so, DS emailed me

[elsieshaye]

Background: Kicked my 18 y/o son out of the house in October due to substance abuse and increasing aggression. Cut his phone off (and cancelled my own phone) when he left me increasingly angry and unhinged voice mails and texts, including cussing me out because I didn't pack his belongings the way he thought I should when I spent nearly $400 to ship all his stuff down to him at his father's house. I haven't responded to any of his subsequent attempts at communication because they were more of same.

But today, I got this, which while completely ignoring his own behavior, was at least civil.  He said that he missed me, and suggested I call him.
 
My response was that I didn't have his new phone number, and that I missed him too, but I don't miss being ranted and cursed at, or trying to talk to him when he is high or drunk.  I told him that the sarcasm, contempt, demands and name calling of his last several attempts at communicating are unacceptable, and that if he felt like he can stay sober and civil when he talks to me, then I am willing to give him a call. But if not, I'd prefer to just trade emails for a while. 
 
How he responds to that will determine how I proceed. I suspect what's going on is that living with his father and being broke all the time has palled, and he's looking either to move back in or get a handout. Or both. Honestly, I'm still pretty ok not talking to him, because I still don't trust him to be sober/drug free and not to treat me poorly.  I just don't have the stomach for it anymore. Three months isn't long enough for real change, and I don't hear anything in what he wrote to give me a lot of hope. But at least he was reasonably polite, if whiny, and I figured I should at least respond. My stomach is in knots. I hope I'm wrong about what's going on, but I'm not really holding my breath.

[lancaster lady]

hi Elsie ,

Until he shows remorse you will always be suspicious of his contact .
I think you are right to take things slowly , he's maybe looking for that weak link .
We know you are stronger than that .
Time will tell , we're in your court .

[Pooh]

I think you should go with your gut.  Emailing him back with your boundaries was good.  Just wait to see what he responds and I think you should continue the emails only for a bit to see if he is sincere if he responds appropriately.  If you limit him to that, then I think you time will tell if he is sincere or not.  And remember Elsie, you have taken back your life.  The ball is now in your court because at the first sign of him returning to his old, hateful ways during the email trade...you have the power to stop answering them.

[luise.volta]

I am so proud of you for not taking the bait and jumping through the hoop! Sending love...

[elsieshaye]

Thanks, Ladies.  Honestly, I'm not really worried about him.  I know he's physically ok, and he's one of those people who always finds a way to survive and land on his feet.  He's made friends in his dad's area, and he has other relatives to fall back on if he needs them.  So I'm not really concerned about caving in either.  (When I shut a door, it stays shut permanently, right or wrong.  One of those traits of mine that I can't tell if it's a failing or a bonus, lol.)  More than anything, I am just not looking forward to being disappointed again, because I suspect I have a limit to how much of that I can take without withdrawing from him permanently.  He needs to work all this stuff, including the drug use, out on his own.  Selfishly, I would really prefer it if he worked it all out by himself, without trying to involve me, and then just came back to me when he can act like a normal person, even if that's 10 years from now.  I don't truly miss him all that much, to be frank, because the person I'd miss hasn't really been around in a very long time, and I don't know if the person he will become is someone I actually like very much.  I'm struggling to not wash my hands of him, if that makes sense, because I know I will eventually really miss him.  I'm trying to find that balance between leaving the door open a bit in case the person I hope he is comes around again ever, while protecting myself from the hurt of having to deal with the person he seems to be right now.  I don't know if I expressed it well.  Actually, I don't entirely have a grasp on what I feel right now. 

[luise.volta]

Much of the time, I have conflicted feelings. Aspects of me want what other parts of me don't want. I think that's pretty human and when the stakes are as high as yours, not easy to process. Sending love...

[elsieshaye]

His response just came in:
 
"mom i never talked to you when i was drunk or high."
 
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Seriously???!!!!

So, really, what am I supposed to do with that? It's a total non-answer (besides being completely untrue). I guess I should have made one of my boundaries "no re-writing reality or gaslighting" as well as the other stuff I wrote. Good grief. I feel like saying "you're clearly not really ready to talk to me. let's try this again in another 3-6 months." Or maybe 3-6 years.

I'm going to sit on this for a couple of days and then respond when I have a better handle on what I feel and think.  Maybe the point of the whole exercise from his perspective was to open a dialogue, and he doesn't really care what the content is.  I do, though.

[luise.volta]

He could have no memory of doing that. Tough stuff to try to make sense of because it doesn't make sense. One lucid person and one not present can't possibly make for a rewarding exchange.  I'm so sorry, E. Sending love...

[elsieshaye]

You're right, Luise.  Thanks.

[pam1]

elsieshayes, when I first started reading it was "yippee!" Then "oh no."  I'm with the previous poster (can't remember who) who said something about remorse.  IMO, he's not remorseful yet.

[Ruth]

Greetings Elsie.  Most people would have caved at this point. and then all that work and suffering for nothing.  It's easy to get fired up and set boundaries, really its not the saddling up that's the hard part, its the long tedious ride.  This is where the real suffering begins, when you've cut your own arm off in order to do what you know is right in the long run, for his ultimate good and your good health and sanity, and then the game shifts - the a/c tries to put on a sheep skin and and now the fun really begins.  I think most of us here have gone through this to some degree or other.  I encourage you to hold the line, you responded I thought so well.  I think that once he has successfully completed a drug program and is clean, we'd begin to move back closer together.  Until then, he's (Im so sorry to say this) but I fear he's just using you, or trying to again.  Rose made a remark recently about the a/c saying and/or doing something in the wrong, and having this strange way of making you (the dm) feel crazy or foolish.  I don't know all the dynamics of this, but it was an experience I'd had over and over with ds. 

[luise.volta]

I agree. For me, boundaries are easy to set but not easy sometimes to maintain. And they aren't worth anything if they are just words that we don't back up. Unfortunately, our AC can catch on quickly regarding how far we will go and when we will weaken and cave. And you're right…then all of our hard work can go down the drain and we have set a precedent regarding how serious we are that we will have to live down in the future..

[Doe]

Elsie-

I thought I posted this but apparently not-

Have you considered just setting some ground rules about what you'll talk to him about?  I think it's unworkable at this point to try to talk about your relationship, who is right and who is wrong.  Maybe you could let him know you're just not interested in that but maybe you two could try just chatting about things that aren't smoldering.   

You can set your boundaries whether he's aware of them or not.  You can direct the conversation away from hot topics or get off the phone. 

[USA Grad mom]

I've learned the hard way it's easier to lie in emails than im person.  I get the same emails from my dd full of ive changed or want to change and I'm sorrry.  I fall for it every time then slowly the devil resurfaces its ugly head and we are right back where we started.  Don't believe anything he tells u in sn email you will probably just be disappointed later,

[Shelby]

His response just came in:
 
"mom i never talked to you when i was drunk or high."
 
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Seriously???!!!!

Elsie - in the 12 step programs, taking an honest inventory of yourself (and your faults) is one of the steps.  Then making amends to those you've hurt is another step.  He seems to still be in denial.  Clearly he did not take an honest inventory of himself.  Luise is probably right - he could have no memory of doing all that - but someone who is SUCCESSFULLY going through the program will say "Mom, I don't remember our conversations when I was drunk or high, but I probably said and did things I would regret if I weren't too stoned to remember.  I am sorry."    Not "It didn't happen".

I say he's still in denial - and he can't make amends to you or deal with his issues himself if he still denies the problems.  Best wishes - it sounds like you're too smart to fall for his baloney.