Lost my son...

[1Glitterati]

re:taking my DS to court for GP visitations right 1x a month
had I not mentioned that to DS that I will challenge him at the court,
as I did not see our 2GDs for almost a year

Is he abusive to the children?

[Eva]

it really seems like he takes something he has done,
blamed it on me and made up a twisted story. 

..and he believe in this twisted story and that hurt
that was like this with us too

Crystal I was blaming my self last year like you do know,
beating myself down, blaming myself for everything,
thinking what if, I should not, I am so wrong...
me and DH even separated for 2 moths after 36 year of marriage
DH blaming me, me blaming DH
but we got stronger, we both love our son
now we called DIL toxic woman

could your DIL  be after your DS money trust fund?
Crystal please do find Invisible story
about her dead son and Invisible  pain
I put on search Invisible and it was an eye opener for me

from day one our DIL was asking about everybody finances,
her father, mother and DIL even came
to our small shop and looked around
asking questions about our small business,
last year DS and DIL came  4X for lunch
asking if she could help somehow to
get us more business, would we pay her 10% royalty?
same as her dad always payed her?
without even invitation,our DS called and came with
DIL and her parents, being in the area as they said,
they stopped at our cottage,
looked around walked cottage from basement to roof
asking questions about our finances,
how much mortgage, how much equity,etc...
what our planes are for retirement, how $ we saved..

Our Oldest son with his family was there with us spending weekend
he said - they are to over friendly...

at the wedding father of the Bride giving cold shoulder to all
ignoring Groom brothers, his over friendliness was gone

[Eva]

Is he abusive to the children?

Yes he was,
as I witness to beating/spanking
but after school called in social services
DS said in counseling last month that  he stopped
-since then he did not spank them -THANK YOU GOD!
as DS  said
he is afraid that he will loose 50% custody
if GDs complain to teacher
Rule#1
"if stepbrother ever touch you, you have to tell your teacher"
Rule #2
"if daddy ever spank you, you have to tell your teacher"

[Sheen]

" It really seems like he takes something he has done, blamed it on me and made up a twisted story. "

Dear Brokemyheart,

I read your post above and it hit a nerve in me because I feel the same way about my son. As I and his three sisters remember it, their childhood was pretty good. They never went without, and we supported him and them all thru their lives. The funny thing is that since he was the oldest , the girls always said that I spoiled him more then them and we were always very close up until he met dil.   Once that happened, he slowly alienated himself not only from me but also from his sisters and we are now hitting the six year mark where he has not spoken, written, or even inquired about any of us.  The last communication I had was from dil telling me that he felt his childhood was horrible and I did not fulfill his expectations as a mom .   I use to sit for hours trying to figure out how five people who had lived thru the same thing have such a different take on it. I use to wonder what it was that I actually did to warrant him  cutting himself off from his entire family to such an extent but after years of sleepless nights, I really have just accepted this is the way he must want it.  It would be easy to blame dil for the whole mess but quite frankly if by the age of 32.  he is so willing to cut off his family then I must hold him responsible. 

I don't think it ever gets easier but I think we get to the point that we realize we have little control over the situation so we come  to a calmer acceptance of the situation and classify it as just another one of life's great mysteries with that hidden hope that they wake up from their fantasy before we pass on.  I think it is good that you have looked at the situation for answers and come up with the belief that you were a good mom and did your best and this is something that you will never understand.
What always amazes me  in these cases that although our sons and daughters have no problem telling us we are horrible or telling us that they are cutting us off, most seem to have a definate problem explaining their decisions to us with cold facts and explaining their reasoning. They tell us they are adults and need to live their own lives etc  but as far as explaining their position on why they are cutting us out of their life , all of a sudden they have lost the power of speech .  We can only resolve a problem if we are aware what  the problem is .

[jomama]

That's my daughter all over!  No one else remembers this horrible childhood she suddenly had. It wasn't too bad to keep me from raising her children or bailing her out of trouble. Course we didn't hear about it until after she left, and then we had to read it on Facebook.  I figure she has to own it now. She can't take the chance her ILs will learn the truth, so I can't see or speak to the gc.  She has no where else to run.  At least not until she finds her next victims, and then it'll be the evil ILs fault.  So many lies.

[Miss Understood]

MU, I read your post and it cought my eye when you said you're ashamed that your son is brainwashed by DIL, I feel ashamed too and I can't explain why. Why do you think that is? Why do we feel ashamed when we haven't done anything wrong? I'm also ashamed to look at DS and DIL's family but I don't why.

