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Why do our sons "obey" princess wives?!

Started by justanoldgrandma, August 18, 2011, 09:17:00 PM

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RedRose

They allow their wifes to treat them that way because they don't want to argue..they want to keep the peace. They have to live with each other. I have personally heard my ex- DIL threaten my son with NO SEX if he didn't do things her way all the time...everytime.

You don't have to change your priorities just because you get married. Respect for each other is all that is needed and respect for each others familys.

My son finally grew a spine and divorced her.


pam1

I think a lot of it has to do with wanting too.  I don't know many of the male species who don't do exactly what they want, when they want.  My DH will make plans with his buddies, sometimes including me and DD, sometimes not.  Before I quit inserting myself in his relationship with his FOO, I was the only one playing ball with them.  DH had took his ball and went home long before I did.  In our case, he went along to see his FOO to appease me, not his FOO.

It's just been my observation reading here and other boards aimed at IL issues that my situation is not anywhere near abnormal, this is typical.  For whatever reason, DH does not feel it is worth it.  Instead of him going to talk to his mother when issues started cropping up (before I was even involved with him) he buried his head in the sand.

I can't say he is right or wrong, beyond including me in a relationship that he won't put work in.  I think he had a responsibility to let me know what was going on in his head regarding his mother.  But other than that, I think most of the time it goes back to it's between Mom and adult Son, somewhere there was a breakdown and DIL is caught in the cross hairs.
People throw rocks at things that shine - Taylor Swift

Belle

RedRose you are so right.  It baffles me how people can allow themselves to be treated that way...but at the end of the day its not up to me.  If people choose to subject themselves to that lifestyle, its none of my business.

I think where so many people get tripped up in the "respect" issue is their own personal definitions of "respect."  In some families and cultures, the matriarch is to be feared and revered...that is her definition of "honor."  Her every whim is to be catered to without question.  My MIL comes from that train of thought, although apparently she adopted it for herself.  Everyone has told me that her mother was not like that, and her sisters are definitely not like that.  The fits she throws when she doesn't get her definition of respect are quite comical.  Even DH doesn't quite understand it...he says she was never like this until he started dating and forming serious relationships.  Our definitions of respect are quite different, and that's mostly where we clash.  I just can't do enough for her...and now neither can DH. 

Rose799

Pam, does your mil know where you stand on the issue?  I'm just wondering if she's made the effort to work with ds rather than go through you?

lancaster lady

I wish someone would explain why my Ds allowed himself to be persuaded to become a dad while living
in a house that belonged to his GF's FOO.
After the baby was born they were asked to leave while remaining friends with her FOO.
They then rented a house which they couldn't afford .
Then my FDIL began planning  wedding when she knew they couldn't contribute anything towards it !
Is this a case of I want , and I want it now ?
No forward planning , no consideration of who would pay for everything.
Also when they asked her FOO to take them in , they were refused .
So the FMIL who was denied access to her GD was asked to rescue this poor delusional family .
I wish my DS had separated his brains from other parts of his body and actually sat down
and thought things out before jumping in with both feet .

Who knows what takes over our DS when they become entangled with the other sex !

