my 21 yr. old daughter won't speak to me and says she never will

[ames849]

Out of total desperation I write this , I have two children that I love more than life. My daughter who is now 21 and my son who is 19. I consider myself to be a normal middle class mom who has had her share of issues with marriage and raising children. I was married to their father at the age of 21. I was married for almost 16 yrs. When I divorced him my daughter was 13 and my son was 11....It was the toughest time of my life ! Thank god I fell into a great career despite having never gone to college. I never received a dollar of child support and didn't want to fight my ex in court. So, I financially took care of us by myself. I bought us a house after the second yr of being divorced that the kids picked out. I was dating at that time but hardly ever saw him. My daughter at the time had made it clear that she wanted nothing to do with him and made it very uncomfortable for him to come over. To the point where he did not ever want to come over and I didn't even want him to come anymore because it was to stressful and uncomfortable for me as well .My son was indifferent to it all and never really said much of anything about it.  And so I was always home with and for my kids except for Sat. nights when I would go out to dinner and hang out with him until 11 p.m at which point I would go back to my house to make sure that my daughter was  home . My son was usually at his dads on Sat. nights.
            Needless to say my relationship came to an end . mostly because i could not ever see us all meshing together. My daughter was 18 and my son was 16 when i met the man that i am currently with. I was so happy to think that this would be my chance to have that complete family again and this would be great!
            It is nothing like that ...My daughter who was excited for this new relationship kept asking for him to come over to hang around so she could get to know him but my son who was now 16 wasn't going to have that! He made it clear that he would tell this guy to get lost. He did not want me to bring anyone over to his house and was really feeling like he was the man of the house at this point. I know this is where I made my biggest mistake but at the time I thought I was doing the right thing. I didn't let my new boyfriend come over to my house.
           I always went to his house and met him for dates and things like that. My daughter who was eighteen started sleeping out on the weekends and my son was staying at his dads on the weekends . My boyfriend kept asking me to sleep over and after waking up alone several times at my house I did start sleeping over his house.
           I would sleep there on Friday and Sat. nights, hang out all day Sunday and then go home Sunday night when I new my son would be there . When my daughter realized this she started to flip out on me and demanded that I stay home (where I belong). I told her she was eighteen and was never around anyway and wasn't going to go backwards in this relationship(mistake #2) .
          It stayed like this up until last Feb. My Daughter was 20 and my son was 18. I could not take all the driving back and forth and decided to stay with my boyfriend Thur. through Sunday returning back to my house on Monday evening after work. My boyfriend never comes to my house because he knows that my daughter hates him and he feels uncomfortable now just like the last guy. I told them both during the summer that come this Jan. I would be moving in with him. They are both welcome to come but don't want to. I pay for everything. Both of their cell phones, both car insurances ,both colleges , all of the bills in the house ...electric ,water ,heat , food.. No one pays a dollar towards anything.and would continue to do it for them in my home. neither of them want to live with their dad but they do talk to him and see him on a regular. Even at my house there father is always around and there is no problem there.
            Well , things got so bad between my daughter and i that I broke up with the man that I love (to much push pull )and sat at home for a month. I was so sad and miserable and could not find the relief that I thought I would . So after a month (Nov 2011) we got back together. Instead of moving in in Jan. i did it now . My son ( now 19 ) doesn't care and is fine with it and of course now says that it is OK for him to come around my house .(too late he doesn't want to anymore. My daughter could not hate me more than she has expressed .. She has cursed me out and said that I am the worst mother on the face of the earth and can't even call my self a mother.She has crossed every line verbally and every boundary that there should be. She has called my boyfriend and cursed him out and I know that she is angry because she wants me to be home but I want to have this other life now and she is 21 now and I just don't understand how to handle this because even though I am with my boyfriend, I have no comfort. I feel like a train wreck and don't know what to do or how to feel normal. If anyone can relate to this at all please help me .....
           

[Doe]

Hey Ames -

You found the right place!  You'll get a variety of viewpoints and you can choose what makes sense to you.

I think you have a choice between trying to please your daughter for the rest of your life (it may take that long...) or setting boundaries for yourself so you can create your own happiness.  You'd have to decide what you really want and set the boundaries and then protect them fiercely.  It's possible you might end up being a good example for your daughter - an example of a woman who is living a life she wants and isn't victimized by her adult children.