Guest 1...I feel ashamed because I raised my son differently than that. I raised him to have a forgiving spirit, to be a communicator, to understand that through all...family is forever and always. I raised him to show respect, to take responsibilities for wrong doing and always...don't let the sun go down on your anger. I am ashamed that my DS has no respect for me anymore, for his sisters, step father that raised him. I am ashamed that he would toss us out after all the good things in life that I have given him. I am ashamed that he would create lies about me and our family to feed his imagination to ensure that he is justified in what he is doing. I am ashamed that he allowed someone else and himself to cause so much hurt to his mother and the rest of us. I am ashamed of him for turning into the most hurtful, selfish and cruel person I know. My DS has caused me more hurt and pain than I have ever experienced in my whole entire life. I have been through a lot...But what he has done to me tops them all. And my DIL too. As much as I want him back in my life, I also am afraid that I will not be able to look at him again, trust him for anything and fear even getting close to my GD for fear of them using her against me. This....makes it harder and sadder for me....so much that I am  to the point of just feeling ashamed of him. Does this answer your question?

[Eva]

one twisted story 

last summer DS and DIL came to our small shop
DIL was 100% in charge to change DS's car brakes
I asked DIL politely:
please, if you love our son do not touch his car brakes
five me chills, as DS or GDs could get killed on the road.."
DIL said she knows, even her mother told her same

next day DS called telling me I should apologize to DIL
for hurting her feelings, that I should not speak so loudly
because she always wanted to be automechanic
and had 4 years of auto mechanics courses
(one semester in HS when DIL was 17)
I told DS I am sorry for loving him
but please next time do not bring DIL to our shop to fix his brakes

I asked DS why he would let DIL touch his brakes?
why he would not let his brother auto mechanic who
always fixed his car before to do that?
DS said that his brother auto mechanic is an as*
who almost killed our youngest son
when he did not fixed his brake properly
so
I talk to our youngest son asking about that
he said it is reversed
that his brother auto mechanic was mad at him,
as he could get killed fixing his car
you see our youngest  want to help and
night before loosed all nuts on the 4 wheals
even his brother told him not to do that
in the morning his brother auto mechanic came
one hour before him and
took a car with all loosed nuts for a spin around the block....

[Pooh]

I can relate to the 'ashamed' part too.  I thought about it many times because I knew in my heart, that I had done a good job raising him.  I finally decided the shame I feel is because I wonder "What was he lacking that made him turn to someone like her?  I may have raised him well, but there was something he was missing that she provides him."

I have friends that were not allowed sugar growing up, and now they are gluttons.  I have friends that were raised poorly, now they are all about material things.  I have friends that were not shown much affection growing up, and they stay with men that beat them because that same man showers them with affection at other times.  So I always have felt that people seek out things they were missing.  So I tried for the longest to figure out what he was missing growing up that attracted him to her and felt ashamed that I didn't provide him with whatever it is.

Then I finally opened my eyes and realized, there was nothing to feel ashamed about.  I look at my other son, who had the exact same raising, and he dates women that are very nice, respectful and good people.  He migrates towards honesty, ethics and kindness so I realized that it boils down to "free will".  Everyone has it, and everyone makes choices.  We make good choices, and we make bad choices.  And when I do make a bad choice, I have to deal with the consequences.  So does he, and that is nothing for me to be ashamed of.  Now that he is choosing to NOT deal with his choices, alienate his friends and family, and lay down and cower to her, that is HIS shame.

[Miss Understood]

Pooh.... SO wisely said.  Thank you. I struggle with this...like I did something wrong. No, I did not. I was a great mother and I did great things for my son. My life wasn't perfect, but no ones is. I just know that I didn't do anything to warrant this from him. What he is doing is all about him. Concequences....Their concequences become our concequences in a way. My DS chose to alienate us and ruin relationships that were good. It not only affects him...it affects us too. He has ruined relationships with us and her side of the family, his father (my ex) and created some damage with my family (my parents, my siblings) So...his deal has become all of our deal. That is what bothers me the most. This thing got so big with them...over nothing and he is not making any attempt to right the wrong or even communicate to resolve anything. Silent Treatment is all he is willing to give after dishing out the hurt, anger, lies and betrayal to his family. Just the Silent Treatment. Like someone who gives a sucker punch then runs and hides....Oh, His father did that when he abandoned our family. Maybe it is genetic...maybe my DS is a spitten image of his cowardly father. My Ex (who I thought was my friend) Ran and hid from me when we pulled up in the same parking lot a couple of months ago...to avoid me...like the coward he still is. Remember that story?

[jomama]

I think they are ashamed, that's why they can't face us. We know them better than anyone else, and they know it. I refuse to let my daughter blame me or shame me for things that never happened.  I'm not sure I can forgive her this time. I've talked to the gc once since then; they are just as hurt and confused as I am. She chose to tear us apart rather than face up to her lies. How do I forgive that?

[Pooh]

I remember that story MU and you are right, it is cowardly.  And you are also right that their consequences become ours.  But, only if we allow it.  That is where I am at now.  I can only let this affect my life if I choose too.  Does that means its not happening?  No, but it means that I have peace in knowing it is his decision and his choice.  How I react to it is my choice.

