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got through the event

Started by erma, November 08, 2010, 03:03:27 pm

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Pooh

I could see where she was going with that BT.  We do tend to do this to ourselves.  He was invited, he didn't come.  The "big deal" justus was referring to was that Erma has no control over what he does, that is on him.  And in the end, he will be the one that suffers for it.  Him not showing was no reflection on Erma.  She issued the invite and let him know about it.  What he chose to do was in his court.  Not that Erma wasn't entitled to being upset that he didn't come and lied about it, but in the end, she did her part.
We must let go of the life we have planned, so as to accept the one that is waiting for us. -
Joseph Campbell

seasage

I have learned through experience that people deal with death in different ways.  A friend's husband left her when their young child was dying of a brain cancer.  The psychologist said it wasn't that unusual.  Some people just can't face death.  They handle it by escaping the situation.

I can't say whether or not this applies to your DS.  And I admit that it doesn't sound good.  Shopping, really!! But maybe,  for this event only, withhold judgment. 

barelythere

Quote from: Pooh on November 09, 2010, 07:34:45 am
I could see where she was going with that BT.  We do tend to do this to ourselves.  He was invited, he didn't come.  The "big deal" justus was referring to was that Erma has no control over what he does, that is on him.  And in the end, he will be the one that suffers for it.  Him not showing was no reflection on Erma.  She issued the invite and let him know about it.  What he chose to do was in his court.  Not that Erma wasn't entitled to being upset that he didn't come and lied about it, but in the end, she did her part.


It makes me want to bawl for Erma.  This makes me sick. 

barelythere

Quote from: Anna on November 09, 2010, 07:38:11 am
Quote from: erma on November 08, 2010, 03:03:27 pm
hello people. well, we were able to muster through the last holiday of a family member. so feeble and weak. just sad.  :'( :'( :'(  i wept all the way home. but, i will remember and think of her for all her greatness and love she had in this world, i will speak of her legacy, not her end.  :)
 
my ds and dil said at first they had a function to go to on dil foo, but they lied. my dd came to our family event with news that her db had called saying they were shopping in her neighborhood and would like to go to her restaurant for a meal. (free)my dd said no, she was headed to our event, to see her dg for the last time, and why weren't they coming. ds responded, "i know, tried to get her (dil)  to go, she wants to shop"


i cant believe my son would shut out his family like that. i know for a fact dil has threatened him before, and i believe she is again now. (leaving with the baby) or, maybe he cant handle death? seeing a family member in the latter part of their life? i know how hard it is believe me. i used to deal with it on a daily basis. plus, all of my kin, except for my father, has died as well.  i still am just reeling...............how someone can be so cold.
and for shopping.??!!.................... how cold....................i am appalled   :-X :-X :-X :'(


Something similar happened to us with our ds & dil.  We had relatives, from very far away pop in unexpectly, I called my ods, my yds,  my siblings, my neices & my parents. Everyone was able to take off work, & make it over to visit, except my ds & dil.  They were shopping, had to go right by our house on there way home, but we were told, "what, we're just supposed to drop everything cause _____ stopped by".  Everyone else was at work, (except my parents), & they all managed to take time off work to stop in  As a result of that decision these relatives have never met my gc, & may never get to meet them.  I was deeply hurt.  This is my son, he knows how much these relatives mean to me, & how little we see them cause they live so far away.  All this happened a couple of years ago, but the memory brings back all the hurt.  Cold & uncaring.  On the upside, I think that now ds & dil would do everything in their power to stop by if this ever happens again.  There is always hope!!   :)       (((((hugs)))))   Anna.


They don't do anything they don't want to do.  Mine included.  They wouldn't come here when my os and wife came..they waited all day long for them. It broke my heart.  I wish I had never had kids.

barelythere

Quote from: Anna on November 09, 2010, 08:02:29 am
Wouldn't it be nice if some of our children could learn to put someone else & their feelings ahead of their own?  My generation was called the me generation, but I think most of my children' generation, are the me, me, me generation.  Does that mean that most of our gc's generation wil be the me, me, me, me, me, me generation?  Yikes!!


Yes, the new kids will adopt the pattern and God help us.  I was not brought up to put myself first.  We were our brother's keepers.  Right or wrong, we were there for others.  Just breaks my heart.

justus

BT, what I mean is that while Erma has a right to be upset about being lied to, it is silly, yes, silly to be upset over something she cannot control. Is she upset because her DS didn't come and how that reflects on her, or is she upset for the dying relative? She has no business being upset for the relative. Did the relative even notice his absence? If she did, then it is up to her to talk to Erma's DS and let him know about. It is between the relative and Erma's son, not her. If she is upset about him not showing up and how that reflects on her, well, then Erma may need to be a little less worried about appearances.

