I genuinely want to know what you think.

[holliberri]

MrsKitty, there is no need to be sorry! I really only brought it up to highlight that I handle crisis situations very, very privately. I needed those miscarriages; I didn't want kids before then. They made me never take my DD for granted when she did finally get here. Plus, if I didn't have them, she wouldn't be here. I would have lived those Angel Babies the same, but they would be different than her. At the moment, something different than her is unimaginable.

Folic acid was my problem...VERY easy fix! There are many other women who haven't a doctor who cares enough to do some research, and others who have an unfixable problem. I appreciate their plight so much more now and I have come to meet some very strong women through all of this. Somehow, the pain grew to be worth it. Weird.

[LaurieS]

I just came back from Austin, and this is what I walk into:

I can't get this at all. People in the delivery room? Grunting, sweating, groaning

Luise.. sweetie, I know you're 83 and memory might not be quite as sharp as you thought at times.. but your description was 'before' the delivery room.  Once in the delivery room it was screaming, glaring, threatening... just thought I'd help you out

[luise.volta]

  I had my first in the hospital I graduated from as an R.N. and my friend was the delivery nurse. She said "Oh, you are crowning...I can it's head (he was still an "it") and I said "i don't care if it's a set of dishes...I jst want to get rid of it!" 

I'm sure glad a crowd of smiling relatives weren't standing around for that one!! 

[LaurieS]

I personally wanted no one there for the birth of my children but my husband.  To me having a baby was a private event and thankfully my dh felt the same way.  When there were problems it was a relief that I did not have others making suggestions and giving unsolicited advice.  We as new parents were able to weigh the information being presented and make sound decisions.  Had I not been able to participate in the decisions, then my dh knew that his mother or mine was only a phone call away.  When I had my second baby, I was very grateful that grandma was willing to watch my first born, but again I asked that no one be at the hospital with us.  I just feel that there are certain times in my life where I prefer privacy.. my wedding, child birth, and I hope my death will be private as well.   

[SunnyDays09]

I just came back from Austin, and this is what I walk into:

I can't get this at all. People in the delivery room? Grunting, sweating, groaning

Luise.. sweetie, I know you're 83 and memory might not be quite as sharp as you thought at times.. but your description was 'before' the delivery room.  Once in the delivery room it was screaming, glaring, threatening... just thought I'd help you out

rofl    I get it.  wink wink. 

[luise.volta]

Well...it sure wasn't anything I would have wanted an audience for...I remember that! 

[SunnyDays09]

Me too.  For either.  The before...the during...or the after.   

[Pooh]

I didn't want anyone in the delivery room either, except me and DH.  But I had about 20 people "camped" out in the waiting room....Lol.  Between my family, my friends, his family and his friends...we had a crowd waiting.  I was in labor for 36 hours with the first (stupid me choose natural birth). 

I could have cared less who all was waiting.  It was their choice to wait and I didn't feel pressured to hurry.  They were on their own to wait it out.  They all did and after we had a chance to hold and love on our first Son, we had the grandparents come in to hold him.  The friends and extended family simply went down and ogled through the nursery window. 

If something had happened to me or the baby, I was glad there was a support system there for DH.  When my Mom or Dad, or my now DH's Mom or siblings have surgery, we wait in the waiting room.  Guess it's just always been that way and I have never given it a thought.  It's just what we do to show we care and no one complains.  It's a give and take.  We show up and are there for support....from the waiting room.

And I loved Creme's post.  It doesn't mean our way is right....it doesn't mean our way is wrong...it's just how we do it and no one minds.  Other people mind, then that's their right to do it their way.  But, I think what is lost that older generations had more of, was compromise.  Today, there seems to be more of a "it's my way or the highway" mentality.  For me, what was it hurting if 200 people are sitting in the waiting room?  They respected my wishes of not being in the birthing room, they were not intrusive and waited because they wanted to.  I think it has to be a two way street of compromise.  They respected my private time, I respected that they wanted to be there.  And I was very proud to hand my Son to my Mother, Father, MIL and FIL afterwards and say, "Meet your GS".  Did I even like my MIL?  Heck NO!  But I was still proud to hand her, her first GS. 

[Pooh]

And Glitter, I think it's a great discussion.  It truly shows everyone's different takes on situations.  This is only my take, and you have yours, Creme has hers, Luise HappyDays, everyone else has their opinions.  No one is wrong, no one is right. 

[LaurieS]

Everyone does have their own take on any given situation.  Maybe it's because I'm not comfortable being in crowds and never ever comfortable being the center of attention.  For that reason my wedding consisted of the necessary people.  The preacher looked at us and asked if we were waiting for any guest to arrive and I said no, it's just us.  Dh chimed in with "let get this over with"..ok he was pushing it a little.  I guess we cut down on the stress and family bargaining by simply not putting the options out there ahead of time.  Maybe we were being a little selfish, but one thing is for sure .... we got on with our honeymoon faster then the average couple.

[Pooh]

Ha ha...I went home after our wedding with a Son, Granddaughter and Stepdaughter!  Honeymoon had to wait until the next weekend....

