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How do I grieve this death

Started by Renet, November 09, 2010, 06:58:49 PM

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Renet

Good night Barley!!!!   I am eternally grateful for your words tonight....You have helped me through the pain......

Hugs dear friend...hugs.... ;D

dablacks

I have been reading your story and noticed that a few of us had very unhappy childhoods, myself included.  Is this a pattern?  What is the link here? 

My mother is still alive and I live 1000 miles away, after my father died 3 years ago I took over all her banking, saved her house from going under, and call every day, sometimes twice.  What do I receive in return?  She is pretty much ungrateful most of the time. 

My daughter has said she doesn't want to hear any details, told me flat out she doesn't like grandma.  I told her I do it so someday I will never look back and regret any of my decisions. But I see  my neediness here of always wanting approval.  That shook me up to see so many others in the same cycle.  We grew up with uncaring, critical parents, we had kids that we adored and made sure they had self esteem and NOW they look at us as weak needy people.  We have to break this cycle and look at our kids for what they are. They could be more like their selfish grandparents then we want to admit. Not very nice people, and if they were strangers or someone we worked with, we would have the good sense to stay away from people like this and NEVER let them know what we are REALLY thinking.

Miss Understood

Quote from: Renet on November 09, 2010, 07:17:02 PM
You said the one thing I need to remember....  It is horrible when she is here.   I never do anything right or good enough and I am a wreck trying to make everything perfect. 

If this is not such a real statement. My DH and Two DD's always told me they had a better time when DS wasn't around and DIL who sat there critiquing everyone and slamming their friends and other family members...DS picking fights, picking apart his sisters and the smug DIL sitting there enjoying the chaos and doing the silent passive aggression towards our family. I was so blind to it...probably because I spent my time trying to make everyone happy and just happy to have my whole family together and my GD's. I miss my GD and Son and even DIL terribly...but as memory serves me, it wasn't always great. But...that's not the point. Nobody is perfect, NO one person can be at fault for anything and at the end of the day....it doesn't have to be a Walton reunion or Rockwell perfect family....It's our families...good or bad...happy or sad...fights or no fights...it is what it is.
I am sorry to hear they spend so much time with the other IL's. You mention Counselor (MIL is HER's) That is bizarre...and must I add that I doubt she is telling her all true factual stuff with her. She is most likely sharing things that are embellished to make her look better in MIL's eyes and feel sorry for her. MIL should know that....but she is probably feeling empowered by their relationship and doesn't have any intent to change it right now...why? Because it is working for her. We get complacent in our lives and when something is working...we don't mess with it.
Reason I know this....
My DS and DIL did some disturbing and hurtful things to other people (her family and my ex's family and a couple of their friends) Mostly bad mouthing them, small lies, the phone would ring while they were at our house and they wouldn't answer and then made a negative comment about whoever it was. I knew that it was wrong and I wanted to pipe up and say, "Hey...that's not right!" I did once and then I got the dirty look from DIL and then a few minutes later...DS decided it was time to leave (an hour earlier)SO, I shut my mouth....listened and said nothing...Because it was working for me.  At least that is what I thought. Little did I know...they were doing the same story telling, slander, cut downs, etc. about us to whoever. We were the joke! Now...we are nothing, just a cut off family because they can't face reality and are living in some delusional world they created.
Delusional World: When someone makes up a scenario about their life and focuses on creating it and living it and then believes it. It's hard to live the Delusional World until something is strong enough to push you out of it. Your own will won't get you there unless you are mature and healthy minded enough to understand the difference and if that was the case....they wouldn't be in this state to begin with.

JaneF

WOW! I don't know what to say first. Renet I am so sorry you have to go through this difficulty. I have the same issue only with DS and DIL. As I read through these replies I noticed that a lot of us had the common thread, unhappy childhood, critical parent etc. Hmmm. I am sorry Renet that your DD treats you this way, maybe the statement that our kids are more like our parents than we realize is correct???? And yes, it seems we are tender hearted, also a common thread. It IS hard to not get to see grandkids and know they are with other grandparents all the time, I've dealt with that for 11 years now. It hurts, I know, but I recently made a choice not to dwell on it anymore. Had to let it go. I don't understand meanness in some folks, never will. I have found in the short time I've been a member here, there are some great women who offer kindness and support, and it's been a blessing. Best to you all.

jill

Dablacks,
Your post is so true.  My odd reminds me so much of my late mother.  I won't say my childhood was unhappy but she was very critical, and I tried my hardest never to criticize my own children.  Now all they do is criticize me, and nothing I do or say is right.  And I want their approval so much, just as I wanted hers.   But she did the best she could, just as I have done, and my kids are doing today, but I never treated her the way my dds treat me.

