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Needing help understanding MIL and how to deal

Started by Rejected, February 09, 2011, 11:11:28 PM

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Pooh

Quote from: Laurie on February 10, 2011, 01:33:31 PM
What I got from my parents is my race and my genes.. The rest is pretty much developed over time with a lot more influences then just my parents.

**ha ha... I guess my race is part of my genes.. but you're following**

No, I never follow you....I just pretend to so you will not call me names. ;D
We must let go of the life we have planned, so as to accept the one that is waiting for us. -
Joseph Campbell

luise.volta

I can sure see why DH's other siblings live out of state. How handy that they can dump it all on DH and then complain that he's not doing it right. I have a short (as in no) fuse with anyone who yells at me and/or mine. I also have the same thing going on with anyone who doesn't listen and partner with me. I think you have done everything possible and do not need to continue to wet-nurse this perpetual two-year-old. IMHO - it is time to move...change phone numbers and put in a security system. My son would write me off in a New York Minute if I pulled that kind of stuff on him and he's a very loving, giving, compassionate and sensitive man. Sending love...
Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible. Dalai Lama

Rejected

Thank again for all the comments! Thank you Pooh for pointing that out! We don't have to put up with DH's siblings and them telling him to take care of their mom better or visit her more. Since DH and I cut back on our visiting with MIL one of his siblings & his family have moved back(for work) and live 30 min away and they hang out with MIL so much and give DH a hard time because we don't do as much as they do. DH said to his B "I took care of mom for the last 8 years, now it's your turn." His B doesn't agree with that mainly because he's not a handyman at all so MIL has been hiring more and more handymen lately to fix things around her house which is costing her money, but that's not our problem anymore.  ;D

Justus you are right on! I have cut back on my answers to MIL making them less informative but I could still be more vague and I will definitely work on that. Also, I had never thought of this until you pointed it out, that it really is her own choice being lonely. Thank you for helping me see that!

DH has hung up on her a few times, usually when the swearing begins, and she never uses the really bad words but still, it's show disrespect. He has also walked out on her yelling at him and peeled out in her driveway a few times, but she doesn't learn. He needs to do it every time though, not just sometimes. Thankfully she hardly ever gets the opportunity to yell at him anymore since the only times we see her are during holidays or special occasions when others are around so she minds her yelling, but it doesn't stop the making fun & laughing at him and passive aggressive comments to the both of us which is only why we stay for around an hour.  :)

Anyway, thanks again to everyone. It means so much to me to have your support!
"Women are Angels and when someone breaks our wings... we simply continue to fly --- on a broomstick... we are flexible."  ~Anonymous

Pooh

Ha ha ha rejected!  Is your icon the evil stepmother in Snow White?
We must let go of the life we have planned, so as to accept the one that is waiting for us. -
Joseph Campbell

LaurieS

Quote from: Rejected on February 11, 2011, 07:49:18 AM
He has also walked out on her yelling at him and peeled out in her driveway a few times, but she doesn't learn. He needs to do it every time though, not just sometimes.
I just spent 936.00 on tires this week.. I think I'd just slam the door to make my point.

cremebrulee

February 11, 2011, 05:43:02 PM #20 Last Edit: February 11, 2011, 05:48:00 PM by cremebrulee
Quote from: Pooh on February 10, 2011, 01:15:51 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 10, 2011, 12:01:18 PM
Quote from: cremebrulee on February 10, 2011, 06:11:50 AM
You see, we are products of our parents or whoever raised us....and we adopt they're cultures....if parents who are uneducated believe in spitting and eating with they're fingers, that is what they're children will grow up to believe....

We adopt our parents thoughts, virtues, beliefs, bad habits, everything....


Do you really  believe this?  Is that how most people here on this forum think and the thoughts they accept?

No I don't believe that in totality.  I do believe we do follow in some things of our parents.  I do take after my Mother/GM on many things as far as they raised me to be responsible, have work ethics, values, integrity, respect for others, that family was important, etc..  But as an older teenager and young adult, I made a choice to keep following those beliefs. 