We all falsely assume that what is important to us is important to our children, that if we are invested in something particular happening, then our children will be, too. This is a false assumption, and it is why we get so hurt and upset over things like this. The assumption is ours, and it is our fault that we are upset. Erma was invested in her DS attending, this was not important to him and so he didn't. He is a grown man and he makes these decisions for himself according to what is important to him. We raise our children knowing that one day we have to let them go, but it still comes as a shock when we find out that they have grown up and become independent thinkers whose values and opinions differ dramatically from ours and then we get upset because they do differ, because we did our jobs well.  Erma did job well, so she should stop with the expectations because she will only be hurt again and again and that is her choice.

I am not sure who you are speaking of when you say, "WE". BT, I have had two MILs. One was horrible, and the current one is deeply flawed and can be a problem if we let her, but we get along quite well. I look back at my relationship with my first MIL and know now how I could have dealt with her more productively, but what did I know when I was 18? I have three children aged 26, 23, and 21. I am a MIL and a GM. I am pretty sure we are of the same generation. I reject that there is some sort of generational wide misunderstanding here. Certainly, there are cultural misunderstandings, but we are all people and I think we are all smart enough to figure out what boundaries are. From what I have read, this DIL/MIL thing has been going on ever since humans came into existence and the nature of the problems have not changed.

We all need to be aware of how we might be coming off to our children and DILs. If we are strong, we might come off as pushy, if we don't approve, they will see that in our every word and move, if we use quilt by making ourselves the victims, they will feel victimized. We have a lot more power than we realize and we need to be aware of how what we say might be taken. In the end, we are the only ones we can control. We also have to keep in mind that they are just kids working through what it is be an adult. It takes time.

Also, I know people from our generation who put themselves first all the time even though they were raised differently. I don't think it is a generational thing, but a human thing. It is easy to blow off these problems by saying it is cultural or how they were raised. Heck we all heard, "Kids these days," said with a shaking head when we were kids. Now we are doing it and it is just as silly a saying.

erma

good morning people. i so wanted to converse yesterday, in stead i was admittedly disgusted with dis and dil's behavior. i just turned it all off sat it the hot tub with a glass of wine and tried not to think. today i read all of your posts,  thank you ladies.  its not about them, its not about me either. its about GM. your right, i did my part. however i do believe when he called his sister, he was looking to get her ear. we (me and dd) believe he was trying to communicate his situation to her without upsetting dil. meaning, ds and dil would show up at my dd's restaurant, he would explain, she would "explain" to me. so, yes Laurie, i do think that was ds's intention. didn't work that way however. i have not heard a word from ds since we arrived home Monday.
i truly don't know how my ds feels about death, however, before dil came along, when his GF died, he had no problem. he was very close to him. he understands how permanent it is. now, the lying thing? that's new to me, from my ds. as a child, he never lied to me. even as he grew into adulthood, he would say to me, "not gonna tell ya mom, love you too much, so don't ask" and i didn't. that motto continues today, i don't ask he doesn't tell, unless he wants too. but lying?? really?? that's a first, that i know of anyway.
I'm not going to even try to figure this out anymore. its too unnerving. (I'm using the SNAP method) ok, on with it............................. :P
thank you ladies

justdontunderstand

Erma,
My condolences--I am sorry for what you are going through. I too read all the posts under this topic.

What strikes me once again is that we have these conflicting expectations. There are certain things that many of us think are reasonable expectations in any given situation. There are others who simply don't see it as reasonable at all. Is it reasonable for someone to value seeing a dying CLOSE relative one last time over a shopping trip that can be done any time? Personally, I think that expectation is reasonable. Is it reasonable for a mother to be hurt when she is lied to by her DS (especially when it is something new)? I think it is. I for one get hung up on expectations every time. But without expectations for what is loving behavior versus unloving behavior--how do we go through life?  I for one need to be able to expect some loving behavior once in a while.

erma

QuoteBT, what I mean is that while Erma has a right to be upset about being lied to, it is silly, yes, silly to be upset over something she cannot control. Is she upset because her DS didn't come and how that reflects on her, or is she upset for the dying relative? She has no business being upset for the relative. Did the relative even notice his absence? If she did, then it is up to her to talk to Erma's DS and let him know about. It is between the relative and Erma's son, not her. If she is upset about him not showing up and how that reflects on her, well, then Erma may need to be a little less worried about appearances.

for heavens sake, no business? really? so does that mean all family is not your business? i don't think coming to the bedside of a dying family member constitutes a "business appearance"

