Good Afternoon

[cremebrulee]

Creme, I worry about what kind of life my son & grandchildren are having constantly.  I don't want to cause him any more pain, but I also want to see my grandchildren.  It is hard.  I love my son dearly & want him to be happy, BUT it ticks me off no end when he allows his wife to treat us unfairly because of HER insecurities.  She says no just because she has the power to do that.  She finds any & every loophole to keep us from spending quality time with our grandchildren.  The last time we went out with my son, dil, & grandchildren, dil seemed resentful, & granddaughter did nothing but whine (GD probably picked up on her moms feelings, I don't think dil wanted to go), so we were all upitght.  She always has some lame excuse why we can't do this or that.  Even something as simple as taking grandchildren to a movie.  I am just so tired of her antics, & wish son would put a stop to them.  I know son agrees with us, he has told us dil is unreasonable, but won't do anything about it because he doesn't want to listen to dil go on about it for months.  He is also afraid of her temper.  She has done some scary things in the past.

Your son and my son won't do anything about it, b/c if he tries...there will be hell to pay...believe me....I have seen my son in action...he forgot I was there, all he was worried about and so nervous about, was that he went along with the men when they were cracking jokes about marriage...

Yes, it is human nature to want the best for your children...and when something like this happens, the only thing you can do is say to
yourself, "This is HIS Life, HIS decission, it's his turn to live life, and if he chooses to do it unwisely, then so be it. 

When are children are small, they're faily easy to raise, but when they grow up and leave the house...that is when the heartaches start...and there is nothing we can do...we no longer have control over they're lives...they know what's going on...they would just prefer to stick they're heads in the sand...and no matter what, they're is nothing YOU or I can do about it...and quit frankly I wouldn't want to...b/c for some reason, they are going thru they're very own, natural process of life....will there be damage done to they're children, my grand daughter, heck yeah....but that is not for us to say...the only thing we can do, is be there for them, if and when they need someone someday...and never, ever talk against her...

Your son, also has a lot to loose...remember, you said children...therefore, if he leaves, he looses everything...do you realize, how difficult it is for a man, to pay support and alimony, and then he does finally meet a decent girl, and he cannot afford both families.  Very sad....

And your son and mine are not free from the guilt of this.  I blame my son even more then her...for not putting down his foot from the very beginning.  He told me once, a long time ago, that she was so bad, he was going to leave her...I wish he would have....he is trapped now, he loves his daughter, he knows, her mother made a living out of marrying men all her life, and then taking them for all she could get...her mother never worked a day in her life?  And my DIL, would take my son to the cleaners...believe me....

Hey, it's his choice...it's your son's choice...there is nothing we can do, but pray.  Sorry, I know how painful it is to hear that.  I really do.

As far as the other DIL sites...believe me, they do feed off of it, like Chickie has stated...but, there are, some nice DIL's there to, they just fear not going along with the crowd...they are followers, unable to make they're own decissions...so, they follow the bullies....yanno?

[2chickiebaby]

Anna, be glad that your son has the courage to say, "I know, Mom"....that means the world!!

[cremebrulee]

I have to admit that I peeked at one of those sites & was horrified, absolutely horrified.  I never felt that way about my mil.  Oh, we had our problems. but I always respected her, & applauded her for the wonderful job she did raising my husband.  She did not have an easy time.  With 4 children she was left on her own, & she did the best she could.  We have a wonderful, loving, relationship now.  The women on "those" sites are so hateful.  How can they live like that?  Glad I don't have that much hate in my heart !!!

My own MIL was intruding...and could sometimes be a pain, but she had a good side as well...she cared....it was just that she was used to being independent and she raised her brothers...so she was used to being the matron...

I could not have lived with myself if I would have tried to estrange my husband from her...it's just not right.