To me, that is like blaming everything your child does on peer pressure.  Does it exist and make it hard sometimes to do the right thing?  Absolutely, but you still always have a choice.  I told my sons that as they were growing up.  If your friends want you to do something that you know is wrong, you have a choice, but don't blame them later for your bad decision.

Holli, I am the exact opposite of you.  Neither of my parents smoked.  I do.  My parents do not believe in drinking.  I like an occasional drink.  They are in no way responsible for my choices.

well Pooh, let me put it another way...and perhaps I worded it wrong, what I meant to say, is what you have said is very true....however, there are people out there who really do not know any better, because they were bought up so poorly...or they develop poor people skills due to they're upbringing...but yes, you are right and I should have made it more clear....we do most certainly have a choice....but what about a child who came up so tramatic that they develop narcississum?  Do they have a choice....I've read that, that is one of the most difficult things to fight, to heal and to live with?  And I know I'm going to the other end of the sprectrum, but this type of thing is what I had in mind in my first post....

Someone doesn't just become that over night, yanno?

LaurieS

Quote from: cremebrulee on February 11, 2011, 05:43:02 PM
Quote from: Pooh on February 10, 2011, 01:15:51 PM
Quote from: Laurie on February 10, 2011, 12:01:18 PM
Quote from: cremebrulee on February 10, 2011, 06:11:50 AM
You see, we are products of our parents or whoever raised us....and we adopt they're cultures....if parents who are uneducated believe in spitting and eating with they're fingers, that is what they're children will grow up to believe....

We adopt our parents thoughts, virtues, beliefs, bad habits, everything....


Do you really  believe this?  Is that how most people here on this forum think and the thoughts they accept?

No I don't believe that in totality.  I do believe we do follow in some things of our parents.  I do take after my Mother/GM on many things as far as they raised me to be responsible, have work ethics, values, integrity, respect for others, that family was important, etc..  But as an older teenager and young adult, I made a choice to keep following those beliefs. 

To me, that is like blaming everything your child does on peer pressure.  Does it exist and make it hard sometimes to do the right thing?  Absolutely, but you still always have a choice.  I told my sons that as they were growing up.  If your friends want you to do something that you know is wrong, you have a choice, but don't blame them later for your bad decision.

Holli, I am the exact opposite of you.  Neither of my parents smoked.  I do.  My parents do not believe in drinking.  I like an occasional drink.  They are in no way responsible for my choices.

well Pooh, let me put it another way...and perhaps I worded it wrong, what I meant to say, is what you have said is very true....however, there are people out there who really do not know any better, because they were bought up so poorly...or they develop poor people skills due to they're upbringing...but yes, you are right and I should have made it more clear....we do most certainly have a choice....but what about a child who came up so tramatic that they develop narcississum?  Do they have a choice....I've read that, that is one of the most difficult things to fight, to heal and to live with?  And I know I'm going to the other end of the sprectrum, but this type of thing is what I had in mind in my first post....

Someone doesn't just become that over night, yanno?

Extreme traumatic occurrences can alter and even in part form our perception of right vs wrong. While I feel that the way a person is reared has a bearing on his/her value system, I do not believe that you can solely blame a parent for choices that their adult child may make. The value system that a child was raised believing in does not necessarily coexist with their value system as an adult.  Assuming that an adult only learns and adheres to values set in their childhood allows one to shift blame for their own responsibilities and misconduct. 

I would like to quote a posting that you made on Feb 9th, under the topic "My Story As It Stands"
QuoteAs everyone else said to you, which I echo, you are not alone, even though you feel you are....
I also experienced the very same thing you have, with my ex husband....finding out your husband ran around is devestating...however, you must believe above anything else, it wasn't you, you were not the reason he ran around!  Believe that and repeat that over and over again....people run around on they're spouces b/c it's in them to do so, and not due to the spouce....it's just how they were raised, what they were raised to believe, and apparently your husband's parents didn't teach him fidelity to self.  You cannot be true to anyone else if you can't be true to oneself.

