, we gave to them, before ourselves....and to many of us, when they get married, we're shell shocked at the huge change...but life is constantly changing, just to prove to us, we must change with it, or be lost....and when our children marry, we must find other things to do with our lives....invest in our future mentally...we have to, b/c we cannot depend on others for our own happienss....we must create our happiness ourselves...if we hold others responsible, or accountable, then we set them up to fail, along with ourselves.

Just stuff I'm learning along the way....

[cremebrulee]

My son and I were really close until I became the MIL.  This past Christmas she seemed to "take over" and has made the situation really uncomfortable for I and my son.  He emails and says he loves I and his stepfather very much and hopes we can work this out.  It is just so crazy for a DIL to try to ruin  the husband's relationships - if you really love a person, you do not want to hurt them this way.  She first distroyed the relationship my son had with his only brother and now me.  It has just broken my heart so deeply that I can hardly bear it.  We have worked through many situations over time and this is the first my son has "shut down" this way.  The more silent time that passes, the more it hurts.

yes, peggy, it is heartbreaking...painful, despairing, b/c we as mothers only want the best for our children...never in a million years, did I ever see my son, choosing to be married to someone so controlling and manipulative...and it shocks me sometimes that he doesn't see how fake her actions and acts are?  But, love is blind...

I'm so so sorry for your family, and that they are experiencing this...but, always remember, this is your son's choice, and as long as he allows her to treat you all like this, she will....and she will change him...b/c he would sell his soul for her love....love at all costs, is not love, and peace at all costs is not peace...but, to compromise your identity, who you are, for the love of someone else, is failure to see, that, that is not love at all....he should understand, that if she loves him, really loves him, she would not be asking him to turn against his family....so sad...so very sad, the webs we humans weave.

Hugs
Creme

[peggyrice@triad.rr.com]

Normally we could shelter ourselves from the abusive party by simply removing ourselves from the relationship.  When DILs become intrusive and wreck standing relationships it shatters the family.  Families are rooted by the bonds in our hearts.  When one hurts, the pain is felt by all involved.  This morning, I wrote a heartfelt letter to my son and can only hope that he receives it.  I pray with all my heart that it will not make the situation worst.   Other than work, he is isolated now to his wife and child only.  She has removed any communication between he and all the people (father, brother,stepmother, stepfather,past friends) that have supported him in the past 30 years.  I fear for him and have begged him not to let himself be isolated and let his extended family be cut from his life.  He did several tours overseas with the Army and I can not help but wonder if that has left some mark on him.  Those tours brought the entire family closer in support of him and now he is cutting us out since his marriage last year.  I keep searching for reason where none exists and keep praying that things will work out.  He is so intelligent.  I think he is just trying to be a good husband and somehow does not realize that being a good husband does not mean giving up your life!  She is so insecure and selfish.  I can not believe that she loves him.  If she did truly love him, she would not distry the life he had before he married her.

[2chickiebaby]

Dear Peggy,
First of all, I am so sorry...we all are sorry when someone else goes through this.  It is heartbreaking and you always wonder what you've done.  I know you go over and over it trying to find an answer and there is none.

It could be some slight she thinks she has been given from you or your family.  If not that, it's "cutting him from the herd" (Luise says that is often the case)

If she is cutting him from the herd, like I suspect, there is nothing you can do but stand by and watch it.  Talking to them both might make it worse for you.  I've heard the way the DILs talk (some of them) and they say "I have set our boundaries, DH agrees (uh huh) and she is breaking the rules!!"

So the letter probably is good but if she sees it, be ready in case she feels that you have broken her boundaries.  They might lose their souls but those boundaries are going too, you know. 

Here for you, Peggy