Look toward your BF and see how you feel.  Then look toward your daughter and see how you feel.  Then go with the one that seems the healthiest option for you.    That's my 2¢.

[Gidget]

Hi ames849, welcome.
The thing here is that you have to ask yourself if your daughter met someone who you did not agree to would she leave him and stick with you???  I think not.  Both your kids are old enough to lead their own lives and you have done your job.  Its now time to think about your own life and what you want to do with it or as Doe said listen to your daughter and unfortunately you will probably end up alone when her and her brother meet someone and move on with their lives.  I left my kids father when they were 4 and 7 and meet my DH 2 years later and he was a good man and a good dad figure for them so I didn't care what they thought and married him and we were happy for 20 years.

[ames849]

Thank you both Doe and Gidget. I feel so desperate because i believe what you guys are saying and yet she can make me feel like I am so wrong. In her eyes she is not old enough for this and just wants mom home. i feel tremndous guilt for that. In my eyes I have never been able to have what I wanted and always needed someone's permission and now I feel like I need hers. Even though i did forge ahead and am staying at my Bf's house. I still go to my house every Monday night to cook a nice meal for them and always make something extra for the frig. then on Sat.'s I go and do a quick clean up , and get like cold cuts and salads . Still her very mean text messages to me and the way she will look right past me when she see's me just hurts so much that i don't want to be here either. if its just me and him and i am not thinking about her then i am happy here !...I wish my kids were little when I met this man but all the wishing in the world is not going to help me . Can you tell me what you would do to fix this if this were you ? I just can't chose between them i love them both so much !!

[Doe]

Well, I don't know if it can be fixed - you want your kids to be little again and this adult child of yours wants you to be her mommy until she doesn't need you anymore.    As I understand this, you both want something that you can't have anymore. 

I wouldn't look to the existing situation for your solutions.  But it's your decision.  She can continue beating you up but I doubt you will be of much use to her sad and demoralized (which is what she is going for, it sounds like.)

[ames849]

Yes, I understand what you are saying and I do agree but how does one begin to not feel this way. To be uneffected by the words and the actions of this person that you raised and took care of for 21 yr's ? To accept that now i don't have her love? This is really hurting me and I am in therapy also. I started that because of our constant battleing through this . Yet I can't find relief......

[pam1]

Welcome ames849

Please read the Forum Agreement and WWU History (top two threads highlighted in pink) in the category Open Me First.  We ask all new members to do so not b/c there is anything wrong with your posts   Also, please ignore the spam you see, we have 4 moderators working on it around the clock

[Eggshelz1]

Doe......you have such a gift with getting right to the point. I so admire you in that. I mean, Ames has a very difficult situation.

Ames..I am sorry you are feeling so tortured.I also have a 21 yo YDD. She is very fierce in her love for me yet I hardly see her! I think they really want us when THEY want us. So....MAYBE you and she can set aside a night- a neutral night which is mother/daughter night on a regular basis? Just a suggestion? Who can figure out a 21 yo lol. Not me!

[luise.volta]

MY take: Time to move forward not backward. Sending love...

[Pen]

Ames, welcome. What a dilemma. I have no frame of reference here, so all I can offer is support for you and the observation that many of us have sacrificed our lives for our kids and it's come to naught. There are no guarantees that we will be surrounded in the warm glow of our adult children's love and attention even if we do everything they want us to do. IOW, take the forward steps and hope DD eventually comes on board.

Eggs, that's a really good suggestion!

[Begonia]

Ames:  Good for you to reach out...glad you found this site.  It sounds to me like both of you have separation anxiety.  I can so relate to all the happenings you describe. I was a single mom too and we bond so closely with our kids that when the kids grow up and when we find love or a life beyond the kids everyone suffers.  Nobody prepares us for this.  I think when we divorce time stops there and we find it difficult to know what to do or what that life beyond should look like. Then the guilt begins and the cycle of us becoming puppets to the clutches and bad manners of children who do not want us to "grow up," even though they are doing what they want and are never home anyway. You can almost see how they grow in power while we wring our hands.   I often think (romanticized) of how easy it was (NOT) when the kids were 10 and we were our little family with specific roles.  They were the kids, I was the mom and we were in it together.  THEN a boyfriend comes into the picture, resentment starts.  THEN kids grow up and start to blame us for all the things we nearly killed ourselves to provide for them. Like you say, push=pull.  Everyone feels it. 

