What do you remember about you & your MIL?

[cremebrulee]

Hey Anna, I'm so glad you had such a wonderful time on Holiday...where did you go, if I may ask...would love to hear about your vacation....

[GreatWhiteNorth]

To Creme-
Thank you so much for sharing your story of your mother this way, it must be painful to even write about. I can only imagine what that must have been like for you. Sorry that you had to endure that as a child and then deal with the aftermath of it as an adult.

I typically also read mother stories too, I related to them alot because MILs are mothers when it comes down to it, it all inter relates very well.

Typically if we get enmeshed in the dysfunction of another dysfunctional person there is typically a reason in our lives (the same is for me, I was severely scapegoated by my family of origin, still very  much am). With growth and reflection it is once we deal with why we got enmeshed, that seems to be the healing point, when we can let go.

I was being triggered by MIL scapegoating me, everytime MIL was unhappy it was blame, and bash Great White North for it, it is such a knee jerk reaction that I don't even have to have anything to do with the situation but she still scapegoats me. Scapegoats tend to take on too much responsibility for things that have nothing to do with them, I was reminded about what it feels like to be scapegoated as a child.

I have actually been following your story for quite a while and to be honest, you have grown substantially in the last little while. It is truly phenomenal and you should be proud of yourself for that. I think you have truly overcome this. If life is about getting challenges and then growing from them, if that is that point, then you my dear have excelled. Be proud of yourself for that.

You can't help who you were born to, that is truly a luck of the draw thing, and your mothers behavior is that of a very sick and twisted woman which again had nothing to do with you either.  Let the issues be hers and hers alone.

You have grown wise from all you have endured, so you can use that gift to help others, which you are.

[cremebrulee]

Greatwhitenorth
Can't thank you enough for the support and understanding....yeah, it is hard to remember, basically I try not to, however, the stories some of these gals told which they have to endure, bought it back...my heart goes out to them, and to you....no one should have to endure that...however, I do believe, there is a saving grace, and that is, to choose and what not to be like....and I refuse to allow hate to guide me....or my decissions...

There are so many very wise, mature, understanding and down right good souls in this forum....they  have helped me along the way a lot....some of them being DIL's....who amaze me by they're resilence and fortitude of not hating, but realize, by understanding. 

I'm sorry GreatWhite, that you are her scapegoat, however, you seem to understand that it is not personal against you....she would have been that way with anyone your husband would have married....the same with DIL's who are this way....and I think by realizing that, is one giant step to freedom from it all...

Again, thank you kindly...and wishing you great things in life....

Creme

[cremebrulee]

Creme, thanx for asking, & letting me remember our wonderful vacation once again.  We went to Prince Edward Island, & stayed in a little cottage right on the ocean.  Just steps to the beach.  We went sight seeing, shopping, went to the toy factory, the cheese lady, the Charlottetown wharf, Avonlea Village, went to some fisherman's villages, it was beautiful.  Watched the sunsets & the sunrises over the ocean, swam, lazy days suning on the beach, cooked simple meals, mostly on the bbq.  Woke when we did, went to bed when we were tired, didn't even wear our watches.   The cottage is in a very private area, & most days we had the beach totally to ourselves.  We saw seals, osprey, jellyfish, lots of crabs washed ashore, we collected seashells, some of them I painted wth little boats, sunshine & ocean pics, & gave them to my gc, & other little ones in our family.  I wrote their names on them, & P.E.I. & dated them 2010, little souvenier keepsakes for them, & they were totally free for me, found the shells on the beach, & I already had the paint.  My hubby liked the little treasures I made so much that he asked where his was!  LOL.  We talked & laughed, & reconnected.  It felt like we were on a honeymoon.  These last few years, since our gc were born, have been very stressful on us, our dils behaviour took it's toll.  So much so that hubby & I almost called it quits.   I wonder how dil would feel if she knew how deeply she affected us, & the people around us.  Would the knowledge bring her joy, or shame?  The vacation my hubby & I took, just the two of us, was just what we needed.  We will never allow anyone to do that to us again, we are stronger together!!  Our vacation helped us to heal a little bit, & we plan to continue the healing, do what ever we need to, for us!!     (((((hugs)))))    Anna.