By the way anyone watching Dr. Phil this afternoon?   It is all about MIL and DIL problems.

dablacks

Hi Jill,
It's a lot to think about.  I have seen time and time again situations where the mother deserts her children and when they are adults, they try to find her and try to prove to themselves that they were loved.  This is always the way.  I sometimes watch young mothers giving in to their children on simple things and see myself in them. 

It shocks me when I am talking to my daughter and think everything is going fine, I mention my roses are perfect this year and she will blurb out "It's always about you"  What, I say, I'm just chit chatting with you, idle conversation. What are you talking about. Blah, Blah Blah. 

After this last trip, I am convinced I will NOT let the grandbaby become a pawn in this relationship.  I live 1000 miles away and right now at this minute I am very happy I do.

LaurieS

Quote from: dablacks on November 10, 2010, 02:08:38 PM
After this last trip, I am convinced I will NOT let the grandbaby become a pawn in this relationship.  I live 1000 miles away and right now at this minute I am very happy I do.
Sometimes it feels like 1000 deep breaths away

MotherOf3

Just want to say that I know how much it breaks your heart to not be with your grandchildren.  Sometimes you have to let go in order to not live a life of pain.  Every time you see a picture it is like your heart is being torn out again and again. 

I know that it can hardly compare but I broke off a 10 year relationship in the last year because I was not being treated right, or kindly, and for awhile I was looking at his profile on social sites.  I got to the point where the pain outweighed the pleasure.  That's what I've read is what it takes for a person to change their situation.  When the pain outweighs the pleasure.  It hurt more to see pictures of him doing the things I had wanted to do with him than it did to see him at all.

I stopped looking.  The pain is just about gone, only a lingering regret that he couldn't treat me like I mattered to him and wasn't just a convenience.

He has come back into my life twice in the last year, trying to start up again.  I find that I don't have any reason to at all since nothing he has said indicates that he is prepared to change.  He got angry and sent me a picture.  I know him and I know that it would be hurtful.  I didn't look at it because I know the pain it would cause.  My need to not be hurt trumps my curiosity even.

Just letting you know that if you keep looking at the pictures, the wound likely won't heal.  It is being opened afresh over and over.

justdontunderstand

Reading the posts about estrangements that include grandchildren just break my heart. It is one thing when adults can't get it together enough to get along but when they deny children the love and attention of grandparents who are ready, willing and able to provide it--it is just terribly sad.

I do not have grandchildren but I shudder to think that if we cannot resolve the estrangement with DIL, and she and DS have children--then this awful story could become our story!

LaurieS

You and I are on identical paths JDU... I'm trying my hardest to set my boundaries and allow my DIL  to set hers, and we need to get it all straightened out before the grandchild comes.  Not that she is even pregnant.. but the writing is on the wall and I'm trying hard to prevent things from happening.  On a good note.. I have followed others and I do not initiate contact.. now I'm getting phone calls up to 3 times a week from my son.  My DIL wants to badly to be left out of anything so I think she'll come around and began to understand that there is a time and place for everything.

Tara

Laurie,

can you say more about not initiating contact?
How long have you been doing that?


justdontunderstand

Laurie,
I have noticed similarities in our stories through your posts. I do not initiate contact with DIL either because I did that for over four years and was continually disappointed. I cannot take that rejection any more. I am done with extending myself to be met with cold silence.

Every unanswered telephone call, email, text message---- every gift that went unacknowledged has chipped away at my open heart.  Being ignored is in some ways more difficult than open hostility. At least when someone is openly hostile toward you there is dialogue. It may not be productive dialogue but you have something to go on to try and understand what that person is thinking. Being ignored just leaves you with rejection with a capital R. After a while you just want to protect yourself from further hurt by standing down and not setting yourself up for further rejection. My heart is closing off the need to be liked by someone who cannot be bothered to even try and get to know me. If DIL were not married to my DS, I would walk away completely. The complication is that she is always looming in the background and every interaction with DS is interpreted through how it might affect his relationship with her. It is an impossible and unsustainable situation for my family...yet we try to keep the door open for our DS.

The situation is so very, very sad.

LaurieS

Hi Tara... I believe  it was Hope who I first heard mention the 'no initiation' clause.  I always politely respond when I'm called, and if I miss a call I will return it.  I reply to  emails but never send the first one.. not even a funny.  It's all in their power to speak to us when they choose.  After trying this I thought you know it has some merit... my son began calling us with more frequency.. DIL.. not so much :)  When he did call he was more forthcoming with information to where before  it  was like pulling teeth.  When he calls here I've noticed that he will ask about his brother, sister and even grandparents.  There seems to be less tension in his voice which to me says that there is less in his life.