I believe there are just as many bad MIL's out there, as well as DIL's...but, there are also some very good ones, who were just very passionate and entergetic about having a DIL and probably stepped over boundaries...also, when your young and first married, a yound DIL sometimes takes a MIL's suggestions as berating her, when it is not meant that way at all...

And as far as that comment, the sins of the father's shall befall the son's...I meant me and every single one of us...but, it was directed in that post, at those DIL's who are unfair and cruel to their MIL's.  Beleive me, if I'm wrong I'll get my share back to....

Some of those DIL's did try to help in the beginning, but then, one of them said..."OH, I could be cooking dinner, but instead I'm in here trying to help you"....sheeesh? 

And yes, they were giving me they're points of view...but they were not seeing or refused to acknowledge the awful things my DIL did, they were excusing her actions...and then when I tried to defend my postion, of course I was wrong and she was right.  They were DIL's and saw me as they're own...so, there was nothing I could have said or done, that would have changed they're minds....

A normal person, does not willing estranger her husband and her children from the MIL.  or Inlaws, unless they're is an substance abuse or abuse problem of any kind...

If you don't like your MIL...you still would encourage your husband to remain close to his family...if you love your husband, and really understand what love is...you don't whine to him about his mother...that is disrespectful and very selfish.  A mother and son, need to have a relationship and believe me, I know many, many DIL's who have no problems with their MIL's.  They don't have a reason to be in here writing, therefore they're not here, but if they were, and saw what some DIL's write they would also hammer them. 

I read once a woman, was not even married yet....and she didn't say why but her inlaws to be, would not pay for the liqure at their wedding....therefore, she made a statement saying..."when we're married, they will never see they're son again, or they're grandchildren".  Literally, that man was in for a big surprise...and a very sad life ahead.

You don't have to like people...not everyone sees eye to eye....but to be down right cruel...nasty and estrange your husband from his family is cruel....and the husbands go along with it to keep peace...they don't want problems and are afraid to put they're foot down. 

I work with nothing but young girls my DIL's age, and do not have a problem with any of them...never had a problem with my SIL's, and the one I didn't care for...the other, I loved dearly...but...to disrespect each other, to be mean to each other, to actually estrange your husband and put him in a position that he feels like he has to choose, is down right evil.  OK, so you don't get along with her...so what...you don't go out of your way to be mean, and to let her know she is not welcome...you tolerate it and be kind....for the small amount of time we're together, there is no reason why things can't be worked out...but no, we've got play out this huge drama scene that our MIL's are so evil, so cruel....so that they're husband's have to go along with them...that is so unfair.  Suck it up and ignore some things...I wish I had...I really do. 

My DIL told me off...she was thowing things away that I was sending my GD...lotsa money spent there...found everything wrong with what I sent my GD...why?  Because she wants to be the only one to give to her...
My DIL yelled at me, that I never ask to talk to her, that I never call her, (this was when she was pregnant)  I didn't think she wanted me to, after the way she treated me?  I knew she hated me from the start.  So, I started calling her...a lot...she never answered the phone and only returned phone calls if I said something to my son.

She said to my son once, (just to give you an idea) do you think I should call your mother?(she was playing her game) If she wanted to really call me, she wouldn't have asked him his permission, she was pretending to care. 

She was angry at me, b/c I wouldn't eat breakfast, yet my son told her before I came, I don't eat breakfast, so what does she do, she puts out this big spread....and I couldn't eat...and oh, she was so hurt?  Hog wash, that was deliberate, just like everything else she does.

So, when they came to my house, several times, what does she do, she barely eats.  I even invited her to join us in a Super Bowl Day event, while my son was working...she said, sure, she'd come.  She comes, asks whose coming and leaves 2 minutes later...did I get upset...NO!  Maybe something else came up?  Maybe she wasn't feeling good?  Maybe she was tired, cuz she just got off of work and what sounded good before, now, all she wanted to do was to get home and unwind?

