My couple's gift this year will be ...

[LaurieS]

I agree Pam.. I do not believe that a thank you note should be issued at every turn.  There are times that it's the proper thing to do...

While my kids were growing up we did "force" them to write  thank you notes to their grandparents/aunts/uncles etc for Christmas gifts.. while very young they loved writing the notes as they became teens the boys were a little put out but went along with our wishes.. I also believe that a note is mandatory when you've initiated the reason for a gift such as a graduation notice, wedding invitation, etc. But when Auntie May takes one of the kids out for a nice lunch.. a simple thank you is acceptable.

[kathleen]

What about when a DIL asks for money?  Asks for gifts, vis a vis showers?  Is some acknowledgement for that a good thing, or, in those cases too, are we supposed to give what they want and feel nothing about no acknowledgement?  I see now that my feeling that she should acknowledge cash and gifts doesn't stem so much from the way I was raised or courtesy, as much as from the feeling I was forced to give her things.  That's not really a gift. 

I finally cut off my DIL's email over her last request for money.  I don't want to read them anymore, after many years of them.  I'm not giving her any more money for her events or causes.  I will select my own causes.  She doesn't like me and prefers I not come around, just give $$ for her events.

The causes she asked for money for generally involved charities that people were involved with at work.  Giving money to those charities would benefit her product that she was marketing.

She loves parties and always is giving them.  An invitation doesn't feel like she wanted us there, it felt like a demand for a gift.  When her baby shower came, her mother called me and said, "How much money are you going to give us to have this party?"  I politely explained that I had just purchased an expensive baby gift for the shower and that for us, this would be enough.  I remember adding again, "It's an expensive gift."

Ann Landers used to write a column of sage advice, and she was huge on thank yous for gifts and teaching children to do that.  I don't see it
as a requirement from my side for the gift, as much as an expression of good manners from the recipient.  Ann Landers repeatedly would say, "If you don't get an acknowledgement, stop sending the gifts."  My sentiments exactly, and that's what I've done.

Kathleen

[kathleen]

Here is an excerpt from the old Ann Landers column on thanking people for gifts, with an interesting perspective that not expecting thank yous is to encourage "boorish" behavior.  Ann was one tough cookie!

Kathleen

Dear Ann Landers: I am angry at you for telling readers not to send gifts to children who don't write thank you notes.
Last year, when my daughter was 8 years old, her "Aunt Louise" wrote to say she did not receive a thank you note for the previous birthday gift, so she would not be sending a gift that year. Louise added, "Ann Landers wrote in her column that if a person doesn't acknowledge a gift with a phone call or a written note, you shouldn't send that person any more gifts."
I was shocked by your lack of compassion, Ann, and amazed that Aunt Louise could be so harsh with her own niece — and that you encouraged it. I'll bet this is one letter you won't print. — A Mom in North Carolina

Dear N.C. Mom: I hope you didn't bet more than you can afford to lose. In my opinion, failure to express appreciation for a gift by note or a phone call is not acceptable behavior. In fact, it is inexcusable rudeness. To continue to send gifts when there is no thank you is to encourage such boorishness. Yes, I did say to "stop sending gifts to people who don't say thank you," and I meant it. However, because your daughter is only 8 years old and still in the process of learning proper etiquette, I hope her Aunt Louise will give her one more chance.

ANN LANDERS (R)

COPYRIGHT 2009 CREATORS SYNDICATE INC.

[LaurieS]

Wow.. pretty bold of Aunt Louise to state why there would be no future gifts.  I don't think I would go that far, but we did stop sending to our nephew and niece when it became obvious that our  gifts were viewed as us meeting our obligations.  It seems like such an easy way  to show someone that you appreciate the thought.

