I genuinely want to know what you think.

[Tara]

Hey Creme and Laurie,

Because I say I don't understand or get something doesn't mean I think someone is wrong or foolish.  It means I would like to understand.  I do get that there is alot of 'diversity' about how people like to do things and generally am accepting of this but possession of images of children is a new concept to me I'd like to know more about. 

Also, understand and have compassion for Holliberrys disappointment.  What I didn't get was someone saying that gp should never send a photo out of their child.  Yes, people have a right to their way of doing things, but since photography an important part of my life, I was simply curious about their thinking about this.  comprehende? 

but Creme, a point well about honoring our differences

[cremebrulee]

Hi there....
Tara, remember, in our days growing up, our worlds were a lot smaller, today, this world thru technology is a whole lot bigger, and people have access to much information over the internet, most people are good, and others are very sick people who would do harm to others.....

Young mothers today, don't let they're kids out to run around the neighbor hoods like we did growning up....I grew up in a very small town and all the parents watched out for everyone's kids.  Back then if a neighbor yelled at your kid, you thanked them and you yelled at them to....nothing was like it is today....

We had a wonderful childhood, playing hide and seek in the neighborhood till much after dark...and we were never harmed....

However, today, the world is much different....you have all kinds of people moving in and over crowding, and it seems the days we knew are gone....there are a lot of fears facing young mothers today, as, with movies, the news, and TV in general, we have privy to a lot of depressing stuff going on out there...and many girls I work with tell me, that when they hear stroeids they're mothers tell about growing up like that, they know that they could never feel safe allowing they're kids outside like that unsupervised....and its true..so, I'm gathering that the photograph thing is a fear, b/c some mothers do not want they're kids pictures all over....and I'm just guessing, maybe I'm wrong?

[Pen]

So when there's a family gathering and group snapshots are taken we can expect to see blurred out faces or black rectangles over the eyes of the little ones on FB or in scrapbooks, LOL. Should make for interesting scrapbooking/genealogical research in the future! "And here's your uncle Pete, uh aunt Julie, or is it cousin Betty? Uncle Devon? Oh well, it's someone you're related to when we all got together for great-gran's 100th birthday. Interesting, huh?"

[LaurieS]

LOL Pen... I'm envisioning that right now.  Tara, I thought you were talking about birth announcements and first pictures etc. 

[Tara]

Good thought about safety. 
Even when my son was young (he is now 46) I didn't worry about him being harmed by someone.
Things have changed alot.  I can see that it would be scary to raise children in these times. 

Pen  I can appreciate your cynicism.

Maybe we should have workshops at hospitals and medical centers for grandparents like they do for parents educating us about
the issues and concerns of the younger family generations     ;- )   . 

When I was working at UC Berkeley each year they sent out statistics about the incoming generation of students like
the ones in the New Yorker and I recall that the incoming generation one year was said to have never known a time
when there wasn't internet.  I found that very interesting.  We need to know about the concerns about the younger
generation and where do we learn if no one educates us or our family members don't dialogue about it?

I've learned alot here in the short time I've been a member.  grateful for that truely

[Pooh]

Ok, I am finding that I am guilty of alot of things we have been talking about lately.  Tara, I wouldn't dream of sending out birth announcements of a grandchild without the parent asking me, but if we are talking about pictures of myself and GD that I gave to my family members or posted as the background on my computer at work....guilty.

I also posted pictures of myself, DH, Son's, GGP, etc. on facebook of them with my GC....guilty.  But I also have pictures of all kinds of events on there that doesn't include her....so I never really thought about it.

I too thought we were talking about birth announcements.

[Tara]

Well, re:  birth announcements - I can't imagine a gp sending them out instead of the parents doing so but that is IMHO.   On the other hand as I mentioned a friend sent out a card with a photo of herself and her grandbaby, it was definitely an announcement but I assume it was only to her friends.  One of those shutterfly.com cards.  It was cute. 

Other than that I was talking about how people send out xmas cards with lots of family photos on it

[Pooh]

Regarding Christmas Cards, etc., then....I have done it and I have received many of them over the years.  I honestly never thought about it being offensive to the parents.  I remember running into people at the mall that I hadn't seen in a while and them saying that my Mother had shown them pictures of my boys.  I guess I only ever figured that she was proud of them.