Ohhhhh my Anna, I am smiling here like anything!  So, now you know what I was talking about don't you?  And isn't it, extremely wonderful to reconnect, not only with hubby but with yourself....

When I was going to the islands...it was such a spiritual awakening....I felt like for the first time in my life, I was home...really home, within myself...everything seemed to come together....first time I spent 14 days there, and I don't care how much it costs, it's worth it, to live that kind of life for awhile.  No watches, no schedules, no preplanning, no TV's or computers...just commune with the self....my oh my what an exuberent feeling....you come home and your brain is mush....which is really neat...

I realized my life was way to small, and I needed to get involved in other things, tostart fulfilling some of the dreams I put aside as a wife and mother....I also realized something very important....and I'm not saying this is you or anyone else here in this forum, however, it might help some of you, I don't know....but I realized, when you grow up living a hard life, as a child, you tend to look for the worst, and tend to expect them...b/c we feel we deserve nothing more....we don't know anything different, so we are conditioned to believe we need to worry to be productive...we look for things to worry about....so, I decided I wasn't going to be that kind of person any longer....you know I have MS, it's the recurring kind, there was a time they thought I'd never work again....or I'd never come back....but I did, and realize now, that it may be due to a lot of stress I put myself through...worry is very unhealthy for us.  I have a girlfriend who has parkinsons, and she swears it's from the life she lived with her husband, very sad story...and I believe our emotions has much to do, with our physical health...so, I'm determined to let life fall where it may....it is, what it is...remember in the Bible, where it says...the birds don't worry about where they're next meal is coming from...well, what he's saying is, it is what it is...or whatever....LOL....and that is how I'm trying to recondition myself....

Oh Anna, it sounds wonderful...I'm so so so happy you went....and so happy you took the time to create something very special for yourself....there is so much to see out there isn't there?  And it's vast and wonderful!!!!!!  What nice pictures to paint in your mind, huh? 

big big hugs....
Creme

[cremebrulee]

Creme, I just want you to know that you are a huge part of the healing process too,  That you really do care, comes shining through in your posts.  Just want to say Thankyou for that.   

and thank you so much for you Anna....I couldn't have gotten to where I am without you and so many other people in forums....there are tons of good people out there....

I am still a mother, but I can't live for my kids and they can't live for me, they can't fulfill my dreams or expectations of how they should live or dictate to me, how I should live mine....grandkids are wonderful gifts, but cannot and should not be our whole lives...we can't depend on our children for our only purpose in life, there is so much more out there to live and see....it's 2010 and time we shed the bras.....LOL

love ya
Creme

[Pen]

Creme & Anna, so true. It's our time to re-discover ourselves and our grown-up relationships. This stuff can be very hard on a marriage  or on friendships, which is kind of ironic since those are the relationships that will see us through. If we put it all into our kids, forever and ever, we're asking to be disappointed.

Anna, when you said "These last few years, since our gc were born, have been very stressful on us, our dils behaviour took it's toll.  So much so that hubby & I almost called it quits.   I wonder how dil would feel if she knew how deeply she affected us, & the people around us.  Would the knowledge bring her joy, or shame?" I suddenly realized something:

On this site, when DILs/MILs are tearing their hair out in pain and confusion, it seems the people they're dealing with don't feel shame over their behavior. I've read posts by MILs/DILs here who do 'fess up and express regret or shame, but the perps we're dealing with continue on unabashedly. My DIL is never wrong, in all the stories she tells us about interactions with others, I've never heard her express remorse or sadness. She is always right, she never has moments of doubt, she never questions her behavior. Others are morons,  others are wrong.

Early on in my situation with DIL, before I found out how she felt about me, I thought we were bonding a bit. She asked about our parenting strategies and DS's childhood. I told her what I thought were successes, but also some regrets. She used that info against us, spinning it to her advantage and influencing DS to see his childhood, and us, very critically. Shortly thereafter the bomb dropped. It was as if I showed weakness and she went in for the kill.

Perhaps that's the main issue in all our frustrations, DILs and MILs - that some people don't have any sense of other's feelings or any compassion. They'll use any sign of "weakness" (AKA having a balanced view of one's self) as an excuse to treat others poorly.