Smilesback@u

Thank you for this thread so I can add my heartfelt thoughts.  Just having come back from visiting GC, 2 and 4 yo, I have fresh feelings and perceptions that bother me about the Princess Bride and Groom.  If you can indulge me a bit here, I'd appreciate it and try to get to the point.  Without going into my trip too much and giving too much attention and energy to that part of me that really makes me feel miserable, just let me say, *expectations* - *feelings* - these are changeable.  My experience influences me, but does not rule my behavior.  I have a head on my shoulders and moral direction and with the help of  WWU, I can *keep my eyes on the target*.  I got a lot of support from WWU before going to the visit and I think more now about what I learned and I think more about what I want from family and how to say that too.  Although I am no saint - neither are DS and DIL, that certainly levels the playing field so who ever is the host and whoever is the guest will help determine the appropriate behaviors.  Civilization is based on being polite and having manners.  Very common, typical stuff to have issues in the family, I agree.  It is the woman's right to build a nest and make the marriage rules, in order to raise children in a safe and secure home.  Men have input, but don't really care all that much, just tell them the rules and be consistent.  Women who rock the cradle really do rock the nation - I think we do!  I just need to realize that when I visit I only see a very very small part of their lives together -- seems less organized and predictable than I would like, but then that's my impression and certainly for sure is not the whole Truth.  I can cut me some slack for saying to get rid of all the junk food that it is not good for the girls -- as I wanted to fight back a little and say what I was thinking.  And I can cut them some slack for not ever cooking a meal for us, or offering to pick up the tab when we ate out.  So, sometimes there is hope for me -- like me noticing that what is a lot more important to me than my feelings, expectations, impressions etc, is getting to see the GC and feel part of their lives.  I am learning to work things out with my Son too - it is kinda touchy, but I am learning to be respectful nonetheless of their own lifestyle.  They do not necessarily want to *hang out* with 60 year olds who also are their parents/ILs.  That being said, after coming home, my DH and I spelled out to each other how unwelcome we felt with not being invited to a home cooked meal, or being offered to pick up the tab when we ate out.  But we were asked to come back after the girls were put to bed which we did and talked with the grownups; and, we also did not impose on them during the work week after we dropped off the girls.  Oh wells, poor us, we are no longer the primary roles in our family, right?  More importantly, now what will we do next?  We just bought our tickets for Thanksgiving to go visit them for a week.  LOL   :o  Again, we will stay at a B&B for a couple nights, again babysit so the parents will go away a couple nights, then stay a couple more nights back at the B&B.  We are still invited to sleep on the couch if we want - our choice is B&B thanks anyways - it is worth it to get a good night's sleep.  I have my limits too on cooking and cleaning -- Not Being In Charge of the Thanksgiving Dinner - but will I refuse to help?  Heck no - it is not who I AM.  I am more than happy to help where DIL would like me to (which is everything and everywhere - sorry couldn't help myself from saying that there).   I can and will be more than happy to set table, watch the kids, make a salad, make dessert, clean the kitchen, baste the bird, make stuffing -- you name it, but I refuse to do it all, and I refuse to let every little slight spoil my visit!  And that's how we are going to keep going, rant here and with my DH, and deal with things directly with Son in a respectful way.  I probably should apologize for criticizing the pantry full of junk food (I will apologize).  My point here is just that in our family it is not going to be acceptable to cut off, to give up, to hate, over stuff we can learn to deal with, because we are family.  We are it - we make it good and get through the bad.  We will work things out -- and that's what I learned, it is more important to me than the other crap.  My DS/DIL have their perceptions and feelings too --- why should mine be more important than theirs?  I chose to be a hardworking Mom and wife -- and in the end I got a divorce and dealt with teenagers dealing with drug issues.  Thank GOD, I recovered from my ex's extramarital affairs, thank GOD I was told about Al-Anon, and Thank God I have another day to learn to love more not only my family and friends, but myself as well.  thanks WWU - I appreciate being able to bring these feelings to the surface -- and  let them go.  I hope you can take what you want and leave the rest.  Peace, hugs.   

Rose799


pam1

Quote from: Rose799 on August 19, 2011, 01:22:37 PM
Pam, does your mil know where you stand on the issue?  I'm just wondering if she's made the effort to work with ds rather than go through you?

Yes and no.  We had a series of a couple hour long conversations each where I could talk a tiny bit, she'd ask for an example and then tell me the ways I misinterpret or misunderstood.  Or, this was her fall back response, was that DH did not act like an adult before he and I were engaged so she is justified for her current behaviors. 

She does have a point, he didn't act like an adult.  They both engaged in an odd adult son/mother relationship, she would do things like shop for gifts for him to give others and he would pay her back.  So yes, she definitely has a point but again, it's an issue with her son and doesn't relate to why she chooses to make her issues with him my fault.

DH has had one conversation with her so far and apparently she pulled the same thing with him, asked for an example, then told him how he was wrong and misinterpreted and when that didn't work she spent the rest of the convo telling him how I was a crappy parent.

I don't know where we go from here, I'm not sure there is any where to go lol.  I'm working on letting go for now, I feel I really did try my best and maybe it was just meant to be a lesson for me.  Here is a person with so much and this is what can happen when there are no limits?  LOL, I don't know.   GMIL (MIL's mother) has said several times to me she knows that MIL has issues, she's been like that since she was a child.  It made me think of all the parents who say they gave their kids everything, maybe that is the problem.  When you have so much, you don't care what you lose? 
People throw rocks at things that shine - Taylor Swift

Belle

SB@U - i want you to know how wonderful it was for me to read your post.  I think you sound like a wonderful MIL, and I would probably trade you for mine any.day.of.the.week.  But it's not because you're super-dee-duper nice and pleasant all the time, but because you have taken that "step back" that all mothers of adult children must learn to do.  You've realized how to pick your battles and zip-the-lip for the sake of salvaging the relationship you have with DS and DIL.  We all ahve to do that, MILs and DILs alike.  You've realized that you shouldn't be first-and-foremost in your son's life anymore, but that YOU are responsible for your own emotional well-being and happiness.  And that, to me, sounds very wise indeed. 