[cremebrulee]

Regarding Christmas Cards, etc., then....I have done it and I have received many of them over the years.  I honestly never thought about it being offensive to the parents.  I remember running into people at the mall that I hadn't seen in a while and them saying that my Mother had shown them pictures of my boys.  I guess I only ever figured that she was proud of them.

your right to feel that way Pooh, I do the same thing with My GD, plus, as you, I'm very proud of her, my DIL and son...however, I guess there are mother's who don't feel the same way....and I think that's ok to...matter of fact, I posted pictures of my GD, I have to remember to ask DIL how she feels about it...I just assumed that she wouldn't mind, however, maybe she does....and that's ok to....but next time we talk, I'm going to make it a point to ask her.  I don't want to upset her or make her feel fear or unhappy....

[LaurieS]

If I'm not mistaken, Holliberri was referring to her child's first Christmas, this was how she was reintroducing her child since the birth announcements.. and whether it was her mother or mil, they stole her thunder.  Holliberri had the right to be disappointed as this person used in part the same mailing list as Holli was going to use.  Had the mom/mil put herself into Holli's shoes she may have chosen a different path. 

While it is possible, I doubt that a mother would be upset with a mom or mil sending a picture to friends.. even posting on fb would probably not upset anyone as long as no personal information was given out.  I know I'm repeating myself, but there is a fb scam going on and they are gathering their information from the pictures and information that is being posted and updated.  I proved this to my sister who was shocked to see how photos and slight descriptions of her grandkids could and did trace them back to their hometown in Texas.. and I know nothing when it comes to really searching for individuals using the internet. 

[Pooh]

I totally believe that Laurie.  We are dealing with tons of calls on fraud daily here it seems, from people getting personal information on people.  I think technology has made it so much easier than it used to be.

I am with you.  I took her post to mean the same thing about the Christmas card.  And I would be upset too about it. 

[Tara]

Yes,  I've heard about these child predators too.

I hope I didn't seem to  indicate a lack of appreciation or caring  and  re:  Holliberrys concern.  I did understand her disappointment
re:  not being able to be the one to send out the photos of her child at christmas.  I was trying to say I did understand that.
I always appreciate hearing her perspective.

[Scoop]

I agree that there are 2 aspects here:

1 - The parents really should give permission for the distribution of photos of their kids.  You can show pictures that are given to you, but handing out pictures is a different matter.  Some people are really private.

2 - The safety aspect.  You should never-ever post pictures of kids online without their parents permission.  Not even group shots with 'strange' kids in the background.  There are just too many creepy people out there.  I have a Flickr account, which is a public photo sharing website that I use to keep our out-of-town family in the loop with what's going on in our lives.  I can see which of my pictures have been viewed and what they're searching for, so I have to be VERY careful what I post on there.  Because if I post something with a title of "bathing suit" it gets 10 times the hits of anything else.  I posted a picture of my niece (with permission) as the first person in "the lake" one year, wearing a wet suit.  Well, you don't want to know how many hits I got off of "wet suit".  And if you search for "wet suit", WATCH OUT.  No one wants a picture of their kid in some pedophiles computer.

The thing is, it's just a question of asking permission.  Some will say yes, some will say no, everyone will appreciate being asked.

[holliberri]

Tara,

Just to clarify, I was talking about Christmas photos/birth announcements. My plan was, had I been asked, to pay for extra photos so MIL could send them to her friends as well. It just didn't work out that way. It turns out MIL was worried that I wouldn't send them out (um, ask me?!), so she decided to take care of it. But, I only get to send out photos of my babies for a few precious years; after that I'm done doing it. Oh well.

I am actually 100% okay with my MIL and mom posting photos of DD on Facebook, because I do it, and I get to see the photos they post  . I know terrible things can happen to the photos, but I can't control everything.

But, I know that there is an aversion to posting things like that on Facebook. I got in trouble with a friend for posting photos of her and she was on Facebook. I really should've respected that. I think it is just one of those things that you have to ask.

As for showing people photos, or sending a friend one? Nah.

BTW, I really could tell you were just asking me about what I was saying. I appreciate that.   

[LaurieS]

BTW, I really could tell you were just asking me about what I was saying. I appreciate that.   

Yeah but Holli.. you weren't here and we were bored.. we all had our morning coffee and were rearing to put our mouths and fingers into gear.. so we started the party without you   It's 3 in the afternoon and you are just showing up... party to much last night???