What to do?

[cremebrulee]

I'd like to open this thread for discussion...for anyone, as I'm not quit sure what to do.

First, I'm honest to a fault....that has been said of me, since I was little....as my foster mother was the same way...and I do step on toes by being honest and do apologize for that if I've hurt anyone's feelings.

Here is my question....

Women come in here and tell they're story....and we all rally to them with support...however, support doesn't always mean to me, that you tell people what they want to hear...sometimes in order to support someone, I think it's necessary to be honest with them....if it insults them, then they are not looking for help....Will it hurt them, probably, b/c the hardest thing is to admit to our faults...but in order to change, or make a situation better, we must take ownership in our misgivings....and we all have them....we've all made mistakes and will continue to do so...for the rest of our lives...

I dunno, I'm the kind of person, if I step on toes, I want you to be honest with me, and let me know I've hurt our feelings, so we can talk it out. 

I do know, to, that we cannot see each other's faces...therefore, it's harder because we all take words the wrong way....depending on our moods, emotions and sensibility, along with what happened to us before we came in here....

I believe this is a very successful forum...and there have been gals who came in this forum who only came into vent....they didn't want advise, they wanted only to gain approval for they're behavior....or to have people rally around saying "you did good" when in fact they didn't. 

I've noted by reading other posts in here, there are girls who feel the same way as I do, they are honest...they are not trying to hurt anyone's feelings...but when you post a thread asking for help, you may not always get the help you wanted....however, that is why I love this forum so much, b/c I know, if I'm wrong, someone is going to let me know so....and that's good....that's only how we learn and change.

We all read words differently and what some may deem as harsh words, others may see as totally different and supportive...it depends on the individual....

So what I'm saying is....perhaps it might be a good idea to suggest this in the rules...that while we here are supportive, and open minded, we may not always say what you want to hear, but we will tell you honestly how we see the situation? 

again, please remember, we all read things differently, and I do honestly believe, everyone is here to help, but what I am not is a kissy face huggy bear type when someone outright states in they're post, something that is wrong...?  I can't do that? 

so the poster should be forewarned...
Please don't take things that are written as a personal attack but more like constructive criticism
And if you are simply looking for validation and not correcting the problem, you may not get that from everyone here.

I don't know, what do all of you think?

Am I wrong...and do know, I understand there is a way of writing things so as not to hurt feelings, however, there is a way that certain people perceive writings as wrong, when they are simply not meant to be...and I understand, sometimes, it depends on our moods, how we are feeling that day...but honestly, I don't believe I've seen anyone here in this forum intentionally try and hurt someone....

I would really appreciate your input....and advice

Creme

[Pooh]

I totally agree with you on this.  But I think there has to be a line between constructive criticism and deconstructive criticism.  This is one of my favorite quotes and I don't remember where I read it, so sorry I can't give credit.

"You can't operate your life by fear, because the way to eliminate fear is to avoid criticism. And the way to avoid criticism is to do nothing."

[miss_priss]

Creme - I think you're on to something, and I'm honest to a fault too.  My DH calls me "Captain Callout" for a reason.  I don't mean anything by it, but I will always be honest and tell you what I draw from a post.  If you ask me "does this outfit look ok?" and I say "no, not really.  You should probably go change into something else," don't fault me...you asked. 

I know I would value that "brutally honest" person even more, because they cared enough about me to not let me go out looking stupid.  But that's just me.  Not everyone can appreciate that I'm sure, some people just want to hear what they want to hear to make themselves feel better.  Those people just want someone to tell them "you're right," but what have they really gained???   

[cremebrulee]

I totally agree with you on this.  But I think there has to be a line between constructive criticism and deconstructive criticism.  This is one of my favorite quotes and I don't remember where I read it, so sorry I can't give credit.

"You can't operate your life by fear, because the way to eliminate fear is to avoid criticism. And the way to avoid criticism is to do nothing."

Think you know I totally agree with you....we have to try to be realistic and want change so badly we are willing to accept our ownerships...however, there are those who are teribly hurt by honesty.....or see honestly as being unkind or to tough?  I dunno? 

[cremebrulee]

Creme - I think you're on to something, and I'm honest to a fault too.  My DH calls me "Captain Callout" for a reason.  I don't mean nything by it, but I will always be honest.  If you ask me "does this outfit look ok?" and I say "no, not really.  You should probably go change into something else," don't fault me...you asked. 

I know I would value that "brutally honest" person even more, because they cared enough about me to not let me go outside looking like a fool.

I'm the exact same way, if I ask, I want you to tell me....however, others view this as wrong...they want to be lied to and I can't do that....I can't....and if someone posts something that is really out of line, I won't reply for fear of seeming angry or writing someting that later I would be sorry for....and I do think most agree?

In order for this site to be helpful, supportive and productive, sometimes, we're going to hear things that we don't necessarily want to hear...however, it isn't meant as a personal attack....it's tough love and posted thru our own experiences....and we're not always going to be right...however, hence the multiple memberships, ideas and input....

Luise, what do you think?  How would you like to see things happen, I guess is what I mean....what would be the best way to handle this situation? 

[Pooh]

I am also brutally honest about things and that is why my friends like to take me shopping with them.  I like people that are upfront, honest and don't beat around the bush.  But that is my personality. 

I have also learned over the years that some people aren't looking for answers, just want to be heard.  I don't have to lie to them, but I don't have to beat up on them any more than they are are already beating themselves.  I am not talking about the people that just want to hear that "they are right" when they are not.  I am talking about those that are just in pain, conflict or turmoil and just need someone to listen.  Just being validated that someone hears them goes a long way.