I hope that this too was misinterpreted because it has a familiar ring of shifting responsibility from the party who should own it.   As a parent I'm already held responsible for the way my three kids viewed their childhood, and all three have a different view.. now I am also to be credited and saddled with their shortcomings as adults regarding conscience decisions that they have made?

Rejected

Quote from: Pooh on February 11, 2011, 11:07:37 AM
Ha ha ha rejected!  Is your icon the evil stepmother in Snow White?

Why yes it is!  ;D  When I was in 3rd grade my elementary school did Snow White and I played the part of the Wicked Queen and since then I've just collected stuff centering her. She's my favorite Disney character, lol.
"Women are Angels and when someone breaks our wings... we simply continue to fly --- on a broomstick... we are flexible."  ~Anonymous

cremebrulee

February 12, 2011, 05:55:55 AM #23 Last Edit: February 12, 2011, 06:10:40 AM by cremebrulee
Laurie, I'm not talking about you....and how you raised your kids, and what I said, doesn't apply to everyone, and wasn't meant to be all negative....I was talking about those who come from homes that teach them it's ok to run around...like my ex-husband....both the uncle and the father, did so....and the mother believed it was ok, due to the way she was raised....it was they're culture....I remember after we were married, my now ex, telling me the stories of how his uncle told him, treat your wife like you would your mother, give her what she wants and be good to her, however, do not ever admit to running around....you never ever admit to it.....it's not everyone's culture, however, as someone mentioned, while we do have a choice, we only have our parents to learn from while little, until we leave the nest...

we learn morals, manners, spiritual beliefs, political beliefs, etc...we learn how to react and interact with people....

Again, it isn't written in stone, that we're going to be just like our parents, however, in some cases we do absolutely contribute to society due to our upbringing, we can choose to change the things we don't like, or not....my post was meant as pooh explained...however, there are cases in which adult children do not break the bad patterns of they're parents, such as child abuse, or one parent being very controlling. Or one parent being a bully, or one parent being constantly negative, or a bully....believe me, when our kids become adults, they do the same thing we did, we interact with many other people and decide what and who we want to be like, some of us, constantly try to change until the day we die...some of us do not...some of us remain bullies, some of us, are able to change those patterns and become a fine upstanding citizen, some need a huge amount of attention, or have to bbe right all the time, and will bully someone they do not like, or someone they are jealous of...and some through a tramatic life experience, realize they're errors and change they're ways...yes, we do have a choice, however, some are never aware enough to get it...which many of us here have seen in our interactions with inlaws, and other relationships...

If your mother wasn't much into cleaning, you very well, might be the same way, or not....it depends....if your father cheated on your mother and you knew about it, depending on the situation, you may do the same, or not....and I'm saying you in general, not you personally...some of us take the good we see in our parents and keep trying to be like that, and we leave the stuff we don't like, and go on to beak the pattern....people say, how did this person or that person get like that? It's years of conditioning....sometimes you have a parent, who doesn't believe at all in a child being repromanded and give that child it's way all throughout childhood, allowing them to make choices, that a child should not be making....when the child grows up and faces the real world, he/she is shell shocked, b/c he/she is not used to being said "no" to....there are tons of examples, both good and bad...and not all are bad....

some of us walk, talk, eat, think and even vote like our parents....or not...however, it's likely we have they're same mannerisums....some of us even pick mates like our parents, or not....it's not written in stone, that we all do...however, that is how societiest progress, or not....if kids grow up in a bad intellectual environment, chances are, they will not progress as much as the parent that encourages the child to excel, and get as much education as he/she can....and it goes on and one....

sometimes an abused child, will chose someone who abuses them for a mate, actually more oft times then not, b/c that is all they've known and they interrut that to be love....you cannot give what you've never known, and others progress through wanting so not to be like they're parents, through counseling and a lot of hard work....

and the beat goes on.....

LaurieS

Yes, I did agree that how we learn and perceive values starts at the moment of life... at some point we have a conscience choice and that is my point.  You state that parental blame is not always the case, yet it's a crutch that is used repeatedly. 