Somebody has to be the adult and that would be you. (I mean this kindly and gently) You can make the rules for how you want to be treated, you can define the boundaries.  It sounds to me like there is a lot of drama and chaos.  Make it a goal to make peace with one thing.  The boyfriend, the dinner schedule, your bath time, when you will cook.  You have rights and it sounds to me like you have given them all away because of guilt.  When I get in this kind of mood my good friend tells me to "Put your big girl panties on and move forward." 

Do one nice thing for yourself, wrap yourself in kindness, grieve all that you may feel is lost, and then be brave and strong and tough love those who wish to take advantage of you.  You can do it, many women here have risen above the fray...myself included.  Keep posting.

[Begonia]

Ames:  I forgot one more thing.  I think what you said in an earlier post is really a key. 
I feel so desperate because i believe what you guys are saying and yet she can make me feel like I am so wrong.

Whenever you feel desperate that is a signal to change your focus.  Go walking, call a friend, take yourself away from the phone and internet.  And nobody can make us feel wrong without our permission...so look closely at why you are giving that permission and stop the bleeding.  Best wishes to you and a circle of love for your courage. 

[Doe]

Yes, I understand what you are saying and I do agree but how does one begin to not feel this way.

Is there anything that makes you feel better?  Makes you happier?  Anything that gives you joy or pleasure?   If you have anything like that, amplify it.  Give those things more and more of your attention and the sad/unpleasant things, less and less.
 
Simple things helped me out, like getting outside to walk and exercise more, swimming more, going out to new places and new activities.  Pursuing some of my interests that I put on hold for so long when I was being there for my kids.  If you have a spiritual path you follow, now might be a good time to look in that direction for inspiration.

The main thing is find some way to take care of yourself.  If this man in your life loves you, lean on him!

[luise.volta]

You start by shifting your focus as Doe has just described. You can't concentrate on what you don't like if you are looking at and doing what you do like. Sending love...

[ames849]

Thank you to all of you ..... I have never spoken to anyone on the internet ever for any reason. No chat rooms or anything like that. I am so glad that i did this though! You are all so kind and caring and i am just a total stranger...

Doe -The only things that make me feel better are total distractions...swamped at work , busy time with cleaning or er ans, doing things with my BF. The rest of my time is consumed with fixing my relationship with my daughter and thinking about what they may need at my house or what i will cook for them next.

eggs- I have apologized repeatedly for anything that I have done wrong as a parent. (I didn't get that book ). I have written her letters, I have cried , I have pleaded, I have taken the stronger approach and just let her be , ignored her a little . I have asked her to go to therapy (with or with out me ). I have asked for her to go shopping with me , dinner , a movie , a play , a vacation for both her a my son to Arizona ! We have family there and cousins her age ... A great trip including Vegas & the Grand cannon !!
...She refusing everything.

Begonia.. You I felt the most ... I actually started to cry when i read your post. You said something that i know you can really relate to me with . Last night was probably the second time in a month that my daughter had something to say to me by text. First it was a Christmas list with some very expressive items on it. Then it was a short text that said : Just in case your feeling extra guilty this yr. I responded to her with .. Let me know when your open to making some real repairs to our relationship. Christmas shopping is the last thing on my mind right now. This proceeded to her unleashing her wrath on me for 4 hrs. I tried again to make sense to her but she is not having it. All she kept saying was that I abandoned her and left my 21 and 19 yr. old home alone. I don't belong living here with my Bf. She should not have to spend her money on food ( i stopped that because of how she speaks to me but I still give my son money for whatever food he wants), She should have a meal cooked for her when she comes home from school or work and not have to cook something herself. She should not have to clean a house. To her , these are all things that only a mother does and if she wanted to do these things she would have her own children..
I didn't play into this to her but I absolutely feel bad...she calls me selfish , a horrible mother ,an embarrassment , and a bunch of other things..
Again , I know that she just wants mom home and i want something else and her love too! I don't want twenty yrs. to go by and miss out on all of her great moments as an adult. i almost feel like I have to go home and just be there no matter what because i did sign on as a mother even though I can't bare the thought of ending my relationship again.