Have I gotten over this, no, I never will...as I said, some days are great, others are very sad...and it's so easy for someone else to tell you to move on, especially those who are not going thru this...or DIL's.  This is a LIFE CHANGING EVENT, it tears your heart out...in my case, my DIL and son live far away...we only saw each other maybe twice a year...but it bothers her so much when we are together that she is deprived of attention from him, that she acts out...even if that means, getting up in the middle of a conversation and walking out of the house...how rude is that...but, he follows, b/c he doesn't know what's going on, he is embarrassed and what that does is set the scene for another rejection from her, she got his attention back, didn't she? 

If when my son was young, one of his friends who came to the house acted like that once, they would no longer be welcome!  I'm talking we had 6 - 8 kids in and out for years...and they were all good kids...so was my son...but, he spent his most formative years, watching his father suck it up, while his step mother nagged his father to death...and thinks his wife's behavior is normal.  It is not only not normal, but, it is unacceptable...would she treat anyone else like this?  No...she restrains....why?  My son's friends told me, when they got together all they did was talk about what an awesome cook I was....how they enjoyed me, they'd share stories...she was never close to her mother, so, that scared her...she feared my son loving me more then her...so, she set out to destroy it...and she did.

Am I over it...never...not unless she changes her attitude, and we sit down and talk...but, she can't....say, yanno, Creme, I was wrong, I'm sorry...then I'd say, yanno, I'm really sorry you took things like that, I didn't mean them the way they must have sounded, I understand now...poof, forgotten and forgiven...but when a person refuses to sit down and talk, that means, they don't want to...and never will...

[Pen]

Wow. Again, my heart goes out to all the MILs who have to deal with these hurtful situations!

Luckily for DH and me, so far, DS has stood up for his right to see us. At least we get to see him sometimes, although it frequently feels like we get the leftovers. My dad had the same problem with my stepmother -  he had to sneak around to visit me because of her jealousy. She was/is really cruel to me. Honestly, I'm no threat...just a bumbling, regular gal of no particular distinction. When it isn't sad, it's pretty amusing

[cremebrulee]

Wow. Again, my heart goes out to all the MILs who have to deal with these hurtful situations!

Luckily for DH and me, so far, DS has stood up for his right to see us. At least we get to see him sometimes, although it frequently feels like we get the leftovers. My dad had the same problem with my stepmother -  he had to sneak around to visit me because of her jealousy. She was/is really cruel to me. Honestly, I'm no threat...just a bumbling, regular gal of no particular distinction. When it isn't sad, it's pretty amusing

I'm so sorry this is happening to you...but proud of your son, that is the way it should be.

If his wife or any man's wife, do not like the inlaws...then he should say..."

"OK, you don't have to like them....but you do have to understand, that I have to and will continue a relationship with my family...when I go over, your more then welcome to come along, but if you do, you behave yourself and I won't have you beratting my family, or them you...it works both ways"

When men do that right from the get go, it usually works...but to let something like this go on for years and years, is just so ridiculous.  And one of the comments my son made was...."Well, you know a lot of inlaws don't get a long"....he is always excusing the fact....

I told my one Girlfriend that, the one who has 5 DIL's...and she went balistic...there are a lot more inlaws that get along then not...and she said, yours is the extreme...he knows her, he knows you, how in the world can he not be seeing what is going on?

[isitme?]

I won't have you beratting my family, or them you...it works both ways"

It DOES work both ways.  I feel so terrible for you ladies with these mean DILs.  The truth is you DO suffer more because you are losing a son in the process.  It sounds like many of you try to respect your DILs but don't get it back.  But if you DID berate her, would you expect your son to stand up for her and tell YOU to treat her with respect?  Or would you expect him to keep quiet and let you say what you wanted to because you are his mother?

Why is it that we rarely hear from MIL's about losing their daughters?  Do girls just naturally stay closer to their mom's? (in my experience this has been a mixed bag... lost my own mother young but have female friends and family members with differing levels of relationships with their own moms.. from hardly ever speaking to being SUPER close... most fall somewhere in-between).  Or is it that MILs have different expectations from their sons than from daughters?  I know people like to pull out the whole oedipal thing - but that's not always the case is it?