[cremebrulee]

Hi Pen

yanno, I truly do believe these people know full well they are hurting others...
and yanno why, b/c she feels the negative energy off of you....don't allow her that...you have power over anyone who tries to hurt you....for instance, when I first started writing on the internet, oh how niaeve I was...and when someone came in and said cruel things, my goodness it shook my tree, and I would coware and run....some people are simply bully's.  They are very very unhappy people and they do things simply to get a negative reaction....to push your buttons....she was raised to be like that, so she's got a real head start on you....

Now, I go in and post and if someone comes in and says cruel things I come back with a shame on you type of thing...and let them know how unintelligent they really are....you can do the same thing, but knowing full well, she is never going to be able to live up to your expectations....and there is nothing wrong with your expectations, however, she is just all wrong....and, I bet you any money, she doesn't like herself very much....not really....

Let them go....and when you need to be around them, try to work on (and this takes time) adopting a new attitude, that what she says and does, isn't going to bother you...you get to a point after years of this, that you don't really care anyway, it just makes you so mad, b/c you feel like this person is controlling your life, when in all truth, we are allowing them to.....by getting all upset, letting it really grind our whole being to the point of obesssing and replaying events that happened over and over again in our minds.  It also wears on our husbands....b/c we're constantly talking to them about it....and it can, in time, literally play havoc with your health....so, why, why let it....she is your son's choice....let him go, let him live with it...if he chooses to allow her to estrange him from his family, that's his fault....annd there is nothing you can do. 
I oft times wondered if, as a mother I was so used to being in control...and now, I couldn't control this, I wanted what "I" wanted and had to have my way...and the more I fought, the more I lost....we women can really be mean to each other, and when you take two women with a personality conflict and stick them in a room alone together, well, no wonder they call it cat fights. 

I really really believe the only way we can fight this and come out alive, is by understanding our selves more, and by accepting where we fault in this....I can't speak for you, but I do know, where I faulted in my Relationship with my DIL....and yanno something very funny....I see a lot of me in her now....she is very strong, independent, used to doing things on her own, making her own decissions, raising herself...relying on her own self....it's difficult for her to trust people, b/c people have left her down so much....my son, choose a woman, who is much like his mother, and how flattering is that? 

Pen, there is good and bad in all of us....and there is something good about your DIL to....right now, your just so overwhelmed and consummed with hurt....and rightfully so....stop letting her words hurt you and start living life without them....I mean really having fun....forget them....they can't and won't make you happy...the only one who can do that is you....

It's a horrible thing what she has done, it is....and some day, maybe, she will be sorry, maybe not, but you can't just sit by and wait for that day that might come, or might not....life is to short....and it's his turn now, he's going to make big big mistakes....he already has....but it's solely up to him to make ammends, and if he doesn't then shame on him....really....but, for the time being, do what Anna has done, try and consentrate on other things that can make you happy....do it....you've got the power to do that....and after a while, it's going to come first nature to you...and by darn, the first few times, they call you and want to shower you with they're presence, have plans, go out, and don't change them for anyone, no matter how bad you want to....and let them know, they are dispensible....and your not at they're beckoned call....don't call them.....don't make any attempt....let em wallow in they're so called choices....but one day they will call, and it's up to you to realize, if they are genuine, for if they're only calling b/c they want something....and YOU CHOOSE...tell them, geeze, sorry, we're not going to be home....don't make them your life....she knows you are now, and she knows your hurting....and one day, when she has children of her own, she might just change all her perspectives....you do you know....when children come along, boy do we start to change, and it's a slow process, but we do.....

I'm so so sorry for you....it's so difficult when we dream of how we want things to play out and it doesn't happen....but if we realize, that life just isn't like that....just when you think you've got it all, life comes along and punches you real hard in the stomach...it's b/c we're supposed to learn something from this one, to prepare us for the next...I so wish, like anything, that things would be different for you and your DIL wasn't such a selfish little thing....but she is....so, our next step is, to learn how to deal with it....

I think you have to start blaming your son as much if not more then her, for allowing her to estrange them from you. 