I was asked to be a hostess of a bridal shower, there were 10 of us and silly me I  didn't realize that all I was suppose to do was to split 1/10 of the cost and clean up  afterwards.  I did this for my friend who's  daughter was getting married, a girl I didn't even really know, but I did it along with 9 other well meaning ladies. Not a single thank you card was  ever sent out.. I thought next time we should include a box of  cards to be  given to the bride-to-be

[luise.volta]

I, too, feel that giving a gift is one side of a two-sided process. The thank you is the rest. When I got new in-laws and never heard a word, I didn't know if sending gifts was wrong, or if the gift itself was wrong or if my ethics were wrong. I never found out. After 20 years of tapering off, I just stopped and no one seemed to notice. 

[pam1]

Kathleen, I can't imagine someone asking me for money like that.  Mind boggling.

But then again, I wonder if it really is a cultural thing.  I know the love languages count gifts as a type of language.  Perhaps some people don't consider gifts to be as important as others?

I know that I don't and I never thought about them much.  For others, it seems to be a really big deal and they have lists of what you can buy them and where you should buy it.  Just really different outlooks.  I do agree with a simple verbal thank you though. 

I know in our culture registries/showers are frowned upon.  I imagine someone whom registries/showers were the norm would feel awkward entering our family. 

[kathleen]

Luise,

You're one tough cookie, too!  Maybe you should start a Luise Landers column.  You certainly give sage advice, and can do it in a few sentences.  Onward to your new career,

Kathleen

PS Don't take the "tough cookie" as anything but a compliment.  It's what I aspire to become.

[luise.volta]

  I have had an advice Website for over five years and have won two coveted awards...one from the Foss Foundation and the other from the Bank of America. Come on over and take a look: www.MomResponds.com

That's how this Web-forum got started. The most often asked question was, "Why Do My Son and Daughter-in-law Hate Me?" I felt we needed a different venue to address our issues with adult children and extended families; one that was more interactive. www.WiseWomenUnite.com started out as www.MotherInLawsUnite.com but so many wonderful DILs joined our forum that I renamed it a year later.

Thanks for your vote of confidence!

[Pooh]

I totally expect a thank you for a gift.  It does not have to be written, verbal is perfectly fine.  I feel the same way about my time.  If I help someone do something, a thank you is appropriate (throw a shower, help them paint their house, etc...).  I don't find that as strings attached, just basic courtesy.  I love to do things for people and will help family and friends with most anything they need.  But if I was asked to help and then arrived and they treated me with disrespect and yelled at me the entire time, I wouldn't help them again.  That would be rude.  So to me, not saying thank you for someone doing something nice for you or giving you a gift, is also being rude.  Just how I am.

[justus]

Just because Anne Lander thinks it is OK doesn't make it OK. DH has been sending occasional gifts to his nieces and nephews. He has only received one thank you so far. He isn't planning on not sending gifts for lack of thanks. That isn't why he is giving these gifts. He isn't sending them because it is expected of him or because he wants praise or needs warm fuzzies. Nope, he is sending them little things that he runs into that he thinks they will appreciate because he loves them and wants to show them this which is hard to do when you live 2,000 miles away. No thank you to him is no big deal. Actually, it isn't an issue at all. Frankly, as a psychologist, he can't stand Ann Landers because of the often harmful and trite advice she gave out.

I think that being thankful is a valuable thing and it is good to show your gratitude, but once again, we are all getting all worked up about what we cannot control. We can only control ourselves and how we chose to give, we cannot control how others react to receiving our gift. We can argue till the cows come home about what is proper, but the truth is not everyone is going to live up to Ann Lander's standards. We have a choice to either let it go or let it really bother us and possibly ruin relationships and cause hurt feelings. I vote for letting it go. It isn't worth the effort to get worked up over.

[Pooh]

I think Ann Landers is funny.  And like here, I take some things and leave some things she says.  And you are right, you can not control if someone thanks you or not.  But I don't let it bother me, I just move on and do things for more grateful people.

[LaurieS]

I don't think that anyone is going to live their lives through the Ann Lander passages or Martha Stewart's decorating skills.  But it was fun to read what she had to say concerning proper etiquette.