Smilesback@u

Thank you Belle, for recognizing that I am working through my stuff - I like how you put it and will certainly take your feedback to heart - step back, pick my battles, and zip the lip and realize that I am not the primary relationship with my dear Son.  (BTW, Belle fits you - means beautiful :)  Thank you again for affirming me.  I did enjoy mothering my sons when they were young and thought I was preparing them to be good husbands someday - not a Mommy's boy.  Now, you are also right, to say that I am responsible for making myself happy or miserable now about my new role - how true is that -- You are a Wise Woman also.  Thanks,

Rose799

Quote from: pam1 on August 19, 2011, 02:30:41 PM
GMIL (MIL's mother) has said several times to me she knows that MIL has issues, she's been like that since she was a child.  It made me think of all the parents who say they gave their kids everything, maybe that is the problem.  When you have so much, you don't care what you lose?

I replied but somehow lost it, so this may appear twice.  I remember you saying that your mil has BPD, Pam.  I'm not sure how that reflects how she is with you & ds, but I am a firm believer in Maya Angelou's quote, "When you know better, you do better."  Maybe she doesn't know any better, Pam.   I note here at WWU, the majority, like Smilesback@u, are open to working things out.  Your being here shows your willingness, Pam.  I hope that your mil knows better soon & will meet you part way.  Don't lose hope.  My df was pretty set in his ways, but he mellowed along with the years. 

((hugs))

pam1

Thanks, Rose :)  Yes, she was diagnosed with BPD and depression.  I try to think she doesn't know any better but there are large parts of me that really do think she knows what she is doing is wrong, otherwise she wouldn't lie when she was caught.  Or she'd be more willing to say these things to me or DH directly rather than saying them to the other or other people entirely.  For all her issues, it has never been clear that she doesn't know what she is doing, she is very good at manipulation.

I think there might be an element that she doesn't know the reaction she is getting now.  Up until recently she as able to get away with this kind of stuff, people will drop it b/c it was too much effort in talking to her.  DH and I haven't recently and I think she just doesn't realize that neither of us are in the mood or right frame of mind to put up with this stuff. 
People throw rocks at things that shine - Taylor Swift

Keys Girl

I just want to point out that you can never tell why people do what they do.  Some people don't even know why they are doing certain things.  I will say that if my son is a spineless wimp, he didn't learn that from me.  I taught him to stand up for what he wanted to and to express that verbally from the time he was a toddler.  I don't know where this spiteful, hateful and disdainful person came from but I suspect my ex had a hand in that.  I have seen many circumstances where a strong mother, a wife who calls the shots, produce a passive husband, and I wouldn't discount passive aggressive either. (at least in my case)

But trying to understand why people do what they do is just another way to explain it to ourselves.  It's a bit of a salve for the wounds.  I don't think it makes much difference in the end.  If you are treated badly by your adult children, they are choosing to do so and at some point in time, I expect my son's choice to limit his expectations for a future relationship with me.

I know I'll be pushing up daisies by the time it comes to that but I would like to see how he deals with his son(s) and their future wives........ooohhh to be a fly on the wall.......looking down from heaven.  (You didn't think I was going to hell did you?)

"Today I will be as happy as a seagull with a french fry." Author Unknown

Pen

I'm a DIL as well as a MIL, which I'm guessing most MILs here are or have been. I've had one awful MIL, one wonderful MIL, and currently have a rather sour, suspicious step-MIL I'd not met until recently. It gives one a broader perspective, I think, to have experienced both sides. Having never been a spoiled princess it never would have occurred to me to influence either of my DHs to turn against their FOOs or fade away from them.

It shocked me when DIL and her FOO started the takeover, and it continues to bother me although DS has stood up to them and reassures us that we are important to him and that he loves us. DH won't say anything but I could tell he was hurt when DS recently told us all about car shopping with his FIL. That's just one example of many regarding the takeover.

DS obeys DIL & her FOO because they can provide the shiny, new stuff. We just provided the boring old stuff that made DS's shiny new life possible.
Respect ... is appreciation of the separateness of the other person, of the ways in which he or she is unique.
-- Annie Gottlieb

pam1

Hey Pen, I saw this article and thought of you.  http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/02/fashion/02studied.html 

It is something I suspect for a long time.
People throw rocks at things that shine - Taylor Swift