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Messages - luise.volta

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Absolutely, J, good catch! No one is responsible for our expectations. They are ours. Mine were pretty minimal but they were from another decade.

Welcome, J. I agree with B. 100%. It's my humble opinion that the present situation is teaching your younger children that abusing parents is OK and respect is outdated. You matter, your husband matters, your marriage matters. When I was in tight spaces with my teens, I got stuck in 'what if'. What if he has to stop school and go to work? What if he makes bad choices? What if I am to blame and failed as a parent?

I learned that adulthood is a classroom and choices need to be made by students. Consequences from their actions have to be faced and lessons learned, or not. I eventually got that my biological, parental role of protecting my sons during their childhood was not a gift when they were of age, it was damaging.

It was awful for all of us...and they grew up in the process. When their own children reached the same fork in the road...they thanked me for my earlier wisdom and did the same thing. Then it was repeated with my 23 year-old great granddaughter, who has flourished as a result. (I am 90.)

When our children were babies, they fell while learning to walk. It was part of the process even though we hated it. I see a strong similarity.


Daughter in Laws and/or Son in Laws / Re: Mostly lurking at this point.
« on: November 27, 2017, 09:01:56 PM »
Welcome P, we ask all new members to go to our HomePage and under Read me First to read the posts placed there for you to be sure WWU is a fit. We're a monitored Website.

How wonderful that you are availing yourself of our archives. That's what they're for! Thank you.

I had a hard time when I started to realize that the paths of others were not where I should focus. It's what moms do for years on end. I actually lost sight of myself as a complete person prior to my biological role and didn't know where to begin. For a long time I let myself be drawn back in...thinking it was what I 'should' be doing without realizing I had let it define me. I admire your clarity and resolve and I hope the support and understanding available here helps.

Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / Re: Should I speak up?
« on: November 27, 2017, 11:22:16 AM »
I think the hardest thing for me to learn was that it was "none of my business"! And to convey that information to my 'adult' son. What was going on with him was 'my business' for so long and he was used to asking for my counsel that it wasn't easy or even natural for either of us. I had to tell him that along with leaving home was leaving the kind of interactions that worked for us in the parent/child context. He wasn't ready or even able to make wise choices at first. The point was for him to choose and then learn from the consequences...or not. When his sons left home, he did the same thing and thanked me for the 'tough love'. They are now grown and my 23 year-old great granddaughter is on the same track. They have all become outstanding adults...but maybe that has nothing to do with any of the above. Who knows? Hugs...

Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / Re: My son is making me feel guilty
« on: November 27, 2017, 08:22:40 AM »
What great news! I would ask him if he would enjoy being your guest at a local restaurant for your Christmas Day Dinner? First, I'd get on the Internet to see what was open close to be able to offer a suggestion or two. Then everyone would get to relax and have a good time. Hugs...

Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / Re: Should I speak up?
« on: November 25, 2017, 08:44:28 PM »
I learned the hard way that my observations were passed on and it went downhill from there. The 'he said or did' and the 'she said or did' is called triangulation for good reason and the promise not to quote me lasted until their first fight. Then all bets were off. Eventually I had to say I didn't want to know the inside details of the relationship. It was their private business. All I added was that, for me, my intimate, live-in relationship(s) were the most difficult venues I ever experienced but/and they brought me the most valuable lessons of life. Adding, that I had to do it alone, via trial and error. I also passed on the fact that a couple of times, I needed a counselor to help me...but that was very different than involving a family member. And I stuck to it. Not easy. We are all protective and hate to see our not-quite-adult children flopping around.

The fact that your daughter already has 'noted some things that her new boyfriend has to change about himself to be a better partner', is a red flag. He probably has a similar list, right? Oh, oh...

Sometimes I had to pretend I actually had tape over my mouth. Hugs...

I had to come to the point of no return before I was able to face something similar, S. I anguished over it way too long before I decided to pick up my dignity and move on. 'I matter'. That was the silent stand I took. My husband was in my corner...(if not in the kitchen)...and brainstormed with me. We didn't have the money to go on a cruise, so we started taking mini-trips over Thanksgiving, no two alike. We studied destinations, gathered data on different Bed and Breakfasts and considered routes including points of interest. We took along good books, slept in, walked on a beach when there was one, and ate like Royalty on Thanksgiving Day. We came home refreshed. It reminded us that we were a couple before we were parents. It was wonderful! We simply told the clan we were spending our holiday giving thanks that we could spoil each other. I'm a widow and those are some of my loveliest memories. Hugs...