That should have been good enough for me, but I had to test it.  I sent him along with others all on a  BCC, photos of his brother and sister with their bf and gf.. An email was fired back with photos of him and DIL from the event that we were sorta uninvited to.  I did not respond as I thought either someone is trying to prove a point or just plain stupid.  My ds called a couple days later and I asked who had sent the photos.. since he didn't know they had been sent it was my DIL. Since civility is not in her vocabulary I slapped myself and said ok back to the method that was working.

My DIL is very upset that we will not spend time with her extended family. She doesn't get it when I say that there is a time and place.  Since I finally put my foot  down and said no I will not be forced into a situation that I do not want it's become a game with her, which was what led to her declaring to my son that they would simply not tell us that her parents would be involved with our visit until we arrived.  So the fact that I am standing firm concerning our boundaries and not initiating contact..  it's  taken some of the fun out of her game.

Tara

So that is very interesting Laurie.  Thank you
I wonder if you feel comfortable telling me what your thoughts were  about setting boundaries re: seeing your ds and dil
with her parents and extended family?  I do get what you mean that there is a time and place.

I'm finding this very helpful.  Have definitely decided I'm going to try out the no initiating rule.

Along these Lines I'm wondering what I should do when I get back from India.   Within a week she will be having the babies / c section. I wanted to go and visit when they were born.  I was going to go visit this weekend but once they started being mean to me
I politely cancelled the plan.  Since then she says she prefers we wait till she gets home from the hospital and they have a
chance to adjust to the babies.  When do you ever adjust to twins?  I already have grand children who are twins and it is
a tremendous adjustment that most people don't adjust to for a long time!  So going along with this not initiating do I just
wait for them to contact me re:  birth.  Then not ask about  visiting till I'm invited?

with gratitude to WW


LaurieS

Tara, you may be sorry you asked.. but this felt good to get off my chest... here goes..

Since my DIL wants her family involved every time we try to spend time with the kids, it was pretty easy to draw  that line and stand firm.  When we have plans with ds and dil and suddenly her parents are tossed into the mix, we excuse ourselves and politely but firmly say that we will make future plans to see them.  To me it was simple.. We will spend time with her family when we choose to, not when my DIL declares.  Since this has happened time and time again, I don't know when I would want to see her parents, it's like they've been unknowingly used as a sharp instrument to induce pain.  At this point it's probable her parents don't particularly want to see us either as I'm sure it's been presented to them that we are not attending anything based on the fact that they will be present.  And it's not solely their presence, it's the type of control that my DIL is trying to obtain, it's like she is forcing the issue and won't stop until she gets her way.  I feel that she has latched onto this because she found something that irritates me to the core.  We do not infringe on her time with her parents, and I think my ds should expect the same.

Never did I think our relationship with our DIL would evolve into this.  I am polite and nice to her.. when she comes into town I take her for lunch and pedicures and  do all the girl things that I do with my own daughter.  We've been generous with gifts, and financial aid (that seems to be a sore spot with DIL, she thought we were  greedy for expecting loans to be paid, we would not agree to the loan until a auto payment withdrawal was set up). Life with my dil seems to be fine as long as we keep our distance.  After 3 years of this, I am bothered by the fact that mutual respect has diminished.  Another boundary.. I will not be the shield.  I no longer make excuses for her (or my son for that matter)..not to my kids, or my son's grandparents.   I will no longer cover for her when she displays lack of common courtesies, no longer will I use her age as an excuse for poor manners, she is going to have to accept responsibility and the consequences of her own actions pertaining to her husbands family as she would in any aspect of her life.

In the end, I've simply learned to say No... who was it here that said, "NO can be a complete sentence"?  That is my boundary.. I do not attempt to change their minds or views, but likewise they now have a clear understanding that they will not change mine either, I'm not going to sulk, cry, beg or plead.  I am not going to pay her to be tolerant of us.  I'm no longer going to forbid my other son and my daughter from speaking up, when she insults them by her lack of caring. I will not be the middle man with intentions of being the peace maker. 

I know that I sound like I despise my DIL and I really don't.... She is part of the reason why my son was able to fulfill his military dreams.... she was there to keep him on track.  I've witnessed how much she loves her family I know she is capable of expanding her world to include that of her husbands.  She may change or come around in the future, but in the meantime I needed to say that I have done all I can to earn her respect without losing self-respect.