When does it stop... I feel that the man who willfully cheats on his wife, is making his own decision and most likely has nothing to do with his upbringing.  Nor does it justify his choices.  Childhood experiences do not give you a ticket to do as you choose throughout life.  When advice is offered to another on this board and it is said, "people run around on they're spouces b/c it's in them to do so, and not due to the spouce....it's just how they were raised, what they were raised to believe, and apparently your husband's parents didn't teach him fidelity to self", are we not perpetuating the cycle of lies and convenient excuses?

My statement has nothing to do with my children, but with me as a parent.  At what point do I get to step back and realize that they are their own people now.  According to your belief that day never comes.  Children take their childhoods then stand at a crossroad.. the decision belongs to them at that moment.  I scrolled through some of your past postings and found where you state that your own mother was an abuser.  According to you this was the reason for your stay at a foster care home.  Taking that into account, you had a choice.  Once you had a child you made the conscience choices, not your parents.  I just hate to see the all encompassing statements made such the one I quoted above, it's not fair to parents, or to the woman you were attempting to show compassion towards. 

cremebrulee

Laurie
Yes, I did agree that how we learn and perceive values starts at the moment of life... at some point we have a conscience choice and that is my point.  You state that parental blame is not always the case, yet it's a crutch that is used repeatedly.


Yes, we agree....I stated that, however, while I don't believe in it...some do...and that is why some never change....which is probably the case with most of our in-law problems, some of them will change, some will not....and yes,....absolutely used as a crutch.

When does it stop...?

It stops only if the person desires change...and admittedly realizes they're mistakes, which is very hard for some to do, to admit that they are wrong. 

I feel that the man, who willfully cheats on his wife, is making his own decision and most likely has nothing to do with his upbringing.  Nor does it justify his choices.

Right again, he is making his own decision to do so....however, in my ex's case, it had a lot to do with his upbringing/conditioning...he didn't break the pattern, just as some who are abused, abuse...they don't break the pattern....some do...because they have a choice...

It only stops if the person cheating wants it to stop, admits to wrong doing and seeks out help, in my ex's case he knew it was wrong, b/c he tried to hide it...however, he kept on doing it, because while growing up, his uncle and dad, verified that it's ok to do so, however, don't get caught.  I don't justify it....not in the least.  His own sister told me to leave, b/c she knew her brother had severe problems that he wasn't about to own up to and change...see, if he had admitted it, it would have meant he was indeed sorry and wanted to change and went for help.

Childhood experiences do not give you a ticket to do as you choose throughout life. 

Your right, they do not, however, some people Laurie, do not see it as you do...they can't help themselves, for many reasons...others can...but we are who we are due to our upbringing and our own choices, and experiences.

When advice is offered to another on this board and it is said, "people run around on they're spouses b/c it's in them to do so, and not due to the spouse....it's just how they were raised, what they were raised to believe, and apparently your husband's parents didn't teach him fidelity to self", are we not perpetuating the cycle of lies and convenient excuses?

Exactly...No they did not teach him fidelity to self, and if he has no respect for himself, he has no respect for anyone else, if it is not in someone to do something; they will not do it...or visa versa

My statement has nothing to do with my children, but with me as a parent. 

Yes indeed, and that is why parenting is a huge responsibility...if morals, self respect, confidence, and awareness that what we do and say, effects the lives of others in either a positive or negative way, how do children know?  They know right from wrong, from the time they are born, however, if the parent enables them, from little on up, there is a chance, they will continue the pattern.

At what point do I get to step back and realize that they are their own people now.

From the time your children are born, they are they're own person, and it is up to the parent to teach them that also...instill confidence, and self respect, and the ability to assume ownership for choices...however, some parents never do that, that is why we have crime...infidelity...lack of education....

According to your belief that day never comes. 

No, that is not my belief...I'll say again, some learn, some don't....how many times has it been said on this board, that they're DIL was raised like a princess...given everything she wanted...and is self imposed with no clue as to how her actions are now effecting the lives of not just her husband, but his entire family...? That is her parents fault...she was used to getting her way, and now she's all grown up and still insists on having things her way...she has probably never been taught how to share, how to deal with someone disagreeing with her...