[cremebrulee]

To answer your question, I would expect my son to be fair...and to call me on my mistakes right away...as well as his wife...it would be a start, wouldn't it?  We could all sit down and discuss it...and then, poof, gone, and moving forward, like most people do...for her to hate me for this many years...and I haven't seen my GD in four years now...can you imagine?  She'll also teach her to dislike me...but yet, when they lived at home for a year, I was ok to babysit every single weekend...yanno when they left, she never said, took me aside and said, "Thanks for all you did for us"....she picked apart the fact that b/c I took my Grand daughter out for breakfast every sunday morning, she insists I gave her coke?  I did nothing of the sorts, but I just let her talk...and that's when my son should intervien and say?  How do you know she gave her coke, and why do you bring that up all the time...? 

Or maybe I should have said something to that effect?  Fought my own battles...?  I used to think she was pushing me on purpose to snap in front of my son, and I didn't...I'd just clam up...big time...and kept telling myself...keep your mouth shut creme, keep it shut....LOL

I dunno? 

[isitme?]

that sounds totally reasonable.  Any person should be called out on their bad behavior.  Whether it is a MIL or DIL, sometimes they react very badly to this however, and it trains the poor guy to just keep quiet because he doesn't want to get caught in the middle OR get in trouble himself.  But then whoever is gettign attacked (the innocent MIL or DIL) gets attacked.  and no one puts a stop to it.  and everybody gets hurt and suffers. 

I would LOVE it if when my FMIL is sniping at me or even saying terrible things about me behind my back, if my BF could just say "mom, I love you but I"m not going to let you talk about her that way"  or even a more stronger worded "what you're saying is not true etc. etc.".  But they can't do this and it's very hurtful that they don't.

[cremebrulee]

Glitterati

I truly hope you find some peace soon.  It sucks to be stuck in the same emotional rut and to not be able to to be unwilling to move forward.  I've been there...and from your past and current postings...it seems you may be, too.

Polize don't patronize me, and pretend with nice words.  I'm not at all stuck in an emotional rut...what changes have occured in my life have been purposeful...I've grown stronger, and have been able to help and sympathize with a lot of women who have or are going thru this....learned from them to, since I started writing about it...learned a lot...so, sorry if I'm not all thankful for your post, but I'm still gunshy from DIL's or woman that found it much more inportant to be a follower and in a click to post contradictory stuff like this to me, and then go back and email each other and write each other, laughing, mocking and egging me on.  I didn't get it then, but now I'm gunshy...so if your legitiment..I apologize, but something tells me, your words wouldn't have come out the same way if you were.

And yes, of course, why would you take it any other way?  it works both ways...whatever I dish out in life, I get back two fold....

Creme

[cremebrulee]

that sounds totally reasonable.  Any person should be called out on their bad behavior.  Whether it is a MIL or DIL, sometimes they react very badly to this however, and it trains the poor guy to just keep quiet because he doesn't want to get caught in the middle OR get in trouble himself.  But then whoever is gettign attacked (the innocent MIL or DIL) gets attacked.  and no one puts a stop to it.  and everybody gets hurt and suffers. 

I would LOVE it if when my FMIL is sniping at me or even saying terrible things about me behind my back, if my BF could just say "mom, I love you but I"m not going to let you talk about her that way"  or even a more stronger worded "what you're saying is not true etc. etc.".  But they can't do this and it's very hurtful that they don't.

Yup, I hear ya...and it should be that way....and think about this....if they would call us on each other, it would open the door to conversing about the situation...yanno?

[2chickiebaby]

Isitme, your BF should protect you.  My DH tries to keep the peace at all cost so therefore, I don't feel protected. He just sits there and doesn't say a word.  He sees me devastated and tries to get me to feel better. 