QuoteWe all falsely assume that what is important to us is important to our children, that if we are invested in something particular happening, then our children will be, too. This is a false assumption, and it is why we get so hurt and upset over things like this. The assumption is ours, and it is our fault that we are upset. Erma was invested in her DS attending, this was not important to him and so he didn't. He is a grown man and he makes these decisions for himself according to what is important to him. We raise our children knowing that one day we have to let them go, but it still comes as a shock when we find out that they have grown up and become independent thinkers whose values and opinions differ dramatically from ours and then we get upset because they do differ, because we did our jobs well.  Erma did job well, so she should stop with the expectations because she will only be hurt again and again and that is her choice
.
this is a generalized statement, not all of us falsely assume

Quote
QuoteWe all need to be aware of how we might be coming off to our children and DILs. If we are strong, we might come off as pushy, if we don't approve, they will see that in our every word and move, if we use quilt by making ourselves the victims, they will feel victimized. We have a lot more power than we realize and we need to be aware of how what we say might be taken. In the end, we are the only ones we can control. We also have to keep in mind that they are just kids working through what it is be an adult. It takes time.


nope, don't agree. my children are grown adults, not kids. their old enough to go to war for their country, their old enough to deal with "pushy, don't approve, feeling victimized" what ever.


Also, I know people from our generation who put themselves first all the time even though they were raised differently. I don't think it is a generational thing, but a human thing. It is easy to blow off these problems by saying it is cultural or how they were raised. Heck we all heard, "Kids these days," said with a shaking head when we were kids. Now we are doing it and it is just as silly a saying.


i believe in the generation gap. my parents had it, i have it, but that doesn't excuse rude behavior problems.
justice, i think its just vicious people verses, docile people, good/evil, giver/taker, humble/narcissistic, what ever you wanna call it, the difference is real.
and thats what im trying to get a grip on here, is the other side. that doesnt mean im going to agree with it, i don't have to. until we work through things, it just "is what it is"

Pen

I understand not wanting to deal with tough stuff. I can always think of something I'd rather do than make a family "duty call." But as an adult, I choose to be compassionate and kind. It's one day out of my life but means the world to others. What's the big deal? I suck it up and attend!

And when I'm the one on the way out, I hope my DS, DIL & GC can spare a moment or two. Good grief (so to speak)!
Respect ... is appreciation of the separateness of the other person, of the ways in which he or she is unique.
-- Annie Gottlieb

MLW07

Quote from: justus on November 09, 2010, 08:24:30 am
BT, what I mean is that while Erma has a right to be upset about being lied to, it is silly, yes, silly to be upset over something she cannot control. Is she upset because her DS didn't come and how that reflects on her, or is she upset for the dying relative? She has no business being upset for the relative. Did the relative even notice his absence? If she did, then it is up to her to talk to Erma's DS and let him know about. It is between the relative and Erma's son, not her. If she is upset about him not showing up and how that reflects on her, well, then Erma may need to be a little less worried about appearances.

We all falsely assume that what is important to us is important to our children, that if we are invested in something particular happening, then our children will be, too. This is a false assumption, and it is why we get so hurt and upset over things like this. The assumption is ours, and it is our fault that we are upset. Erma was invested in her DS attending, this was not important to him and so he didn't. He is a grown man and he makes these decisions for himself according to what is important to him. We raise our children knowing that one day we have to let them go, but it still comes as a shock when we find out that they have grown up and become independent thinkers whose values and opinions differ dramatically from ours and then we get upset because they do differ, because we did our jobs well.  Erma did job well, so she should stop with the expectations because she will only be hurt again and again and that is her choice.

I am not sure who you are speaking of when you say, "WE". BT, I have had two MILs. One was horrible, and the current one is deeply flawed and can be a problem if we let her, but we get along quite well. I look back at my relationship with my first MIL and know now how I could have dealt with her more productively, but what did I know when I was 18? I have three children aged 26, 23, and 21. I am a MIL and a GM. I am pretty sure we are of the same generation. I reject that there is some sort of generational wide misunderstanding here. Certainly, there are cultural misunderstandings, but we are all people and I think we are all smart enough to figure out what boundaries are. From what I have read, this DIL/MIL thing has been going on ever since humans came into existence and the nature of the problems have not changed.

We all need to be aware of how we might be coming off to our children and DILs. If we are strong, we might come off as pushy, if we don't approve, they will see that in our every word and move, if we use quilt by making ourselves the victims, they will feel victimized. We have a lot more power than we realize and we need to be aware of how what we say might be taken. In the end, we are the only ones we can control. We also have to keep in mind that they are just kids working through what it is be an adult. It takes time.

Also, I know people from our generation who put themselves first all the time even though they were raised differently. I don't think it is a generational thing, but a human thing. It is easy to blow off these problems by saying it is cultural or how they were raised. Heck we all heard, "Kids these days," said with a shaking head when we were kids. Now we are doing it and it is just as silly a saying.


Very well put Justus!

luise.volta

This situation isn't new. The ostrich invented it.
Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible. Dalai Lama

erma

thank you, all of you! love the ostrich luise...................