It's safe to say that the recipient of the gifts should not be upset if the gifts were to stop coming because the person giving them does not know how they were received.  Maybe in your case Justus, the nieces made some favorable reference to the gifts in passing, that I would accept as a thank you.

My dd was constantly jokingly chastised by her college coach each time she thanked him for during a practice session.  He said that she was the only kid that ever thanked him for trying to kill her at her position.... but the way she looked at it was even tho he is paid to be a coach, he was not required to help make her a better player. It's an individual choice I guess. Showing gratitude can go a long way towards someone positive perception of you. 

You are correct in the fact that you can not control how someone will receive a gift but you are in control to decide if you want to make the offer of a gift based on past experiences with this person. 

[luise.volta]

For me, to ask if the gift was received was not connected with thinking it might have been lost in the mail. When they can't be delivered, they are returned to sender. For me, it was a covert way of reminding the person that they had no manners. It took me a while to realize that I was displaying bad manners myself by doing that.

[kathleen]

Luise, that's so cool!  I am either incredibly bright or incredibly stupid (probably the latter) to suggest you start something you've already won awards for doing.  I can't wait to see you on Oprah.  Huge baskets of flowers to you on your wonderful, amazing awards.  No wonder you are so successful bringing together MIL's.  Thank you for sharing that, and I love the "momsRespond" site.  Just wish I'd had it when I was a young mom.

Ann Landers is not the Holy Grail to me. I think when we read each other's posts, we should not make assumptions such as "just because Ann Landers says something doesn't mean it's true." Of course not.  I just posted that because I thought her message about accepting "boorish behavior" was very interesting to me in terms of our discussion, and of course, she is of the 50's and times have changed.  She wouldn't have been caught dead, for example, going on Oprah in jeans, whereas plenty of advice book writers now do so.  Woe to Ann today for appearing in photos in her trademark mink stole.  But many, many famous and successful people of her day admired Ann Landers and commented in her column, not to mention the mere normal mortals who looked up to her.  She was a fixture and, I think, a good one.

I do disagree that all her advice was pat. Please understand she was dealing with very limited newspaper space. What's difficult is to get a good, thoughtful piece of advice into a few sentences; Luise accomplishes that, and it's a talent and a gift.  I know.  I've written for newspapers for decades.  I got guidance from Ann on many subjects, as I do from Luise on this list. I'm sure not all of Ann Landers' advice was good.  Psychologists also have given out bad advice, although I don't remember an instance when Ann did---perhaps you can enlighten me. 

One time when I was very very young, my dad took me to hear Ann Landers speak.  I never forgot it.  She was so serious about her work and took her role as an influence very seriously. She talked about that, and how important it was for her to stay grounded. Down to earth.  She made a deep impression on me as a young person.  From the time I was young to the time she died, I turned my newspaper first to her column every day.  The letters and problems were so interesting and often resonated personally, particularly after I got married.  When I became a newspaper columnist myself, I took her great style of ethics very much to heart.  My father spent his life in the newspaper/print business, and very much admired Ann Landers for the quality and dedication she brought to her work.

I really have to take issue---as a personal aside--- with any possible comparison of Ann Landers to Martha Stewart, a convicted criminal.  Ugh, ugh.  I can't believe a major cable channel now features yet another one of her shows.  Please no more Martha Stewart.  And I won't even apologize to her fans.  It's just my opinion, of course, but a strong one from which I won't budge.  Give me Ann any day.

So you can imagine me, Ann Landers devotee, meeting up with my DIL, who doesn't think anything of routinely asking for $$ and never acknowledging it, let alone expensive gifts.

Not a good match.

Kathleen

[luise.volta]

Thanks for that! You are one interesting gal!

I read that Ann Landers was unwilling to "perpetuate" her column so that others could write under her name. She wanted it to stop when she did and that's what happened. There are other columns where many have ghost-written under a single banner.