Someone who is insecure takes things much more sensitively/personally then someone who was taught confidence in themselves....you can't give what you've never known.

Children take their childhoods then stand at a crossroad.. The decision belongs to them at that moment.  I scrolled through some of your past postings and found where you state that your own mother was an abuser.  According to you this was the reason for your stay at a foster care home.  Taking that into account, you had a choice.  Once you had a child you made the conscience choices, not your parents. 

I hated the way my mother was....and your right I made a conscious choice...however, I could have very easily gone the other way as well, and become an abuser, but I sought out help...I wasn't in foster care, I had people who lived on the same street as I did, take me in...and raise me like one of they're own...I call them my foster parents, b/c I have no other way to describe them or differentiate them from my maternal mother.   

I went home every night to my maternal mother...and I will state this, until the day I die...if it hadn't been for those people...who were a positive influence in my life, I would have turned out just like my mother...she would have been my only role model to parrot, instead, I saw, there was another side to life, to family, love, understanding, self respect...and I sought help at an early age, b/c I didn't want to become my mother...however, some people do...

My mother was the way she was, because she came up very hard, was abused very badly...she had only a 7th grade education...her mother died when she was very young...she was the oldest, she had to quit school and get a job in a sweat factory, raise all her sisters, hand over all her money to her drunken father who also sexually abused her..she was beaten and she beat me...she thought that was love...it was all she knew, she didn't have any positive influences in her life, that isn't an accuse, it's the way it was...she became very embittered...was a very jealous woman, hated everyone...was very angry, and never really grew up, she had only a 7th grade mentality as far as common sense and had no self esteem what so ever...she is a very very lonely woman...and always has been.  When she became pregnant with me, yes, it was her choice, however, she was single and at that time, banned from society, that in itself is enough to drive anyone over the edge, compounded by her childhood...I'm not making excuses for her, some people should never be parents, and she was one of them...but I can also see, why she is and was the way she was....I don't think she viewed me as her daughter, I believe she saw me as her sister, b/c she was extremely jealous of me, my friends in school, my education...and hated it, when I excelled, did everything she could to stagnate me and punch me down...but that is the only life she ever knew...

I just hate to see the all encompassing statements made such the one I quoted above, it's not fair to parents, or to the woman you were attempting to show compassion towards.

Well, it wasn't an all encompassing statement, you took it that way...you don't know me, therefore, you have no idea how my mind works...as I you and everyone else here, that is why it's very important to discuss issues like we are now...I admit, I didn't make myself clear, hey, I'm not perfect....I knew what I was writing, but it didn't come out right, so shoot me....lol

But this is a perfect example as to how things are misunderstood....because,
1. We don't know each other
2.  Because we can't see each others faces, expressions...
3.  Because I didn't make myself more clear, never realizing that you would not be able
Understand, that I didn't mean it as an all encompassing statement...
However, again, if something isn't in a person to do or be, they won't do it...

If it isn't already in a young person to bully, they won't do it, and chances are, not always, but it is likely someone else in his family is also a bully...and or enables him to do so...there is no behavior modification...

And yes, all your kids have parts of you in them...it's genetic, along with how you raised them to believe...morals, values, confidence, awareness, spiritual beliefs...etc...yet, each of your children are very different in they're own being...but it is from you and your husband that they do develop...

cremebrulee

and one more thing Laurie...you may hate to see statements made by people, on this board or any where else in your life time, however, the way you interpret them, is not always the way they are meant...you are not able to control the words of others, even if they did mean them the way you read them...like Luise always said, and I echo time and time again, "take what applies and leave the rest..." but that's life and people...we are not always on the same plain at the same time...we can't be...and you'd be wise to consider that...as well as me and everyone else in this world...this is again, a perfect example of how things are misunderstood and not meant as you took them...and why problems start with out inlaws...not every thing is black and white, rightor wrong...and you certainly cannot control how people think if it doesn't perfectly alighn with your thoughts and feelings...ask, instead of accussing, which is one heck of a good lesson for all of us to consider, don't you think?