But if you are able to get past this, someday, maybe they're going to get curious and come around, and believe you me, when you get to the point that I'm at, there is no way any body plays games with me anymore....I'm to old, and I want peace in my life and I choose my friends, they do not choose me.....and if someone smothers me to much, I'm gone....but I refuse to live my life any longer trying to live up to everyone else's expectations, I can't.  I was suffocating....

I don't know if I said anything here that will help you, I just so wish I could.

Hugs
Creme

[GreatWhiteNorth]

Creme- it is not how you start the race sometimes but how you finish it and you should be proud of yourself for how you finished it. How you started it was not your fault in the least, that was your mothers dysfunction, not yours...but you get to deal with the aftermath of it, I know, but guess what...you have and done so beautifully.

Now you have the gift of wisdom...which I have notice people who have had painful lives seem to have if they choose to learn from it and not be bitter.

[barelythere]

O, so true.  That drumbeat of things told to her in confidence  and sent to him through her can be lethal once it makes landfall.  Why?  Why do some DILs have to make us look like criminals to our sons?  It makes you think you can't live another minute.  I wish I'd never talked to her in the beginning. Course, then, she would have said your mother never talks to me.  How do you get over this? 

[Barbie]

Hi Anna, I think someday my son will regret allowing all this to happen, and I hope we're still alive to see it. LOL.
Glad you and hubby had such a wonderful time.

[barelythere]

I want to say something about the sons and a few daughters having regrets or feeling guilt in the future for what they have done.  There has been a seed change in thinking over the past years.  Guilt is a dirty word now and shame, well, shame is just the dirtiest word of all.  I think they do feel guilt and they do feel shame but it is bred out of them till their hearts are stone.  Shame and guilt are the things that separate us from animals and it's being drummed out of humans today.  So, will they feel guilt and shame for what they've done?  Yes, because they're human but will they be talked out of it by books written to make them feel better and by people they're married to telling them that this is their life and they owe nothing, not even respect to their parents?   Yes, because like they say, "I didn't ask to be born".  How many times have I heard that one?

[miss_priss]

I want to say something about the sons and a few daughters having regrets or feeling guilt in the future for what they have done.  There has been a seed change in thinking over the past years.  Guilt is a dirty word now and shame, well, shame is just the dirtiest word of all.  I think they do feel guilt and they do feel shame but it is bred out of them till their hearts are stone.  Shame and guilt are the things that separate us from animals and it's being drummed out of humans today.  So, will they feel guilt and shame for what they've done?  Yes, because they're human but will they be talked out of it by books written to make them feel better and by people they're married to telling them that this is their life and they owe nothing, not even respect to their parents?   Yes, because like they say, "I didn't ask to be born".  How many times have I heard that one?

I have to add to this as well.  We can't narrow this down to sons and daughters.  There are older adult parents that do not know shame or guilt either, or rather they use "shame and guilt" to manipulate their children.  It's not generational for sure.  Of the DILs on this site, I think we'd all agree our MILs are absolutely shameless.  Mine, for one, has told others that she has done nothing to feel guilty about, and the only thing she regrets is that she didn't try harder to get rid of me. 

Shame and guilt are personal emotions as old as the human race itself.....the lack of shame and guilt are just as old. 

[cremebrulee]

I have an internet friend, who I've been friends with for oh, maybe 8 years now....and while we don't wish anything bad on anyone, his wife was very cruel to his mother...cut him off from her and he allowed it....she was also very hard to live with.  They had children, 3, and I've found if DIL's and MIL's are cruel to anyone in the family, they are also cruel to they're spouces, etc. 

Well, this woman was so bad, he left her, and found out the 3 kids were also treated badly by her....they left her to, and moved on with they're lives and refuse to see her unless she gets help.

He is very much like I am...after he left her, he gave her everything, and the kids were upset with him for that, however, he didn't want any more laywers playing games, as well as, he simply wanted to get on with his life....

I know he is struggling, he worked so very hard all his life....however, material things are not worth it to him....
Life plays out in strange ways...and there are just things we cannot control....to fight these things and fear change, is one of our downfalls, but if we work at acceptance, and changing our lives, it goes a bit easier....

adding, and some people just never get it, all of they're lives...they are so self absorbed, that, they leave this earth unfulfilled...it's a shame...