[Tara]

such diversity.  I think that is what we are talking about here to some extent.  When I was working at UC Berkeley they did alto of work around 'diversity'  Diversity potlucks, etc.  Same thing with weddings, births, grandparenting, parenting.   but if no one minds, I wanted to go back briefly to the issue of photographs and gc.  I have a friend who sent out a card to some of her friends that was a photo of her and her grandchild as a birth announcement.  Its was pretty cute, but had never seen that before.  I'm wondering what is so offensive
about this?  (again, I get it that not everyone would be offended) also, as a photographer  I can imagine sending out an xmas card with various photos including a grandchild in one of them.  I don't get the problem with that that some DIL's mentioned.  Holliberry, you mentioned something about this.  I think you were saying that before you could send out a xmas card with your child on it your MIL sent one out to the same people that you would have sent it to and then deprived you of the opportunity.  I can see how disappointing that would be, but what would be the problem if she sent it to her friends?  A friend of mine who is also a photographer sent out a xmas card a couple of yrs ago with lots of different family photos on it including her gc.   The key seems to be to communicate with the parents to double check just in case.

[cremebrulee]

Tara Wrote:
I have a friend who sent out a card to some of her friends that was a photo of her and her grandchild as a birth announcement.  Its was pretty cute, but had never seen that before.  I'm wondering what is so offensive
about this?  (again, I get it that not everyone would be offended) also, as a photographer  I can imagine sending out an xmas card with various photos including a grandchild in one of them.  I don't get the problem with that that some DIL's mentioned.

But Tara, and I promise you, I'm not trying to insult you or be contrary in any way, but this right here, is a very good example....

OK, you say, you don't get what the problem is that some DIL's mentioned, well, that right there is the problem, you don't understand why they feel the way they do, you think they are maybe wrong or foolish b/c it's not what you believe...however, it is what they believe and it's not wrong for them to believe that way, just as it's not wrong for you to believe the way you do....and this is the one thing, if I can get across to anyone here, it will make one great big difference in they're relationships....

For instance...I all my life, have been a very early riser, why?  Because I had to get up to feed my horses....do the chores, and then off to school....and it's now my schedule....however, to a person who sleeps in late, they say, "your up at what time in the morning?"  like I'm some weirdo....now I don't know if you've ever had this happen to you...but they talk about me at work....they think it's awful weird.....however, it's not weird to me....when I was a kid, I worked at a bakery, had to be there at 3 a.m. in the morning....then it was off to swimming practice...after 7 a.m., so, now, it's my schedule, being up at 4 a.m. and I love it, it's so quiet, everyone's still sleeping and I have the whole world and development to me and my dog...and I love that time of day, early morning and watching the sun rise....but do you see my point...if only we could allow other's they're own cultures, without taking offense, there would be a lot more relationships that were workable....

It's like I always say, your not wrong for your feelings, but neither am I....
or
just because you feel one way and I feel another, doesn't make you right and me wrong, or me right and you wrong, it is simply how we are....

I don't understand for the life of me, why this concept is so difficult to understand....allowance...to allow people they're feelings, to live they're lives, even if it contradicts ours (within reason, like me getting up at 4 in the morning)  what is our society becoming that we are forgetting everyone else's views but our own, and I'm not meaning you Tara...but all of us....

You see people in the work place standing around talking about someone, b/c they are living they're lives to they're own standards....but because those other people who are gossiping do not live like that, they are talking about the other person who is?  How shallow is that?

I am a loner, and I don't always mingle with people...I love, love love to go off on my breaks by myself and enjoy the peace and quiet and not think about anything....however, b/c I choose sometimes to do that, some take offense....some really feel like I think I'm to good for them, or I've heard someone say, "She isn't into company politics"  and I'm not, not in the least, and I dislike hearing about stuff like that on my breaks, however, b/c I'm not going along with the majority of the culture, I'm labeled?  Why?  Why can't I be who I am?  Why do I have to live up to everyone else's expectations of who I should be and how I should utillize my breaks? 

Same thing with our family and friends....next time you catch yourself, saying, ewwwww about a family or friend who does something totally different then your life style, think about it....
Isn't if funny how society will stand around and talk about the one person that isn't there?  We take life much to seriously and expect people to live up to our expectations of what we think life should be....

I can't do that....

When I went off for Christmas vacations to the islands, you should have heard people...gosh, that was an awful thing to do...and how could I do that? 

Yanno, I have wonderful memories and mind photographs, that will go with me when my time comes...I'm going to live my life to the fullest, and be who I always wanted to be...and the reason why I'm not married...b/c I get to choose, and I don't have to look for anyone's approval...to be happy.

Tara, this was a great subject for discussion, thank you

[LaurieS]

Tara.. the chances of overlapping friends is quite different then overlapping relatives. I took it that Holliberri was heartbroken because she really owned the right to send an announcement and picture to the extended family.  I remember my child's first picture, and how proud I was to share it with my family.  Since this is someone else's child, it might be wise to ask before printing... such a small step will leave so many bridges undamaged. 

[cremebrulee]

Me too.  For either.  The before...the during...or the after.   

Hey there chickie...so so good to see you....