When my hubby vents about his day, sometimes he is looking for advice, sometimes he just wants to be heard and is not asking me to fix anything.  I think you develop that sense when you get to know someone, but on a forum, that is difficult because you truly don't know the person and don't know what they need.  I try to get a sense by their thread which one it is. I am sure I am off the mark and post advice on some that just need to be heard, and don't post on some that want advice.  I think we all do the best we can and as long as everyone keeps in mind that everyone has good intentions, it seems to work.

[cremebrulee]

I am also brutally honest about things and that is why my friends like to take me shopping with them.  I like people that are upfront, honest and don't beat around the bush.  But that is my personality. 

I have also learned over the years that some people aren't looking for answers, just want to be heard.  I don't have to lie to them, but I don't have to beat up on them any more than they are are already beating themselves.  I am not talking about the people that just want to hear that "they are right" when they are not.  I am talking about those that are just in pain, conflict or turmoil and just need someone to listen.  Just being validated that someone hears them goes a long way.

When my hubby vents about his day, sometimes he is looking for advice, sometimes he just wants to be heard and is not asking me to fix anything.  I think you develop that sense when you get to know someone, but on a forum, that is difficult because you truly don't know the person and don't know what they need.  I try to get a sense by their thread which one it is. I am sure I am off the mark and post advice on some that just need to be heard, and don't post on some that want advice.  I think we all do the best we can and as long as everyone keeps in mind that everyone has good intentions, it seems to work.

ahhhh yes, you've made some very good points....I agree pooh...especially this part...and I for one, need to remember this....

I have also learned over the years that some people aren't looking for answers, just want to be heard.  I don't have to lie to them, but I don't have to beat up on them any more than they are are already beating themselves.  I am not talking about the people that just want to hear that "they are right" when they are not.  I am talking about those that are just in pain, conflict or turmoil and just need someone to listen.  Just being validated that someone hears them goes a long way.

Thank you for this

[Orly]

You ladies are talking my talk.  I'm blunt...sometimes brutally so..those are the days I don't post.   Other posts that just need an "IVY", I tend to let the more compassionate of the group take care of.   

[Pooh]

So that's the little devil you refer to Orly!   

And by the way, you all have total permission to let me have it anytime that I am totally off-base! 

[cremebrulee]

You ladies are talking my talk.  I'm blunt...sometimes brutally so..those are the days I don't post.   Other posts that just need an "IVY", I tend to let the more compassionate of the group take care of.

thanks Orly, that is good advice....

[Orly]

Sorry Pooh, 
The little devil's nickname is "blunt"...."brutal" is the dragon curled up on the floor at my feet.  AND people do not want to see it raise it head up over my shoulder.  "shudder" I'm not at all happy when it makes an appearance, either.

[Sunny1]

Newbie here...I know I'm new to this forum, however, I'm certainly not new to the concept.

I was raised to always be honest and respectful to others, but I tend to be brutally honest as well, though I would also never want to unintentionally hurt someone. It truly can be a fine line.

The more, the merrier!...I've found that I appreciate many people's different viewpoints,  because they truly may see things at such different angles. I'd rather hear  the truth from people, their honest opinions, whether I like it or not. I'm certainly not one to claim I know it all, so I like to ask others.

I do agree though, it wouldn't hurt to throw out a little warning on the homepage to "post at your own risk"

[Pooh]

Orly that reminded me of a  seminar I went to one time titled: Letting go of anger.  One of the things the speaker said was everyone should have a mantra so when they feel anger welling up during any confrontation, you are supposed to say your mantra to help center and calm you.  She gave us an example to use of "Butterflies in....dragons out" until you came up with one of your own.

The second day, one of the other ladies who had a fight with her ex over lunch, came in all mad and flustered.  The instuctor yelled across the room at her, "Your Mantra!  Your Mantra!"

The lady yelled back, "My da&% dragon done ate that butterfly!"

Priceless I tell ya!

[cremebrulee]

Orly that reminded me of a  seminar I went to one time titled: Letting go of anger.  One of the things the speaker said was everyone should have a mantra so when they feel anger welling up during any confrontation, you are supposed to say your mantra to help center and calm you.  She gave us an example to use of "Butterflies in....dragons out" until you came up with one of your own.

The second day, one of the other ladies who had a fight with her ex over lunch, came in all mad and flustered.  The instuctor yelled across the room at her, "Your Mantra!  Your Mantra!"

The lady yelled back, "My da&% dragon done ate that butterfly!"

Priceless I tell ya!

LOL

this was great
but going to try and remember that

I wish we had these classes around where I live....God Knows, I could use them....

[Pooh]

I was a wreck after my divorce and the circumstances and was trying desperately to get my life back.  I had always been a pretty upbeat person, but after going through my Son's teenage pregnancy situation and then a divorce all in a 4 month period, I was becoming a person that I didn't like very well and knew I needed to do something.

I am lucky, there is a place called "Abba's House" about 30 minutes away from me.  It is attached to a big Church, but they use it to bring in all kinds of speakers that are not religious too to help people from crisis to financial help.  I have attended several of their seminars, and find that it's very much like our conversation here.  You have to take the parts away with you that fit your situation and just leave the ones behind that don't.  But each one I have attended gave me some very good coping tools that I could apply to my personal life.

I think that may be the key to all of this.  Whether we are talking seminars, books, articles or forums.  You have to have an openness to try new concepts.  If it works, Great!  If it doesn't, have you really lost anything by listening or trying?