LaurieS

Sorry.. I had a hard time getting through all that Creme.  I can assure you that I am not out to dictate how you use your words, but I do know that my reading comprehension is not poor.  Your warning, I have taken into consideration.

You have every right to continue to perceive every negative action as the responsibility of environment, upbringing, etc.  I'm a believer in accepting that people make their own choices and then need to accept the consequences which comes from those choices. 
QuoteWhen advice is offered to another on this board and it is said, "people run around on they're spouses b/c it's in them to do so, and not due to the spouse....it's just how they were raised, what they were raised to believe, and apparently your husband's parents didn't teach him fidelity to self", are we not perpetuating the cycle of lies and convenient excuses?

Exactly...No they did not teach him fidelity to self, and if he has no respect for himself, he has no respect for anyone else, if it is not in someone to do something; they will not do it...or visa versa

How can this assumption be made? To remove the blame from the individual and place it squarely on his parents shoulders is a great injustice for all of the people involved. 

Once again I agree we are all a product of our environment, our thoughts, actions, behaviors, are directly or even indirectly related to our environment.  Our parent's influences, their values etc. play a large role in who we are today but it can not be used as an excuse for poor or horrific and devastating decisions.

QuoteWell, it wasn't an all encompassing statement, you took it that way...you don't know me, therefore, you have no idea how my mind works...as I you and everyone else here, that is why it's very important to discuss issues like we are now...I admit, I didn't make myself clear, hey, I'm not perfect....I knew what I was writing, but it didn't come out right, so shoot me....lol

You are right...I don't know you, I don't know how your mind works, and all we do  have are words and a few smiley faces to try and convey our thoughts, feelings, and beliefs. When I did ask for clarification of a statement and asked others if they felt the same way or read it the same way, offense was taken.


cremebrulee

February 12, 2011, 01:40:49 PM #28 Last Edit: February 12, 2011, 01:43:34 PM by cremebrulee
Laurie link=topic=1412.msg30709#msg30709 date=1297545229]
Sorry.. I had a hard time getting through all that Creme.  I can assure you that I am not out to dictate how you use your words, but I do know that my reading comprehension is not poor.  Your warning, I have taken into consideration.[/quote]

It wasn't a warning Laurie, merely a suggestion...

QuoteYou have every right to continue to perceive every negative action as the responsibility of environment, upbringing, etc.  I'm a believer in accepting that people make their own choices and then need to accept the consequences which comes from those choices.

I can see your totally not getting what I'm trying to project, but thank you for the interaction....

QuoteHow can this assumption be made? To remove the blame from the individual and place it squarely on his parents shoulders is a great injustice for all of the people involved.

see, this is where your not getting it Laurie, I'm not removing any blame from the individual...not in the least....

but it can not be used as an excuse for poor or horrific and devastating decisions.



You are right...I don't know you, I don't know how your mind works, and all we do  have are words and a few smiley faces to try and convey our thoughts, feelings, and beliefs. When I did ask for clarification of a statement and asked others if they felt the same way or read it the same way, offense was taken.

I don't understand Laurie, who took offense?  I believe we were merely having a discussion, just as you and I are now....why would that offend anyone? Yes, they are my thoughts and feelings, which we all contribute to this forum...they disagreed which they have every right to do...but offense, I don't think so... ?  But in the event anyone was offended, I'd like to apologize, I do truly believe in what I've written today...however, its a subject that cannot be black or white....I'm quit proud to have my parents thoughts, feelings, morals, both good and bad in me...if it were not for them, I wouldn't be here today...

thanks for the interaction, it was nice...I appreciate your kindness...and patience....

cremebrulee

Back to the topic...Rejected, sorry to hijack your thread...and hope that there was something in what we were discussing that may have helped you understand...

I feel knowledge is power, and the more we know and understand why people act the way they do, the easier it is for us to interact with them...

Sometimes, people are just angry, period...and they don't even know why.