He will say occasionally, "this has been the most hurtful thing of my life". Then,  he'll change the **((*$#)*##*# subject. PUKEHEAD SCUMBUCKET SWEET GUY

Men must be like that.  I think it's terrible. 

[cremebrulee]

Isitme, your BF should protect you.  My DH tries to keep the peace at all cost so therefore, I don't feel protected. He just sits there and doesn't say a word.  He sees me devastated and tries to get me to feel better. 

He will say occasionally, "this has been the most hurtful thing of my life". Then,  he'll change the **((*$#)*##*# subject. PUKEHEAD SCUMBUCKET SWEET GUY

Men must be like that.  I think it's terrible.

LOL...laughing with ya dear...
I agree, but can't help but find humor in it as well....
men...?? 

Yanno, if we are so bad...how can our DIL's love their husbands so much...we raised them, they are part of us?? 

Think about it.

[cremebrulee]

OMG, I do come with spectators...don't I, there were over 640 views on this thread...can you imagine?  The DIL's I guess, the ones from the other sites...Sheesh...

[isitme?]

thanks.  I think it helps me to hear that it's not wrong of my to expect my BF to stand up for me and protect me.   I don't want him to have to do this by cutting out his mother!  But it's so hurtful that he just sits back and takes it.  He let's her talk about him that way as well.  It took me a while to see it but one day we were at FMIL's house and she was just going on and on about what terrible career choices he had made and how he had never done anything worthwhile because he was interested in being an "academic" (like me) which doesn't make any money.  I thought she was being really really unfair to him but I didn't say anything because I thought it wasn't my place to get involved in an argument between him and his mother.  but now I"m finding out that she has NEVER supported him.  To the outside world I think she brags about him, but privately she abuses him like this.  Telling him he has never done anything right.  OMG, he is an MD and also has a JD from Yale!  He once told me that he felt I was the only one who had ever given him any support in his life.  I almost cried when he said that because I felt so bad and I had always assumed he came from a close family.  He's such a wonderful person.  I have to give his mom at least the credit for raising him.  But now I"m noticing that he has issues that stem from all these things.  He can't directly stand up to her for himself, and now he can't directly stand up to her for me.  And that hurts me in so many ways.  I have a harder time trusting him now but I also feel bad seeing this family relationship erode away. 

I'm sorry your husband also doesn't say anything.  You know, we are always going back and forth about what DIL did and how she is and what MIL said and what's she's like, but how often do we look at the MEN involved and examine the role they play in all of this?  Men really are different from women.... 

[Glitterati]

Glitterati

I truly hope you find some peace soon.  It sucks to be stuck in the same emotional rut and to not be able to to be unwilling to move forward.  I've been there...and from your past and current postings...it seems you may be, too.

Polize don't patronize me, and pretend with nice words.  I'm not at all stuck in an emotional rut...what changes have occured in my life have been purposeful...I've grown stronger, and have been able to help and sympathize with a lot of women who have or are going thru this....learned from them to, since I started writing about it...learned a lot...so, sorry if I'm not all thankful for your post, but I'm still gunshy from DIL's or woman that found it much more inportant to be a follower and in a click to post contradictory stuff like this to me, and then go back and email each other and write each other, laughing, mocking and egging me on.  I didn't get it then, but now I'm gunshy...so if your legitiment..I apologize, but something tells me, your words wouldn't have come out the same way if you were.

And yes, of course, why would you take it any other way?  it works both ways...whatever I dish out in life, I get back two fold....

Creme

The intent wasn't patronizing.  As I said...I was a lurker.  I don't know about any pm's or emails that occurred among the registered members.

I wondered about the bolded...because it seemed to say parenting was gonna come back and bite dil's in the butt as far as future relationships with their dil's.  If thats the case...then rather than your son acting the way he acts because of dil...why wouldn't it be because of your parenting?  That's how I took it...but I don't think that's how it was meant.