     Thinking of you R. Wondering, since it was what sounded like a repeat performance, if you feel it served anyone? If not, what would you change that is about your life, not theirs?
     Where my experiences, which were similar, eventually took me was to change what didn't work for me while getting that what my eldest son, his wife and their children did was about them to change or not. They chose to continue but/and not in my home. I choose to no longer participate in the lesson they were teaching; that abuse was acceptable.      Did I lose something? Yes, my garden variety expectations. Did I gain something? Yes, my self respect. Hugs...
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Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / Re: My son is making me feel guilty
« on: November 22, 2017, 09:08:23 AM »
Welcome back, Nik. We are always here for you! What comes up for me is my own experience of my eldest son's criticism. I honestly thought it was about me and anguished over having not done things 'right'. Looking back I know it was his job as an adult to work through his childhood issues. We all have them. He chose to focus on the past instead of the present...and on my humanness as well as his dad's. We were a garden-variety family with normal ups and downs.

Parental blame for some has great appeal because it carries with it the denial of responsibility. It supports the illusion that if we had done things differently life would be perfect, the consequences that come with poor choices wouldn't exist and no lessons would need to be learned.

Welcome, M. I don't have much to add to the great response you got from S. For me, learning to listen, care and shut up has been a lesson that's been long in coming! That's all that's needed and it's priceless. Making choices and learning from the consequences...or not, is what adults do and how they do that is their business.
Hugs 2U.

Welcome, C. I have been there, too. My issues aren't gone but I finally learned that my expectations, which were just the garden variety 'gramma stuff', were mine and that no one was responsible for fulfilling them. In my generation, I was born in 1927, those things were a given.

We are here for you. Please know that you are not alone and that we care. Many have healed here and gotten their lives back, even though they were not what they'd planned on or hoped for. For me it was the discovery that there was Life After Parenting...other options, as SL just described, beyond my beloved biological role. Hugs...

Welcome, F., this is where you can be heard and understood, for sure.

For me, what tripped me up was my very garden-variety expectations. I didn't realize for a long time that they were mine and others had no obligation to fulfill them. All I wanted was what I knew in my own childhood where both families were honored and respected. I thought it was just a given.

What I had to learn to do was to focus on what I did have. Since it was unfair, that was a hard and very slow transition for me. I guess I had to do some growing up of my own before I could get that my son had started a new family unit and they got to make their own rules and work through their own lessons. I thought traditions mattered like they used to.

I don't know if there is anything in my story that might help. I am now a great grandmother and my great granddaughter is 23! What a lovely women! I have seen her once in the last 10 years. She lives about 5 hours away and came up to see me last year with her own grandmother, my ex-DIL, and her dad, my eldest grandson. It was wonderful! My son died of a sleep apnea stroke at age 52, so I am deeply grateful to still be connected and to feel their love. Thank heaven for FaceBook. In my case, it is a treasure but I know that's not always the case. Sending hugs...

Welcome, S. We ask all new members to go to our HomePage and under Open Me First to read the posts placed there for you. Please pay special attention to the Forum Agreement to be sure WWU is a fit for you. We're a monitored Website. Thanks in advance!

My experience is similar to the others that have responded to you. To become a healthy, responsible adult...separation has to occur. I left home at 18 and so did both of my sons. It isn't as hard when it is to go to college or into the service, which is what we did...but it was permanent and it was a long time before any of us, myself included, reached even a minimal level of maturity.

A blowup is no fun for anyone but it can achieve the same purpose. You both initiated it and you son's attempts at blaming you are probably about saving face. Who knows? We can't change others...just ourselves so I agree that focusing on your own life is where you will find peace. There is life after parenting. There are many here to attest to that! Hugs...

Grab Bag / Hang in There!
« on: October 29, 2017, 10:55:57 AM »
Our Home page has been changed and our Webmaster is working on the lack of traffic on our Site. It is due to shifts in focus that are coming from Google. Crossing fingers! Hugs to all!

Adult Sons and/or Adult Daughters / Re: adult daughter giving up on me
« on: October 23, 2017, 10:41:14 AM »
Welcome, M. We ask all new members to go to our HomePage and under Read Me First, to read the posts placed there for you. Please pay special attention to the Forum Agreement to be sure WWU is a fit. We are a monitored Website. (This is our, legal 'Canned Greeting' and nothing personal.)

My heart goes out to you because I know how it feels to have limited vision at night, fatigue and an aging dog. For me, I think my worst enemy has been the fact that I look and act pretty much like I used to, so what evidence there is that my limitations are increasing is not easily faced by those that don't want to see them. Thus, I was seen as a wimp when I was just being as honest as possible.

I don't know what will work for you, of course. Certainly the present situation appears loaded. The hardest thing for me to get was that I wasn't heard. They didn't want to hear it. And the fact that nothing I said or did made any difference was really painful. It was about my eldest son and daughter-in-law...their perspectives, not mine, that were the issue. I finally got that I couldn't change any of that and my responsibility was to take care of myself. I asked to continue to be invited to all occasions and to have my responses respected. That didn't happen but it was the best I could do. Now, my focus is on my friends and the volunteer work I can do from home. My life matters and so do I. So do you! Sending hugs...

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