Jomama, I think that as selfish as this sounds, we forgive them for ourselves, not for them.  I have forgiven my son for how he treats us, even though he hasn't apologized.  He still doesn't think there is anything wrong with what he is doing, and he may never realize it.  But I have forgiven him so that I can move on.  Forgive and forget are two different words.  I have forgiven him but I have not forgotten and refuse to allow him or DIL to treat us badly any longer.

[Miss Understood]

I don't think they feel ashamed. I think somewhere inside they feel justified. When they tell a lie so much, so big...they start to believe it and I think it takes an act of GOD or something really big in their life for them to take a good hard look at themselves and see through the lie. It takes a really big person to admit to their wrong doings and it takes an even bigger person to come clean and make things right in their life because they'd have to eat that Humble Sandwich.

If I really knew what my DS was so mad at me for, what the cut off is for...I'd make it right if I could. I just don't have a clue and I find it very unfair that he won't tell me the truth or even give me an option to understand what it is.

[Pen]

MU, I'm kind of in between on this. I think that some DILs need to justify it somehow, hence some of the incomprehensible reasons for cut off (although I'm sure there are good reasons for cut off occasionally, such as abuse or extreme/dangerous behavior.) But many DILs don't feel the need to justify - they don't want ILs in their life or in the life of DH and that's that. I think in some cases the DS is ashamed because he knows his wife is not being fair, but he's decided to go along with her to keep the peace. In other cases the DS doesn't like the feeling of being ashamed so he takes on his wife's attitude.

DIL need to justify + comprehensible complaints = ILs can choose to fix/not fix = good/poor relationship
DIL need to justify + incomprehensible complaints = ILs can't fix = poor relationship
DIL no need to justify = ILs can't fix = cut off/poor relationship which can lead to:
    DS feels DIL unfair + wants to keep the peace = DS feeling ashamed = awkward/poor relationship
DS feels DIL unfair, wants to keep the peace = cut off/poor relationship= feeling ashamed + doesn't like feeling ashamed = total cut off
DS totally agrees with DIL from the get go, justified or not = total cut off

[Eva]

I'm not sure I can forgive her this time. I've talked to the gc once since then; they are just as hurt and confused as I am. She chose to tear us apart rather than face up to her lies. How do I forgive that?
-------------------------------
jomama just start to pray for you daughter
..and forgive our trespasses
...as we forgive those who trespass against us...
that is what help me to forgive our son

I look at our son and see that he is hurting inside very much and
his pain and accusations is all what he has
that is the only way he could right now communicate
he need to get his anger out of him,
he is not happy person he used to be, he is very angry
I am praying for his well being


in counseling when DS told to me that
I am a worst mother any body could have, that loving mothers
do support their children even in jail,
if their children deals drugs or killed some one
but I am not one of those loving mothers
because I do not support him,
that nobody love me and no one want to be to be around me,
everybody hates me, and stop invite me for family gatherings,
that his 2 DDs had some activity at school and
I did not choose to  come to see them...
DS said: "you are saying you love them but you were not there.."
you have schizophrenia and it is not safe for girls to be around you,
you need to go on medications, you need professional help
because you are crazy...

re: GDs school: "I asked DS how could I come? I did not know
as he did not invite us to come to their school

re:family gatherings, first he made problem and
said :"if mom come I would not come....
them twisted to :"...nobody want to be around you..."

re: medication and crazy, I will bring my family doctor statement
about my mental health for next counseling
no medications, no schizophrenia

I told to DS..I am sorry I was not mother you want me to be,
I did my best in situation I was ,
"I am sorry I put your children needs first -
they are little and need help
you are adult you could take care of your self, but girls could not
I am not pushing myself into your life,
I do not want to come to your house,
or to your wedding if you do not want me to be there,
you do not need to hire bodyguards to kick me out of you wedding
I will respect your wish
all I am asking from to you, to let us see your girls 1X a month
you choose the place and time and we will come
you are welcome to supervise, to stay all the time with girls,
we could go to library, ZOO or Mc Donald, it is your choice...
or you  could bring girls  here with you for concealing
and they will supervised our visits it is up to you...

DS said he need more time...

[Miss Understood]

DIL need to justify + comprehensible complaints = ILs can choose to fix/not fix = good/poor relationship
DIL need to justify + incomprehensible complaints = ILs can't fix = poor relationship
DIL no need to justify = ILs can't fix = cut off/poor relationship which can lead to:
    DS feels DIL unfair + wants to keep the peace = DS feeling ashamed = awkward/poor relationship
DS feels DIL unfair, wants to keep the peace = cut off/poor relationship= feeling ashamed + doesn't like feeling ashamed = total cut off
DS totally agrees with DIL from the get go, justified or not = total cut off

Great Analagy Pen...
I guess it's hard to tell which one I fall into because my DS isn't even speaking to me. It was soooo weird. She seems so sweet and calm and quiet...then he became angry, then happy when she wasn't around, then mean with her being around and then angry at me (like I was the scape goat) then her daggers came out and then he did the attacking and then boom! Like a bomb...destroyed everything.